Black Caviar vs Winx vs Makybe Diva

[Macpotata]

I don't know much about horses. I know you campaigners are mad into it and know a s**t load about horses. How do these stack up against each other, and if all 3 were to race off in the big 3 over here Caufield, Cox and Melbourne Cup, what would transpire. Or should I say, what would be LIKELY to transpire.

I'm just more interested in your opinion into the great trio.


no s**t it's a hypothetical.

 

[Jugada]

Ones a stayer, ones a sprinter and ones an in between so impossible to line them up in a specific race

Melbourne Cup: Diva > Winx > BC
Caulfield Cup/Cox Plate: Winx > Diva > BC

As for just pure ability

BC = Winx >>>> Diva

 

[bigpapagman]

I don't know much about horses. I know you campaigners are mad into it and know a s**t load about horses. How do these stack up against each other, and if all 3 were to race off in the big 3 over here Caufield, Cox and Melbourne Cup, what would transpire. Or should I say, what would be LIKELY to transpire.

I'm just more interested in your opinion into the great trio.


no s**t it's a hypothetical.

I'll bite.

Black Caviar wins none, as she was a sprinter. Ran a max distance of 1400m.
Winx wins the Cox Plate under WFA conditions. (2000m)
The Caulfield Cup being a handicap would probably suits Makybe Diva, but wouldn't rule out Winx completely. (2400m)
Makybe Diva wins the Melbourne Cup by default as no-one knows if Winx can stay that far, and the Diva won 3 of them. (3200m)

 

[bigpapagman]

Ones a stayer, ones a sprinter and ones an in between so impossible to line them up in a specific race

Melbourne Cup: Diva > Winx > BC
Caulfield Cup/Cox Plate: Winx > Diva > BC

As for just pure ability

BC = Winx >>>> Diva

At a pinch you could try at a mile, but I have no idea what would happen. Caviar would probably lead, Winx would grab her at the 200, Makybe would hit the line and battle out 3rd with Caviar.

My best guess.

 

[Macpotata]

cheers. What do you know about American Pharoah and how would that stack up against this lot?

 

[bigpapagman]

cheers. What do you know about American Pharoah and how would that stack up against this lot?

Raced on dirt. Unknown quantity. Retired as a 3 year old in a country where their biggest races are based around 3 year olds.

 

[iluvparis]

cheers. What do you know about American Pharoah and how would that stack up against this lot?

On turf with no drugs over 2400 or 3200m I would legitimately expect him to die during the race.

 

[bigpapagman]

On turf with no drugs over 2400 or 3200m I would legitimately expect him to die during the race.

Hahahahahaha

 

[TBellicious]

Makybe diva would beat Black Caviar in the MC by 100 lengths.

Ability wise, still think BC is the best Aus horse of all time.

 

[HeathySure]

At a pinch you could try at a mile, but I have no idea what would happen. Caviar would probably lead, Winx would grab her at the 200, Makybe would hit the line and battle out 3rd with Caviar.

My best guess.

Makybe would finish 6 lengths behind them.
I think BC just beats Winx.

 

[Lebbo73]

Makybe would finish 6 lengths behind them.
I think BC just beats Winx.

If it is just a 3 horse race over 1600m, BC probably wins easy. A sit and sprint affair suits her just fine over 1600m. A full field and Winx probably wins easily. Very hard to prove though.

 

[HeathySure]

If it is just a 3 horse race over 1600m, BC probably wins easy. A sit and sprint affair suits her just fine over 1600m. A full field and Winx probably wins easily. Very hard to prove though.

not really. on a good track at Flemington at WFA i reckon BC could run about 1.33 Winx 1.33.5 and Makybe Diva 1.34.5 . a second equals 6 lengths. you dont have to make it difficult.

 

[rideclutch]

Winx would be our current top sprinter comfortably if she was trained for it IMO. I think she'd run 2 miles as well, but that one's more of a hunch. What a freak of nature.

There's a touch of rose-coloured glasses for me with BC though... the unbeaten factor plays strong with me, so maybe that's why I still have her narrowly ahead in my mind.

The Diva has her own place immortalised in history, but she's not in the conversation with these other 2 freaks.

 

[Hamingja]

On turf with no drugs over 2400 or 3200m I would legitimately expect him to die during the race.

Are you saying that you would back American Pharoah in that race

 

[Hamingja]

Winx is more versatile. Her unbeaten run is more impressive for mine, much harder to do it over varying distances especially over 1400m/1600m when she is aiming to peak over 2000m v Black Caviar who can be wound right up going into 1000-1200m races.

 

[HeathySure]

Winx is more versatile. Her unbeaten run is more impressive for mine, much harder to do it over varying distances especially over 1400m/1600m when she is aiming to peak over 2000m v Black Caviar who can be wound right up going into 1000-1200m races.

BC won over 1400 meters then a week later won over 1000, do not underestimate how hard that is to do. I dont think it has been done for a long time before and definately not done since.

 

[Duritz]

No Hartnell?

 

[iluvparis]

BC won over 1400 meters then a week later won over 1000, do not underestimate how hard that is to do. I dont think it has been done for a long time before and definately not done since.

Yup - I think in the year she did that something like 50 horses across all classes had tried going 1400>1000 in Australia within a week and only about 2 had placed let alone won!

We quickly forget how dominant she was. Odds on EVERY start except her debut. Never longer than $1.18 after her first 10 starts. Only 3 wins in her last 15 by less than 2 lengths (one was Royal Ascot).

 

[iluvparis]

Having said that - Winx does get ridden pretty conservatively - her record might look similar if they used even a fraction of energy to settle her closer in races.

 

[Gavin Excell]

I wonder if Winx owners toyed with setting her for the Everest. Reckon would go v close even if distance wasnt ideal

 

[HeathySure]

I wonder if Winx owners toyed with setting her for the Everest. Reckon would go v close even if distance wasnt ideal

i reckon this would only happen if she got beaten in the meantime. She would win pretty easily IF she was set for it.

 

[TBellicious]

Touching on BC's win at Royal Ascot. Moonlight Cloud (2nd) has a very strong record (6x Group 1s) and is a gun horse. And BC won with a torn quad, and a tear in her pelvis, after a 30 hour plane ride and a jockey that tried to get her beat!
Freak.

 

[bigpapagman]

Makybe would finish 6 lengths behind them.
I think BC just beats Winx.

Don't forget Makybe won a Memsie, placed in a couple of Feehans and a Carlyon. Her record over 1400-1600 isn't as shoddy as we're making out.

Mind you, all of these races were very slowly run and the times are s**t.

 

[iluvparis]

Don't forget Makybe won a Memsie, placed in a couple of Feehans and a Carlyon. Her record over 1400-1600 isn't as shoddy as we're making out.

Mind you, all of these races were very slowly run and the times are s**t.

Placed in a Carylon might be good enough if we were comparing her to the likes of Regal Roller.

 

[bigpapagman]

Placed in a Carylon might be good enough if we were comparing her to the likes of Regal Roller.

I'm just trying to find mile form.