Welcome to Hawthorn Pick 19: Ryan Burton

[HomerJayS]

Better liptak than blu tac

Yet to be proven they're not the same thing

 

[Davo23]

Yet to be proven they're not the same thing

Yes, I don't believe "Liptak" is a real name.

He probably got bluetac on his lips as a young kid and the name stuck.

 

[MrPremiership]

Haven't heard much about JML's leg issues since we drafted him. He too, like RB, came off a pretty bad leg injury and didn't play AFL for a long time. JML played a lot of Dev Squad this year (same as Hardisty and LLangford), yet only Hardisty got the chop

 

[TAITA]

Yes, I don't believe "Liptak" is a real name.

He probably got bluetac on his lips as a young kid and the name stuck.

Hmmmm......why isn't it called "greytac" or "you'llhavetorepaintyourwallsafteryourollthisshitoff" which is more appropriate.

 

[Clarkos_Soldier]

Lovell is shorter than all of those players. Materially shorter. How about you put together a list of inside midfielders who are current players and are under 180cm. Mitchell is one but there are not many others. While Mitchell is short Lewis, hodge, Burgoyne, Langford and roughy are all 185 or larger. We don't have a short midfield. But if you think you could replace hodge, Burgoyne and Mitchell with three sub 180cm mids and remain competitive then you are delusional.

Mate my point was not Lovell's extreme height challenge. I mean people seem to just think if someone is not 190cm they are not going to be a good midfielder. All tall midfielders do is get dinky little hand passes. Look at Fyfe he hand passes way more than he should. But I must say you seem to be from Chris Scott's school of thought. He only recruits rucks and even plays them as midfielders.

 

[Rocket72]

Haven't heard much about JML's leg issues since we drafted him. He too, like RB, came off a pretty bad leg injury and didn't play AFL for a long time. JML played a lot of Dev Squad this year (same as Hardisty and LLangford), yet only Hardisty got the chop

Hardisty had only one year on our list, think something is behind that, we would usually give a kid two years minimum.

 

[grumbleguts]

Possible that stat was one that was missed from an earlier piece of play and only got updated during that refresh.

Happens all the time. I was interested because he was listed at 467th in disposal efficiency two years ago and everyone was gushing over him. I don't think anyone with 63% disposal efficiency can be considered good no matter how little emphasis you place on stats.

Watched a few games, and he is stacking up stats when not in the vicinity of the ball. No one else seems to be though. Anyway, it's not really relevant to this discussion. But it is astounding how many sheep there are who hear the commentators talk about how great he is, and refuse to actually look with their own eyes at how he grabs the ball and bombs it long into the frward line without bothering to check if there are any team mates where the ball is going to land. Most of his possessions are either 1-2 handball receives or a long bomb to a 50/50.

 

[Collins-Langford-Ayres]

People put far too much emphasis on stats, which are ultimately the sum of an outcome - not a precursor to the outcome. And boil them, fry them, bake them, coat them in batter - in the view of the statistician Cyril Rioli is a very average player and the 2015 Hawks should not have even made the GF given their average age.

That's not true.

From memory based on Champion Data's methodology, Rioli a year back or so was deemed elite. These days they just don't measure possies.

 

[TAITA]

That's not true.

From memory based on Champion Data's methodology, Rioli a year back or so was deemed elite. These days they just don't measure possies.

You just go back and keep believing Spangher is our most important player mate - if Champion Data is how you go about your footy you are a deadset flog.

I will add - a year ago Rioli only managed to put 12 games together FWIW - how can that be construed as elite seeing as how you are using an example to try and pull apart a well made point?

 

[SodaPop]

I keep clicking on the Ryan Burton thread but it keeps taking me to the Lovell thread....weird???

 

[sven_inc]

You just go back and keep believing Spangher is our most important player mate - if Champion Data is how you go about your footy you are a deadset flog.

Not sure what you're on about with Spangher... Champion Data seem to do a great job. Yes they measure pretty much every stat. Yes stats are useless on their own. Yes the ranking points aren't perfect, but they are a bloody good resource.

If you were to write down who you thought your top 5 were in a game in terms of influence on the outcome and then compared to CD, they wouldn't be far off.

The only thing they might need to improve IMO is how lowly they rate key defenders. A solid defensive stopping/spoiling game generally doesn't stack up with the naked eye.

But who really cares though?

Not sure where the aggro comes from but TAITA made a fair point.

 

[Brishawk]

Mate my point was not Lovell's extreme height challenge. I mean people seem to just think if someone is not 190cm they are not going to be a good midfielder. All tall midfielders do is get dinky little hand passes. Look at Fyfe he hand passes way more than he should. But I must say you seem to be from Chris Scott's school of thought. He only recruits rucks and even plays them as midfielders.

You responded to my post and I said nothing of the sort.

 

[Dipper]

He looks like a fine genetic specimen, symmetry and body shape, every inch an alpha...

He just looks like a quality footballer in a way that's impossible to quantify.


Probably relative to all that, a fine looking lad as well (not that there's anything wrong with that)

Swoon!

 

[HR Roughnstuf]

You need to consider where each list is at before you understand why clubs can and can't take risks.

Clearly the Hawks list is in a very different place to the Crows and if you then consider what both clubs have achieved over the last 10 seasons, you can fully comprehend why Adelaide are not willing to take the risks that Hawthorn can.

Yep. And the last risk Hawks took was Garlett.

Hope this one works out better

 

[Argy]

Finally decided to have a look into his Injury wow it doesn't paint a pretty picture . No doubt the clubs done there research and feel he can make an impact but wether he becomes the player he was prior to the injury is a another story he seems to have the attitude at least

Only time will tell. Big risk, high reward.

 

[Blaze Storm]

You need to consider where each list is at before you understand why clubs can and can't take risks.

Clearly the Hawks list is in a very different place to the Crows and if you then consider what both clubs have achieved over the last 10 seasons, you can fully comprehend why Adelaide are not willing to take the risks that Hawthorn can.

This. How many of our draft picks will be needed for best 22 next year? The answer is NONE. We have 1-2 players to cover every position, and the draftees will only be played if we want to blood them or some disastrous run of injury. Therefore we can take risks.

Again, this guy is high-risk, high-reward. If we only get 3-5 playing years out of him before OA sets in, but he turns out to be some mercurial mix of Gunston and Fyfe, that's a pick well spent. If he trends onwards and gets to 200 games, even better. He wouldn't have lasted any longer than he did in the draft before teams came back around with their 2nd-3rd picks and figured "well, now that I've covered my bases, we can take a gamble".

 

[Steven Tyler]

Hope he doesn't end up back in Adelaide playing with his mate Ben Jarman at the Crows in 3 years time after we've fixed his leg!

 

[offtherails9]

Hope he doesn't end up back in Adelaide playing with his mate Ben Jarman at the Crows in 3 years time after we've fixed his leg!

I'm quite confident Ben will be coming to Fourthorn

 

[Steven Tyler]

I'm quite confident Ben will be coming to Fourthorn

I'm more chance of winning tattslotto, first division, single winner, jackpot $55 million than Ben Jarman nominating and playing for Hawthorn

 

[whiteTiga2k]

Didn't like him saying hawthorn as "they" so much in his interview. Thought he could throw in a few more "we".

 

[Beandip]

Didn't like him saying hawthorn as "they" so much in his interview. Thought he could throw in a few more "we".

No issue with this, inclined to think from the rest I've read that he feels he's only just joined and has to earn his spot rather than risk being seen to be entitled.

 

[cryptor]

Would be surprised if he left us without something drastic changing.

He just needs to remember that Adelaide passed over him with both their only picks before we took him with our first pick. Our earliest pick since the 2010 draft.

We took a huge risk while Adelaide didn't even give him a chance.

 

[offtherails9]

I'm more chance of winning tattslotto, first division, single winner, jackpot $55 million than Ben Jarman nominating and playing for Hawthorn

Do you know something that others don't? Please tell.

 

[Steven Tyler]

Do you know something that others don't? Please tell.

Nah, but if you had the choice to stay home and nominate the club you supported all your life, wouldn't you?

 

[cryptor]

Can't see Ben Jarman nominating us just because he's friends with Burton. Not unless Burton is his only friend in the world and he doesn't like his family all that much.