Prediction Who will crack the best 22 in 2016.

[One_Wing]

Neale is on his
way to being a clone of Mitchell....

Why because they are both short?

Fairly different kind of players.

 

[wayToGo_]

All we need for inside mids are good hands, and size, strength to get the ball to our outside classy players. Neale is on his
way to being a clone of Mitchell, and Fyfe should play mid/forward.
If Weller is anything like his brother, will be a beast, and will win his own ball, plus huge outside game.
It could be argued that in a few years we will have a better crop of players than Today, especially midfield/flankers, we
haven't even seen yet what Harley brings to the table.
Add Langdon, Blakey, Crozier, I think we will see more retirements, trading to ensure they remain in the fold.

I generally agree with what you are saying, which is why I think Balic would do well as an inside mid. He's a fair bit bigger than our other options (@188cm and still growing) except Blakely. He needs more muscle but he is only 18. He isn't fast but is a great endurance runner (perfect for a follower), has good leap and can take a strong mark (useful as outlet coming out of defence), has good quick hands, seems to find the right options in congestion and is agile so could also run and carry out to clear if the opportunity presents. I think he and Neale would work really well together - Neale right under the ruck, and Balic another step out like Fyfe tends to play. Plus like Fyfe and Bennell he can rotate as a forward and he can kick goals from 50+ which is a big plus. Fyfe is really a utility that has become an elite inside mid, and I think Balic could be moulded the same way. Their size and versatility is what gives us them an advantage against other inside mids.

 

[freoextra]

Here's mine...

As much as I have him last above I think Balic might have the most potential of all our draftees. Once he sorts his wrist out I think they should train him up as a running inside mid that can also play high half forward. He should be following Fyfe around like a shadow, and being a sponge. Think we have plenty of outside running mids coming through but once Mundy and Barlow retire I'm not sure we should just be relying on Blakely improving considerably and stepping up. Way too early to call this really but isn't that what BF is for?

The bolded is my view as well. He is last on most lists at the moment purely based on his preseason unavailability so far. Could rocket to number one if he takes to the AFL structure, just a great size and smooth running style that catches the eye.

 

[M_rash]

The West is reporting A.Pearce has osteitis pubis and will rejoin main group early Feb. Wonder if this opens the door for Collins? Should get a look in for NAB but would he be ahead of SOS for round 1 if Pearce isn't ready to go? Or is MJ & Dawson enough. Can't wait for NAB cup!

 

[scon]

Suspected it might be that with Pearce.Only good thing is that the physio mob have managed it as successfully as you can with several others.
Looking forward to watching NAB games as well,there'd be a couple of candidates looking the make their case,including Collins.

 

[wayToGo_]

Not sure if this is of interest to anyone but was getting a bit sick of hearing how bad our forward line is so decided to analyse (statistically) what was perhaps different when we managed to kick 100ish points in a game last season. As expected, in the 8 games we managed to kick 95 points or more (we won all of them) our forwards overall weren't exceptionally better than they were for the other games in the season. Mayne and Pavlich were better in those 8 games but Walters and Ballantyne actually had better output in games we just won or lost. Taberner had glimpses of good output but was generally well down on the others. As a whole team however we were statistically far better in those 8 games than we were across most other games in the season. In all 4 of our losses we were also well under our normal output.

If you look at the 8 games we had 95 points versus the games we won but kicked far less than 95 it is quite interesting. Fyfe was pretty solid across all he played and true to his attitude even stepped up slightly in the games we just won. Mundy and Sandilands were pretty consistent also. However players like Hill, D.Pearce, Neale, Barlow, Johnson and C.Pearce all provided considerably more (a **** load more!) output statistically (as an average) in those 8 games we scored 95 or more.

This all points to the fact that our forwards are capable of kicking good winning scores if the supply is good. But if those players that are critical to transitioning the ball from defence to our forwards are down on form, or kept out of the game, our scoring potential is diminished considerably. I suspect all the focus on ball movement is because the club has identified the same trends. Let's hope we can extend the form we showed in those 8 games to the full 25 games this season.

 

[DudleyDocker]

Not sure if this is of interest to anyone but was getting a bit sick of hearing how bad our forward line is so decided to analyse (statistically) what was perhaps different when we managed to kick 100ish points in a game last season. As expected, in the 8 games we managed to kick 95 points or more (we won all of them) our forwards overall weren't exceptionally better than they were for the other games in the season. Mayne and Pavlich were better in those 8 games but Walters and Ballantyne actually had better output in games we just won or lost. Taberner had glimpses of good output but was generally well down on the others. As a whole team however we were statistically far better in those 8 games than we were across most other games in the season. In all 4 of our losses we were also well under our normal output.

If you look at the 8 games we had 95 points versus the games we won but kicked far less than 95 it is quite interesting. Fyfe was pretty solid across all he played and true to his attitude even stepped up slightly in the games we just won. Mundy and Sandilands were pretty consistent also. However players like Hill, D.Pearce, Neale, Barlow, Johnson and C.Pearce all provided considerably more (a **** load more!) output statistically (as an average) in those 8 games we scored 95 or more.

This all points to the fact that our forwards are capable of kicking good winning scores if the supply is good. But if those players that are critical to transitioning the ball from defence to our forwards are down on form, or kept out of the game, our scoring potential is diminished considerably. I suspect all the focus on ball movement is because the club has identified the same trends. Let's hope we can extend the form we showed in those 8 games to the full 25 games this season.

Very challenging observations wayToGo_. As always, things are not as simple or clear cut as we armchair critics would like to believe.

I guess that's why the coaching staff get the big bucks.

 

[wayToGo_]

Seems many of us are excited about Collins playing this year. Think he's got the potential to be a combination of McPharlin and Johnson for us. Good closing speed, strong 1-on-1 contested mark, reads the ball really well, great intercept mark, and a bit of run and carry. Future club leader if we can keep him. A potential swingman but suspect he will be more valuable to us down back.

Can see A.Pearce becoming a combination of McPharlin, Johnson and Dawson. Elite endurance, good contested mark, good closing speed, reads the ball well, agile and potential 1%er king. Think is he is far more valuable developing at CHB than trying to swing him forward this year, especially with the interrupted pre-season.

Smith is being groomed as our next negating key defender like Dawson isn't he? I think he was more than serviceable playing on Shulz in that game against Port and he seemed to play the role well for Peel last year. He seems to rack up the disposal numbers but certainly isn't the best kick. If he can improve his kicking efficiency and penetration I think he'll be ok for us.

Add Hurley in the mix next year if he keeps developing like he is and I think our key defender stocks are looking pretty good.

As much as I think some of these guys could play forward I'd probably rather we gave Uebergang a crack instead (as a swingman) and left these guys to focus on keeping our defence rock solid.

2017/18 (post Pav, Johnson & Dawson) - KPD: Collins, A.Pearce, Smith/Hurley, KPF: McCarthy/Hogan, Apeness/Taberner, Uebergang

Are others thinking similarly/differently?

 

[salim malik]

Seems many of us are excited about Collins playing this year. Think he's got the potential to be a combination of McPharlin and Johnson for us. Good closing speed, strong 1-on-1 contested mark, reads the ball really well, great intercept mark, and a bit of run and carry. Future club leader if we can keep him. A potential swingman but suspect he will be more valuable to us down back.

Can see A.Pearce becoming a combination of McPharlin, Johnson and Dawson. Elite endurance, good contested mark, good closing speed, reads the ball well, agile and potential 1%er king. Think is he is far more valuable developing at CHB than trying to swing him forward this year, especially with the interrupted pre-season.

Smith is being groomed as our next negating key defender like Dawson isn't he? I think he was more than serviceable playing on Shulz in that game against Port and he seemed to play the role well for Peel last year. He seems to rack up the disposal numbers but certainly isn't the best kick. If he can improve his kicking efficiency and penetration I think he'll be ok for us.

Add Hurley in the mix next year if he keeps developing like he is and I think our key defender stocks are looking pretty good.

As much as I think some of these guys could play forward I'd probably rather we gave Uebergang a crack instead (as a swingman) and left these guys to focus on keeping our defence rock solid.

2017/18 (post Pav, Johnson & Dawson) - KPD: Collins, A.Pearce, Smith/Hurley, KPF: McCarthy/Hogan, Apeness/Taberner, Uebergang

Are others thinking similarly/differently?

Collins was very impressive today out muscling and out marking Pav at one stage. He could be super important with Pearce and Johnson missing most of the pre.

 

[sherrif]

Seems many of us are excited about Collins playing this year. Think he's got the potential to be a combination of McPharlin and Johnson for us. Good closing speed, strong 1-on-1 contested mark, reads the ball really well, great intercept mark, and a bit of run and carry. Future club leader if we can keep him. A potential swingman but suspect he will be more valuable to us down back.

Can see A.Pearce becoming a combination of McPharlin, Johnson and Dawson. Elite endurance, good contested mark, good closing speed, reads the ball well, agile and potential 1%er king. Think is he is far more valuable developing at CHB than trying to swing him forward this year, especially with the interrupted pre-season.

Smith is being groomed as our next negating key defender like Dawson isn't he? I think he was more than serviceable playing on Shulz in that game against Port and he seemed to play the role well for Peel last year. He seems to rack up the disposal numbers but certainly isn't the best kick. If he can improve his kicking efficiency and penetration I think he'll be ok for us.

Add Hurley in the mix next year if he keeps developing like he is and I think our key defender stocks are looking pretty good.

As much as I think some of these guys could play forward I'd probably rather we gave Uebergang a crack instead (as a swingman) and left these guys to focus on keeping our defence rock solid.

2017/18 (post Pav, Johnson & Dawson) - KPD: Collins, A.Pearce, Smith/Hurley, KPF: McCarthy/Hogan, Apeness/Taberner, Uebergang

Are others thinking similarly/differently?

Smith played on Butcher in the Port game. IMO he actually had a really poor game, but was saved by the fact Burtcher missed four easy shots at goal. Some on the freo board said Smith played well, I disagree.

Collins looks good, but Im yet to see anything close to the McPharlin level of athleticism. Reminds me more of a serviceable type like Richards from Sydney.. Collins is a good kick who does well in one on one contests and he possesses decent, but not outstanding speed.

Sometimes in training reports the positives get overstated. I said Collins looked outstanding ( In a training report), so all Im doing is trying to clarify that outstanding might have been e a bit of an exaggeration. I think he will be a solid,rather than an outstanding player from what I have seen.

In my opinion Hurley will be developed into a forward (where he played his gaelic football) in the long run due to his outstanding athleticism. In the next year or two he will probably play as a negating back.

I agree if we get McCarthy or Hogan our key position stocks are better than advertised.

 

[DannyTheDoorman]

Smith played on Butcher in the Port game. IMO he actually had a really poor game, but was saved by the fact Burtcher missed four easy shots at goal. Some on the freo board said Smith played well, I disagree.

Collins looks good, but Im yet to see anything close to the McPharlin level of athleticism. Reminds me more of a serviceable type like Richards from Sydney.. Collins is a good kick who does well in one on one contests and he possesses decent, but not outstanding speed.

Sometimes in training reports the positives get overstated. I said Collins looked outstanding ( In a training report), so all Im doing is trying to clarify that outstanding might have been e a bit of an exaggeration. I think he will be a solid,rather than an outstanding player from what I have seen.

In my opinion Hurley will be developed into a forward (where he played his gaelic football) in the long run due to his outstanding athleticism. In the next year or two he will probably play as a negating back.

I agree if we get McCarthy or Hogan our key position stocks are better than advertised.

My observation of Collins at training today is that he looks a bit like a slimmer version of Leigh Brown (but much quicker). He has some smarts about him that he has demonstrated in match sims and in the congested play sessions where he uses his body to block out for a teamate after he (Collins) releases the ball.He contests really well in pack situations (as a defender) with the high ball coming in.

sherrif You might want to observe Ubergang in the match sims and kicking sessions next week as he had a good session today and he is a good kick and he is of good size.

 

[wayToGo_]

Smith played on Butcher in the Port game. IMO he actually had a really poor game, but was saved by the fact Burtcher missed four easy shots at goal. Some on the freo board said Smith played well, I disagree.

Collins looks good, but Im yet to see anything close to the McPharlin level of athleticism. Reminds me more of a serviceable type like Richards from Sydney.. Collins is a good kick who does well in one on one contests and he possesses decent, but not outstanding speed.

Sometimes in training reports the positives get overstated. I said Collins looked outstanding ( In a training report), so all Im doing is trying to clarify that outstanding might have been e a bit of an exaggeration. I think he will be a solid,rather than an outstanding player from what I have seen.

In my opinion Hurley will be developed into a forward (where he played his gaelic football) in the long run due to his outstanding athleticism. In the next year or two he will probably play as a negating back.

I agree if we get McCarthy or Hogan our key position stocks are better than advertised.

I think you might find it was Alex Pearce, not Smith playing on Butcher on all of those marks and goal attempts except maybe one (and that one was an awesome grab in amongst a big pack - if Butcher learns to kick straight he'll be pretty amazing for Port). Almost certain Smith was playing on Shulz most of the game. So perhaps that is why you are not agreeing with other people about it because you are getting the two mixed up? Regardless I think he did pretty well given it was his first senior game and those guys had little support with many of the inside 50 entries. Our defensive structure wasn't as tight as normal given most of the team were on debut. I don't remember too many inside 50 marks by either Shulz or Butcher in the second half, so they (Alex and Tanner) must have locked them down a bit better after half time. I'm not sure how you could judge his performance bad in that game given his output.

They tried Hurley forward for Peel in a few games in the middle of the season last year but he seemed a lot more comfortable down back and that's where he ended up playing out the remainder of the season from memory. Agree they might experiment again though. Still liking Uebergang as a prospective third tall forward in the mix more so atm.

I like Collins because of his poise and form in the footage from games I managed to track down more than anything. He really looked good playing for Box Hill last year against AFL quality opponents. He seems to body up well already and can take a contested mark in a pack or a one-on-one. Not suggesting he's a ready made McPharlin replacement but confident he will fill some of the gap left over the coming years.

 

[theGav56]

MacPharlin is one of our greatest players and an outstanding KPP of the comp. But sometimes I feel like it is a bit of a waste having someone as good as him in defence. Obviously he didn't make it as a permanent forward so it was justified, but lesser players can provide pretty good value.

 

[sherrif]

I think you might find it was Alex Pearce, not Smith playing on Butcher on all of those marks and goal attempts except maybe one (and that one was an awesome grab in amongst a big pack - if Butcher learns to kick straight he'll be pretty amazing for Port). Almost certain Smith was playing on Shulz most of the game. So perhaps that is why you are not agreeing with other people about it because you are getting the two mixed up? Regardless I think he did pretty well given it was his first senior game and those guys had little support with many of the inside 50 entries. Our defensive structure wasn't as tight as normal given most of the team were on debut. I don't remember too many inside 50 marks by either Shulz or Butcher in the second half, so they (Alex and Tanner) must have locked them down a bit better after half time. I'm not sure how you could judge his performance bad in that game given his output.

They tried Hurley forward for Peel in a few games in the middle of the season last year but he seemed a lot more comfortable down back and that's where he ended up playing out the remainder of the season from memory. Agree they might experiment again though. Still liking Uebergang as a prospective third tall forward in the mix more so atm.

I like Collins because of his poise and form in the footage from games I managed to track down more than anything. He really looked good playing for Box Hill last year against AFL quality opponents. He seems to body up well already and can take a contested mark in a pack or a one-on-one. Not suggesting he's a ready made McPharlin replacement but confident he will fill some of the gap left over the coming years.

It was definitely Smith on Butcher.. Check the post game thread if you don't believe me. You keep saying stuff where you talk about your view, as being the views of others which is super annoying. But moving on. Hurley played forward after about round 7. One of the guys who comes to training and watches peel games (not a big footy poster, but mates with Salim) had a conversation with him and Hurley said Fyfe looks at his highlights from Gaelic and said 'you're a natural forward.' They played him as a forward for the rest of the year. He definitely covered a ton of ground watching him play. Coulda said it wass 16km in a game from memory. Im confident in the short term Hurley will play back, but with another a year or two he will play forward. His athleticism is super exciting.

 

[wayToGo_]

It was definitely Smith on Butcher.. Check the post game thread if you don't believe me. You keep saying stuff where you talk about your view, as being the views of others which is super annoying. But moving on. Hurley played forward after about round 7. One of the guys who comes to training and watches peel games (not a big footy poster, but mates with Salim) had a conversation with him and Hurley said Fyfe looks at his highlights from Gaelic and said 'you're a natural forward.' They played him as a forward for the rest of the year. He definitely covered a ton of ground watching him play. Coulda said it wass 16km in a game from memory. Im confident in the short term Hurley will play back, but with another a year or two he will play forward. His athleticism is super exciting.

I just checked the actual replay and unless they switched bodies and numbers Alex was definitely playing on Butcher... Alex is #25, Tanner is #22 - please go and check yourself if you still don't believe me. Here's where you can find the footage:

~6:15min mark of first quarter - Alex was playing on Butcher when he marked inside 50 (missed the goal)
~0:48min mark of second quarter - Alex was playing on Butcher when he was paid a free kick inside 50 (missed goal right in front)
~5:40min mark of second quarter - Alex was playing on Butcher when he did a pack mark inside 50 (missed the goal)
~27:34min mark of second quarter - Tanner was playing on Butcher when he made a big pack mark inside 50 (scored a goal)
~19:42min mark of third quarter - Alex was playing on Butcher when he marked inside 50 (missed the goal)
~21:25min mark of final quarter - Alex was playing on Butcher when he was paid a free kick in front of goal (missed the goal)

I'm not going to throw personal insults at you so please refrain from doing so in return - this is now the second time, do we need to delete this series of posts as well? Especially when it is unfounded... I used "I" in every sentence in my post, so not sure how I am implying that I am speaking on behalf of everyone?

 

[sherrif]

I just checked the actual replay and unless they switched bodies and numbers Alex was definitely playing on Butcher... Alex is #25, Tanner is #22 - please go and check yourself if you still don't believe me. Here's where you can find the footage:

~6:15min mark of first quarter - Alex was playing on Butcher when he marked inside 50 (missed the goal)
~0:48min mark of second quarter - Alex was playing on Butcher when he was paid a free kick inside 50 (missed goal right in front)
~5:40min mark of second quarter - Alex was playing on Butcher when he did a pack mark inside 50 (missed the goal)
~27:34min mark of second quarter - Tanner was playing on Butcher when he made a big pack mark inside 50 (scored a goal)
~19:42min mark of third quarter - Alex was playing on Butcher when he marked inside 50 (missed the goal)
~21:25min mark of final quarter - Alex was playing on Butcher when he was paid a free kick in front of goal (missed the goal)

I'm not going to throw personal insults at you so please refrain from doing so in return - this is now the second time, do we need to delete this series of posts as well? Especially when it is unfounded... I used "I" in every sentence in my post, so not sure how I am implying that I am speaking on behalf of everyone?

Ill take your word for it now after the effort you have gone too. I remember having discussions on here about how even Butcher made Smith look bad, while others said he had a good game. I don't have a problem saying then there were a few of us (including me) who were wrong.

Please don't post s**t like this 'So perhaps that is why you are not agreeing with other people about it because you are getting the two mixed up'. It comes across like you think your views speak for everyone.

Ill agree you were right on this one. Moving on.

 

[Schauermann]

Not sure if this is of interest to anyone but was getting a bit sick of hearing how bad our forward line is

I really like to see how we go with both Walters and Ballantyne in top form.

 

[wayToGo_]

Please don't post **** like this 'So perhaps that is why you are not agreeing with other people about it because you are getting the two mixed up'. It comes across like you think your views speak for everyone.

I think you may have taken this completely the wrong way and out of context. I was referring to what you said in your post prior to it: "Some on the freo board said Smith played well, I disagree." - you brought up the other people first and about disagreeing with them. I was just saying that was maybe because you had your wires crossed about who Pearce and Smith were playing on in that game, nothing more. But I do agree, let's move on.

 

[wayToGo_]

I really like to see how we go with both Walters and Ballantyne in top form.

Yes me too. Although it's hard to assess. I don't think it is a coincidence that Pav and Mayne performed better when the ball is coming inside 50 nicely, and Walters and Ballaz sometimes perform better when the ball is coming in sloppy (although Walters was still good regardless - he just stepped up when we needed him to). Perhaps if our ball movement is improving then we might question whether we need two "crumbers". Hawks and WC don't really have any. As much as Ballantyne has been a great player for us and his 2014 was awesome, his 2015 was pretty ordinary and I am starting to think our forward line is needs to grow in a different direction to his style of play. Would slotting Yarran in instead (probably later in the year) give us another body who can make a strong lead, take a contested mark and still be opportunistic as required? Here's hoping Ballaz gets back to his best and Yarran proves he's got the fitness so we have both options at our disposal.

 

[meima]

Yes me too. Although it's hard to assess. I don't think it is a coincidence that Pav and Mayne performed better when the ball is coming inside 50 nicely, and Walters and Ballaz sometimes perform better when the ball is coming in sloppy (although Walters was still good regardless - he just stepped up when we needed him to). Perhaps if our ball movement is improving then we might question whether we need two "crumbers". Hawks and WC don't really have any. As much as Ballantyne has been a great player for us and his 2014 was awesome, his 2015 was pretty ordinary and I am starting to think our forward line is needs to grow in a different direction to his style of play. Would slotting Yarran in instead (probably later in the year) give us another body who can make a strong lead, take a contested mark and still be opportunistic as required? Here's hoping Ballaz gets back to his best and Yarran proves he's got the fitness so we have both options at our disposal.

Nah Ballaz and GU will be the player to watch in 2016, Yarran due to injury will make his impact towards mid season. Stats only show 2015 which is past , the current pre season is more important. Therefore I am not too fuzz young or new recruit player spend some time in wafl if they do not impress in Nab .

 

[PurpleReign]

Nah Ballaz and GU will be the player to watch in 2016, Yarran due to injury will make his impact towards mid season. Stats only show 2015 which is past , the current pre season is more important. Therefore I am not too fuzz young or new recruit player spend some time in wafl if they do not impress in Nab .

That's an interesting assertion M. You watch training way more frequently than me but I do think Gu looks quite spritely this summer. We often talk about the young guys putting pressure on fringe players and I think Gu's training reflects this. I don't care where the improvement comes from, whether it's young guys pushing into the first 22 or mature guys having career best seasons, it's all good. I am a fan of Gu so I hope your prediction comes true.

 

[feds2000]

That's an interesting assertion M. You watch training way more frequently than me but I do think Gu looks quite spritely this summer. We often talk about the young guys putting pressure on fringe players and I think Gu's training reflects this. I don't care where the improvement comes from, whether it's young guys pushing into the first 22 or mature guys having career best seasons, it's all good. I am a fan of Gu so I hope your prediction comes true.

on that dark day when no one could kick straight, one man stood up.......... The Gu.

 

[DannyTheDoorman]

Yes me too. Although it's hard to assess. I don't think it is a coincidence that Pav and Mayne performed better when the ball is coming inside 50 nicely, and Walters and Ballaz sometimes perform better when the ball is coming in sloppy (although Walters was still good regardless - he just stepped up when we needed him to). Perhaps if our ball movement is improving then we might question whether we need two "crumbers". Hawks and WC don't really have any. As much as Ballantyne has been a great player for us and his 2014 was awesome, his 2015 was pretty ordinary and I am starting to think our forward line is needs to grow in a different direction to his style of play. Would slotting Yarran in instead (probably later in the year) give us another body who can make a strong lead, take a contested mark and still be opportunistic as required? Here's hoping Ballaz gets back to his best and Yarran proves he's got the fitness so we have both options at our disposal.

Hi wayToGo_ Go to Dockers website and listen to Lachie Neale's interview from today where he mentions Ballas and Walters coming up into the midfield to chop out for the regular guys to take a breather. Ballas and Walters in the drills today worked through the centre (and I think Sherrif mentioned that in his training report for today). So they will not be full time crummers but will be opportunists IMO when they are playing as forwards.

 

[salim malik]

Hi wayToGo_ Go to Dockers website and listen to Lachie Neale's interview from today where he mentions Ballas and Walters coming up into the midfield to chop out for the regular guys to take a breather. Ballas and Walters in the drills today worked through the centre (and I think Sherrif mentioned that in his training report for today). So they will not be full time crummers but will be opportunists IMO when they are playing as forwards.

Ballas was the clearance ace in the match sims today. No one could lay a glove on him breaking away from the ball up's. Sadly he has not been able to re produce that in the regular season. Fingers crossed this is the year Ballas's joins the midfield Gods.

 

[sherrif]

Ballas was the clearance ace in the match sims today. No one could lay a glove on him breaking away from the ball up's. Sadly he has not been able to re produce that in the regular season. Fingers crossed this is the year Ballas's joins the midfield Gods.

The Hawks obviously rotate their half forwards through the midfield at times. I really, really like the idea of getting Ballaz into the play more in the midfield in short five minute bursts like Hawthorn does with Rioli and Breust. An added bonus is that we would gain someone with the pace to break away from congestion. IMO the Hawthorn centre square structure is two inside mids with one speedster and a ruckman. That structure certainly destroyed West Toast.