The Rendell Fiasco

[ManInTheArena]

Re: Rendell Says the club will only recruit Aboriginals that have one white parent

fairdinkum - there are site rules that cannot be excused simply because people are upset at what has happened. I think I've been very reasonable letting people know what will and will not be accepted rather than simply swinging the hammer.

I'm not exactly sure what people are saying to get your heckles up. Specifically what about the analogies given by posters do you define as racism?

 

[TheLeftFist8]

Re: Rendell Says the club will only recruit Aboriginals that have one white parent

I wonder how Bernie Vince would be treated if he went to Stansbury on the weekend and took to someone he knew with a machete?

 

[aneale]

Re: Rendell Says the club will only recruit Aboriginals that have one white parent

fairdinkum - there are site rules that cannot be excused simply because people are upset at what has happened. I think I've been very reasonable letting people know what will and will not be accepted rather than simply swinging the hammer.

I have no problem with site rules, the issue for me is I have witnessed many a Mod on this site show absolute no legal understanding of what racism is. Like any sentence that includes the word Aboriginal in and then making a statement or opinion automatically makes it racist. Which of course is not true.

 

[aneale]

Re: Rendell Says the club will only recruit Aboriginals that have one white parent

I wonder how Bernie Vince would be treated if he went to Stansbury on the weekend and took to someone he knew with a machete?

wonder how many tickets Rendell has to buy?

 

[rayven]

Re: Rendell Says the club will only recruit Aboriginals that have one white parent

Ben Cousins admitted he was addicted to drugs, right? I don't know the details.

I would prefer we keep Ben Cousins out of it too.


fairdinkum - there are site rules that cannot be excused simply because people are upset at what has happened. I think I've been very reasonable letting people know what will and will not be accepted rather than simply swinging the hammer.

If you look into my posting history you'll see that the last thing I could be accused of is "casual rasism" towards cultures here before the british, so am i allowed to express my opinion and use precedence to back up that or not?

I can't see what bf rules i am breaking if i do, ben cousins never ever was caught breeching the afl doping policy but was hung out to dry where various victorians were and were not hung out to dry.

People are forgetting that the quotes from the victorian article that started this media and intenet frenzy clearly expressed Rendell as speaking as an AFC employee and his clubs policy and as chief recruiter it carried the most weight it could...

Can i speak of how Jason Akermanis was dealt with?

 

[CroCop]

Re: Rendell Says the club will only recruit Aboriginals that have one white parent

Dear Andy D & Jason Mifsud,

Thanks for pointing out our recruiter is racist. You've done everyone a service by taking his honest feedback about the difficulties of drafting Aboriginal kids - and they are kids - and screwing him for it, thereby ensuring you'll never get any honest feedback from recruiters again, when you could have handled it in-house... or even, taken on board his comments. Instead, you threw him under the bus. Mifsud, you list-clogger, great work, you really helped solve this issue. Oh that's right, there's no issue now, because the only person honest enough to tell you what was going on is gone - problem solved!

regards
deaneus

Best comment from someone on here that ive ever read .

In this country we are so concerned about being politically correct. Our work environments are littered with people/management who only say what is the right thing to say and what people want to hear rather than what they actually think. The way out for many people is not to say anything. How can any organisation (including the AFL) improve if society is like this .
Being honest in this country of ours unfortunately will not get you far because as this example shows " the only person honest enough to tell the AFL what was going on is gone"

 

[cmndstab]

Re: Rendell Says the club will only recruit Aboriginals that have one white parent

I thought I'd made it pretty clear, but I'll do so again.

Discussions about what constitutes racism and what doesn't are just generally a bad idea.

The Liam Jurrah issue is a separate one from this issue.

General racism, for example, comments about how "we all know that indigenous players are less reliable than average", are also not on.

I obviously can't detail every case. If you're not sure about something, PM me.

 

[LC40]

Re: Rendell Says the club will only recruit Aboriginals that have one white parent

Oglive deserves his shot.
He didnt get the credit he deserved for some of the big recruiting decisions weve made recently.

Faith you seem to have a source which gives you inside information, are you related to Oglive?
What were those big recruiting decisions you just mentioned?

 

[ManInTheArena]

Re: Rendell Says the club will only recruit Aboriginals that have one white parent

Dear Andy D & Jason Mifsud,

Thanks for pointing out our recruiter is racist. You've done everyone a service by taking his honest feedback about the difficulties of drafting Aboriginal kids - and they are kids - and screwing him for it, thereby ensuring you'll never get any honest feedback from recruiters again, when you could have handled it in-house... or even, taken on board his comments. Instead, you threw him under the bus. Mifsud, you list-clogger, great work, you really helped solve this issue. Oh that's right, there's no issue now, because the only person honest enough to tell you what was going on is gone - problem solved!

I think you and the people you quote are missing the point; it's not what Rendell said, it's that fact that as an AFL recruiter he shouldn't even be thinking it!

Judging a potential recruit (or saying it might come to that) by the fact that they have two aboriginal parents is absolutely stupid and offensive. Rendell is not an idiot for saying what he thought, but for thinking something so stupid in the first place, and then more of an idiot for actually saying it.

 

[cmndstab]

Re: Rendell Says the club will only recruit Aboriginals that have one white parent

aneale - we do the best job we can. I certainly don't have a legal background. If you disagree with how the definition of racism is being interpreted, particularly since you have a legal background, I strongly encourage you to speak with the forum admins about what an appropriate line to draw would be. I've seen many site rules clarified to the mods after such discussions.

 

[FAITH]

Re: Rendell Says the club will only recruit Aboriginals that have one white parent

I wonder how Bernie Vince would be treated if he went to Stansbury on the weekend and took to someone he knew with a machete?

Given he isnt indigenous i doubt Demetriou would be supportive

 

[Dirty Bird]

Re: Rendell Says the club will only recruit Aboriginals that have one white parent

I think you and the people you quote are missing the point; it's not what Rendell said, it's that fact that as an AFL recruiter, he would even be thinking it!

Judging a potential recruit (or saying it might come to that) by the fact that they have two aboriginal parents it absolutely stupid and offensive. Rendell is not an idiot not for saying what he thought, but for thinking something so stupid in the first place, and then more of an idiot for actually saying it.

Why?
Trying to think about the background of a player is quite logical.

It's the strong tradition of the Aboriginie culture that's a worry. THey put family before everything. Some believe 'walk about' is a neccessary thing in their life.

If you were tossing up a player who might want to do that, and a player that doesn't, which would you take if they were equal?

Why take an equal player when they might go hate the seperation from the family and want to leave after 1 year?

The events at home have a high impact on their thoughts, and it could distract their football.

Look, I agree that clubs should think about all the impacts of someones background might have on a player, it makes recruiting from abroad (be it the outback or be it from Ireland) risky.

What I disagree with, is letting this out of the recruiting department at any one club.

This would obviously have a negative impact if it reaches the open, but it's a very serious topic that needs to be considered, racist or not.

 

[FAITH]

Re: Rendell Says the club will only recruit Aboriginals that have one white parent

Faith you seem to have a source which gives you inside information, are you related to Oglive?
What were those big recruiting decisions you just mentioned?

No i dont know the man, but someone from within the club told me that he is rated very highly and some of the big recruiting decisions made recently were because of his persitence.
I said before that he and Rendell were joint at the hip, but rendell got most of the credit for certain decisions.

 

[Stig O'Hara]

Re: Rendell Says the club will only recruit Aboriginals that have one white parent

1) stupid thing to say to Jason Mifsud

2) disgraceful conduct by Misfud to ask for feedback on a particular issue because they have concerns about what going on, to then dob them in and leak info from a private official AFL meeting

3) good luck getting Clubs to honestly discuss why there are changes in recruiting now without fear of being hung out to dry

4) Clearly inspired by Jurrah, Taylor, Wonna, Sampi, Rioli and all the other examples lately, in a risk business you can't be surprised that they weigh up all risks, regardless of how unsavoury it may be. Don't ask Don't tell will be the next AFL mandate.

5) What would the AFL have done if he said 'I don't recruit Irish kids because in 25 years they've all been shit bar 2 and its an expensive waste of time'?

6) he did the right thing and resigned, so the CLub weren't forced to sack him but if I were Triggy privately I'd be taking a sledgehammer to Vlad for making it a story. They could have handled it behind closed doors, now the AFL have a PR nightmare cos they know that a number of Clubs are expressing concern.

Terrific post.

Then it all gets a bit murkier.

Mifsud said several clubs had indicated they had concerns about recruiting Aboriginal players because they could be more difficult to handle.

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/afl/mor...-over-racism-row/story-e6frf9jf-1226301482027

So there are other clubs, or is it individuals, not so overt?

 

[ManInTheArena]

Re: Rendell Says the club will only recruit Aboriginals that have one white parent

So they are practically saying each individual, be they full black or not, should be treated on their own merits and not grouped into that "too hard basket" based on colour

Yes, that's what they are saying. Why would you write off a player based on having aboriginal parents? How does one know the parents, what they do, or how they raised their child? how does one know the character of the child based on their parents colour?

This is why the comment was absolutely stupid.

but then on the one hand if a white player pulled out a Machete would they be treating him individually , of course they would but with Jurrah they have grouped him ( as being from these so called people) and thus have given him a chance . Hope this makes sense

No, it makes absolutely no sense. Someone hit someone in the head with a machete, and I bet it wasn't Jurrah. He wouldn't be back here playing footy if he was the primary suspect in an attempted murder case.

 

[TheTonic]

Re: Rendell Says the club will only recruit Aboriginals that have one white parent

Judging a potential recruit (or saying it might come to that) by the fact that they have two aboriginal parents it absolutely stupid and offensive. Rendell is not an idiot not for saying what he thought, but for thinking something so stupid in the first place, and then more of an idiot for actually saying it.

Ultimately AFL recruiters are judged on their recruiting decisions. In this example 99.999% of people acknowledged that his words were hideously chosen. Furthermore... my feelings are that Rendell is reflecting on his experiences rather than some pre held prejudice. His words I am hoping were loose... but ultimately reflect the anxiety recruiters face when dealing with kids that suffer from serious social issues that are to be placed in an elite environment... completely understandable.

I wil be listening very closely to Matt Rendell's response to this debacle. Having listened to the man many times before it wont take very long at all to determine his feelings behind the words. That is unless he is now a completely broken human being after the treatment dealt him.

 

[rayven]

Re: Rendell Says the club will only recruit Aboriginals that have one white parent

Niel craig in his time often spoke about the type of person he wanted recruited to his club, that type of person i argue is framed amongst other factors around thier home life and the stability of that as it does impact on thier ability to be commited proffesional footballers.

Niel spoke about drafting SA players who couldn't be distingushed with Vic players as terms of ability as the SA player was less likely to be distracted by homesickness and other issues about relocation...

Please tell me how drafting an alice springs full blood who as a teenager is an elder of a tribe full on emacipated by lateral violence not a risk to our buisness and the money that we would invest in the development of that teenager...

Mcleod was deemed to risky for Neesham and thus he traded.....


WE are in a cut throat buisness in very tight economic times.......

We whites make decisions based on the odds, we cut them down as much as possible, it is our culture and rendells been hanged for that..

If anything is intolerant....

 

[macca23]

Re: Rendell Says the club will only recruit Aboriginals that have one white parent

Stabby, you've lost me here with your constant reminders about racism or casual racism whatever that means.

If there has been any racism, it's gone straight over my head, because I can't remember seeing too much of it, if any.

Those people defending Rendell basically are doing so because they don't think he meant his comments to be as racist as they actually were, in the sense that they think he meant that there were likely to be problems drafting aboriginals from remote communities, due to cultural differences etc.

Unfortunately, that's not what he said, and he was a goner once he brought the need for one parent to be white into it - that is racism whether he intended it or not.

I actually agree with those who say that they think Rendell probably didn't mean his comment in a racist sense, but unfortunately for him, intentional or unintentional, once you bring the colour of a man's skin into it you are being racist.

However, the AFL lose a lot of credibility in my eyes if it was actually back in January that Rendell made these comments. Why wasn't it dealt with immediately - it should have been.

You also get the feeling that this matter would have been better dealt with in private rather than making a media circus about it - or was that the intention of the AFL?? That's not to say that the end result wouldn't have been the same for Rendell, but the comments were made to the AFL, not the media.

Sad ending for Matty Rendell, whose main weakness in life has been to honestly say what he is thinking, and unfortunately as he has found out, you can't always do that.

He may be a fool, but he's not a criminal.

Thanks for all you have done in your role Matty. Until now, you have served us well.

 

[footballl]

Re: Rendell Says the club will only recruit Aboriginals that have one white parent

There is obviously a legitimate discussion to be had about the difficulties that indigenous draftees from rural/outback areas face in making the transition to AFL/city life, and how the situation could be improved.

The problem was that Rendell chose to articulate his view in the most vile, offensive and blatantly racist way imaginable. I mean, seriously, having a white parent will will make it easier to integrate into an urban lifestyle? The Australian government once had a similar view and we all know how that ended.

The people jumping up and down about 'political correctness' are disgusting. Obviously we've got a few graduates from the Andrew Bolt school of race relations.

 

[cmndstab]

Re: Rendell Says the club will only recruit Aboriginals that have one white parent

Stabby, you've lost me here with your constant reminders about racism or casual racism whatever that means.

If there has been any racism, it's gone straight over my head, because I can't remember seeing too much of it, if any.

I've deleted many posts m23, most of them within a minute of them being posted. That would be why you haven't seen them. Some were very much racist, some were more subtly so, but I'd rather not have to make the distinction. Racism full stop is not acceptable here.

As for my constant reminders, I'd rather have just mentioned it once, but I have been asked to clarify it several times. I could have sent a PM reply but in the interest of covering as many bases as possible I've replied in the thread. Probably an error, but it's what I did.

Those people defending Rendell basically are doing so because they don't think he meant his comments to be as racist as they actually were, in the sense that they think he meant that there were likely to be problems drafting aboriginals from remote communities, due to cultural differences etc.

I agree with these sentiments. I believe that Rendell was most likely taken out of context. I have no issue with people debating that issue.

This is a far cry from much of what has been posted in this thread, however.

 

[macca23]

Re: Rendell Says the club will only recruit Aboriginals that have one white parent

I've deleted many posts m23, most of them within a minute of them being posted. That would be why you haven't seen them. Some were very much racist, some were more subtly so, but I'd rather not have to make the distinction. Racism full stop is not acceptable here.

Fair comment Stabby. Play on!!

 

[ManInTheArena]

Re: Rendell Says the club will only recruit Aboriginals that have one white parent

but ultimately reflect the anxiety recruiters face when dealing with kids that suffer from serious social issues that are to be placed in an elite environment...

If that's what he was trying to convey then why did it pop-up in a forum about aboriginals and why did he bring aboriginals into it?

It seems to me that what he was trying to convey is that aboriginals with two aboriginal parents are prone to serious socials issues and homesickness etc. and therefore a risk to recruit. It's a stupid thing to apply in a recruiting context and even more stupid to say. Every person should be judged on their own merits and merits don't need to be pre-judged before interacting with the person. "Who are their parents?" is a stupid way to begin assessing a persons character.

I have a dream that my four little children will one day live in a nation where they will not be judged by the color of their skin but by the content of their character.

 

[rayven]

Re: Rendell Says the club will only recruit Aboriginals that have one white parent

Fair comment Stabby. Play on!!

Seconded...

 

[Magma]

Re: Rendell Says the club will only recruit Aboriginals that have one white parent

well, at least out of all this i found out who jason mifsud is. every cloud as they say.

 

[OldCrowBloke]

Re: Rendell Says the club will only recruit Aboriginals that have one white parent

People like you who foolishly labelled people a disgrace for absolutely nothing comments are the reason people fantastic at their job get sacked for stupid reasons.

It is ridiculous. He said what probably every clubs recruiting department was thinking. What he said is a legitimate concern given events in the past. Aboriginal players from strictly aboriginal families and communities need to be looked at very closely and they rarely work out.
...

The stupidity lies squarely with the person who made the comment.

What evidence do you have to support your sweeping generality about aboriginal players?