Bluemour Discussion Thread IX

[Iamcarlton]

Where did they say they were willing to trade our first pick? We can go for mature players without giving up pick #1...

As far as i know they havent but didnt i just cover your question in my post ?
However tbh why wouldnt they its not uncommon ?
Theyve made a statement re mature players SOS is creative its certainly not out of the question if they want quality players .
If they are just after average to good players thats a little different yes .
But i wouldnt be ruling anything out imo .

 

[Blue_Fusion]

Correct.
So who do we bring in of value to our midfield in the 24+ age group?

Why is that so critical?

Are we any chance to win the flag next year?

We will see what's available and if a quality player of that age group decides they want to join us then we will do whatever we can to get them to us apart from trading pick #1.

It will not happen.

 

[HereComesJuddy]

I’d like to know the other 24.

Kelly
Cripps
Macrae
Bont
Mitchell
Fyfe
Dangerfield
Martin
Cotchin
Treloar
Coniglio
Neale
J kennedy syd
Ward
Wines
Selwood
Sidebottom
Gaff
Higgins
Merrett
Pendlebury
Heeney
Gibbs
Duncan
Murphy
Brad crouch
Parker
Zorko
Sloane
Beams
Viney

Then in the youth department id choose players such as:
Dow
LDU
Rayner (will play lots of mid time)
Andrew Brayshaw
Cerra

But thats just me.

 

[PrinceCharles]

This attitude confuses me a bit. If pick 1 turned out to be a Shiel, we’d do a dance. Not to mention the very very real risk that you get something less than that. No certainty with the draft.

So why do we think pick 1 is overs for someone that is a certainty to be a Shiel in the sense that he is literally Dylan Shiel?

Because he'll be 26 years old and a free agent next year.

 

[GapInIkonPark]

Why is that so critical?

Are we any chance to win the flag next year?

We will see what's available and if a quality player of that age group decides they want to join us then we will do whatever we can to get them to us apart from trading pick #1.

It will not happen.

I agree to disagree on this one Blue_Fusion

No side that has Pick 1 is a realistic chance of winning the flag the next year.

 

[Blue_Fusion]

As far as i know they havent but didnt i just cover your question in my post ?
However tbh why wouldnt they its not uncommon ?
Theyve made a statement re mature players SOS is creative its certainly not out of the question if they want quality players .
If they are just after average to good players thats a little different yes .
But i wouldnt be ruling anything out imo .

So, we've now established the club has not said it is willing to trade pick #1 yet.

Here is what was originally said by Malifice in case you need reminding:

22 games earlier than if we take him as FA next year for free.

Thats not worth Pick 1. Its still not worth it if we also get pick 9.

Next year we wont be anywhere near the top 8, even with Shiel. The plan is (and always has been) 2020 onwards.

To which you said:

So your calling bluff on the clubs stated desire to recruit mature readymade players this off season ?

He said Shiel + pick #9 is not worth pick #1. And the plan is to be playing finals 2020 onwards.

You've twisted what he said into something it isn't. What he said has nothing to do with calling bluff on the clubs stated desire to recruit mature ready-made players. Nothing whatsoever.

We can recruit those types without giving up pick #1. And Shiel is not the only one we can target.

We've been rumoured by a strong inside source that Angus Brayshaw will be a target this year and that Shiel will be the target next year.

 

[TommyMcG]

Kelly
Cripps
Macrae
Bont
Mitchell
Fyfe
Dangerfield
Martin
Cotchin
Treloar
Coniglio
Neale
J kennedy syd
Ward
Wines
Selwood
Sidebottom
Gaff
Higgins
Merrett
Pendlebury
Heeney
Gibbs
Duncan
Murphy
Brad crouch
Parker
Zorko
Sloane
Beams
Viney

Then in the youth department id choose players such as:
Dow
LDU
Rayner (will play lots of mid time)
Andrew Brayshaw
Cerra

But thats just me.

Shiel has had an OK year at best. I'd like him at the blues but pick 1 should be out of the question. It's a crude indicator but just looking at this years "supercoach" averages, Shiel is well down the list of midfielders.

https://www.footywire.com/afl/footy...in_salary=0&max_salary=1000000&sort=2&order=D

 

[Canyouhearthedrums]

Kelly
Cripps
Macrae
Bont
Mitchell
Fyfe
Dangerfield
Martin
Cotchin
Treloar
Coniglio
Neale
J kennedy syd
Ward
Wines
Selwood
Sidebottom
Gaff
Higgins
Merrett
Pendlebury
Heeney
Gibbs
Duncan
Murphy
Brad crouch
Parker
Zorko
Sloane
Beams
Viney

Then in the youth department id choose players such as:
Dow
LDU
Rayner (will play lots of mid time)
Andrew Brayshaw
Cerra

But thats just me.

With respect, I stopped taking it seriously when I saw Higgins.

 

[FairKouta]

Why hasn't anyone started the CRIPPS BROWNLOW WATCH Thread yet ?

 

[Red Bull]

The alternate view would be a season of development wasted (or at least, not optimised).

Individual players, and the collective unit, develop better when the team is better.
Cripps gets a chop-out, and can spend some time forward. Dow, Fisher, Samo, Kennedy, LOB get help in their development playing with another gun, confidence grows, etc. The backline is under less pressure, the ball comes in a bit less, and a bit slower, and they have better options coming out of defence. The forwardline gets more, and better, opportunities.

Understand that I would 100% take Gaff for free rather than needing to trade for Shiel this off-season, but I think we have to accept that Gaff isn't coming to Carlton. And we need help beyond what another class of draftees would bring.

The team would develop together and improve substantially , in turn evolving CFC into a desired destination for future FA's and out of contract A graders.
The club has drafted hard for 3 years as promised and looks to have delivered in the main.
Its now time to add some class as promised if possible to our stable of developing youth and begin the climb to relevancy and beyond.

 

[Blue_Fusion]

I agree to disagree on this one Blue_Fusion

No side that has Pick 1 is a realistic chance of winning the flag the next year.

Right. So why is it so critical to go after a quality 24 yr old mid this year? If one comes out and nominates us, then sure we'd be open to acquiring them. But we won't be trading pick #1 to do it. Like I just said, we're rumoured to be targeting Angus Brayshaw and also McGovern this year. Shiel is the target for next year. There's more than one VERY good reason for that.

 

[Iamcarlton]

So, we've now established the club has not said it is willing to trade pick #1 yet.

Here is what was originally said by Malifice in case you need reminding:



To which you said:



He said Shiel + pick #9 is not worth pick #1. And the plan is to be playing finals 2020 onwards.

You've twisted what he said into something it isn't. What he said has nothing to do with calling bluff on the clubs stated desire to recruit mature ready-made players. Nothing whatsoever.

We can recruit those types without giving up pick #1. And Shiel is not the only one we can target.

We've been rumoured by a strong inside source that Angus Brayshaw will be a target this year and that Shiel will be the target next year.

Fair enough i thought you were talking about my thoughts on the subject re the club and trading. Hence you asked me where the club has stated trading premium picks not Malifice but anyway carry on .

 

[HereComesJuddy]

With respect, I stopped taking it seriously when I saw Higgins.

Hes better than Shiel currently

 

[blue healer]

So, have we got Sheil and Gaff yet?

 

[HereComesJuddy]

With respect, I stopped taking it seriously when I saw Higgins.

Btw Higgins is paying $12 for the brownlow with sportsbet. Shiel $150.

But yeah, i can see why you think Shiel is better... lol

 

[GapInIkonPark]

Right. So why is it so critical to go after a quality 24 yr old mid this year? If one comes out and nominates us, then sure we'd be open to acquiring them. But we won't be trading pick #1 to do it. Like I just said, we're rumoured to be targeting Angus Brayshaw and also McGovern this year. Shiel is the target for next year. There's more than one VERY good reason for that.

I assume you mean the Adelaide McGovern.

What would Brayshaw and McGovern cost in terms of draft picks or trades?

I would be happy with Brayshaw, not with the Adelaide McGovern.

But I would be even happier with Shiel and another high pick.

Did you see this article?

https://www.theaustralian.com.au/sp...l/news-story/d077285b22a001310227d6811caad55d

 

[thylacine60]

god I hate lol

 

[Blue_Fusion]

Fair enough i thought you were talking about my thoughts on the subject re the club and trading. Hence you asked me where the club has stated trading premium picks not Malifice but anyway carry on .

Right, and you can't provide any evidence that they said that.

So the very nature of this whole discussion is going off an assumption you made which you have exclusively tied to only recruiting Shiel this year rather than any other target that may be on our radar.

 

[Benaly28]

Kelly
Cripps
Macrae
Bont
Mitchell
Fyfe
Dangerfield
Martin
Cotchin
Treloar
Coniglio
Neale
J kennedy syd
Ward
Wines
Selwood
Sidebottom
Gaff
Higgins
Merrett
Pendlebury
Heeney
Gibbs
Duncan
Murphy
Brad crouch
Parker
Zorko
Sloane
Beams
Viney

Then in the youth department id choose players such as:
Dow
LDU
Rayner (will play lots of mid time)
Andrew Brayshaw
Cerra

But thats just me.

That’s a brilliant constructed list of which I agree with the majority of them but Shiel would at least be in the top 20.Id have him in front of Higgins,Zorko,Crouch,Murphy,Merret.

 

[blue healer]

god I hate lol

WTF's wrong with Little Old Ladies?

Not sure if this is a gender or an age thing.

 

[Iamcarlton]

The team would develop together and improve substantially , in turn evolving CFC into a desired destination for future FA's and out of contract A graders.
The club has drafted hard for 3 years as promised and looks to have delivered in the main.
Its now time to add some class as promised if possible to our stable of developing youth and begin the climb to relevancy and beyond.

Agree entirely i think the one thing one that people need to get out of their minds is talk of premierships .
We are that far from that its just ridiculous .
We went to ground zero in 2015 resetting the whole club establishing hopefully in time a winning culture and a strong foundation for future success .
Our first second and third thought is to put a competitive side out on the field each an every week that gets us out of the bottom 4 .
If that means getting in a couple of mature agers so be it .
Once thats achieved then ok lets start talking bigger picture .
But right now where we are at talking premierships is just pie in the sky stuff .

 

[Stamos]

WTF's wrong with Little Old Ladies?

Not sure if this is a gender or an age thing.

A size thing

 

[HereComesJuddy]

god I hate lol

Some people deserve it on here with their lack of football knowledge

 

[HereComesJuddy]

That’s a brilliant constructed list of which I agree with the majority of them but Shiel would at least be in the top 20.Id have him in front of Higgins,Zorko,Crouch,Murphy,Merret.

Think Shiel gets let off the chain with all GWS' other class mids. Id have him below those you mentioned

 

[Blue_Fusion]

I assume you mean the Adelaide McGovern.

What would Brayshaw and McGovern cost in terms of draft picks or trades?

I would be happy with Brayshaw, not with the Adelaide McGovern.

But I would be even happier with Shiel and another high pick.

Did you see this article?

https://www.theaustralian.com.au/sp...l/news-story/d077285b22a001310227d6811caad55d

That article is behind a paywall.

Yes Mitch is the one. Don't think he's a requirement for us either tbh.

As for Brayshaw, it's hard to say what it would cost in terms of trades. We might offer up our 2019 1st with a pick coming back to us. His concussions are a concern which may drive his value down a bit.

Shiel and another high pick isn't going to happen. There's too many logical reasons for it not to.