AFL experience as a coach

[PP34]

So Kane Cornes thinks Brendan Bolton not playing at the highest level is a giant elephant in the room when it comes to his coaching.

Without turning this into a discussion about Bolton himself, do you actually think not playing AFL is a serious issue for any AFL level coach?

Me personally I don’t think so. Obviously it’s not footy but in the NBA you’ve got Greg Popovich who’s one of the greatest coaches ever, never played a single NBA minute. Then in soccer you’ve got Jose Mourinho who never played at the highest level but did learn off some all time greats. I think that as long as you have good mentors, you can motivate players and you understand the game well you can succeed.

One of my mates makes the argument that footy is different because you’re asking blokes to run through a wall for you basically and how is any AFL player going to listen to the words of someone who hasn’t experienced it in the AFL.

I think in the future we’ll probably see more coaches coming from less traditional backgrounds as we realise that a lot of players turn out to be rubbish coaches.



Thoughts?

 

[unplugged]

So Kane Cornes thinks Brendan Bolton not playing at the highest level is a giant elephant in the room when it comes to his coaching.

Without turning this into a discussion about Bolton himself, do you actually think not playing AFL is a serious issue for any AFL level coach?

Me personally I don’t think so. Obviously it’s not footy but in the NBA you’ve got Greg Popovich who’s one of the greatest coaches ever, never played a single NBA minute. Then in soccer you’ve got Jose Mourinho who never played at the highest level but did learn off some all time greats. I think that as long as you have good mentors, you can motivate players and you understand the game well you can succeed.

One of my mates makes the argument that footy is different because you’re asking blokes to run through a wall for you basically and how is any AFL player going to listen to the words of someone who hasn’t experienced it in the AFL.


Thoughts?

Kane Cornes with no experience in having interesting opinions, trying to give interesting opinions. Same same.

 

[Sir_Loin]

Kane Cornes will never be an AFL coach. That should be the start and end of it.

 

[sataris]

how is any AFL player going to listen to the words of someone who hasn’t experienced it in the AFL.

This is way more common than your mate thinks.

If you've ever had a job, someone, somewhere is taking orders from someone whose never had to do that job.

 

[PP34]

This is way more common than your mate thinks.

If you've ever had a job, someone, somewhere is taking orders from someone whose never had to do that job.

That’s not AFL footy though. I can see some logic in the argument that when things are going tough or when players need a rev up a coach who didn’t play in the AFL may not get through to everyone.

 

[Sir_Loin]

This is way more common than your mate thinks.

If you've ever had a job, someone, somewhere is taking orders from someone whose never had to do that job.

He’s been involved at all levels of footy for a long time. He might not have run on to the field as an elite player but to dismiss his abilities on that alone is a very narrow view.

If anything he was too young to take on the job at the time he took it. The blues board would have known how green he was as a senior coach. They’ve hedged their bets with his contract but given the low base he’s coming off it would smack of panic if they sacked him now. And it wouldn’t be based off him not playing AFL level footy

 

[sataris]

That’s not AFL footy though. I can see some logic in the argument that when things are going tough or when players need a rev up a coach who didn’t play in the AFL may not get through to everyone.

They're playing sport, not defending Athens/Sparta from the Persians.

 

[Supercoach Bargain]

Kane Cornes has little experience as a firie, gave up when the going got tough. A great background.

 

[SickQwon]

Coaches have proven to be successful in codes like soccer and basketball with out playing the sport. Can’t really be sure if Aussie Rules is an exception. There have been great coaches at AFL level who were bog-ordinary players too.
History has shown that playing/playing ability doesn’t really correlate to coaching ability.

 

[Supercoach Bargain]

This is way more common than your mate thinks.

If you've ever had a job, someone, somewhere is taking orders from someone whose never had to do that job.

While the playing experience helped Mark Neeld, Brent Ratten, Vossey etc.

 

[Kwality]

Kane Cornes has little experience as a firie, gave up when the going got tough. A great background.

He's been there, done that, in the AFL

 

[kranky al]

Theres a few league coaches that didnt play firsts either

http://forums.leagueunlimited.com/threads/nrl-coaches-who-never-played-for-an-nrl-club.461206/

 

[Sir_Loin]

While the playing experience helped Mark Neeld, Brent Ratten, Vossey etc.

Rats extremely stiff that he got knifed like that. Remember his press conference like it was yesterday - pure class act that bloke. Rated him as a player and he’s a top shelf person

 

[Luv_our_club]

I can imagine running through a wall if Chris Fagan asked me too..... would love to play for Fagan. Exactly the kind of coach i would want.

 

[mick500]

Don't believe it 1 bit. Other sports have had plenty of successful coach's that never played the game at the top level.

He's just being elitist. The boys club. That he would love enough to sell his fireman suit to be a part of.

No plebs can coach, only ex footy gods. /s

Does every line coach or fitness coach have a background in playing in the AFL? Is their opinion immediately discarded by Kane if they don't ? If so he is poorer for it.

I'm sure theres a statistician or Supercoach geek that would make a great recruiter, or possibly even head coach if there were courses in it and they were given a chance.

I know with tennis coaching you get different levels of coaching accreditation. Does AFL have the same thing in place?

 

[HarryFlashman]

This is way more common than your mate thinks.

If you've ever had a job, someone, somewhere is taking orders from someone whose never had to do that job.

The best project managers tend to have never done the job, they know how to put together a team of professionals, use there relevant expertise and lead/manage to complete the task.

 

[Sir_Loin]

I can imagine running through a wall if Chris Fagan asked me too..... would love to play for Fagan. Exactly the kind of coach i would want.

Poor Clarko

 

[Luv_our_club]

Poor Clarko

Not an either/or type scenario....

 

[Lavender Bushranger]

So Kane Cornes thinks Brendan Bolton not playing at the highest level is a giant elephant in the room when it comes to his coaching.

Without turning this into a discussion about Bolton himself, do you actually think not playing AFL is a serious issue for any AFL level coach?

Me personally I don’t think so. Obviously it’s not footy but in the NBA you’ve got Greg Popovich who’s one of the greatest coaches ever, never played a single NBA minute. Then in soccer you’ve got Jose Mourinho who never played at the highest level but did learn off some all time greats. I think that as long as you have good mentors, you can motivate players and you understand the game well you can succeed.

One of my mates makes the argument that footy is different because you’re asking blokes to run through a wall for you basically and how is any AFL player going to listen to the words of someone who hasn’t experienced it in the AFL.

I think in the future we’ll probably see more coaches coming from less traditional backgrounds as we realise that a lot of players turn out to be rubbish coaches.



Thoughts?

Yes I do.

There comes a point, when most people think to themself, that they know better than their authority figure - whether it be teacher, parent, coach etc.

In most circumstances, it's real world experience that overcomes that hurdle.

 

[Sir_Loin]

Not an either/or type scenario....

OK

 

[gavaniacono]

So Kane Cornes thinks Brendan Bolton not playing at the highest level is a giant elephant in the room when it comes to his coaching.

Without turning this into a discussion about Bolton himself, do you actually think not playing AFL is a serious issue for any AFL level coach?

Me personally I don’t think so. Obviously it’s not footy but in the NBA you’ve got Greg Popovich who’s one of the greatest coaches ever, never played a single NBA minute. Then in soccer you’ve got Jose Mourinho who never played at the highest level but did learn off some all time greats. I think that as long as you have good mentors, you can motivate players and you understand the game well you can succeed.

One of my mates makes the argument that footy is different because you’re asking blokes to run through a wall for you basically and how is any AFL player going to listen to the words of someone who hasn’t experienced it in the AFL.

I think in the future we’ll probably see more coaches coming from less traditional backgrounds as we realise that a lot of players turn out to be rubbish coaches.



Thoughts?

I think yes and no.
Yes, it will help by creating more immediate trust in the training and system from players and club. Esp in bad times there will be more faith and commitment to things turning around. Lions Lynch has said their faith in Mathews was immense and they looked to him as the man that WILL take them to the promised land espesh in the 2001 GF up against Bombers during a tough first half. Mathews instilled belief.

No, because if a coach can win the trust through demonstrable improvement it can still work out. I'd think the whole club would need to be in unison.

Thread not about Bolton, however, it looks like there are player doubts and wins are few and far and it will be a long haul if the club is strong enough to stay the course.

 

[Cincinnatus]

Good rule of thumb, any time Kane Cornes thinks anything, jump on the other side. Youll be right far more often than not.

 

[Ron The Bear]

Was it Tony Lockett who said the opinions of people who never played in the AFL are worthless?

Until someone like Bolton leads a club to a premiership, doubts will remain in some quarters.

Coach|Club(s)|Career|M|W|L|D|Win %|Best
\Fagan, Chris|Br|2017-2018|37|8|29|0|21.6|16th*
\Bolton, Brendon|Ha,Ca|2014-2018|64|19|45|0|29.7|14th
\McCartney, Brendan|WB|2012-2014|66|20|46|0|30.3|14th
\Riley, Mark|Me|2007|9|3|6|0|33.3|caretaker
\Craig, Neil|Ad,Me|2004-2013|177|93|84|0|52.5|3rd
\Brittain, Wayne|Ca|2001-2002|46|18|28|0|39.1|6th
\Kinnear, Col|Sy|1989-1991|66|23|42|1|35.6|7th
\Todd, John|WC|1988-1989|45|20|25|0|44.4|5th
\Hammond, Bob A.|Sy|1984|8|3|5|0|37.5|caretaker
\Cahill, John|Co,PA|1983-1998|91|46|43|2|51.6|4th
\Jordon, Ray|NM|1976|1|0|1|0|0.0|fill-in
\Thomas, Hughie|St|1944-1945|38|8|28|2|23.7|9th
\Cassidy, Jim|WB|1926|8|1|7|0|12.5|sacked
\Melling, Ted|Fi|1919|9|4|4|1|50.0|caretaker
\Brown, Vic|Un|1913|18|0|18|0|0.0|10th
\Hickinbotham, Dave|Ge|1910-1911|36|18|16|2|52.8|5th
\Strickland, Bill|Co|1904-1908|13|8|5|0|61.5|3rd
\Worrall, John|Ca,Es|1902-1920|279|165|110|4|59.9|5 flags

Yeah, I know, SANFL etc. Don't want to start an argument about the definition of "top level" here.

 

[Luv_our_club]

Was it Tony Lockett who said the opinions of people who never played in the AFL are worthless?

Until someone like Bolton leads a club to a premiership, doubts will remain in some quarters.

Coach|Club(s)|Career|M|W|L|D|Win %|Best
\Fagan, Chris|Br|2017-2018|37|8|29|0|21.6|16th*
\Bolton, Brendon|Ha,Ca|2014-2018|64|19|45|0|29.7|14th
\McCartney, Brendan|WB|2012-2014|66|20|46|0|30.3|14th
\Riley, Mark|Me|2007|9|3|6|0|33.3|caretaker
\Craig, Neil|Ad,Me|2004-2013|177|93|84|0|52.5|3rd
\Brittain, Wayne|Ca|2001-2002|46|18|28|0|39.1|6th
\Kinnear, Col|Sy|1989-1991|66|23|42|1|35.6|7th
\Todd, John|WC|1988-1989|45|20|25|0|44.4|5th
\Hammond, Bob A.|Sy|1984|8|3|5|0|37.5|caretaker
\Cahill, John|Co,PA|1983-1998|91|46|43|2|51.6|4th
\Jordon, Ray|NM|1976|1|0|1|0|0.0|fill-in
\Thomas, Hughie|St|1944-1945|38|8|28|2|23.7|9th
\Cassidy, Jim|WB|1926|8|1|7|0|12.5|sacked
\Melling, Ted|Fi|1919|9|4|4|1|50.0|caretaker
\Brown, Vic|Un|1913|18|0|18|0|0.0|10th
\Hickinbotham, Dave|Ge|1910-1911|36|18|16|2|52.8|5th
\Strickland, Bill|Co|1904-1908|13|8|5|0|61.5|3rd
\Worrall, John|Ca,Es|1902-1920|279|165|110|4|59.9|5 flags

Yeah, I know, SANFL etc. Don't want to start an argument about the definition of "top level" here.

I didn't know Pagan was a player

 

[Ron The Bear]

I didn't know Pagan was a player