Training 2017/2018 Pre-season Thread

Who will be our most improved for 2018?


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  • Poll closed .
Jun 7, 2011
58,419
60,460
Mount Gambier
AFL Club
Adelaide
P

Problem was we had no one else to replace him with. McKay and Otten were already in the yeam and our safe selection policy throughout the year meant no one else had game time under their belt

We prefer injured continuity ahead of actual ability to run out a game of football. Mackay elevated from a s**t sub game into the 2015 semi final where he played his worst ever game. The selection of injured players in the 2016 semi and then again throughout last year's final series. It seems to be a very strongly held belief that continuity is more important than anything else. The issue with this is that it's not something that can change, so it's not an area that we can actually improve in.
 
May 25, 2009
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Back in S.A.
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We prefer injured continuity ahead of actual ability to run out a game of football. Mackay elevated from a s**t sub game into the 2015 semi final where he played his worst ever game. The selection of injured players in the 2016 semi and then again throughout last year's final series. It seems to be a very strongly held belief that continuity is more important than anything else. The issue with this is that it's not something that can change, so it's not an area that we can actually improve in.
You can go further back than the 2016 semi, remember Petrenko and his injured shoulder? I think the Petrenko incident highlights two things: first the belief the club has transcends individual head coaches, meaning that it's an ingrained belief at a culture level, and second that the belief is so strong that even players of lesser importance are viewed as indispensable in maintaining continuity and team cohesion.

I think it's something that needs addressing because it has cost us dearly in the past, and it's likely to continue to do so. Going into finals with injured players is bad enough, but if you then get another injury during the game, it becomes almost impossible to win.
 
Jun 7, 2011
58,419
60,460
Mount Gambier
AFL Club
Adelaide
You can go further back than the 2016 semi, remember Petrenko and his injured shoulder? I think the Petrenko incident highlights two things: first the belief the club has transcends individual head coaches, meaning that it's an ingrained belief at a culture level, and second that the belief is so strong that even players of lesser importance are viewed as indispensable in maintaining continuity and team cohesion.

I think it's something that needs addressing because it has cost us dearly in the past, and it's likely to continue to do so. Going into finals with injured players is bad enough, but if you then get another injury during the game, it becomes almost impossible to win.

Yep, forgot about the selection of a hard tackling, defensive forward that couldn't tackle due to shoulder injuries.
 

Mego Red

The Artist Formerly Known As Kristof
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Soft spot for Brisbane
Do you think every team in the comp does the same but when you win you don’t need to make excuses


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This hurts ... But I kind of agree with you.

All sides are managing injured players. You only really notice how it affects losers.
 

DD#23

Norm Smith Medallist
Dec 31, 2013
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You can go further back than the 2016 semi, remember Petrenko and his injured shoulder? I think the Petrenko incident highlights two things: first the belief the club has transcends individual head coaches, meaning that it's an ingrained belief at a culture level, and second that the belief is so strong that even players of lesser importance are viewed as indispensable in maintaining continuity and team cohesion.
accurate, and damning.
 
Do you think every team in the comp does the same but when you win you don’t need to make excuses


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I don't think every club does the same. Have a look at the numbers of players most other clubs use; it's a fair bit higher than us.

The most successful clubs aren't afraid to use a "next man in" approach. We place too much importance continuity and forget we have more than just 22 capable AFL players
 
May 24, 2006
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I don't think every club does the same. Have a look at the numbers of players most other clubs use; it's a fair bit higher than us.

The most successful clubs aren't afraid to use a "next man in" approach. We place too much importance continuity and forget we have more than just 22 capable AFL players
Ironically under Sanderson in 2012 we used heaps of players (from memory quite a few were only for 1-3 games admittedly) but then we stuck with a sore Petrenko in the preliminary final
 

marty36

Brownlow Medallist
Aug 17, 2009
26,372
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Adelaide
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I don't think every club does the same. Have a look at the numbers of players most other clubs use; it's a fair bit higher than us.

The most successful clubs aren't afraid to use a "next man in" approach. We place too much importance continuity and forget we have more than just 22 capable AFL players

History clearly shows clubs that use the most players finish bottom 10 the majority of the time

Why do you make things up


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Jun 7, 2011
58,419
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Mount Gambier
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Adelaide
History clearly shows clubs that use the most players finish bottom 10 the majority of the time

Why do you make things up


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That statement doesn't counter what you were responding to. If we played a fit Hampton or Milera instead of an injured Greenwood, we'd have still played the same amount of players for the year. Yes, Marty, it might have necessitated a bit of a shuffle, but we could have chosen to play a fit player instead of one that had clearly been carrying an injury.
 
History clearly shows clubs that use the most players finish bottom 10 the majority of the time

Why do you make things up


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Richmond used 38 players, GWS used 37 and Geelong used 36. We used 31. Brisbane used 38
 

marty36

Brownlow Medallist
Aug 17, 2009
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That statement doesn't counter what you were responding to. If we played a fit Hampton or Milera instead of an injured Greenwood, we'd have still played the same amount of players for the year. Yes, Marty, it might have necessitated a bit of a shuffle, but we could have chosen to play a fit player instead of one that had clearly been carrying an injury.

Like I said richmond would have had the same I’m injured players playing every team plays them


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Jun 7, 2011
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Mount Gambier
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Like I said richmond would have had the same I’m injured players playing every team plays them


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There's a difference between carrying a niggle, which almost all players have by that time of the year, and carrying a midfielder that can't actually run out a game of football.
 
Sep 28, 2014
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There's a difference between carrying a niggle, which almost all players have by that time of the year, and carrying a midfielder that can't actually run out a game of football.
Problem was he couldn't run out a game before he was injured then got injured and couldn't train then couldn't run out as much of the game as when he couldn't run out the game to begin with

We shouldn't pick him again until he can play 60 % game time minimum but maybe even more than that like 70%+
 

kulak

Premiership Player
May 16, 2006
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Problem was he couldn't run out a game before he was injured then got injured and couldn't train then couldn't run out as much of the game as when he couldn't run out the game to begin with

We shouldn't pick him again until he can play 60 % game time minimum but maybe even more than that like 70%+
Greenwood was fantastic in the first quarter.

Supposedly he injured his good calf around then, which ties up with him doing nothing for the rest of the game.

If he doesn’t get that injury and instead plays a third quarter like his first, then his selection is correct. Unlucky.

Instead I’d argue we should have picked a running player ahead of Otten which would have given us more margin for error if we copped injuries.

0077881F-0973-43D6-B6B8-1232853DAD38.jpeg
 
Nov 1, 2012
38,542
58,992
AFL Club
Adelaide
Statistics go back multiple years, and include clubs at both ends of the ladder. There are almost no 1st round draftees who have played 100+ games, having failed to debut in their first 2 seasons. Those are the facts. That's what the statistics tell us.

I notice this post as it was the second time you made claims about statistics you didn’t share

That stood out like dog balls


How about you go and find a list of 1st round draftees who played 100 games, after not debuting in their first 2 seasons? It's a very short list.

Then this

So you don’t actually know, don’t have a list yourself, and haven’t done the research you’re making at these claims from

I mean jeepers humanity really is the loser when you and Wayne indulge in a sexually frustrated bullshit-off and then i spend time thinking about your sexual frustration in a very personal way
 
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Nov 1, 2012
38,542
58,992
AFL Club
Adelaide
It's an interesting clash we have here. On one side we have Vader who never predicts anything that goes against the odds, while on the other we have Wayne who relies entirely on instinct instead. I'm not sure that we could find two more diametrically opposed posters when it comes to assessing talent.

So don't expect them to agree any time soon.:p

They have very similar records though :)
 

Doedee Bros

Debutant
Aug 28, 2016
70
82
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Adelaide
If Milera had come into the GF last year and did what Graham did to Sloane let’s say Milera did it to dusty

It would have been fantastic and we would have probably won the GF

This board would have an orgasm

Come on stop showing bias against brilliant efforts


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Bias? my comment is to bias as Irony is to Alanis Morrisette.
 

marty36

Brownlow Medallist
Aug 17, 2009
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Bias? my comment is to bias as Irony is to Alanis Morrisette.


Youre Bia about suggesting the player is a flash in the pans, because the player in question has won a larke medal in 2016 was drafted in 2016 broke into the best team in the comp in 2017 and won an AFL premiership medal in 2017 whilst being one of the best on ground

You say he could fall away just as quick, you make your own luck in this life and is there anything in that resume to suggest anything but upwards and onwards where we look at players that havent had the junior success and yes they have done well to be drafted and havent done anything since

Are you jealous we missed him, I am, he had all the attributes to make it, being the son of football pedigree with his father an SANFL football whilst the SANFL was a premier comp and a fantastic junior career.
 
Oct 14, 2005
52,179
36,117
Canberra
AFL Club
Adelaide
Other Teams
Norwood, Adelaide Crows
Picks 40-60 have been good not so good for us from memory.

2004 40 Ivan Maric 77
56 Chris Knights 96

2005 48 Alan Obst 0

2006 48 David MacKay Adelaide 185

2007 58 Tony Armstrong 14

2008 44 Rory Sloane Adelaide 165
60 Thomas Lee 0

2009 45 Sam Shaw 24

2010 no picks in this range J Lyon pick 61

2011 41 Mitchell Grigg 20
46 Nicholas Joyce 0

2012 No picks in this range

2013 46 Riley Knight Adelaide 31

2014 43 Mitch McGovern Adelaide 36
58 Harry Dear Adelaide 0

Others too soon to rate
That's actually a pretty damn good record.
  • 2 players (Mackay, Sloane) who have already played 100+ games for Adelaide
  • 2 players (Maric, Knights) who played 100+ including games with other clubs.
  • 1 player (Lyon) who will almost certainly play 100+ games, including games with another club
  • Only 4 players who never played a single game
For a single club to select 5x 100+ game players, from 14 selections, is extraordinary for picks in this range. That's without considering the possibility of McGovern and (less likely) Knight playing 100+ games as well.
 
Oct 14, 2005
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That statement doesn't counter what you were responding to. If we played a fit Hampton or Milera instead of an injured Greenwood, we'd have still played the same amount of players for the year. Yes, Marty, it might have necessitated a bit of a shuffle, but we could have chosen to play a fit player instead of one that had clearly been carrying an injury.
The question is whether a fit Hampton or Milera would have given us more than an injured Greenwood?

Milera was previously dropped due to poor form, and I don't recall reading any SANFL match reviews raving about his performance and demanding an AFL recall. Hampton was on the verge of being dropped when he got injured, and we got more from an injured Greenwood in the PF than we did from a fit Hampton earlier in the season.

I'm not convinced that there was any "right answer" here. As far as I'm aware, neither Milera nor Hampton were doing anything to justify a recall. Greenwood was injured. Maybe they might have been better picking someone else - Gallucci, maybe? This would have meant selecting him for the GF as his second game, knowing that he hadn't done enough to register a single B&F vote in his debut game (months earlier). Once again, it's a gamble.

All of this is hypothetical. We know they selected an injured Greenwood and it didn't work out. Everything else is pure speculation.
 
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