Why did Brisbane take Aish?

[pazza]

poor effort by brisbane not to get the kid to put his best foot forward for the rest of the year.

not playing him and they are looking at a second round pick.

I hate that attitude.

Perhaps Aish needs to stop being a sook, earn his place through good form in the NEAFL and then see how he goes.

Why should Brisbane play him if he has no form to warrant his selection?

 

[cotter101]

Gap between Aish and Freeman/Salem/Lennon was and is huge. It's not like they would have been tossing a few lads up for the pick, Aish was just that much better than any of the next best few at the time so it was worth the risk. Cripps and McCarthy wouldn't have been on their radar I doubt.

I'd say McCarthy would have been firmly on our radar. Club thought he was too big a reach at pick 7 when Aish was also available.

 

[Lionheart182]

It is still poor recruiting. They didn't have to take those players , they could have went hard for KPP. I bet they aren't on minimum wage and take a fair chunk of the salary cap. Which is going to cost them in chasing a KPP in the future now.

Right, so what KPP's should we have gone after? Think you'll find we looked very closely at McCarthy with pick 7 two years ago despite him not being rated anywhere near there. Would have been a good option in hindsight but can hardly blame the recruiting staff for that one.

We also had Mitch Clark and Henderson on the list who left for different reasons.

We had Fev, Brown and Bradshaw on the list.

We drafted Michael Close who did a knee and Jono Freeman who is injured until mid year.

We played Dan McStay and Harris Andrews on the weekend up forward, 1st and 2nd year KPP's. We also played Clarke and Gardiner down back who are both also young.

We went hard for Tippet, got screwed over by Melbourne after pretty much securing Hogan a few years back and even went hard for Dawes.

We targeted Crameri who didn't want to leave Melbourne. We went after Ryder last year.We had a trade bust in Jordan Lisle.

We've tried pretty damn hard to get a proven KPF over the past few years but they do not grow on trees. Lack of options and some really bad luck sees us where we are now - still trying through FA and developing our own. And we are already going after Rance and Dixon if you believe the stories in the papers.

Quoting myself to reply to this one.

 

[footycats007]

I don't think it is fair at all to call Aish soft.
Football is a business and players have the right to work the system to the allowed limits.

Family is incredibly important to some people.
If you are away from your family from age 18 to age 25 for example, you are going to miss out on a lot, which you can't get back.

 

[pazza]

I don't think it is fair at all to call Aish soft.
Football is a business and players have the right to work the system to the allowed limits.

Family is incredibly important to some people.
If you are away from your family from age 18 to age 25 for example, you are going to miss out on a lot, which you can't get back.

Doesn't seem to affect the Selwood's. They seem to be a wonderful family able to be with Scott in Perth and then Joel back in Melbourne.

 

[4#Didak#4]

Right, so what KPP's should we have gone after? Think you'll find we looked very closely at McCarthy with pick 7 two years ago despite him not being rated anywhere near there. Would have been a good option in hindsight but can hardly blame the recruiting staff for that one.

We also had Mitch Clark and Henderson on the list who left for different reasons.

We had Fev, Brown and Bradshaw on the list.

We drafted Michael Close who did a knee and Jono Freeman who is injured until mid year.

We played Dan McStay and Harris Andrews on the weekend up forward, 1st and 2nd year KPP's. We also played Clarke and Gardiner down back who are both also young.

We went hard for Tippet, got screwed over by Melbourne after pretty much securing Hogan a few years back and even went hard for Dawes.

We targeted Crameri who didn't want to leave Melbourne. We went after Ryder last year.We had a trade bust in Jordan Lisle.

We've tried pretty damn hard to get a proven KPF over the past few years but they do not grow on trees. Lack of options and some really bad luck sees us where we are now - still trying through FA and developing our own. And we are already going after Rance and Dixon if you believe the stories in the papers.

Coulda, woulda, shoulda.

Its true they are hard to come by (defenders less so though - look how easily GWS got Patful), but that doesn't mean you just give up because you were bad at it or had bad luck. Its a matter of putting yourself in a position so that when that opportunity is there you take it, I can't see where Brisbane has shown enough intent to fill list holes at all.

All decisions have flow on impacts on the list. Beams & Christensen (both whom I rate highly) are not players who will give you success, because you already had players good enough on the list to do this in the midfield. What they do is gobble up a hell of a lot of salary cap and push out young midfielders who will drop off & want out.

All that cap space could have been reserved by signing up and forward loading young gun contracts then going hard for a legitimate KPF gun where you will need that cap space (see the Dogs with Tom Boyd). Target free agent key defenders with spare cash or simply just older competitive bodies. This all becomes difficult to do when a great portion of the salary cap is taken by midfielders.

Dixon is a real good target and should have a crack at him, but he will be asking a lot and someone like Carlton will be mortgaging poor Jeanie Pratt's house to get him if he is available. Hawkins as a free agent is the other who will require wheel barrows of cash. Landing a deal with these guys has been compromised by last years signings, you would be a far better team with Hawkins than with Beams/Christensen/Robbo.

What I can see happening now is you will start selling off some of your young talent to fix list holes. Aish for Butcher (Port Adelaide) could be a possible trade to make something of a bad situation. Butcher is no Dixon/Hawkins but could be part of a functioning forward line at a relatively low cost.

 

[Lionheart182]

Coulda, woulda, shoulda.

Its true they are hard to come by (defenders less so though - look how easily GWS got Patful), but that doesn't mean you just give up because you were bad at it or had bad luck. Its a matter of putting yourself in a position so that when that opportunity is there you take it, I can't see where Brisbane has shown enough intent to fill list holes at all.

All decisions have flow on impacts on the list. Beams & Christensen (both whom I rate highly) are not players who will give you success, because you already had players good enough on the list to do this in the midfield. What they do is gobble up a hell of a lot of salary cap and push out young midfielders who will drop off & want out.

All that cap space could have been reserved by signing up and forward loading young gun contracts then going hard for a legitimate KPF gun where you will need that cap space (see the Dogs with Tom Boyd). Target free agent key defenders with spare cash or simply just older competitive bodies. This all becomes difficult to do when a great portion of the salary cap is taken by midfielders.

Dixon is a real good target and should have a crack at him, but he will be asking a lot and someone like Carlton will be mortgaging poor Jeanie Pratt's house to get him if he is available. Hawkins as a free agent is the other who will require wheel barrows of cash. Landing a deal with these guys has been compromised by last years signings, you would be a far better team with Hawkins than with Beams/Christensen/Robbo.

What I can see happening now is you will start selling off some of your young talent to fix list holes. Aish for Butcher (Port Adelaide) could be a possible trade to make something of a bad situation. Butcher is no Dixon/Hawkins but could be part of a functioning forward line at a relatively low cost.

A lot of this comes across as willfully ignorant considering the effort we have gone to over the past few years to (unsuccessfully) trade for a key forward. If we landed any of those KPF's we would be fine right now but as luck would have it, we missed out on multiple proven players and have lost a couple for different reasons. As for contract loading, I think you will find we have front loaded the s**t out of our new contracts for that very reason and still have a ton left over.

The new recruits haven't compromised anything. Swann himself said he has never seen so much free cap space. It's a matter of getting them to come here, which is the issue. Hence our stockpiling of young key forwards. Expect us to go after a FA or two this year but don't be surprised if we don't land one. It's just the nature of being a struggling team in a non-traditional market.

 

[pazza]

Right, so what KPP's should we have gone after? Think you'll find we looked very closely at McCarthy with pick 7 two years ago despite him not being rated anywhere near there. Would have been a good option in hindsight but can hardly blame the recruiting staff for that one.

We also had Mitch Clark and Henderson on the list who left for different reasons.

We had Fev, Brown and Bradshaw on the list.

We drafted Michael Close who did a knee and Jono Freeman who is injured until mid year.

We played Dan McStay and Harris Andrews on the weekend up forward, 1st and 2nd year KPP's. We also played Clarke and Gardiner down back who are both also young.

We went hard for Tippet, got screwed over by Melbourne after pretty much securing Hogan a few years back and even went hard for Dawes.

We targeted Crameri who didn't want to leave Melbourne. We went after Ryder last year.We had a trade bust in Jordan Lisle.

We've tried pretty damn hard to get a proven KPF over the past few years but they do not grow on trees. Lack of options and some really bad luck sees us where we are now - still trying through FA and developing our own. And we are already going after Rance and Dixon if you believe the stories in the papers.

Plenty around to trade for if you know where to look. Pears at Essendon for one.

 

[Lionheart182]

Plenty around to trade for if you know where to look. Pears at Essendon for one.

Right, but we're after decent players. A third tier key back does not help us long term and stunts the development of our young key backs. I'd say we'll be looking for decent talent or nothing at this point and rightfully so.

 

[ash_78]

Culture of a club can play a part. As a Lions fan I'd be asking whether the club is doing all it can to help these kids settle into their new city and club.

 

[a mayes ing]

Right, but we're after decent players. A third tier key back does not help us long term and stunts the development of our young key backs. I'd say we'll be looking for decent talent or nothing at this point and rightfully so.

Yep, think it was Leppa or Swann that said we will be looking for A grade talent or nothing at all. Pretty happy with that line. Christensen and Beams are A-Grade, robinson aint tho.

Not sure why some Collingwood posters are saying they are taking too much cap space. We have a s**t tone left, barely scraping the 95% and we would have front-loaded the contracts as well. Easily be able to afford at least 2 high quality KPP's

 

[OniAu]

Quoting myself to reply to this one.

You gave away pick 5 when Wright went for pick 8. He now ends up your cross town rival club

 

[cotter101]

You gave away pick 5 when Wright went for pick 8. He now ends up your cross town rival club

To get a local talent. Who added an elite piece to our midfield going forward. I personally didn't rate him all that highly. Few clubs had him around the pick 15 mark.

 

[scoman]

Culture of a club can play a part. As a Lions fan I'd be asking whether the club is doing all it can to help these kids settle into their new city and club.

I will say it again. Every other player from his draft class has bought in and signed extensions. For a number if reasons it is usually the first round picks who feel the need to leave our club not the second round through rookies. Is that culture or something else?

 

[pazza]

I will say it again. Every other player from his draft class has bought in and signed extensions. For a number if reasons it is usually the first round picks who feel the need to leave our club not the second round through rookies. Is that culture or something else?

Good question.

Seems to be a lot of me me me going on.

 

[ash_78]

I will say it again. Every other player from his draft class has bought in and signed extensions. For a number if reasons it is usually the first round picks who feel the need to leave our club not the second round through rookies. Is that culture or something else?

I hope you're right. But aren't the first round picks the ones you need to hang on to? History is repeating - Aish appears unmotivated and unhappy. Why? And what about the high picks from previous years who also were unmotivated and unhappy? I'm not trying to be critical or controversial, but it's far too easy to blame the players. All I'm saying is as a member of the club I'd be very keen to know the club is going above and beyond to make all draftees happy and assimilated.

If you genuinely think it is entitlement and selfishness, then are you satisfied the club is vetting the psychology and personalities of the guys they're drafting?

Whatever the reason, Brisbane needs to learn from it and fix it.

 

[Lionheart182]

You gave away pick 5 when Wright went for pick 8. He now ends up your cross town rival club

When mids of Beams quality want to come to your club, you make room.

 

[iBeng]

You gave away pick 5 when Wright went for pick 8. He now ends up your cross town rival club

We'll do a Bulldogs and sign him next year for a Squillion $$ and give them Rockliff in exchange.

 

[scoman]

I hope you're right. But aren't the first round picks the ones you need to hang on to? History is repeating - Aish appears unmotivated and unhappy. Why? And what about the high picks from previous years who also were unmotivated and unhappy? I'm not trying to be critical or controversial, but it's far too easy to blame the players. All I'm saying is as a member of the club I'd be very keen to know the club is going above and beyond to make all draftees happy and assimilated.

If you genuinely think it is entitlement and selfishness, then are you satisfied the club is vetting the psychology and personalities of the guys they're drafting?

Whatever the reason, Brisbane needs to learn from it and fix it.

Indeed it is the first round and early second rounders we need the most. Why is it that we struggle to keep these? Do they need an extra level of pampering? Maybe...
To be honest I think it is more than just the me, me, me attitude.
These guys are those judged to have the most potential and are more likely to become stars of the game. I don't think they head up here with the intention of bolting at the first opportunity. But over time with enough encouragement from managers, family, friends and (I'm sure) other clubs, they get a hankering for a bigger club or at least one in their home state.
I'm sure there are things our club could do to improve, but you have to remember how attractive some of these other clubs/ cities are, compared to Brisbane for a professional AFL player. Particularly if you are a first round draft pick who has shown a bit at senior level and are a good chance to become a star.

 

[magpielicious]

Um - the question that was asked was "Would you stay in a job you didn't like?". I just pointed out that lots of people do.

That's their choice.
The difference is we have the right to move if we don't like it, AFL players currently don't.
As I said, it will take only one court case to destroy it all.

 

[ash_78]

Indeed it is the first round and early second rounders we need the most. Why is it that we struggle to keep these? Do they need an extra level of pampering? Maybe...
To be honest I think it is more than just the me, me, me attitude.
These guys are those judged to have the most potential and are more likely to become stars of the game. I don't think they head up here with the intention of bolting at the first opportunity. But over time with enough encouragement from managers, family, friends and (I'm sure) other clubs, they get a hankering for a bigger club or at least one in their home state.
I'm sure there are things our club could do to improve, but you have to remember how attractive some of these other clubs/ cities are, compared to Brisbane for a professional AFL player. Particularly if you are a first round draft pick who has shown a bit at senior level and are a good chance to become a star.

It's a good point re influential people in their lives getting in their ears to move. Tricky situation, hopefully the Lions are formulating "countermeasures" of their own to combat this. I'm sure you agree that this is the sort of thinking they're applying, always asking what more they can do to increase their chances of keeping high interstate picks. Sustained years of early picks are the only way to build a successful list.

 

[TW Sherrin]

Draft the best available and back your club to retain them.

 

[baldandbroke]

That's their choice.
The difference is we have the right to move if we don't like it, AFL players currently don't.
As I said, it will take only one court case to destroy it all.

If they don't like the job then quit AFL and go play in a local league somewhere. It is still "playing football".

Do you actually think that there are so many jobs at the pointy end of any industry that people in them can just pick and choose? No way. You want the high paid elite job, then expect to pay the piper in some way.

I keep hearing that "one court case will destroy it all" but I don't think that will happen do you?

 

[peppy la pew]

I don't think it is fair at all to call Aish soft.
Football is a business and players have the right to work the system to the allowed limits.

Family is incredibly important to some people.
If you are away from your family from age 18 to age 25 for example, you are going to miss out on a lot, which you can't get back.

If he didn't want to run the risk of playing interstate, simply don't nominate for the AFL draft.

Trying to work the system in your favour by way of refusing to go interstate, is called draft tampering.

You would be pissed as a Brissie fan if he cited homesickness as a reason for getting out, then ended up at a Melbourne club.

 

[Blackas87]

When mids of Beams quality want to come to your club, you make room.

Could of traded Aish.