Where Do the Swans Go From Here?

Jul 1, 2013
21,866
18,249
AFL Club
Fremantle
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Fulham, 76ers, Cubs, Bills
AFL is a minnow sport in NSW, here are attendance figures from 2009/2010:



In NSW, nobody cares about Sydney Swans outside of Sydney Swans fans. How many NSW sports fans are sitting at home watching Sydney play compared to how many sat at home and watched Hawthorn vs Geelong tonight in Melbourne, Adelaide, Perth and Hobart? There are probably more AFL fans in Hobart than Sydney, which is astounding given the population differences!

I could be misreading the numbers there - but doesn't AFL check out pretty well when you divide total number by number of clubs? There are 10 NSW NRL clubs right?
And if AFL is level to cricket then it's probably on the right track?
 

Kummerspeck

Cancelled
Pokemon is Life
Sep 12, 2013
5,219
5,356
AFL Club
Sydney
5 years old is not really an eon. You have any data to counter those figures or you just prefer stuff people make up?
Well, I don't really need to. The poster you replied to said the Swans had the largest attendance of any team in any sport in NSW. Demonstrably true with a half second look at attendance figures. You countered by posting total figures on attendance from self-reporting survey from half a decade ago which covers all level of sports above u15s. It's nice that soccer gets a lot of attendees at u/15 and above games, but it's not really relevant to the point SBD was making.
 
They go on the attack from the top down... about bloody time Pridham came out and said what Swans fans have wanted for almost 10 months. Diplomatic channels useless with AFL so the return broadside has FINALLY been delivered by Swans executive.
http://m.sydneyswans.com.au/news/2015-08-14/pridham-calls-for-removal-of-trade-ban

Good luck with that. Seriously. Trade ban was ridiculous (as long as your payments were less than the reducing cap each year you should be able to recruit whoever you want). I enjoy when the AFL admin gets embarrassed.
 
Jul 5, 2012
24,743
40,159
AFL Club
Sydney
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Kidding, right?
AFL is a minnow sport in NSW, here are attendance figures from 2009/2010:



In NSW, nobody cares about Sydney Swans outside of Sydney Swans fans. How many NSW sports fans are sitting at home watching Sydney play compared to how many sat at home and watched Hawthorn vs Geelong tonight in Melbourne, Adelaide, Perth and Hobart? There are probably more AFL fans in Hobart than Sydney, which is astounding given the population differences!
Nonsense. You're the one who said “zero profile in NSW”, and then straight away to try and justify your point you're comparing interest in the Swans in NSW with interest in AFL in other states. Wrong comparison.

Interest in the Swans in NSW may well be small compared to general interest in AFL in other states. But that’s not what you were talking about. Interest in the Swans in NSW is significant, compared to interest in other teams in NSW. That is the salient point here, and it is indisputable.

You don’t get to have the most valuable jersey for sponsor dollars in all Australian sport without offering those sponsors some pretty good return.

BTW the only three national TV audiences in history to break the 3 million mark for the AFL grand final were 05, 06, and 2012. Notice a pattern? I don't have the state-by-state breakdown but it’s ridiculous to assume that that extraordinary fact is only attributable to AFL suddenly appealing to some weird previously undiscovered audiences in the southern states, which strangely vanishes again when the Swans aren't in the Grannie.

Anyway, whatever. Shoot me down in flames, I couldn’t be arsed taking this any further.
 
Feb 24, 2013
45,365
37,740
The GoldenBrown Heart of Victoria
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Hawthorn
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If the past 4 weeks are any gauge, the Swans have gone from accusing every other clubs supporters of being whingers & whiners from their heretofore position of privilege....To the greatest WOE IS ME persecuted sect in the history of the AFL....What another 14 clubs wouldn't do to be in their top 4 position at present.

But NO....This mob must be guaranteed top 2, or the sky is falling....What a bunch of Misbegotten sods they are.
 

hk89

Norm Smith Medallist
Jul 12, 2009
8,503
10,459
Melbourne
AFL Club
Hawthorn
I could be misreading the numbers there - but doesn't AFL check out pretty well when you divide total number by number of clubs? There are 10 NSW NRL clubs right?
And if AFL is level to cricket then it's probably on the right track?

Yes, which was apparently SBD's point. Sydney does ok in raw attendance numbers because NRL/Union are low attendance events. But as a sport as a whole AFL was at least 5 years ago, was a very minor sport compared to NRL in terms of total following in NSW. This lessons the value of Sydney as a sponsorship target, as you are simply not getting the same share of the back pages as NRL is as a whole. Sydney siders will watch the GF if Sydney are in, but I would guess don't give that much of a toss outside the supporter base for the rest of the year. This is party why Sydney had to shut their attempt at a pokies venue a few years back. Nobody wanted to go, because the local league clubs were soaking up all their potential customers and they were possibly the only football club in Australia to lose money on a pokies venue, which ultimately led it to shut down.

I'll take back my 'zero profile in their home state' comment. It was hyperbole. They are the highest profile AFL team in their state, and comparing to individual NRL clubs get good attendance levels, but they are a high profile AFL team in a state where AFL is a very minor sport, and I don't think that makes them as attractive to sponsors as big teams in traditional AFL states are. I'd like to see some data backing up SBD's 'Jersey more valuable for sponsorship dollars than any other jersey in Australian sport' statement, as I don't see how that is possible. Is SBD saying Sydney get more sponsor money than say Hawthorn or Collingwood? I imagine this data is in the club financial reports, is this actually the case?
 

MF

Good Poster, s**t Bloke
Sep 10, 2006
19,610
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If the past 4 weeks are any gauge, the Swans have gone from accusing every other clubs supporters of being whingers & whiners from their heretofore position of privilege....To the greatest WOE IS ME persecuted sect in the history of the AFL....What another 14 clubs wouldn't do to be in their top 4 position at present.

But NO....This mob must be guaranteed top 2, or the sky is falling....What a bunch of Misbegotten sods they are.

Top2? Top spot or nothing.
 
Feb 28, 2007
51,375
66,869
Sydney
AFL Club
Sydney
Yes, because AFL is a tiny sport in NSW. This is my point.

The Swans have much higher average attendance figures that any other NRL club, often double that of NRL clubs. The Swans got 38,000 people to a game on Friday and while that may not be a lot to a Victorian in context I highly doubt any NRL team in Sydney has got a crowd that big this year.
 

hk89

Norm Smith Medallist
Jul 12, 2009
8,503
10,459
Melbourne
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Hawthorn
The Swans have much higher average attendance figures that any other NRL club, often double that of NRL clubs. The Swans got 38,000 people to a game on Friday and while that may not be a lot to a Victorian in context I highly doubt any NRL team in Sydney has got a crowd that big this year.

Yes. Sydney do quite well as an individual club when compared head to head with NRL clubs. It has a reasonable mind share of what is a very minor sport in NSW. If you want to assess the impact of AFL in NSW, go read the sports pages and compare the NRL/Union coverage with the AFL coverage. Sponsors notice the difference too.
 
Feb 28, 2007
51,375
66,869
Sydney
AFL Club
Sydney
Yes. Sydney do quite well as an individual club when compared head to head with NRL clubs. It has a reasonable mind share of what is a very minor sport in NSW. If you want to assess the impact of AFL in NSW, go read the sports pages and compare the NRL/Union coverage with the AFL coverage. Sponsors notice the difference too.

Then why do the Swans have one of the most valuable guernsey's in Australian club sport?
 

deflated

Team Captain
Jul 14, 2004
419
303
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Les Expos
Yes. Sydney do quite well as an individual club when compared head to head with NRL clubs. It has a reasonable mind share of what is a very minor sport in NSW. If you want to assess the impact of AFL in NSW, go read the sports pages and compare the NRL/Union coverage with the AFL coverage. Sponsors notice the difference too.

You keep bringing this up and it just isn't true.

"AFL minor premier Sydney Swans will reap about $15 million in sponsorship revenue this year, believed to be the one of the highest amounts for an Australian sports club."
http://www.afr.com/business/media-a...wans-swoop-for-15m-sponsorship-20140831-jdg88

That's from this time last year. The Swans are one of the best options for sponsor exposure in Australian sport and have some quality, long-term relationships with corporate sponsors. The sponsors believe the fans exist and its rare for corporate money to stick around if the value isn't there.
 

hk89

Norm Smith Medallist
Jul 12, 2009
8,503
10,459
Melbourne
AFL Club
Hawthorn
You keep bringing this up and it just isn't true.

"AFL minor premier Sydney Swans will reap about $15 million in sponsorship revenue this year, believed to be the one of the highest amounts for an Australian sports club."
http://www.afr.com/business/media-a...wans-swoop-for-15m-sponsorship-20140831-jdg88

That's from this time last year. The Swans are one of the best options for sponsor exposure in Australian sport and have some quality, long-term relationships with corporate sponsors. The sponsors believe the fans exist and its rare for corporate money to stick around if the value isn't there.

Fair enough, and I stand corrected. Found this:
http://www.theage.com.au/victoria/a...oy-life-in-the-fast-lane-20150619-ghsmgd.html

According to which Sydney actually outrank Hawthorn for sponsorship revenue, coming 4th in the AFL for sponsorship revenue (although Hawthorn out-profit Sydney comfortably in most years, despite the $2m gap in sponsorship revenue). I'm surprised Sydney do so well given the low AFL interest in their home state, I guess the interest concentrated into 1 club (gws still not really competing) makes up for the lack of general AFL interest.
 
Aug 14, 2011
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:rolleyes: Worse than that COLA bunch.

Selling games interstate = selling your soul. You might as well have merged with Melbourne.

When you don't have enough supporters, enough sponsors, games should be played somewhere they are wanted - too much footy in MELBOURNE is a reality, supply exceeds demand, are you aware of softening crowds numbers Chara1 - just as Geelong have home games in both Melbourne & Geelong, the Hawks have two venues & are supplying fans in Tas with AFL footy. Sad there are some elitist fans that cant see whats good for the game, desperately hanging on to the old concept of home & away games.
 
Aug 14, 2011
44,794
16,853
Trafalgar
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West Coast
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Mclaren Mercedes F1
Fair enough, and I stand corrected. Found this:
http://www.theage.com.au/victoria/a...oy-life-in-the-fast-lane-20150619-ghsmgd.html

According to which Sydney actually outrank Hawthorn for sponsorship revenue, coming 4th in the AFL for sponsorship revenue (although Hawthorn out-profit Sydney comfortably in most years, despite the $2m gap in sponsorship revenue). I'm surprised Sydney do so well given the low AFL interest in their home state, I guess the interest concentrated into 1 club (gws still not really competing) makes up for the lack of general AFL interest.

Sponsorship is a big factor in some clubs financial model, but not all - see West Coast with a more diverse income stream who like North & Freo don't have pokies. Someone said comparisons are odious.
 

Tedeski

Brownlow Medallist
Oct 2, 2006
21,806
26,870
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Mava Fan Cooler
Fair enough, and I stand corrected. Found this:
http://www.theage.com.au/victoria/a...oy-life-in-the-fast-lane-20150619-ghsmgd.html

According to which Sydney actually outrank Hawthorn for sponsorship revenue, coming 4th in the AFL for sponsorship revenue (although Hawthorn out-profit Sydney comfortably in most years, despite the $2m gap in sponsorship revenue). I'm surprised Sydney do so well given the low AFL interest in their home state, I guess the interest concentrated into 1 club (gws still not really competing) makes up for the lack of general AFL interest.

Nothoing better than reading the many Hawk posts on here attempting to dig the boots into anything Swans.
The infatuation with any Swans threads by Hawk supporters is amusing.
Why they feel so threatened is beyond me.

Is it still 2012 burning?
Has to be!
 
Jul 5, 2012
24,743
40,159
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Kidding, right?
If the past 4 weeks are any gauge, the Swans have gone from accusing every other clubs supporters of being whingers & whiners from their heretofore position of privilege....To the greatest WOE IS ME persecuted sect in the history of the AFL....What another 14 clubs wouldn't do to be in their top 4 position at present.

But NO....This mob must be guaranteed top 2, or the sky is falling....What a bunch of Misbegotten sods they are.
Go for it, CHOOSE a jaundiced view of the world. Sheesh.
 

deflated

Team Captain
Jul 14, 2004
419
303
Nowhere near home
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Sydney
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Les Expos
Fair enough, and I stand corrected. Found this:
http://www.theage.com.au/victoria/a...oy-life-in-the-fast-lane-20150619-ghsmgd.html

According to which Sydney actually outrank Hawthorn for sponsorship revenue, coming 4th in the AFL for sponsorship revenue (although Hawthorn out-profit Sydney comfortably in most years, despite the $2m gap in sponsorship revenue). I'm surprised Sydney do so well given the low AFL interest in their home state, I guess the interest concentrated into 1 club (gws still not really competing) makes up for the lack of general AFL interest.

At some point you may want to check your assumptions, assuming a conclusion and working backwards from there is rarely satisfying.
 
Jul 5, 2012
24,743
40,159
AFL Club
Sydney
Other Teams
Kidding, right?
Fair enough, and I stand corrected. Found this:
http://www.theage.com.au/victoria/a...oy-life-in-the-fast-lane-20150619-ghsmgd.html

According to which Sydney actually outrank Hawthorn for sponsorship revenue, coming 4th in the AFL for sponsorship revenue (although Hawthorn out-profit Sydney comfortably in most years, despite the $2m gap in sponsorship revenue). I'm surprised Sydney do so well given the low AFL interest in their home state, I guess the interest concentrated into 1 club (gws still not really competing) makes up for the lack of general AFL interest.
Thank you for being a decent poster. Thank you for being good enough to back away from your initial claim of zero profile in NSW.

I think we can all agree that, whatever the true state of the Swans' profile in NSW (and I'm more than happy to see further discussion of this, to establish the facts), it most certainly is not zero. Last thing I want to get into is some mindless BF pissing contest and I can see you're not like that, unlike some jerks here who clearly have no conception whatsoever of what the Swans faced in Sydney in the first 10-15 years, and what a thoroughly dispiriting time it was for those who were with us from the beginning. They clearly think we just get given premierships every few years at the AFL's pleasure. (Go to the Swans board and you'll find plenty of posters who sincerely believe the AFL is actively trying to destroy us! As always, the truth is somewhere in the middle.)

Yes, I bristled at your first post because I thought "here we go, another of those jerks who want to totally deny how much the Swans have contributed to making this a truly national competition" but you're not like that. Cheers mate.
 

CharacterFirst

Norm Smith Medallist
Feb 25, 2011
5,721
6,034
A wilful, lavish land.
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Geelong
When you don't have enough supporters, enough sponsors, games should be played somewhere they are wanted - too much footy in MELBOURNE is a reality, supply exceeds demand, are you aware of softening crowds numbers Chara1 - just as Geelong have home games in both Melbourne & Geelong, the Hawks have two venues & are supplying fans in Tas with AFL footy. Sad there are some elitist fans that cant see whats good for the game, desperately hanging on to the old concept of home & away games.
Relax. I'm only having a friendly dig at the Hawks. ;)
 
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