Labor MP accused of rorting union credit Part II

[tazzietiger]

Mod edit - This topic continues on from here: http://www.bigfooty.com/forum/showthread.php?t=561229

And which minister at the time created the basis for this farce?

Hopefully the NSW cops can sidestep this pile of s**t and lay charges soon over the printer Amex cards.

That case should be clear cut and won't require the FWA arse clowns or dodgy HSU records.

As Richo said tonight on sky this farce will give an Abbott lead govt the perfect opportunity to replace FWA.

 

[King Elvis]

Re: Labor MP accused of rorting union credit

FWAs management is surely untenable now?

 

[Stumpy Pete]

Re: Labor MP accused of rorting union credit

FWAs management is surely untenable now?

Unless she gets out of there toot suite Bernadette O'neill is up for another grilling and Senate Estimates.

FWA = F&*$ing Worthless Agency?

Regards

S. Pete

 

[Contra Mundum]

Re: Labor MP accused of rorting union credit

This has turned out to be a bigger farce than what I ever expected. My main criticism of the investigation was how long it has taken but the recent developments has took it to a new level of incompetents. Even the ACTU is now trying to distance itself it seems.

The ACTU position is bullshit - it punishes those branches and members who have been asking the hard questions at the National Executive of the HSUA for years. I cannot believe that those Unions who put money and resources into Craig Thompson's pre-selection and election bid now want to punish the ****ing poor innocent HSU members and the leadership of the vocal minority of the leadership of the Union who have always acted in an above board manner

 

[Contra Mundum]

Re: Labor MP accused of rorting union credit

Unless she gets out of there toot suite Bernadette O'neill is up for another grilling and Senate Estimates.

FWA = F&*$ing Worthless Agency?

Regards

S. Pete

Bernadette is a good person who has taken over an job that involves a buffet of s**t sandwiches - things have really moved along since she took over

 

[Contra Mundum]

Re: Labor MP accused of rorting union credit

As Richo said tonight on sky this farce will give an Abbott lead govt the perfect opportunity to replace FWA.

The Tribunal and the Agency who oversees the ROs are different things. We all advised Labor that their bullshit "one stop shop" argument about calling everything Fair Work Australia was going to cause problems - now the Tribunal which is a great Australian institution is collateral damage for something that is not its fault

 

[Subprime]

Re: Labor MP accused of rorting union credit

Pretty good summary by Michelle Gratton here...


WHAT a total farce! Fair Work Australia, after its investigation - done in tortoise-time - of allegations of rorting by Craig Thomson and others has now presented the Director of Public Prosecution with a load of unusable material.

...

As for Julia Gillard, her constant refusal - repeated yesterday - to say whether FWA should release its report is not, as she insists, upholding that body's independence, but giving the appearance she wants the facts of the Thomson affair hidden.


Read more: http://www.theage.com.au/opinion/po...for-the-dpp-20120404-1wdab.html#ixzz1r7d2EANB

 

[Contra Mundum]

Re: Labor MP accused of rorting union credit

So after inexplicably taking years to "investigate" this, FWA has now (deliberately?) handed the DPP a report they can't use.

Brilliant....!


To think that if Thomson had simply fessed up and apologised and payed the money back when the scandal broke, the issue would be dead and buried long before now.

The story in the press is a Murdoch beat up. Of course a prosecutorial agency cannot investigate, so much is self evident, but they can determine whether the evidence that FWA has collected is enough to prosecute or whether further investigation is required

 

[Contra Mundum]

Re: Labor MP accused of rorting union credit

False. The DPP cannot start a criminal prosecution because FWA did not conduct a criminal investigation.



Bernadette O"Neil should be haulled over the coals by a Parliamentary comminttee for what appears to be gross incompetency. Firstly in the length of time taken to investigate the matter. And now for stating that it is up to the DPP to consider whether to raise criminal charges - but the DPP can't do this because of the nature of the FWA report.

Given that the DPP cannot either make a criminal investigation nor initiate a criminal prosecution the evidence should be passed to the police.

The FWA took evidence on oath - now if you are saying this cannot be used in a criminal prosecution then you are poorly mistaken. I am not defending the bullshit delay by the way.

 

[cancat]

Re: Labor MP accused of rorting union credit

The FWA took evidence on oath - now if you are saying this cannot be used in a criminal prosecution then you are poorly mistaken. I am not defending the bullshit delay by the way.

Who will initiate the criminal prosecution? The police have been refused access to the evidence. The DPP is saying it cannot start a criminal prosecution because a criminal investigation was not carried out.

O'Neill said the FWA did not seek to establish any particular likelihood of criminal conduct because that was the job of the DPP. That appears to be a fundamental error.

 

[Stumpy Pete]

Re: Labor MP accused of rorting union credit

Bernadette is a good person who has taken over an job that involves a buffet of s**t sandwiches - things have really moved along since she took over

Contra,

Good person or not (and I am making no value judgement about her) she is in for a tough time from Abetz and Co. There will be little she can do to avoid looking evasive, indecisive or incompetent.

Anyway, this is really never going to be about criminal proceddings or even civil proceedings. Once the details are revealed, should it be reasonably clear that Thomson used Union funds for illegitimate purposes then the ALP will be under ongoing intense pressure to dump him on the basis that he was ripping of workers in the health services industry.

Regards

S. Pete

 

[King Elvis]

Re: Labor MP accused of rorting union credit

The story in the press is a Murdoch beat up. Of course a prosecutorial agency cannot investigate, so much is self evident, but they can determine whether the evidence that FWA has collected is enough to prosecute or whether further investigation is required

Contra is there anything preventing FWA from providing a brief of evidence, as Abbott is demanding?

Tony Abbott last night declared FWA must produce a proper brief of evidence for the CDPP or hire a firm of solicitors to prepare one on its behalf.

"This is not rocket science," Mr Abbott told The Australian.

"This must happen if justice is to be done. If it does not happen people will be entitled to conclude that this is not just an institutional go-slow but a protection racket."

And the FWA 'expressly states' that they're required to disclose evidence to Police conducting investigations, yet...

Ms O'Neill did not answer questions about what actions she would now take following Mr Craigie's rejection of her report, including whether she would now relent and co-operate with police.

This whole thing is a joke.

 

[Visions]

Re: Labor MP accused of rorting union credit

This is just going to make it worse for Labor next year. In the back of voter's minds will be the lengths FWA and the Labor party went to stonewall Thompson's removal.

It would have been better to cut him loose, even if it cost them power. Now they'll enjoy the mother of all hidings.

Exactly, this is a better result for the Coalition than they could have imagined. Any case and result against Thompson wouldn't take place before the next election as it is, this makes is look like a huge cover up involving Labor with their denials which I'm sure Abbott and Co. will have no problem driving home to the electorate. Labor will help them every step of the way.

As Richo said tonight on sky this farce will give an Abbott lead govt the perfect opportunity to replace FWA.

I think independent senator Nick Xenophon says it best.

'There's now a new phrase in Australian colloquialism to describe working hard for years but producing a useless result - it's called doing sweet FWA,' he told AAP.

 

[Contra Mundum]

Re: Labor MP accused of rorting union credit

Contra,

Good person or not (and I am making no value judgement about her) she is in for a tough time from Abetz and Co. There will be little she can do to avoid looking evasive, indecisive or incompetent.

Anyway, this is really never going to be about criminal proceddings or even civil proceedings. Once the details are revealed, should it be reasonably clear that Thomson used Union funds for illegitimate purposes then the ALP will be under ongoing intense pressure to dump him on the basis that he was ripping of workers in the health services industry.

Regards

S. Pete

No argument with this brother. but if you examine the transcript before Eric last time she was not evasive she answered all the questions put to her honestly. What is terrible is that Thompson's branch is includes the Age Care Sector which is the lowest paid in the Health industry.

 

[jo172]

Re: Labor MP accused of rorting union credit

I think independent senator Nick Xenophon says it best.

'There's now a new phrase in Australian colloquialism to describe working hard for years but producing a useless result - it's called doing sweet FWA,' he told AAP.

Haha, not bad Nick

 

[King Elvis]

Re: Labor MP accused of rorting union credit

Decent line that.

I hope Thompson is ready to be a celebrity, because I suspect he's going to feature extremely heavily in Liberal Electoral advertising.

 

[Contra Mundum]

The whole thing is desperately sad.

 

[jo172]

Can someone explain to me on what planet it's acceptable for the HSU to be suspended from the HSU while Craig Thomson is allowed to remain in the Labor Caucus let alone Federal Parliament?

 

[pazza]

Re: Labor MP accused of rorting union credit

Decent line that.

I hope Thompson is ready to be a celebrity, because I suspect he's going to feature extremely heavily in Liberal Electoral advertising.

Be wary of legal action from Thomson if that is the case...anyone know how to spell injunction? and for those who don't think he would, he would have a case as he has had nothing proven against him. That could seriously backfire on the Coalition using Thomson in any advertising.

Perhaps it is now best for all concerned if we all just move on.

 

[jo172]

Re: Labor MP accused of rorting union credit

Be wary of legal action from Thomson if that is the case...anyone know how to spell injunction?

Perhaps it is now best for all concerned if we all just move on.

He can't get an injunction on the grounds something might be defamatory. He can try and get damages after he proves it.

EDIT - Let alone the whole implied freedom of political communication notion.

What a thoroughly absurd post.

 

[Eagle87]

Re: Labor MP accused of rorting union credit

Be wary of legal action from Thomson if that is the case...anyone know how to spell injunction? and for those who don't think he would, he would have a case as he has had nothing proven against him. That could seriously backfire on the Coalition using Thomson in any advertising.

Perhaps it is now best for all concerned if we all just move on.

**** your funny pazza ... "move on" you say? Perhaps if the Government and various "independent" bodies didn't act like they were in the middle of the most blatant banana republic style cover up, then everyone would move on ...

but you hang in there with the poms poms pazza ... its funny that you reckon Thomson seeking injunctive relief in the hypothetical outlined would discourage the opposition. it would have the opposite effect i suggest.

 

[pazza]

Re: Labor MP accused of rorting union credit

**** your funny pazza ... "move on" you say? Perhaps if the Government and various "independent" bodies didn't act like they were in the middle of the most blatant banana republic style cover up, then everyone would move on ...

but you hang in there with the poms poms pazza ... its funny that you reckon Thomson seeking injunctive relief in the hypothetical outlined would discourage the opposition. it would have the opposite effect i suggest.

He would if the ad went on air...so he would seek an injunction to remove it from the airwaves and newspapers thereby cancelling the attack upon him. The Opposition would be forced into the removal of the advertising and the references to Thomson by the courts.

 

[jo172]

Re: Labor MP accused of rorting union credit

He would if the ad went on air...so he would seek an injunction to remove it from the airwaves and newspapers thereby cancelling the attack upon him. The Opposition would be forced into the removal of the advertising and the references to Thomson by the courts.

But how? On what grounds?

Honestly read Lange v ABC and then learn something about remedies for defamation.

This is beyond misleading.

 

[Eagle87]

Re: Labor MP accused of rorting union credit

He would if the ad went on air...so he would seek an injunction to remove it from the airwaves and newspapers thereby cancelling the attack upon him. The Opposition would be forced into the removal of the advertising and the references to Thomson by the courts.

You hang in there pazza. Tough times ahead ....

 

[pazza]

Re: Labor MP accused of rorting union credit

But how? On what grounds?

Honestly read Lange v ABC and then learn something about remedies for defamation.

This is beyond misleading.

By putting information out there that has not actually been proven formally did occur (as in be tested in the legal system) and using that information as abasis to attack a person.

We all know about injunctions - remember Channel 7 obtaining that information about the players at Hawthorn and drug use (yes that one!!). Injunction was obtained by Hawthorn and the AFL and despite people knowing about it, the information has not been made public.

Thomson is well within his rights to seek an injunction against the Liberal Party should it put this information into an attack ad using the same principle.