Was Neil Balme our biggest loss since GAJ?

[GHS33]

Balme joined us at the end of 2006 and our success since then has been well-publicised. He leaves us end of last year and we begin an immediate spiral down the ladder while his new team, Collingwood, are sitting pretty at the pointy end.

 

[catempire]

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Correlation_does_not_imply_causation

 

[GHS33]

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Correlation_does_not_imply_causation

I understand that. After opinions nonetheless.

 

[catempire]

I understand that. After opinions nonetheless.

I think it's very hard to tell what influence someone in Balme's position has on on-field success.

For example, do you know anything about what strengths Balme has over Hocking or vice versa? I don't.

 

[Partridge]

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Correlation_does_not_imply_causation

I was going to suggest reading 'The Demon-Haunted World'.

 

[SJ]

Balme joined us at the end of 2006 and our success since then has been well-publicised. He leaves us end of last year and we begin an immediate spiral down the ladder while his new team, Collingwood, are sitting pretty at the pointy end.

We were similarly placed in 2012 at Round 13 but with a far a better list and far fewer injuries than this year.

 

[Cattergirl]

I think he's a huge loss. He would also have intimate knowledge of our pursuit of Dangerfield & could use this to Collingwood's advantage

 

[catempire]

I was going to suggest reading 'The Demon-Haunted World'.

Is it an account of the events at Simonds Stadium last Sunday??

 

[Partridge]

I understand that. After opinions nonetheless.

I'd say he was one component. And he certainly helped enormously in especially 2007. But I think a lot of equally important factors contributed to our turnaround and success. Off the top of my head, I'd nominate all of the following as crucial to various degrees:

- Thompson focusing solely on coaching
- Harley's appointment as Captain
- The off-season review
- Harley's push to suspend Johnson until Round 6 which worked brilliantly
- The round 5 loss and the internal reaction to it
- Chapman's very public self-criticisms of the team after round 5, which was unheard of at Geelong
- Ottens playing solely as a ruckman after Round 1 (which we lost; he played 20 games for the remainder of the year and we won 19 of them)
- Balme handling the off field load that Scott had been doing
- Nathan Ablett being preferred to Playfair and Gardiner as Mooney's key forward partner (less experienced; much more talented)
- Mooney's maturity and continuation of excellent form from 2006
- Gary Ablett becoming the best midfielder in the game
- Ling's readjustment to becoming a pure tagger instead of ballwinner as he was in 2006

So I wouldn't downgrade Balme's contributions. But he was one cog out of many.

 

[SJ]

I'd say he was one component. And he certainly helped enormously in especially 2007. But I think a lot of equally important factors contributed to our turnaround and success. Off the top of my head, I'd nominate all of the following as crucial to various degrees:

- Thompson focusing solely on coaching
- Harley's appointment as Captain
- The off-season review
- Harley's push to suspend Johnson until Round 6 which worked brilliantly
- The round 5 loss and the internal reaction to it
- Chapman's very public self-criticisms of the team after round 5, which was unheard of at Geelong
- Ottens playing solely as a ruckman after Round 1 (which we lost; he played 20 games for the remainder of the year and we won 19 of them)
- Balme handling the off field load that Scott had been doing
- Nathan Ablett being preferred to Playfair and Gardiner as Mooney's key forward partner (less experienced; much more talented)
- Mooney's maturity and continuation of excellent form from 2006
- Gary Ablett becoming the best midfielder in the game
- Ling's readjustment to becoming a pure tagger instead of ballwinner as he was in 2006

So I wouldn't downgrade Balme's contributions. But he was one cog out of many.

- Eighth year of consistent rebuild of the list to a point where a huge core was approaching their individual peaks

 

[you pick one]

I'll get back to you in 2 weeks.

 

[Partridge]

I'll get back to you in 2 weeks.

2-3.

 

[dazbroncos]

I'd say he was one component. And he certainly helped enormously in especially 2007. But I think a lot of equally important factors contributed to our turnaround and success. Off the top of my head, I'd nominate all of the following as crucial to various degrees:

- Thompson focusing solely on coaching
- Harley's appointment as Captain
- The off-season review
- Harley's push to suspend Johnson until Round 6 which worked brilliantly
- The round 5 loss and the internal reaction to it
- Chapman's very public self-criticisms of the team after round 5, which was unheard of at Geelong
- Ottens playing solely as a ruckman after Round 1 (which we lost; he played 20 games for the remainder of the year and we won 19 of them)
- Balme handling the off field load that Scott had been doing
- Nathan Ablett being preferred to Playfair and Gardiner as Mooney's key forward partner (less experienced; much more talented)
- Mooney's maturity and continuation of excellent form from 2006
- Gary Ablett becoming the best midfielder in the game
- Ling's readjustment to becoming a pure tagger instead of ballwinner as he was in 2006

So I wouldn't downgrade Balme's contributions. But he was one cog out of many.

Agree.


Balme was part of the system that allowed the structure of the GFC to shift from 06 to 07. A vital part no less. But not the only part.

His loss, whilst not great, was not terminal and while I don't miss the ritual "2 weeks". Getting Steve Hocking into that role was not bad after having the same set of eyes looking at things for 8 years or so.

And I doubt that Steve Hocking has any control or influence over the injury list - IMO that has a far greater effect on our performance than Balme/Hocking.

GO Catters

 

[JUBJUB]

I'll get back to you in 2 weeks.

So cya in 6 weeks then

 

[Catatonic Shock]

So cya in 16 weeks then

Uhhhh jubby....

 

[Teriyakicat]

2-3.

Is that short-term or medium-term, Partridge?
I noticed that the Cats have changed their injury terminology so Balme doesn't understand what we are up to in the rehab rooms

 

[UnitedWarrior93]

umm no, with him still here I dare say we would still be 6-6. He can't control what happens out on the field and the injuries that happen. Plus our draw has been pretty tough, if we had the pies first 12 games in reckon we'd be at worst 7-5.

 

[Whit3y]

ottens was our biggest lose since gaz

the big o

 

[Teriyakicat]

Balme joined us at the end of 2006 and our success since then has been well-publicised. He leaves us end of last year and we begin an immediate spiral down the ladder while his new team, Collingwood, are sitting pretty at the pointy end.

I'm with those above- my opinion is that it is just coincidence that the "one up and one down" is not attributable to Balme. The GFC slide has been predicted for quite some time now, the list shape has been well documented both age-wise and LTI-wise. Blind Freddie would've known we'd hit a dip at some stage and nobody from the Engine Room at the Cattery would be anywhere near as blind as Blind Freddie, so Balmy would know exactly where the club stood.
Likewise, other clubs are on the rise- how high they rise will depend on a lot of factors. No doubt Balme would have had a fair idea of which teams would make it and which had no hope and I guess the call came from the Pies, with an offer too good to refuse. The movement of the Pies northwards should not be credited to him.

 

[sharks33]

No

 

[CatsDoItBetter]

He certainly is a big loss he also sat in the box that is the area I thought they'd miss him the most and partly why Knights has permanently moved there.
The pies recruiting team is first class we have Wells who is genius but they have a large team of recruiters (as do the eagles). They rarely miss with their recruiting look how many rookies they manage to find that can have good careers. I'm sure Balme would be playing a good role their but I think the recruits and the development they have put in there is most significant.

 

[Bobby_]

His list management needs to be seriously questioned.
I'd even go as far to say he he has left us in pretty bad shape for the future. The amount of injured players he kept, and proceeded to continually bring onto the list which has literally catapulted us down the ladder, it all has to be largely pointed at Neil Balme.
The handling of other players who are now on other clubs lists is yet another example of his undoing.

He, along with the original pioneers need to be congratulated for what they achieved, 3 flags in 5 years but at the same time, it's a shame he was not able to stay ahead of his game and in doing so, the club is now paying a price for some of those monumental blunders.

 

[catempire]

His list management needs to be seriously questioned.
I'd even go as far to say he he has left us in pretty bad shape for the future. The amount of injured players he kept, and proceeded to continually bring onto the list which has literally catapulted us down the ladder, it all has to be largely pointed at Neil Balme.
The handling of other players who are now on other clubs lists is yet another example of his undoing.

He, along with the original pioneers need to be congratulated for what they achieved, 3 flags in 5 years but at the same time, it's a shame he was not able to stay ahead of his game and in doing so, the club is now paying a price for some of those monumental blunders.

What makes you place blame with Balme for list management decisions?

 

[Bobby_]

What makes you place blame with Balme for list management decisions?

he was footballer operations director.
I'd say he was very much the guy who steered the ship in that regard.

But of course, Geelong supporters in here simply do not like to here anything untoward said of past/present players or staff so I'm sure you are going to proceed to tell me Neil Balme was not even part of the list managing delegations

 

[catempire]

he was footballer operations director.
I'd say he was very much the guy who steered the ship in that regard.

But of course, Geelong supporters in here simply do not like to here anything untoward said of past/present players or staff so I'm sure you are going to proceed to tell me Neil Balme was not even part of the list managing delegations

I just find it odd to blame the football manager for list management decisions when they are made by a football department consisting of, among others, a senior coach and an aptly named List Manager.