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Opinion Butcher

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El_Scorcho said:
Don't make me get out the list of poor footballers who have played more games for Port Adelaide than John Butcher in less time on the list.
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Pretty sure Cam Hitchcock and Daniel Stewart are on this list.

Benny Jacobs came within a handful of games too despite flying home to mummy after just two seasons.
 
PatientMental said:
We didn't draft him.
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But we did develop him better than Richmond who drafted him and failed. Really, take Rewoldt out of the equation and we wouldn't even be having this conversation. My only point is that I don't think Richmond are a club for whom we should model our development on... But we certainly do need to improve our systems of development for tall forwards. I remember a few years ago the Crows said they were going to use Hawthorn's model for developing tall forwards. They subsequently drafted and developed Gunston, Tippet and Walker. I wouldn't mind working out the strategy Hawthorn and the Crows used and implement it starting in the next draft, which should be strong for talls. Ironically, for all the good work the Crows have done with drafting and developing tall forwards, they have to be among the worst for player retention in the past decade.
 
crazee_peet said:
I remember a few years ago the Crows said they were going to use Hawthorn's model for developing tall forwards. They subsequently drafted and developed Gunston, Tippet and Walker.
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Look how well that went for them
Gunston - 3 flags, 4 grand final appearances for Hawthorn
Tippett - 0 flags, 2 grand finals appearances for Sydney
Walker - 0 flags, 0 grand final appearances

A++ recruiting.
 

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The Crows have absolutely knocked us out of the park in terms of forward development in recent times. As has everyone else in the AFL bar maybe Freo.

We lucked out with Schulz and Dixon who did their apprenticeships elsewhere. We haven't developed an AFL quality tall forward since Tredrea, who was drafted 20 years ago.

Ultimately forwards take time and development and the SANFL is a terrible league for key forwards, so you either play them in the AFL or they wither on the vine. We haven't shown the patience and we've got what we've deserved.
 
El_Scorcho said:
The Crows have absolutely knocked us out of the park in terms of forward development in recent times. As has everyone else in the AFL bar maybe Freo.

We lucked out with Schulz and Dixon who did their apprenticeships elsewhere. We haven't developed an AFL quality tall forward since Tredrea, who was drafted 20 years ago.

Ultimately forwards take time and development and the SANFL is a terrible league for key forwards, so you either play them in the AFL or they wither on the vine. We haven't shown the patience and we've got what we've deserved.
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Current quality Crows forwards drafted, retained and developed.
Taylor Walker.
 
Pappagallo said:
Pretty sure Cam Hitchcock and Daniel Stewart are on this list.

Benny Jacobs came within a handful of games too despite flying home to mummy after just two seasons.
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The only example you need is the fact that Michael Pettigrew has his name on a locker at Alberton.

I'll let that sink in. Michael. Pettigrew.

I also apologise in advance to anyone who had successfully wiped his career from their memory.
 
Who was the last tall forward Sydney developed? The bulldogs?

Hawthorn got Roughead and Franklin as top 5 picks, we've had one and we used it on Hartlett when we could have had Hurley. But we've never had pick 2.

I think its quite a stretch to say we are the clear worst in the league. Good key forwards are bloody hard to get without very high draft picks.
 
We definitely ****ed up in the 2008 draft and 2009 draft IMO as we had great opportunities to get talls then.
 
Ando39 said:
The only example you need is the fact that Michael Pettigrew has his name on a locker at Alberton.

I'll let that sink in. Michael. Pettigrew.

I also apologise in advance to anyone who had successfully wiped his career from their memory.
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Stevens and Chaplin bother me more and in that order.
 
PatientMental said:
Current quality Crows forwards drafted, retained and developed.
Taylor Walker.
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Jenkins and Lynch spent time at other clubs, but there's no comparison to Jay Schulz coming to us after 6 years and 71 games. Between them they played 3 years and 6 AFL games for other clubs. It's just not comparable.

And even if it is only Walker, it's still a shitload more than us.
 

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Peck said:
Who was the last tall forward Sydney developed? The bulldogs?

Hawthorn got Roughead and Franklin as top 5 picks, we've had one and we used it on Hartlett when we could have had Hurley. But we've never had pick 2.

I think its quite a stretch to say we are the clear worst in the league. Good key forwards are bloody hard to get without very high draft picks.
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I'm not even asking for good key forwards. I'm just asking for someone who can hold their own as a second tall.

Westhoff is a tall flanker but he's probably the shining light of our key forward development in the last 10 years. And he got backed in and played and played despite inconsistency. Butcher never got that.
 
El_Scorcho said:
Jenkins and Lynch spent time at other clubs, but there's no comparison to Jay Schulz coming to us after 6 years and 71 games. Between them they played 3 years and 6 AFL games for other clubs. It's just not comparable.

And even if it is only Walker, it's still a shitload more than us.
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Who they were gifted through that bullshit nonsensical NSW Academy setup they had going.
 
PatientMental said:
Who they were gifted through that bullshit nonsensical NSW Academy setup they had going.
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So what? We were gifted Butcher after he fell from a potential top 2 pick to pick 8. You still have to develop them and the Crows have done so and done so really well.

We had the same crack at a nsw academy player they did.
 

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PatientMental said:
Current quality Crows forwards drafted, retained and developed.
Taylor Walker.
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Retention isn't a factor here.

And still they have a dirth of AFL quality KPFs despite losing two of the higher rated KPFs in the league.
 
PatientMental said:
Current quality Crows forwards drafted, retained and developed.
Taylor Walker.
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That's not a fault of their drafting and development. As for the comment that you need high draft picks for tall forwards, I'm not sure any of the ones mentioned were real early picks. I know Walker was a NSW zone rookie. I couldn't be bothered looking up the rest. I think we could do better than looking at Richmond as a team we model our tall forwards development on.
 
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