Bluemour Discussion Thread XI - Facts Not Welcome

[fizzkakz]

Uh, it's posted here first already which you already stated.

Who turned the light out, George?

I'm referring to posting on his group on FB, not here.

Sent from my SM-G950F using Tapatalk

 

[Marc Shmurf 3]

What’s your take MS3, where will he end up?

We have been working on getting him for the last 2 years. At this stage its us or the Giants.

 

[Aphrodite]

Uh, it's posted here first already which you already stated.

Who turned the light out, George?

Pretty sure he meant posting it 1st on Earls (take it to the Bank) Flogbook page.

 

[Wickzki]

Pretty sure he meant posting it 1st on his Flogbook page.

My bad.

If he had any clue he'd just delete it and repost it.

Alternatively, it would make his page the place to go (for those not wanting BigFooty) on FB as a community would be updating it almost as quickly as it gets posted here.

 

[Waite_30]

We have been working on getting him for the last 2 years. At this stage its us or the Giants.

I'm hearing that he is out of there. Won't be at the Giants next year.

 

[Blue__Balls]

St Kilda are, at the very least, encouraging Shiel and his manager to stretch our offer a little more. He may have no intention of going to St Kilda, but if they're offering +2 years or +$200k per year, there's a good chance Shiel's manager will get us to come up a little from where we're sitting now.

Smart move by the Saints I reckon - the more they can get us to commit to Shiel, the less we have to bid against them for others next year.

 

[Gavstar]

We have been working on getting him for the last 2 years. At this stage its us or the Giants.

Happy to take next year as an RFA!

 

[therubbernub]

Yeah it was, apologies. I've just had an infected tooth pulled and am struggling!

Are you out of the chair yet?

 

[TheKing101]

We have been working on getting him for the last 2 years. At this stage its us or the Giants.

Good to hear!

 

[KohPhi]

was it at toothirty?

You bastard!! Made me laugh and that hurt!!

 

[KohPhi]

There's so many variables that a genuine 50/50 would surely be very rare. Money, contract years, coaches & coach security, team success, friends at the club, location etc. all come into it. That's why every player nominates a specific club. Luckily for us St Kilda is probably the one Victorian club we can confidently say we are more attractive than.

Spot on!!!

 

[ESKIE]

Think about it as paying somebody $900k/year for 5 years, with a $1m signing bonus.

We have managed our cap so that we can, and need to do this.

This spot on Cookie

 

[BrisbaneCFC]

St Kilda are, at the very least, encouraging Shiel and his manager to stretch our offer a little more. He may have no intention of going to St Kilda, but if they're offering +2 years or +$200k per year, there's a good chance Shiel's manager will get us to come up a little from where we're sitting now.

Smart move by the Saints I reckon - the more they can get us to commit to Shiel, the less we have to bid against them for others next year.

If Im SOS, I don't increase the money at all on offer for Shiel. IMO, if Shiel ask for more than has been offered by CFC already, it says all I need to know about him. Based on the reported numbers being thrown around of course.

 

[Dooky]

The only people who place any credence in the 'history' of a club as to whether a player should/would/will pick or not pick that club are supporters. Anyone who thinks an 18-24 yo kid thinks "Hmmm.. I'm not going to St.Kilda coz they've only one 1 flag" is ******* delusional. They couldn't give a fat rat's **** about what happened in the 60's or 70's.
There will NOT be one player who comes to Carlton this trade period saying to their Manager "get me to the Blues, they've won 16 flags". What horseshit.

No different to players picking Essendon, they couldn't give a s**t what happened a few years ago.

I hope we land Shiel, I really do. But it won't be because his family are 'die hard' Blues for **** sake.
Kreuzer's family are die hard Magpies as is Tom Williamson. s**t, he even had a poster of Pendlebury on his wall. Cripps loved West Coast growing up. Why haven't they gone 'home?'

**** off.

Edit: Shiel will pick the Blues if he feels a rapport with the Coaching staff, if he gets a good vibe from the players he meet, if he feels the list is going places and he gets paid accordingly. Not because the other clubs have a 's**t' history.

In essence you are right , definitely on the historically successful piece , 16 flags etc etc - I don't think there is much credence in that. Although I still think there is a draw to playing with big clubs with big supporter bases 90k+ in a H&A game type thing - look at how easily Collingwood bring in players in recent years vs Saints, Dogs etc.

But I think it's also case-specific especially when the decision is line ball. You can't predict what might tug at the heartstrings nor what an impact a couple of club legends like Silvagni and Judd may have if there was already a fondness there to begin with.

Using examples of Cripps, Kreuzer, and Williamson is just stupid because they don't find themselves in the position of having to choose a club, i.e. they are happily contracted and not willingly looking elsewhere.

Ask Sam Docherty about his decision...

http://www.carltonfc.com.au/news/2015-10-14/top-trades-8-sam-docherty

When Docherty arrived at Ikon Park, there was no doubting his passion for the Blues and his desire to play for the guernsey.

“I can’t wait to put the jumper on, it’s a dream come true,” Docherty said on October 24, 2013.

“Obviously growing up (barracking) for them and now getting here – I can’t think of anything better.”

Don't be so absolute in your statements either.

 

[ESKIE]

How do Saints afford Shiel @1.3m when also going hard for Hannebery, Wingard and likely others in the 800K -1.2m range?

Just doesn't make sense? Do they have 25% - 33% of their cap available to spend on 3 players? even then that's poor money management

They’re throwing a million darts at once hoping for a bullseye, land one ditch the other

 

[barass70]

I'm hearing that he is out of there. Won't be at the Giants next year.

Yep.. I think Saints or us.

 

[Weitbricks]

I'm hearing that he is out of there. Won't be at the Giants next year.

Heard anything about Gaff and us?

Yep.. I think Saints or us.

Any chance at Gaff?

 

[Dadda Dave]

I'm hearing that he is out of there. Won't be at the Giants next year.

So that means Shiel will be a blue!

 

[Blue and Silver]

Alright stick with me

If in one circle you have Gws and Carlton and in the other St Kilda and Carlton then the only intersection is Carlton.



Sent from my SM-G950F using Tapatalk

 

[Waite_30]

Heard anything about Gaff and us?

Unfortunately I've only got mail on GWS. Gaff to the Blues along with Shiel, MM, Setterfield and Walsh will be some sort of Trade period.

 

[The Old Dark Navy's]

Not going to happen.....Carlton family, there's no way he goes there, its pretty simple.
We aren't talking about punters, we are talking die hard supporters - unless the money was ridiculous it wont happen (& it wont be as we will be prepared to pay)....People should chill, out its going to happen

I can see the likelihood of us offering 850k per year over 5 years and St Kilda have been reported as offering $1.3m over 6 years. That sort of stuff can be a gamebreaker. Nobody here wants us paying that sort of coin surely?

 

[ParapMarkets]

If Im SOS, I don't increase the money at all on offer for Shiel. IMO, if Shiel ask for more than has been offered by CFC already, it says all I need to know about him. Based on the reported numbers being thrown around of course.

+1
He needs to hold his nerve. The reported figure that we are offering is well over his value already without going into the territory the Saints are in. I know we (and the Saints) have an additional $1.3 million as a result of being able to go to 105% for 2 years but we can't go overboard. It's scary to think what offers are going to be in front of Cripps when he becomes a free agent.

 

[jd2010]

The only people who place any credence in the 'history' of a club as to whether a player should/would/will pick or not pick that club are supporters. Anyone who thinks an 18-24 yo kid thinks "Hmmm.. I'm not going to St.Kilda coz they've only one 1 flag" is ******* delusional. They couldn't give a fat rat's **** about what happened in the 60's or 70's.
There will NOT be one player who comes to Carlton this trade period saying to their Manager "get me to the Blues, they've won 16 flags". What horseshit.

No different to players picking Essendon, they couldn't give a s**t what happened a few years ago.

I hope we land Shiel, I really do. But it won't be because his family are 'die hard' Blues for **** sake.
Kreuzer's family are die hard Magpies as is Tom Williamson. s**t, he even had a poster of Pendlebury on his wall. Cripps loved West Coast growing up. Why haven't they gone 'home?'

**** off.

Edit: Shiel will pick the Blues if he feels a rapport with the Coaching staff, if he gets a good vibe from the players he meet, if he feels the list is going places and he gets paid accordingly. Not because the other clubs have a 's**t' history.

Finally some realism!

 

[jd2010]

Well really it just depends on the player, if it's a 50/50 decision minor things can sway your decision

Name some players who have moved to their boyhood club when making a 50/50 decision?

 

[Blue__Balls]

If Im SOS, I don't increase the money at all on offer for Shiel. IMO, if Shiel ask for more than has been offered by CFC already, it says all I need to know about him. Based on the reported numbers being thrown around of course.

Bullshit. Shiel doesn't ask for more money. Shiel lets his manager do the negotiating.

The manager comes to us and says "Look, Dylan is really keen on you guys, but earning an extra $1.5mil over the next 6 years is something he really needs to consider. I know you've been saving up for your big recruitment push, if you can come up a little, or add an extra year on the end, I think that would seal it for Dylan."

The whole thing is negotiation. I'd also be astounded if we haven't allowed for some extra inflation of our current offer for this very purpose.