Test Rugby Wallabies Rugby World Cup discussion

[Maester]

He might get in on versatility. His form hasn't been good but how many wingers are clearly better than him? I don't think there's many, and his versatility would be a tie breaking factor when compared to others. Ultimately I think it will come down to form in the Rugby Championship and he'll have his chance to perform. How many back 3 players will get picked in a squad of 31? Maybe 5? Folau, Speight, Ashley-Cooper, Tomane, JOC would be my guess. I think Beale may miss out.

 

[LukeParkerno1]

Karmichael Hunt getting picked is very strange. Stirzaker and Timani should have been there IMO.

Horwill is very lucky and has certainly been picked on past performances. No way should he be in the world cup squad unless there's an injury crisis.

Perfect bench player. We need a utility. Can play 10,12, 15 and I'm sure at an absolute pinch he could play on the wing. If we are starting JOC on the wing (likely) we will need a utility on the interchange bench.

 

[LukeParkerno1]

I don't mind Genia going as the back up. I'd rather take the very experienced rather than the very young (Stirzaker) or even the limited Nic White.

Bring back Chris Whittaker and George Gregan while you are at it. Genia hasn't played well ever since he did his knee. Why can't we trial Stirzaker? We need impact off the bench.

 

[S120]

Bring back Chris Whittaker and George Gregan while you are at it. Genia hasn't played well ever since he did his knee. Why can't we trial Stirzaker? We need impact off the bench.

I have more faith in Genia to provide impact in huge games at the RWC than Stirzaker who hasn't played 40 Super games yet.

Stirzaker should be in this training squad and going over to Europe though.

 

[Maester]

Perfect bench player. We need a utility. Can play 10,12, 15 and I'm sure at an absolute pinch he could play on the wing. If we are starting JOC on the wing (likely) we will need a utility on the interchange bench.

I think we have plenty of back up in all those positions and better utility options. Also I think Hunt showed he is not a good cover for 10. Beale, JOC, Lealiifano...even Robbie Coleman are all better bench options.

I like Karmichael Hunt as a player and think he will turn out to be decent. But there's no way he should be getting picked for the Wallabies this year. He hasn't played enough games and he hasn't played well enough when he has.

 

[S120]

Yeh I'm not worried about out stocks in the outside backs. Even at 13 behind Kuridrani, Folau can shift there or AAC. And we have piles of wings and fullbacks.

I do like how our playing stocks are looking long term. We've got good backs but I particularly like what we've got long term in the forward pack. Guys like Scott Sio, Paul Alo-Emile (although he's going overseas, he may return soon if he gets a taste of Test rugby), James Slipper, Tolu Latu, Hugh Roach, Rory Arnold, Blake Enever, Adam Coleman, Will Skelton, Jack Dempsey, Michael Hooper, Liam Gill, Luke Jones are a good bunch of potential test players to build a pack out of (along with older veterans) as we head forward.

 

[LukeParkerno1]

I have more faith in Genia to provide impact in huge games at the RWC than Stirzaker who hasn't played 40 Super games yet.

Stirzaker should be in this training squad and going over to Europe though.

You are in la la land then. Has Genia played 1 good game in the last 2 years? You want experience, fine. What about Luke Burgess then. Genia is so ordinary it is laughable...and it is even worse that I am hoping that an average halfback in Nick Phipps doesn't get injured!

 

[LukeParkerno1]

I think we have plenty of back up in all those positions and better utility options. Also I think Hunt showed he is not a good cover for 10. Beale, JOC, Lealiifano...even Robbie Coleman are all better bench options.

I like Karmichael Hunt as a player and think he will turn out to be decent. But there's no way he should be getting picked for the Wallabies this year. He hasn't played enough games and he hasn't played well enough when he has.

That is where I disagree, not one of those options are utilities, especially Beale who is only a 12 or fullback at most. JOC will start. Our side was at our best recently when we had Mat Rogers on the bench as the utility (2003 WC for instance where we only lost to a freak team). You need a genuine utility and not one that is a bits and pieces.

 

[Maester]

That is where I disagree, not one of those options are utilities, especially Beale who is only a 12 or fullback at most. JOC will start. Our side was at our best recently when we had Mat Rogers on the bench as the utility (2003 WC for instance where we only lost to a freak team). You need a genuine utility and not one that is a bits and pieces.

You have to be kidding, they are all definitions of utility backs. Beale is a better 10, 12 and 15 than Hunt is. He's played more rugby games in all of those positions than Hunt has played rugby games in total. Same for both Coleman and JOC. Lealiifano is a better 10 and 12 than Hunt and given his strengths under the high ball and good kicking game I think he'd be able to play decent at 15 too if required.

Wouldn't bank on JOC starting. His form has been horrendous. Speight and Tomane or Speight and Ashley-Cooper seem more likely to me.

 

[S120]

If it came down to choosing between the two, I'd probably start Cummins over JOC on a wing too for the RWC. Neither have had good years with their teams but I'd take Cummins' hard running, hard hitting, straight line attack in a Northern Hemisphere RWC over JOC.

 

[LukeParkerno1]

You have to be kidding, they are all definitions of utility backs. Beale is a better 10, 12 and 15 than Hunt is. He's played more rugby games in all of those positions than Hunt has played rugby games in total. Same for both Coleman and JOC. Lealiifano is a better 10 and 12 than Hunt and given his strengths under the high ball and good kicking game I think he'd be able to play decent at 15 too if required.

Wouldn't bank on JOC starting. His form has been horrendous. Speight and Tomane or Speight and Ashley-Cooper seem more likely to me.

They are not test level utilities, Coleman especially, he is just way too small. Our backbone is small enough. How many short people do you want? Good luck coming up against a big SA backbone or the Kiwis...and you want Foley, Beale, JOC....and then you want more short people? Hunt is a better utility, covers those position with a big framed body who can really hurt the opposition especially in defence. Lealifano has been average (at best) this season, and his kicking has been miles off the mark.

Ashley Cooper will be at outside centre, unless they decided to go for a bit of flair. Cummins will have 1 wing spot, the other with either go to Drew Mitchell OR James O'Connor.

 

[LukeParkerno1]

If it came down to choosing between the two, I'd probably start Cummins over JOC on a wing too for the RWC. Neither have had good years with their teams but I'd take Cummins' hard running, hard hitting, straight line attack in a Northern Hemisphere RWC over JOC.

Remember there is Drew Mitchell too but I agree with your thoughts.

 

[Maester]

I also forgot Mike Harris. Another better utility player than Hunt at 10, 12 and 15 who is also probably the best goal kicker we have. Not picked. I just think it's a bizarre and undeserved selection and must be related to the 'investment' the ARU have made in him.

 

[S120]

They are not test level utilities, Coleman especially, he is just way too small. Our backbone is small enough. How many short people do you want? Good luck coming up against a big SA backbone or the Kiwis...and you want Foley, Beale, JOC....and then you want more short people? Hunt is a better utility, covers those position with a big framed body who can really hurt the opposition especially in defence. Lealifano has been average (at best) this season, and his kicking has been miles off the mark.

Ashley Cooper will be at outside centre, unless they decided to go for a bit of flair. Cummins will have 1 wing spot, the other with either go to Drew Mitchell OR James O'Connor.

Kuridrani will be our 13. Unequivocally.

 

[LukeParkerno1]

I also forgot Mike Harris. Another better utility player than Hunt at 10, 12 and 15 who is also probably the best goal kicker we have. Not picked. I just think it's a bizarre and undeserved selection and must be related to the 'investment' the ARU have made in him.

Yikes! Just no, slow and just ordinary. Harris has nothing apart from being able to kick the ball between the posts...and even then didn't he miss 3 or 4 last week!

 

[LukeParkerno1]

Kuridrani will be our 13. Unequivocally.

Possibly, personally I would rather AAK there as I feel it is the best of both worlds. It is no wonder when AAK was out early in the season NSW struggled. Kuridrani just does a lot of dumb things, especially getting himself carded and you can't afford that. However yes, he is an option. Still haven't forgotten him getting himself red carded for a dumb lifting tackle and costing us.

 

[Maester]

Hunt is not a big body. He's 93kg. Lighter than Lealiifano.

Kuridrani is a lock for 13 if fit. No doubt about it. Ashley-Cooper will more likely play wing and provide some cover for 13 and 15. And Cummins has done nothing this year. He's slow, can't kick, can't side step. He runs hard and sometimes runs some decent lines, but there are a few ahead of him.

 

[Maester]

Yikes! Just no, slow and just ordinary. Harris has nothing apart from being able to kick the ball between the posts...and even then didn't he miss 3 or 4 last week!

He's actually played decent rugby in general play in a few Rebels matches.

I don't know what you've been watching with Hunt. He has done hardly anything this season. A couple of classy passes, but several mistakes and no impact as a runner.

 

[S120]

Hunt is not a big body. He's 93kg. Lighter than Lealiifano.

Kuridrani is a lock for 13 if fit. No doubt about it. Ashley-Cooper will more likely play wing and provide some cover for 13 and 15. And Cummins has done nothing this year. He's slow, can't kick, can't side step. He runs hard and sometimes runs some decent lines, but there are a few ahead of him.

Yeh I agree with the first part. Hunt doesn't play like a battering ram, he seems to play more for footwork and skill.

And yeh I wouldn't actually start Cummins atm, I'd pick Horne, AAC, Speight and Tomane before him at this stage on the wing. I'd just pick Cummins over JOC atm.

Incidentally, who'd have thought 3 years ago that Rob Horne would be our most consistently performed winger?

 

[LukeParkerno1]

Hunt is not a big body. He's 93kg. Lighter than Lealiifano.

Kuridrani is a lock for 13 if fit. No doubt about it. Ashley-Cooper will more likely play wing and provide some cover for 13 and 15. And Cummins has done nothing this year. He's slow, can't kick, can't side step. He runs hard and sometimes runs some decent lines, but there are a few ahead of him.

Hunt hits hard in his defence, it is what he is known for. Doesn't miss too many tackles. He provides something different. You are wanting way too many short people in the team. As it is there are too many of them, but I am realistic. If Hunt is 93kilos I'd be surprised, but I'll take the word there, I would have expected something closer to 98kilos.

You want 2 finishers on the wing. I expect Drew Mitchell to be on the wing anyway.

 

[LukeParkerno1]

He's actually played decent rugby in general play in a few Rebels matches.

I don't know what you've been watching with Hunt. He has done hardly anything this season. A couple of classy passes, but several mistakes and no impact as a runner.

The Rebels must have made the finals with his great play right? Decent does not equal test quality. I have no doubt Harris is a good Super 15 player, so are quite a few others. You need to be more than that though.

I have seen enough to at least trial Hunt in the Rigby Championship. You try playing behind a halfback that can't pass or run, a pack full of spuds and to make matters worse a coach that can't coach.

 

[LukeParkerno1]

Yeh I agree with the first part. Hunt doesn't play like a battering ram, he seems to play more for footwork and skill.

And yeh I wouldn't actually start Cummins atm, I'd pick Horne, AAC, Speight and Tomane before him at this stage on the wing. I'd just pick Cummins over JOC atm.

Incidentally, who'd have thought 3 years ago that Rob Horne would be our most consistently performed winger?

Hunt at his best does both, and that comes from seeing him at NRL level and the attacking side of the game is similar. What I love about him mostly is he HATES losing. He won't be soft, unlike quite a few of our other players that prefer to coast along looking pretty.

Mitchell is better than every wing option we have and is probably critical as none of our players can kick!

 

[S120]

Hunt at his best does both, and that comes from seeing him at NRL level and the attacking side of the game is similar. What I love about him mostly is he HATES losing. He won't be soft, unlike quite a few of our other players that prefer to coast along looking pretty.

Mitchell is better than every wing option we have and is probably critical as none of our players can kick!

I haven't seen Mitchell play in aaaaages, but if he's still playing as well as the last time I saw him, I'd be very happy to see him in the squad and maybe XV.

 

[Maester]

Hunt is no better in defence than Lealiifano.

9. Phipps
10. Foley
11. Ashley-Cooper or Tomane
12. Toomua
13. Kuridrani
14. Speight
15. Folau

Bench backs: Genia/White, 1 or 2 of Quade Cooper/Lealiifano/JOC/Horne/Kerevi/Beale (or Ashley-Cooper if he doesn't start)

That's not a small back line at all. Toomua is not a big 12 (91kg) but he is the hardest defender out of all of them. At this stage Hunt is ordinary at every position he covers. The Wallabies will have plenty of versatility among the starting backs anyway so they may not even care about having someone who can cover 3 or 4 positions on the bench.

 

[S120]

I think Rob Horne is a bigger chance for a wing spot then many people are thinking. But I do really like that backline.