Autopsy Wayne Carey: "Jack > Buddy"

[ferrisb]

Wayne Carey is just like everyone else in the media.

Say something clever and people nod and then forget about it.

Say something stupid and the masses talk about you and your controversial idea ad nauseum.

He's just trying to drum up discussion, even if (or especially because) most people will think he's wrong.

 

[jc12]

Ablett>Carey>Dunstall>Hudson>>>>>>>>>>>>Buddy>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Kennedy>>>Hawkins>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Riewoldt

ahhahahahah you had to sneak hawkins in there didnt you? salty cats fan, hope you enjoyed that belting we gave you at the g

 

[jc12]

This is the same Jack Riewoldt that did not even kick 40 goals this year, right???

do you even watch football? did not even kick 40 goals?

 

[DrEvil_]

Wayne Carey: "Kelli > Anthony"

 

[Marlowe]

 

[Leeda]

Wayne cares just not about anything important. oops I just said something of detritus but wayne will know all about that.
or would he know what the word means?

gosh I'm getting growly tonight.

 

[Ishmael_]

Buddy is a supremely better player, but he's a player without a home. He's like a massive winger/small forward.

He can't mark, so a third man up is particularly effective, there just isn't the space to move in the modern game's forward 50. When he gets a shot inside 50 often uncontested or from a free kick, he isn't a great set shot. So you play him up the ground and hope he wins the ground ball.

I've always maintained that if i was building a team I'd pick a traditional key forward (like a Kennedy) over Franklin. They bring the ball to ground, get small forwards into the game and provide structure.

Buddy might kick 60.50, his enormous goals are incredible, but it's also wasteful and your team becomes too Lance-centric.

Hawthorn lost a grand final with him, recognised the above issues and changed. Sydney has now lost two more with him. You can scoff all you want, but until that changes, them's the facts.

 

[Leeda]

Buddy is a supremely better player, but he's a player without a home. He's like a massive winger/small forward.

He can't mark, so a third man up is particularly effective, there just isn't the space to move in the modern game's forward 50. When he gets a shot inside 50 often uncontested or from a free kick, he isn't a great set shot. So you play him up the ground and hope he wins the ground ball.

I've always maintained that if i was building a team I'd pick a traditional key forward (like a Kennedy) over Franklin. They bring the ball to ground, get small forwards into the game and provide structure.

Buddy might kick 60.50, his enormous goals are incredible, but it's also wasteful and your team becomes too Lance-centric.

Hawthorn lost a grand final with him, recognised the above issues and changed. Sydney has now lost two more with him. You can scoff all you want, but until that changes, them's the facts.

said all along till it grinds your teeth into oblivion. timing was so wrong and I guess he might think that well money is one thing but we have the cups to prove it

 

[Tiger2709]

Ablett>Carey>Dunstall>Hudson>>>>>>>>>>>>Buddy>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Kennedy>>>Hawkins>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Riewoldt

Tell me you didnt put tubby porkins above Reiwoldt, oh my, you did.

Surely even you dont believe that

The others on the list I can except, Hawkins is not even close

 

[Jables]

Buddy is a supremely better player, but he's a player without a home. He's like a massive winger/small forward.

He can't mark, so a third man up is particularly effective, there just isn't the space to move in the modern game's forward 50. When he gets a shot inside 50 often uncontested or from a free kick, he isn't a great set shot. So you play him up the ground and hope he wins the ground ball.

I've always maintained that if i was building a team I'd pick a traditional key forward (like a Kennedy) over Franklin. They bring the ball to ground, get small forwards into the game and provide structure.

Buddy might kick 60.50, his enormous goals are incredible, but it's also wasteful and your team becomes too Lance-centric.

Hawthorn lost a grand final with him, recognised the above issues and changed. Sydney has now lost two more with him. You can scoff all you want, but until that changes, them's the facts.

Lance Franklin has played in 5 grand finals. 5. Truly a weight around his teams neck. Kennedy has lost all his grand finals while never scoring a goal, scoff all you want, but them's the facts.

 

[go you pups]

Ablett>Carey>Dunstall>Hudson>>>>>>>>>>>>Buddy>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Kennedy>>>Hawkins>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Riewoldt

Where's Lockett, Coventry, Pratt, Titus and Coleman?

 

[legend166]

I blame Adelaide for all this.

They should have to give us Rory Sloane as compensation.

 

[Benny78]

Where's Lockett, Coventry, Pratt, Titus and Coleman?

Lockett is obviously after Carey but before Dunstall.

The others however don't even rate as none of the records back then are in colour.

 

[Xtreme]

Wayne Carey = idiot.

Game, Set and Match

Sam Mitchell wouldn't get a game in any other team ? MYTH BUSTED
Cyril wants to go home to the Tiwi Islands ? Myth busted

His party boy life style has altered his way of thinking common sense.

Jack Riewoldt is a premiership player but he's nowhere near the star power of the likes of Buddy, Jonathan Brown, Mitch Morton and Zac Dawson.

 

[Rance2Mewtwo]

Buddy is a supremely better player, but he's a player without a home. He's like a massive winger/small forward.

He can't mark, so a third man up is particularly effective, there just isn't the space to move in the modern game's forward 50. When he gets a shot inside 50 often uncontested or from a free kick, he isn't a great set shot. So you play him up the ground and hope he wins the ground ball.

I've always maintained that if i was building a team I'd pick a traditional key forward (like a Kennedy) over Franklin. They bring the ball to ground, get small forwards into the game and provide structure.

Buddy might kick 60.50, his enormous goals are incredible, but it's also wasteful and your team becomes too Lance-centric.

Hawthorn lost a grand final with him, recognised the above issues and changed. Sydney has now lost two more with him. You can scoff all you want, but until that changes, them's the facts.

I'm with you, starting from scratch I'd pick Kennedy over Franklin for structure, which is basically the point Carey was making.

Franklin is a tall flanker mega star, but you don't build around him, which is why he's never played in a team without a Roughead or Tippett type next to him.

 

[AG]

That’s because he’s criminally underrated

He's rated fairly imo. Very good key forward who had a few excellent seasons.

This year his role changed and the importance of tackling, creating a contest etc., became just as important as kicking goals. Probably not in the top 5 key forwards this year, so he's rated fairly I think?

 

[Dr Tigris]

Sort of an interesting thread. The interesting thing to me is the lack of comprehension/interest in what Jack actually does for the RFC nowadays. Jack has to be able to mark and kick goals, so that oppositions mark him, double/triple mark him. The ball gets kicked to him and his job is to mark it if possible, but definitely not allow the defender to mark. He acts as a tool to cause ground balls and contests in our forward line. Most traditional KOFs, and even Buddy ( who isn't traditional) don't try and do that. Jack is also playing a defensive forward role, unlike most KPFs. And he is also playing a roaming.midfielder like role. So he has to cover ground to disrupt defensive structures, and create mismatches for Caddy/Dusty/Constanza, whilst ebign invvled in moving ht eball forward, helping defensively and acting as a 'KPF'. Buddy doesn't do that. Probably no other genuinely good KPF does this sort of job.

So, yes is Carey was saying that Buddy couldn't play Jack's role in the premiership side as well as jack does he's right. If he was sasying that Jack is a better KPF in a normal KPF role than Buddy he's wrong. And Buddy doesn't even play that normal KPF role. As a second forward buddy is the best ever (likely Hart could do it better, but he always played the first up CHF).

Most likely Carey wanted to get people talking about him, and to stake out a position that makes him worth paying $ for by the media.

 

[Grrr]

He's rated fairly imo. Very good key forward who had a few excellent seasons.

This year his role changed and the importance of tackling, creating a contest etc., became just as important as kicking goals. Probably not in the top 5 key forwards this year, so he's rated fairly I think?

A few fine seasons!! He's a far better player now than when he won his Coleman's. He has never really had a poor season, I think kicking over 50 goals every year he has played. But his goal assists, tap ons, foot passing, body work etc brings team mates into the game like no other forward. I would have him over Kennedy because of his versatility. Also over Tex for the same reason. Daniher is tracking well but right now is not better than Riewoldt, although he might pass him.
People also underestimating Franklin on here. Great footballer who's one flaw is that he doesn't pack mark. Is the most marked player in the league.

 

[ZingerB]

A few fine seasons!! He's a far better player now than when he won his Coleman's. He has never really had a poor season, I think kicking over 50 goals every year he has played. But his goal assists, tap ons, foot passing, body work etc brings team mates into the game like no other forward. I would have him over Kennedy because of his versatility. Also over Tex for the same reason. Daniher is tracking well but right now is not better than Riewoldt, although he might pass him.
People also underestimating Franklin on here. Great footballer who's one flaw is that he doesn't pack mark. Is the most marked player in the league.

You're more than welcome to look up their stats. Franklin kicked 20 more goals, had 50% more goal assists, 3 possessions more a game, half a mark more a game this year. Franklin lays .2 less tackles a game which is about the only stat Riewoldt beat him in. The only times Franklin doesn't win the Coleman is when he is injured for a 1/3 of the season. Evidently, in 2012 Jack won the Coleman with 65 goals from 22 games. Franklin kicked 69 in 19 games that year. Its actually embarrassing that someone would argue that Jack is even in his league little own better than one of the all time great players. Not a little bit embarrassing, but, burn your computer and gouge your eyes out so you never infect the game with your stupidity embarrassing.

 

[MinerBoy]

I'm with you, starting from scratch I'd pick Kennedy over Franklin for structure, which is basically the point Carey was making.

Franklin is a tall flanker mega star, but you don't build around him, which is why he's never played in a team without a Roughead or Tippett type next to him.

Except Hawthorn did build around him....and climbed from the very bottom to Premiers in 4 years. And then won another and had a RU within the next 5 years.

 

[Hap Hapablap]

Wtf is this. how did i not see this.

without a doubt the most stupidest thread ive sene here in a while and that is saying something considering the have results and crowd prediction threads days or even months before.

and wayne carey. get off the drugs.

 

[Leather Poisoning]

If Wayne Carey started this thread it would be deleted and he would be red carded.

BigFooty has standards.

 

[Ishmael_]

Lance Franklin has played in 5 grand finals. 5. Truly a weight around his teams neck. Kennedy has lost all his grand finals while never scoring a goal, scoff all you want, but them's the facts.

I would try and rebut your brilliant analysis, but it would be a waste of both our time.

Instead I'd recommend googling 'straw man' and correlation vs. causation. Comprehension doesn't come naturally to everyone, but stick it out.

 

[cannot]

Wtf is this. how did i not see this.

without a doubt the most stupidest thread ive sene here in a while and that is saying something considering the have results and crowd prediction threads days or even months before.

and wayne carey. get off the drugs.

i dont think he does drugs

just beer and protein shakes

 

[charcoalchicken]

I am inclined to agree with the King.

I have always marveled at the talent buddy has but hes far from a flawless player. The hawks have evolved to new standards after he left and he hasnt won enough flags to justify his money; with just a quality team around him at the swannies.

Jack #1 for tackles in the Grand Final is an example of his career; moving to a more unselfish role after winning multiple colemans as a kid for the betterment of the team.

**** oath or na?

Stupidest thread i've seen in a minute, that's my thoughts and we've got 12 months of this dribble to look forward to, yay