Strategy What are we going to do about centre half forward?

[steady2]

Wasn't it an ankle injury to Brown - possible picked up prior to the Collingwood match but played through it.

Only concern if we play Walker next week along side Hawkins against the Hawks - what happens if Hawkins opponents get hold of his jumper again and he runs out of #26 jumpers, don't think we can actually have 2 Walkers running around on the field together and would there be another teammates jumper big enough for Hawkins?

It has become an accepted opposition tactic to deliberately rip jumpers off Geelong players. Against the Dockers you all saw Sandilands grab Johnno's jumper and rip it down the middle, SJ was then sent off the ground by the umpire - another useful Ross Lyon trick - how to play the game the way it should not be played.

 

[nohairandfair]

We have the most i50 marks in the competition so things aren't as dire as it seems WRT the CHF position.

We had 19 against Carton (vs their 7) but just didn't capitalise enough with some very poor set shots on goal.

Hawkins is at times playing further up the ground and even taking grabs around the wing... standard modus operandi of a mobile CHF.

With a resting Blicavs always likely to take a grab up there and importantly also having the mobility to provide adequate defensive pressure the setup looks okay.

The main issue the MC are faced with is what to do with Kersten. He's had a very decent crack at it and is simply not imposing himself. The question is do we back him in or replace him with a small, medium or tall. Time is of the essence so they will need to make a call on this VERY soon.

 

[Scottland2007]

Would Hawk to CHF and SJ to FF work? Or vice versa?

 

[nohairandfair]

Would Hawk to CHF and SJ to FF work? Or vice versa?

Given his foot is okay Id prefer to see StevieJ marauding around the HF line and utilizing his elite endurance.

 

[Jeff76]

Its a huge chance to play in finals and maybe a GF for either Brown, Walker or Kersten, you'd think who ever they go with is gonna bust his poo valve to stay in the side. Starting with a game at the G in front of 80000 people this week.

 

[Pure_Ownage]

Can anyone tell me why Brown was dropped earlier in the year in the first place? My recollection, although perhaps a bit cloudy, was that he played quite well the first half against Collingwood; was subbed, and then dropped. I thought at the time it was a bit harsh. He was certainly given no where near the time or latitude that Kersten has enjoyed this year.

I'd give him the nod over Walker purely based on class. To me he is a very good footballer, who is just taking a little extra time to develop. He has far more class than Walker.

I think they subbed him, said he was injured and then dropped him.

Anyway I think Brown is a better player than Walker but what worries me is he lacks confidence (understandable given how MC treats him) and at times he waits for a teammate to call him in or a midfielder to demand him to lead and watches the play, a bit the same as Kersten is doing at the moment. Walker, while he is nowhere near as talented as Pods, shares the same trait in that he charges at the football and demands it be kicked, and doesn't worry if there's a 100 game teammate in the way. For that reason although he's the most inferior of the three he may be the best option because this is what we are missing at the moment, hence guys from the midfield aren't seeing enough people coming at them and the ball movement is becoming slow. I am worried that in finals this will result in good teams clogging Hawthorn's space. Whereas if you get Walker to come at the footy it makes the ball movement more predictable and encourages the mids to move it quickly, creating space in behind.

Regardless I wouldn't be unhappy with Brown though, I think we have to make a change either way.

 

[Pure_Ownage]

We should drop Kersten, move Blitz to CHF and then have Mcintosh and Simpson ruck.

That won't happen now Simpson is injured and the Hmac/Blicavs combo is working very well.

It's down to Kersten, Walker or Brown unless they do something radical and put Taylor forward (which I doubt will happen).

 

[year of the cat]

I think they subbed him, said he was injured and then dropped him.

Anyway I think Brown is a better player than Walker but what worries me is he lacks confidence (understandable given how MC treats him) and at times he waits for a teammate to call him in or a midfielder to demand him to lead and watches the play, a bit the same as Kersten is doing at the moment. Walker, while he is nowhere near as talented as Pods, shares the same trait in that he charges at the football and demands it be kicked, and doesn't worry if there's a 100 game teammate in the way. For that reason although he's the most inferior of the three he may be the best option because this is what we are missing at the moment, hence guys from the midfield aren't seeing enough people coming at them and the ball movement is becoming slow. I am worried that in finals this will result in good teams clogging Hawthorn's space. Whereas if you get Walker to come at the footy it makes the ball movement more predictable and encourages the mids to move it quickly, creating space in behind.

Regardless I wouldn't be unhappy with Brown though, I think we have to make a change either way.

My thoughts were that Brown was less likely to compete for the same footy as Hawkins compared with Walker so would be a better bet. Brown just needs to get on his bike and provide a mobile, leading forward option which I think he is capable of. Walker, as you say, is more a bullocking type, but he just seems to me, at this stage anyway, to find the rise in class in the AFL too much for him. Brown is also a far better kick of the footy than Walker so is more likely to both kick more accurately for goal and also find a teammate if needing to give it off. Brown for me.

 

[meto]

Can anyone tell me why Brown was dropped earlier in the year in the first place? My recollection, although perhaps a bit cloudy, was that he played quite well the first half against Collingwood; was subbed, and then dropped. I thought at the time it was a bit harsh. He was certainly given no where near the time or latitude that Kersten has enjoyed this year.

I'd give him the nod over Walker purely based on class. To me he is a very good footballer, who is just taking a little extra time to develop. He has far more class than Walker.

But can you wait for class to emerge when 2014 is on the line, Walker is performing atm, Kersten after 6 games still isn't. And remember class to a degree can be in the eye of the beholder, it can be misconstrued for style.
IMO, Walker is at least the harder player.

 

[year of the cat]

But can you wait for class to emerge when 2014 is on the line, Walker is performing atm, Kersten after 6 games still isn't. And remember class to a degree can be in the eye of the beholder, it can be misconstrued for style.
IMO, Walker is at least the harder player.

There's 42 players on the list. Surely you can wait for a taller type to develop with one spot on your list?

 

[meto]

There's 42 players on the list. Surely you can wait for a taller type to develop with one spot on your list?

YOC, ....My point is Walker has developed, he needs a chance!....kickin' butt in the two's!.....what else?

 

[Partridge]

Wasn't it an ankle injury to Brown - possible picked up prior to the Collingwood match but played through it.

Only concern if we play Walker next week along side Hawkins against the Hawks - what happens if Hawkins opponents get hold of his jumper again and he runs out of #26 jumpers, don't think we can actually have 2 Walkers running around on the field together and would there be another teammates jumper big enough for Hawkins?

Definitely prior. Was in the final minutes of the Adelaide game in Round 1.

 

[year of the cat]

YOC, ....My point is Walker has developed, he needs a chance!....kickin' butt in the two's!.....what else?

An ability to hold a mark and kick accurately when he gets a chance in the senior team. I think Walker will always be a fall back option rather than the main guy. We are indeed running out of time to find a second tall forward this year but Brown, to my mind, is a better bet. I can understand the alternate view though.

 

[meto]

keep playing Kersten, needs to work through this poor patch as all good players do when they begin their footy journeys. He's a stronger body than Brown, while giving up 5cm height, so Mitch isn't the answer going forward.
If anything, Walker could get another go but then again, Blicavs showed us some almighty positive signs on Friday night when he strolled inside forward 50.
Bartel, Hawkins, Kersten isn't the quickest trio but add in Blicavs, and a small crumber like McCarthy or Hartman (not small at 6ft'2) and it structures us up a little better perhaps.

Time for some experimentation against Hawthorn next weekend

Bobby, I do like the attributes Kersten brings but a CHF he isn't, time to drop the tall forward paranoia and play him on a flank with Walker CHF, for Kersten that's where he should be.
Up the ground enough to use that booming kick, but not central.

 

[meto]

An ability to hold a mark and kick accurately when he gets a chance in the senior team. I think Walker will always be a fall back option rather than the main guy. We are indeed running out of time to find a second tall forward this year but Brown, to my mind, is a better bet. I can understand the alternate view though.

Difficult, but if they use Kersten wide, Walker gives the mongrel and size. It's a conundrum!

 

[nohairandfair]

Difficult, but if they use Kersten wide, Walker gives the mongrel and size. It's a conundrum!

The way the ball is transitioned into the forward 50 means that the classic tall CHF and FF combination is not an absolute necessity.

Although on the small side, Jimmy Bartel with his excellent overhead marking and goal sense could play a lead up role... a half-mongrel role if you will.

 

[meto]

The way the ball is transitioned into the forward 50 means that the classic tall CHF and FF combination is not an absolute necessity.

Although on the small side, Jimmy Bartel with his excellent overhead marking and goal sense could play a lead up role... a half-mongrel role if you will.

Can we afford to place that expectation on Jimmy, I love the courage he plays with, but he's not a CHF...think we all agree on that one!
Having said that, how much do we still rely!.....the bloke's amazing.

What's wrong with Jimmy as a forward pocket?

 

[Seeds]

That won't happen now Simpson is injured and the Hmac/Blicavs combo is working very well.

It's down to Kersten, Walker or Brown unless they do something radical and put Taylor forward (which I doubt will happen).

What? We have been smashed in the clearances the last two games. What definition do you guys use for ruckman working very well? Lots of cheap link up kicks on the half back line is the only one I can think of.

 

[Seeds]

The way the ball is transitioned into the forward 50 means that the classic tall CHF and FF combination is not an absolute necessity.

Although on the small side, Jimmy Bartel with his excellent overhead marking and goal sense could play a lead up role... a half-mongrel role if you will.

That is a heap of rubbish. There were so many times where we were dieing for a big guy to take a big mark between the forward fifty and wing last game it wasn't even funny. Hawkins had to come up to do it a lot of the time leaving no one for him to kick to. A centre half forward is as important these days as it has ever been.

 

[meto]

Jimmy as a forward pocket??.........Can kick'em!

I like what you say 'Seeds'.

 

[you pick one]

With Johnson maybe restricted we won't have the luxury of Jimmy in the forward line he will be required around the ball. FFS just play some one with CHF attributes 196cm+pushing up around 100 kegs who's played the spot before who will compete and if it doesn't work it doesn't work were F---ed anyway.

 

[meto]

With Johnson maybe restricted we won't have the luxury of Jimmy in the forward line he will be required around the ball. FFS just play some one with CHF attributes 196cm+pushing up around 100 kegs who's played the spot before who will compete and if it doesn't work it doesn't work were F---ed anyway.

Beautiful!........I couldn't say it other.

 

[Partridge]

What? We have been smashed in the clearances the last two games. What definition do you guys use for ruckman working very well? Lots of cheap link up kicks on the half back line is the only one I can think of.

Either way it won't be changing. Simpson injured his back last week so he won't be coming back in. We have exactly two fit ruckmen right now and it's McIntosh and Blicavs. They have to play there.

 

[Partridge]

Difficult, but if they use Kersten wide, Walker gives the mongrel and size. It's a conundrum!

The game's changed. It's not the 1970s or even 1980s any more. Mongrel and size alone contributes nothing. An ability to hold marks at senior level and kick the odd goal is infinitely more valuable.

I'm not sure if Walker is the best option, but mongrel is pretty close to the last quality he needs to bring. Better football skills will do me.

 

[meto]

The game's changed. It's not the 1970s or even 1980s any more. Mongrel and size alone contributes nothing. An ability to hold marks at senior level and kick the odd goal is infinitely more valuable.

I'm not sure if Walker is the best option, but mongrel is pretty close to the last quality he needs to bring. Better football skills will do me.

But what I'm suggesting is an option to what we're using,....without success!...what's you're suggestion?