Dear West Coast,
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I only know it due to being forced to watch Dead Poets Society for year 8 English.
I think the problem is other teams worked out the Weagles Web after Hawks showed how to.
Our players copped a smashing mentally.
We have tinkered with the game plan and its not coming together, players have lost confidence with the system.
When we have Naitanui dominating hit outs our mids run to attacking positions. Having him out is a major shift in midfield set ups, we must defend aroung stoppages.....which is both a positive and a negative.
Our current game plan is a kicking to advantage plan. Not a play on quickly and run and carry using handball. Thats why we lose the total possession stat and uncontested possession stat.
Both recruits had injuries preseason and haven't done much, losing Sheed for the season so far hasn't helped.
I've seen it before but maybe we should flip the switch and go run and handball crazy and attack. No more stop start kicking.
Our players copped a smashing mentally.
We have tinkered with the game plan and its not coming together, players have lost confidence with the system.
When we have Naitanui dominating hit outs our mids run to attacking positions. Having him out is a major shift in midfield set ups, we must defend aroung stoppages.....which is both a positive and a negative.
Our current game plan is a kicking to advantage plan. Not a play on quickly and run and carry using handball. Thats why we lose the total possession stat and uncontested possession stat.
Both recruits had injuries preseason and haven't done much, losing Sheed for the season so far hasn't helped.
I've seen it before but maybe we should flip the switch and go run and handball crazy and attack. No more stop start kicking.
Okay, I'll bite.
In the six weeks leading up to surgery Naitanui was in the best two or so West Coast players against Port Adelaide, St Kilda and Geelong. He was also in the best handful of West Coast players against Gold Coast. His ruckwork in the Adelaide game was exceptional but wasted on our mids time and time again and he was the only who seemed to give a damn in that last quarter.
Before the Bulldogs game I would've thought he was obvious choice for AA ruck.
I'm not sure how you concocted your reality about Naitanui's previous six games but it is severely inaccurate in my opinion.
Biggie
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Quality post Keys.
I've taken this fall from top form hard, had some real melts & even been labelled a sook.
But there have been worrying signs all season. That hard 2 way running, helping mates out, it's not there, it's non existent. It's deflating.
I remember when we used lock the ball inside 50. Now it comes out way easier than a lady of the night from Kings Cross.
Still, every weekend, I hold out hope that this changes. Let's start this weeks v Pies at the G.
Carn Eagles.
I've taken this fall from top form hard, had some real melts & even been labelled a sook.
But there have been worrying signs all season. That hard 2 way running, helping mates out, it's not there, it's non existent. It's deflating.
I remember when we used lock the ball inside 50. Now it comes out way easier than a lady of the night from Kings Cross.
Still, every weekend, I hold out hope that this changes. Let's start this weeks v Pies at the G.
Carn Eagles.
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Great post, hope you sent it to Nisbett Keys.
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Nisbett's above reading what the fans thinkGreat post, hope you sent it to Nisbett Keys.
To be honest I was happy. That was a dirty win that we didn't deserve and teams have had them against us and we got one. Hawthorn's start to the year was built on them.
There is a battle and it all comes down to moments. Vince slipping on his arse helped at a key point but Hurn, Barrassment Panda & Gov all took many match saving marks in tough situations which I liked.
We were outplayed and I think there is something to be gained by being down and having to work your way back into a game as opposed to our usual modus operandi this year which has been to build a match winning lead and watch it wither away.
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FatPizza
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We watched Chant of Jimmy Blacksmith. Very enlightening.
Im surprised this has come from Keyser as he has been telling everyone who has been saying that something is wrong to stop being so Chicken Little.
From the star of the year:
Bringing in Emac just because was an issue for me. Our backline was not the issue at all last year and just plonking another tall in it who has no ability to rebound, average skills and coming back from a reco so wouldn't be in tip top shape seemed a tad WTF? But he is a former B&F winner, nearly made the AA team etc so he should be picked is an archaic way of looking at it to me.
He should have been put in East Perth to build fitness confidence and then have to knock out or wait for injury to McGovern & Schofield. Or wait for the teams that have 3 big forwards i.e. Adelaide.
Playing Redden after the Hernia operation from the start. He couldn't have been doing weights, he couldn't have been pushing himself after that kind of surgery. What would have been wrong with him starting the year at East Perth?
I remember leaving the Brisbane game after round 1 and thinking these guys think its just going to happen again. It was Hollywood footy against a very s**t team and let them score over 100 points.
After a few games:
Bringing Hutch back and playing a team that consisted of Hutchings, Redden & Priddis was horrible. 2 had a reason to not to be other, Redden perhaps could have been rested earlier and Priddis should have been forced out for more time with that injury he had around round 3-4, instead of just 1 game.
I dont mind persisting with Duggan as he is part of midfield going forward. But it started to look a bit top heavy in the we are persisting with Priddis (hampered by injury), Redden (hampered by no pre-season), Mackenzie (hampered by form and confidence), NN (hampered by inflammation) , Duggan (hampered by second year), Lecras (form), Gaff (form). I think you can persist with form issues and youth to an extent but when you throw some injury management on top of it after round 4 you making harder for yourself the it need be.
I think we are too stagnant with our best 22. If you are over a certain age and have played regularly with us you are more than likely to keep your spot no matter what. I think you do have to have a best 25- 30 and we are well short of that and have very little confidence in that group as we prefer to play under done out of form seniors than give others a go or change things up.
Dropping Jetta for our poor performances. He was scapegoated and as we saw after his dropping very little changed with the team.When we get flogged in away games blaming them on the guy who relies on the team to be up and about is never going to work. You need to look at who gets the team up and about and determine if they are holding their own. Was and still is shuffling deck chairs on the Titanic.
Where we are now or as the mainboard would prefer: Where are the Eagles at?
I think we are where we deserve to be. Although we haven't set the world on fire we haven't lost as many winnable games as Sydney, Bulldogs, Geelong, GWS with the 4th quarter fade out against the Crows being our only real stumble.
Our form is currently pretty shocking though and I wouldn't back us at Subi at the moment against most of those contenders. But what to change?
A return the smaller defence would be a start. Gov & Barrass the only talls. I think we should go with 2 ruckman regardless of NN's injury. So Giles plays until NN is back. As all of the makeshift fixes like Gov to ruck & Brown rucking are just not going to work.
The ruck who isn't rucking needs to be forward. I think Darling works best as the 3rd tall. Lycett is a pretty decent forward and would like him to be there permanently when not rucking.
Not playing anymore than 1 of Priddis, Redden or Hutchings. If Priddis is the incumbent then so be it. But don't play the other because they are of certain age and should be getting a game to hell with the balance of the team. I had no problem with Simpson playing the 3 rucks to give Lycett the game as we weren't a chance and could barely make finals if at all. But now we probably shouldn't do that.
Back other players in. Don't make it like some guy coming off of a surgery performing at 60% is definitely better than trying a younger player in his position.
Dont blame fringe players for poor performances. The core of a group have the biggest say on how it performs, blaming the new guy or the young guy isn't being realistic IMO. Unless you can pinpoint that its his man that is free and he isn't pulling his weight defensively or that when he gets the ball he butchers it but hey when you can point to senior players who do that why blame the new/young guy?
From the star of the year:
Bringing in Emac just because was an issue for me. Our backline was not the issue at all last year and just plonking another tall in it who has no ability to rebound, average skills and coming back from a reco so wouldn't be in tip top shape seemed a tad WTF? But he is a former B&F winner, nearly made the AA team etc so he should be picked is an archaic way of looking at it to me.
He should have been put in East Perth to build fitness confidence and then have to knock out or wait for injury to McGovern & Schofield. Or wait for the teams that have 3 big forwards i.e. Adelaide.
Playing Redden after the Hernia operation from the start. He couldn't have been doing weights, he couldn't have been pushing himself after that kind of surgery. What would have been wrong with him starting the year at East Perth?
I remember leaving the Brisbane game after round 1 and thinking these guys think its just going to happen again. It was Hollywood footy against a very s**t team and let them score over 100 points.
After a few games:
Bringing Hutch back and playing a team that consisted of Hutchings, Redden & Priddis was horrible. 2 had a reason to not to be other, Redden perhaps could have been rested earlier and Priddis should have been forced out for more time with that injury he had around round 3-4, instead of just 1 game.
I dont mind persisting with Duggan as he is part of midfield going forward. But it started to look a bit top heavy in the we are persisting with Priddis (hampered by injury), Redden (hampered by no pre-season), Mackenzie (hampered by form and confidence), NN (hampered by inflammation) , Duggan (hampered by second year), Lecras (form), Gaff (form). I think you can persist with form issues and youth to an extent but when you throw some injury management on top of it after round 4 you making harder for yourself the it need be.
I think we are too stagnant with our best 22. If you are over a certain age and have played regularly with us you are more than likely to keep your spot no matter what. I think you do have to have a best 25- 30 and we are well short of that and have very little confidence in that group as we prefer to play under done out of form seniors than give others a go or change things up.
Dropping Jetta for our poor performances. He was scapegoated and as we saw after his dropping very little changed with the team.When we get flogged in away games blaming them on the guy who relies on the team to be up and about is never going to work. You need to look at who gets the team up and about and determine if they are holding their own. Was and still is shuffling deck chairs on the Titanic.
Where we are now or as the mainboard would prefer: Where are the Eagles at?
I think we are where we deserve to be. Although we haven't set the world on fire we haven't lost as many winnable games as Sydney, Bulldogs, Geelong, GWS with the 4th quarter fade out against the Crows being our only real stumble.
Our form is currently pretty shocking though and I wouldn't back us at Subi at the moment against most of those contenders. But what to change?
A return the smaller defence would be a start. Gov & Barrass the only talls. I think we should go with 2 ruckman regardless of NN's injury. So Giles plays until NN is back. As all of the makeshift fixes like Gov to ruck & Brown rucking are just not going to work.
The ruck who isn't rucking needs to be forward. I think Darling works best as the 3rd tall. Lycett is a pretty decent forward and would like him to be there permanently when not rucking.
Not playing anymore than 1 of Priddis, Redden or Hutchings. If Priddis is the incumbent then so be it. But don't play the other because they are of certain age and should be getting a game to hell with the balance of the team. I had no problem with Simpson playing the 3 rucks to give Lycett the game as we weren't a chance and could barely make finals if at all. But now we probably shouldn't do that.
Back other players in. Don't make it like some guy coming off of a surgery performing at 60% is definitely better than trying a younger player in his position.
Dont blame fringe players for poor performances. The core of a group have the biggest say on how it performs, blaming the new guy or the young guy isn't being realistic IMO. Unless you can pinpoint that its his man that is free and he isn't pulling his weight defensively or that when he gets the ball he butchers it but hey when you can point to senior players who do that why blame the new/young guy?
Yamumluvsbigcox
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6 weeks was off the top of my head so I checked
It was last 5 weeks before surgery
I agree he was killing it at the start of the season then it was obvious he couldn't run jump or chase properly .
First 7 games average 15 possessions
Last 5 before his surgery average 9 possessions
Geelong game only 23 hit outs against blizcavs and Smith . If fit he should have toweled them up . Was still a good game
Port he was against Trengove who isn't even a ruck . Had a lot of hit outs against poor opposition
bulldogs only 6 touches but had good hit out numbers against poor opposition
Suns only 8 touches . Lycett had a gun game not nic
It was just how I remember it but looking back I'm pretty much on the money with a sharp decline in his last 5 weeks .
Maybe you should check your own reality mate before you ' bite ' next time
The team looks devoid of any type of urgency. Always seem to be in second gear or a step or two behind most weeks. The team got punched in the mouth on Grand Final day and haven't been the same since.
He can share all he likes - we have gone from precision ball movement back to bang it on the boot. Spray and pray.
Came here to post basically this.
Most of 2014 and first quarter of 2015, we looked the same as we do now. Then the web structure came in and suddenly it looked like the coaches had finally gotten the most of our personnel.
The players had supreme confidence in the system, and it culminated in the defeat of Hawthorn in the Qualifying Final.
Then it got completely obliterated three weeks later.
And it looks as though since then the players don't trust the system anymore. Simpson didnt want to tweak the structure too much over the off season, but had to try bring Mackenzie back (and Mackenzie doesn't seem comfortable with the zone at all).
Whatever Simpson tweaked over the off season, it seems as though it either hasn't worked or it hasn't been translated properly because apart from McGovern everyone looks confused out there.
We've lost the hunt because I reckon the players don't believe
One thing I have noticed this year and it happens every year is that other teams are copying the web.
The Crows certainly are and it's working for them. Problem is that this year everyone is doing it better than us.
Also with less rotations this year the game has become a bit more of a contested scrap like seasons past, and as we have all noticed we aren't a very good contested team, all around the ground not just in the midfield.
This is what makes the Hawks so good. They have blokes who can win (and back each other to win) in a contest.
They have 22 who can do this we have a handful.
The game has changed since last year and we've been left wanting.
The Crows certainly are and it's working for them. Problem is that this year everyone is doing it better than us.
Also with less rotations this year the game has become a bit more of a contested scrap like seasons past, and as we have all noticed we aren't a very good contested team, all around the ground not just in the midfield.
This is what makes the Hawks so good. They have blokes who can win (and back each other to win) in a contest.
They have 22 who can do this we have a handful.
The game has changed since last year and we've been left wanting.
Probably nit picking but I would say we were pretty good at the end of 2014 and very good for all of 2015, even the start.
We were also considerably better at the start of this season than we are right now. So yes hopefully you're right and it's a belief thing.
Yeah I meant most of 2014 until the Adelaide game when we threw caution to the wind and started running and handballing more. Probably right about last year
swooshacummings
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And I think we still haven't mastered the art of midfield recruitment and drafting.
Sometimes we can get too caught up in the game plan when the opposition is successfully neutralizing it... at this point it is about how well each side does the basics...
Our problem summed up in one handy chart. You'll not all the other top 8 teams are at the other end. We don't need to be at the top (last year we were 6th), we just can't keep getting smashed in the possession count each week otherwise we end up doing a lot of chasing.
Probably a reflection of our current inside mids situation.
As a contrast, last year we had Sheed, Selwood (as much of a ball-butcher as he was) and Rosa (who was quite adept in clearances with his big body) all in the mix. Yeo had that purple patch for ~8 games in the guts, and Hutchings had a cracking last 1/3 of the season.
As a contrast, last year we had Sheed, Selwood (as much of a ball-butcher as he was) and Rosa (who was quite adept in clearances with his big body) all in the mix. Yeo had that purple patch for ~8 games in the guts, and Hutchings had a cracking last 1/3 of the season.
The Falcon Strike
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Carlton won 4....
We have had a pretty easy stretch - which is when I would say the Eagles identified to put Naitanui in for surgery.
Our last 5 quarters of football have been tripe. Our inability to win the groundball contest is evident. Only Shuey has improved this year at that - and perhaps the last month, Cripps.
Clearly everyone's too busy star gazing at Shuey.
F-that! Carpe Jugulum should be the MO!
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