Research Missing DOD or DOB for League players (AFL)

[GreyCrow]

TWENTIETH BATCH

*
Joseph "Joe" Sullivan - Carlton 1900-03. dob 01/02/1877 orig club : Rutherglen. Died 1935. Death as O'Sullivan ?

Confirmed

EventDeath Registration year1935 Personal information Family name OSULLIVAN Given namesJoseph
Father's nameOSULLIVAN John Mother's nameMargt (Drew) Place of birth ? Place of death HEIDELBERG Age58

Birth

Registration year 1877 Personal information Family name SULLIVAN Given names Joseph
Father's nameJohn Mother's name Margaret (Drew)

Place of birthC'WOOD

The Fathers name the only concern but the mothers maiden name clinches it

 

[35Daicos]

Confirmed

EventDeath Registration year1935 Personal information Family name OSULLIVAN Given namesJoseph
Father's nameOSULLIVAN John Mother's nameMargt (Drew) Place of birth ? Place of death HEIDELBERG Age58

Birth

Registration year 1877 Personal information Family name SULLIVAN Given names Joseph
Father's nameJohn Mother's name Margaret (Drew)

Place of birthC'WOOD

The Fathers name the only concern but the mothers maiden name clinches it

http://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/203985686

Joseph O'Sullivan. 10th July 1935. Many years playing member Carlton Football Club.

 

[GreyCrow]

TWENTIETH BATCH
James "Jim" Scott Sutherland. Sth 1924. dob 10/5/1900 Orig club: Leopold

Still alive post 1945 http://nla.gov.au/nla.news-article70681819

Maybe his father needs to be in the Inaccuracies Thread? Says he played for Footscray. ( could be an association side)
http://nla.gov.au/nla.news-article70737088

Divorce granted to Sarah Grace 1935 http://nla.gov.au/nla.news-article70730659

Based on the desertion in 1934/1935 I offer this possibility. Based on his parents being born in Scotland could we suppose James/Jim to be a Scottish Piper?
1934 a footballer http://nla.gov.au/nla.news-article201811928

1934 a piper http://nla.gov.au/nla.news-article75990808

1939 http://nla.gov.au/nla.news-article46384408

1963 and still piping

All this leads to a burial of a James Sutherland in 1980 aged 80. ie born 1900
SUTHERLAND JAMES 80 years 1980 HELENA VALLEY

Just presenting an option to chase up

 

[GreyCrow]

NINETEENTH BATCH

James "Jim" William Smith (Sth 1906) dob 11/2/1887 orig club Marylebone

There are 2 James Williams born in 1887
James William born to William Liddle Smith and Agnes (Ritchie) there is a subsequent death entry in 1958 to those 2 people

The other James William Smith (who I assume is ours) was born to John Williams and Mary (Williams) and there is NO corresponding Victorian death entry

Edit: Added. The above James William Smith born to John and Mary was registered in the Geelong district. Guess he is the one. Just a note, in 1907 he returned to a newly re-formed Marleybone now playing as East Geelong. Another player was Gibney http://nla.gov.au/nla.news-article147915749

 

[Snidely Whiplash]

NINETEENTH BATCH

*Stanley Vincent Smith (Coll 1947-50) dob 17/4/1925 orig club Collingwood Juniors "Brother of Ron A."

Pretty sure Stan Smith may still be alive. Was a recent invite to past players function. I will check on Monday.

On SM-G955F using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[rbartlett]

TWENTY-FIRST (and last!) BATCH

*Lionel Charles Upton - Nth Melb 1948 - dob 3/10/1924 Orig club Brunswick
Eric Leslie Watson - Fitzroy 1911 - dob 11/9/1893 Orig club Kew WW1 Army
*Edward "Ted" Matthew Wellington - Nth Melb 1943 - dob: 20/11/1921 Orig club West Footscray POSSIBLE FOUND - see post below
Tom Wellington - Melb 1912-13 dob: 27/10/1894 Orig club CBC; East Melb
Edward "Ed" "Titch" White - Fitzroy 1945 - dob: 10/4/1922 Orig club Fitzroy Sub-Districts
*Albert "Alby" Joseph Williams - NthMelb 1943 - dob 3/8/1916 Orig club Oakleigh WW2 Army
William "Billy" Francis Williams - StKilda 1907 - dob: 2/5/1888 Orig club Eaglehawk
William "Bill" Henry Woods - Geelong 1909 - dob: 21/8/1890 Orig Club Ashby. Half Brother of Ike
Charles William Young - Fitzroy 1937 - dob: 10/10/1918 Orig club North Carlton Died 1969. WW2 Army


Thanks for everyone's assistance over this thread.
Once we've looked over this batch, I will send off the final email to Stephen R.
I will ask him to then collate for me the outstanding DOB (which I think are the original 4 still) , and DOD - and I will then paste them into a single post.

 

[GreyCrow]

TWENTY-FIRST (and last!) BATCH

*Lionel Charles Upton - Nth Melb 1948 - dob 3/10/1924 Orig club Brunswick

Strong possibility Lionel is still with us. A notice for a Jean Upton in August 2017 has a Lionel as Husband and still listed as alive. Need to investigate if Jean was his wife.

Charles William Young - Fitzroy 1937 - dob: 10/10/1918 Orig club North Carlton Died 1969. WW2 Army

Nominal Rolls have this listed as 10/10/1917 not 1918

Thanks for everyone's assistance over this thread.
Once we've looked over this batch, I will send off the final email to Stephen R.
I will ask him to then collate for me the outstanding DOB (which I think are the original 4 still) , and DOD - and I will then paste them into a single post.

Thank you

 

[GreyCrow]

TWENTY-FIRST (and last!) BATCH


Eric Leslie Watson - Fitzroy 1911 - dob 11/9/1893 Orig club Kew WW1 Army

A possibility for a search , given he hasnt been found (so far) maybe a search in the UK may find him. Based on his wedding and his service he may have gone to England with his bride http://nla.gov.au/nla.news-article146719200

And we do see this from the 1939 Register Links: birthplace of bride and Eric L as second member

Watson HouseholdMere and Tisbury R.D., Wiltshire, England

FIRST NAME(S) LAST NAME(S) BIRTH YEAR
Gertrude Watson 1892
Eric L Watson is also on this record

Off for a coffee look after if anybody doesnt find him

 

[the croucher]

A possibility for a search , given he hasnt been found (so far) maybe a search in the UK may find him. Based on his wedding and his service he may have gone to England with his bride http://nla.gov.au/nla.news-article146719200

And we do see this from the 1939 Register Links: birthplace of bride and Eric L as second member

Watson HouseholdMere and Tisbury R.D., Wiltshire, England

FIRST NAME(S) LAST NAME(S) BIRTH YEAR
Gertrude Watson 1892
Eric L Watson is also on this record

Off for a coffee look after if anybody doesnt find him

When his mother died in early July 1946, Eric is listed as still alive and living in England
http://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/206375706

 

[GreyCrow]

A possibility for a search , given he hasnt been found (so far) maybe a search in the UK may find him. Based on his wedding and his service he may have gone to England with his bride http://nla.gov.au/nla.news-article146719200

And we do see this from the 1939 Register Links: birthplace of bride and Eric L as second member

Watson HouseholdMere and Tisbury R.D., Wiltshire, England

FIRST NAME(S) LAST NAME(S) BIRTH YEAR
Gertrude Watson 1892
Eric L Watson is also on this record

Off for a coffee look after if anybody doesnt find him

FindMyPast has an entry for an Eric Watson 1892-1971 and 1894-1971 one Wiltshire records and one England Wales record. I will assume they have split the difference between informants. I havent seen a grave record etc

 

[the croucher]

FindMyPast has an entry for an Eric Watson 1892-1971 and 1894-1971 one Wiltshire records and one England Wales record. I will assume they have split the difference between informants. I havent seen a grave record etc

Excellent. I think we have probably found him, but of course need final confirmation.
The Ancestry website has UK civil registration death records in which a death of an Eric Watson (DOB 11 Sep 1892)
is listed in the Salisbury, Wiltshire region for the January to March quarter of 1971.

Given the player we are after had a DOB of 11 Sep 1893....looks like the 1971 death is almost certainly same person.

 

[GreyCrow]

TWENTY-FIRST (and last!) BATCH


Edward "Ed" "Titch" White - Fitzroy 1945 - dob: 10/4/1922 Orig club Fitzroy Sub-Districts
.

4/4/2012

http://tributes.heraldsun.com.au/archivenotice/3002478/view?random=1510390607722

 

[the croucher]

TWENTY-FIRST (and last!) BATCH
<snip>
*Edward "Ted" Matthew Wellington - Nth Melb 1943 - dob: 20/11/1921 Orig club West Footscray
<snip>

Ted Wellington shows up living in Shepparton via electoral rolls dated 1949 to 1980 on Ancestry,
looks like he was married to Joy Merle (maiden name unknown).

 

[the croucher]

TWENTY-FIRST (and last!) BATCH

<snip>
Tom Wellington - Melb 1912-13 dob: 27/10/1894 Orig club CBC; East Melb
<snip>

Thanks to Trove, here is a photo and neat summary of Wellington's athletic achievements as a young man:
http://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/175803800

Nice tip at the end with reference to him being in the Federal Public Service.

 

[WhiteHartLane23]

Ted Wellington shows up living in Shepparton via electoral rolls dated 1949 to 1980 on Ancestry,
looks like he was married to Joy Merle (maiden name unknown).

From http://greatershepparton.com.au/region/cemeteries/pine-lodge-cemetery
Born: 20 November 1921
Died: 7 June 2004
Date of Burial: 11 June 2004
Location: Pine Lodge
Cemetery: Grevillea Close
Site Number: 318

 

[WhiteHartLane23]

Thanks to Trove, here is a photo and neat summary of Wellington's athletic achievements as a young man:
http://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/175803800
Nice tip at the end with reference to him being in the Federal Public Service.

He was admitted as a clerk into the public service and "disappears" from Ancestry records after about 1925...
I think this explains why - addicted to drink and betting -> jail...

 

[GreyCrow]

He was admitted as a clerk into the public service and "disappears" from Ancestry records after about 1925...
I think this explains why - addicted to drink and betting -> jail...

Strong possibility he may have changed his name then

 

[GreyCrow]

Strong possibility he may have changed his name then

Which leads to this 1935 notice. a Where is he notice

http://nla.gov.au/nla.news-article11758547

 

[GreyCrow]

Strong possibility he may have changed his name then

Which leads to this 1935 notice. a Where is he notice

http://nla.gov.au/nla.news-article11758547

If its the same and the dates lend an air of credence Tom wasnt having much luck. http://nla.gov.au/nla.news-article203421538

A marriage in 1917 of Thomas ( no middle name) Wellington to Violet Stagoll. In 1926 its alleged she married another man in 1918. The curious thing is the report states ''married to Thomas Wellington , then being alive'' I assume its a legal phrase and offers nothing sinister. Which is confirmed in this article which Thomas himself appears http://nla.gov.au/nla.news-article202217006 he is a clerk in Elsternwick

Violet had many charges of shoplifting etc made against her over the years.

 

[rbartlett]

Barb Cullen has cited the death notice/certificate of Johnny MacGregor and confirms he died on May 16 1966, in a small city called... Dunkirk.
He was listed as a 'corporate director' with Cullen believing he ran a hotel in Dunkirk.[/QUOTE]

 

[GreyCrow]

Eighth Batch of missing DOD



James "Jim" Arthur Greenham (Foots 1937-41, 1943-45) (B: 16/11/1915 Original club Footscray Tech O.B) Believed to have died in 1993 in QLD perhaps

MyHeritage , which relies more on personal entries, has Jim passing in 1995. 3 different entries say this , but they could all be confirming each other!!

I havent ( as yet) found any civil confirmation but will keep looking. If anybody knows some Qld members or if any State Library has Qld archives a search of 1995 Obits might find him

 

[GreyCrow]

On Edward Page Heffernan I have seen a link to a Bon Voyage to WA http://nla.gov.au/nla.news-article70075362 for an Edward Heffernan. Light on details but a possibility. No WA BDM jump out.

The Kyneton Observer which is near to being added has many mentions of an E Heffernan/R Heffernan as Captain. This is after the above Bon Voyage so maybe 2 different people. As soon as they are added I shall chase them up more. ie the R Heffernan is assumed to be Roger ( an insert)

Kyneton Court of Petty Sessions. TUESDAY, MARCH 15TH. (Before Messrs Armstrong, Blencowe, Cooney, and Menzies, J’s.F.) DEBT CASES. [coming soon]
The Kyneton Observer (Vic. : 1856 - 1900) Thursday 17 March 1898 p 1 Article
... Bench had to decide was the validity of the receipt for 19s 3d. Boger Heffernan deposed that he clerked ... sundries. He did not produce his cashbook, as it was merely a copy of his bankbook. James Heffernan ... 771 words

SPORTING NEWS. FOOTBALL .KYNETON V. EAST [?] [coming soon]
The Kyneton Observer (Vic. : 1856 - 1900) Tuesday 15 August 1899 p 2 Article
... match started at about i.i.-,0'cir,t R. Heffernan captained Kyneui,. O'Connell had charge of E ... 487 words

SPORTING NEWS. FOOTBALL. [coming soon]
The Kyneton Observer (Vic. : 1856 - 1900) Saturday 5 August 1899 p 3 Article
... team—E. Heffernan (capt), EEL'bv. Kelt. Crcwther, Grant, O'Connor, B-E-aaa. Eeardon, Semple, J ... . Heffernan, Jtań. AVearr.cn. Thompson (2), Noble, teffiim. Palmer, Sandford (2), Spain, ficfon. Darby ...179 words

The interesting thing ( for me ) is there is then no mention of football in 1897. Then again I couldnt find a mention for Carlton either but I did for season 1896 http://nla.gov.au/nla.news-article139731764 Match in October?? http://nla.gov.au/nla.news-article139731766

Though we do see a Heffernan lining up for Kyneton also in 1896 http://nla.gov.au/nla.news-article240965542

I think there is still some searching to be done for EP Heffernan but hopefully this doesnt confuse too many

 

[35Daicos]

The interesting thing ( for me ) is there is then no mention of football in 1897. Then again I couldnt find a mention for Carlton either but I did for season 1896 http://nla.gov.au/nla.news-article139731764 Match in October?? http://nla.gov.au/nla.news-article139731766

Though we do see a Heffernan lining up for Kyneton also in 1896 http://nla.gov.au/nla.news-article240965542

I think there is still some searching to be done for EP Heffernan but hopefully this doesnt confuse too many

Blueseum has him as being recruited from Fitzroy Juniors in 1894, and playing that year and in 1896:- http://www.blueseum.org/tiki-index.php?page=Ted+Heffernan

Born in Gisborne in 1869, Edward Page Heffernan joined Carlton’s VFA team from Fitzroy Juniors, and was one of 15 Blues who made up the majority of the side selected for Carlton’s VFL debut against the Maroons at the Brunswick Street Oval on May 8, 1897. A week later, he played his second and last game for Carlton on the eve of his 28th birthday.

Victorian Football Association
Games: 23 (May have been more, details incomplete)
Goals: 4
Career: 1894 - 1896

E. Heffernan recruited from Fitzroy Juniors in 1894 and played 6 games that season.
No record of him playing in the First Twenty in 1895.
Played 17 games and scored 4 goals in 1896.
(Origins of Australian Football Vol 4)

Not all team details were published.

1895 May
The Herald, says Heffernan, a follower, returning to the Blues.

etc.

 

[Snidely Whiplash]

Jack Thompson real name Walter John DOD was 7 Dec 1961 per trial of girlfriend notice in The Age.

https://news.google.com/newspapers?...AIBAJ&sjid=UrsDAAAAIBAJ&pg=5205,3945866&hl=en

Steve Rogers at AFL advised.

 

[rbartlett]

Hi all
I've sent the final email to Stephen of all the research that has been found.
Once he looks after that I will ask him to forward to me the names of the outstanding players still missing DOD
and I will paste them into a single post that everyone can work from.

Rhett