Bluemour Discussion Thread XI - Facts Not Welcome

[Zlatan]

Let’s reassee for a minute.
There’s a myth that we need mature players to help the kids.
Bullshit, we need mature best 22 players to help us become a sustained competitive team able to challenge for flags.
2 state league players will do sfa for us in the long term.
What happens when,murphy Simpson,kruze,Thomas retire in the next year or 2?
We’ll be back to square one in 2 years.

If SOS is really serious about bringing in mature talent, we'll trade 2018 #1 and 2019 #1-4 and go after the contracted players we want. We have the capacity to do this.

Not saying we will..

 

[PooMonkey]

Trying to rub me up the wrong way? [emoji1303]

Don’t you have someone to block on FB....

 

[Wily trout]

In 'The Age' story about the state league picks, it alludes to The Suns getting three state league players and us only two??? Clearly nothing has been announced in this regard officially.....but WTF?? Has there been a mistake and the Suns actually only won two games and came stone motherless last??
I know knickers knotted...still pi55ed.

 

[Gavstar]

Well done Anthony who called into SEN

Accused Whately of being on the anti-Carlton committee.

Asked what will topping up with State league players do given we've already tried Kerridge, Graham, Mullet and O'Shea?

Thanks says Gerrard.

 

[RoyalBlues]

If SOS is really serious about bringing in mature talent, we'll trade 2018 #1 and 2019 #1-4 and go after the contracted players we want. We have the capacity to do this.

Wouldn’t be surprised; depends on a judgement call, a bolt from the blue and an English/Italian translation or two.

 

[RoyalBlues]

Don’t you have someone to block on FB....

I don’t do Facebook, I’m not 48 trying to be 20!

 

[TheBlueCampaigner]

Trying to rub me up the wrong way? [emoji1303]

Dare I say it, I just hope this Shiel thing has a happy ending.

Yes, I’m a grub. I’ll show myself out.


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[footyfan1978]

Technically correct, but I think inaccurate in practice.

So it shows how big a bonus a pointy end PP could have been...

Not saying we wan't/need one. Just debunking the theory that a PP doesn't change much....

Darling and Shuey are PP players for Eagles....
In their second grand final in four years this weekend. Eagles without both those guys do not make those grand finals.

 

[RoyalBlues]

Dare I say it, I just hope this Shiel thing has a happy ending.

Yes, I’m a grub. I’ll show myself out.


On iPhone using BigFooty.com mobile app

And to quote the most used 4 letter word in such an establishment:


Apparently . . .





Next

 

[serenityNow]

Pick 1 for MM + Pick 7
Pick 7 for Shiel

Turns 1 into Shiel and MM. Your list management say the next step is recruiting a certain age bracket which would fit the above trade.

Leaves 23 and 24 to work for Setterfield or the draft.

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lol no ******* chance.

 

[PooMonkey]

I don’t do Facebook, I’m not 48 trying to be 20!

So what time shall we expect this breaking news you’ve managed to pull out of thin air?

 

[Bluerice]

Darling and Shuey are PP players for Eagles....
In their second grand final in four years this weekend. Eagles without both those guys do not make those grand finals.

Are they really? That is not my recollection. Darling had a stigma over him during draft year and by accounts was a shithead student but was drafted with no PP. Nor was Shuey from my memory

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[ferrisb]

Furthermore.......

Grand Finalists, don't have any PP players running this weekend

FYI, your arrow looks WAY off here....

2018 ladder

1 - Richmond: Rance
2 - West Coast: Darling, Shuey
3 - Collingwood: Pendelbury*
4 - Hawks: Roughead^
5 - Melbourne: Brayshaw#

Actually, every team in the top 5 of the ladder had at least one PP running around in 2018 (taking some license here on Melb). And not only that, but basically each team's best player over the last decade came as PP (except for Brayshaw, but he just came 3rd in the Brownlow at age 22).

PLUS Richmond, WC, Hawks and WC all had PPs in addition to those above that are either retired, traded or ended up being busts. And then I'd like to note Kennedy (WC) as a previous PP (not given to WC). I would argue that PPs are a HUGE factor in these teams' success.




Some license here *Pendelbury was not taken as PP, Thomas was. But with no PPs, Collingwood would have missed out on Pendles. ^ Roughhead WAS taken with PP, but without it, the story goes Hawks would have taken Franklin first. So Roughy is the bonus. #Brayshaw officially FA compo, but basically a Clayton's PP as the AFL was pretending it wasn't a PP.

 

[Blue and Blue]

If SOS is really serious about bringing in mature talent, we'll trade 2018 #1 and 2019 #1-4 and go after the contracted players we want. We have the capacity to do this.

Not saying we will..

Reckon SOS is smarter than that. And this state league access outside of draft will give two mature agers without abandoning the gradual improvement with youth. Or even better yet extra draft picks to bargain with or use.

 

[Coona Blues]

Let’s reassee for a minute.
There’s a myth that we need mature players to help the kids.
Bullshit, we need mature best 22 players to help us become a sustained competitive team able to challenge for flags.
2 state league players will do sfa for us in the long term.
What happens when,murphy Simpson,kruze,Thomas retire in the next year or 2?
We’ll be back to square one in 2 years.

Yeah, Nah.
Bullshit offering from AFL.

Will not be back to square one.
Shiel counteracts Murphy.....likely add Setterfield and Walsh, with some chance of Brodie or others.
Simpson offset by return of Doc, Willo and Byrne (perhaps others developing/traded)
Thomas will have his work cut out to remain best 22 as the kids develop.
Kreuzer the tough one, but I have plenty of faith that a developing TDK will assume the mantle,
perhaps another youngster added next year (Luke Jackson if he grows a little)

 

[Arr0w]

Technically correct, but I think inaccurate in practice.

Pendelbury (while not selected with a PP) is the player Collingwood would have missed out on if not given PP in 2005.

Josh Kennedy same for Carlton. And while he wasn't given to WC, he has turned out to be one helluva player.

Those two are their sides' best players for the last decade. So it shows how big a bonus a pointy end PP could have been...

Not saying we wan't/need one. Just debunking the theory that a PP doesn't change much....

Ferris, I enjoy the banter you and I have had over recent times regarding the benefits of a PP

Surely you would have to concede it is more about sound list management than priority picks.

Until recently, we have never fully embraced a complete rebuild. As much as Judd, was wonderful for what he brought to Carlton (and still giving), having players like Kennedy and Masten on our list right now, would look completely different/better

Also, overpaying for Thomas, decreased our ability for fast tracking success, two fold. Pies get a 1st round pick, while we lose the ability to attract a compensation pick for Betts, by signing Thomas. Staggering decisions.

Fast forward to SOS, who has traded out players that will not be around for our next flag, which is tough for many fans, but ultimately will create a more sustained competitive group.

As an example, if we trade Murphy next year, for say a late 2nd or early 3rd, then select a player that goes on to be a premiership player, are we going to say that the PP was the reason, or good list management/talent identification?

While guys like Rance were priority picks, he was a very small part of the greater cog, in their flag, as he is for not making the GF this year.

The key factors in list management/talent identification is utilising your assets wisely, rather than worrying about the number of assets you have, as no recruiter has a 100% strike rate when it comes to drafting/trading

 

[RoyalBlues]

So what time shall we expect this breaking news you’ve managed to pull out of thin air?

So, it’s thin air AND you want an exact time?

... as you’ve been so thoughtful . . .

Work on your cross examination techniques too, perhaps.

 

[Arr0w]

FYI, your arrow looks WAY off here....

2018 ladder

1 - Richmond: Rance
2 - West Coast: Darling, Shuey
3 - Collingwood: Pendelbury*
4 - Hawks: Roughead^
5 - Melbourne: Brayshaw#

Actually, every team in the top 5 of the ladder had at least one PP running around in 2018 (taking some license here on Melb). And not only that, but basically each team's best player over the last decade came as PP (except for Brayshaw, but he just came 3rd in the Brownlow at age 22).

PLUS Richmond, WC, Hawks and WC all had PPs in addition to those above that are either retired, traded or ended up being busts. And then I'd like to note Kennedy (WC) as a previous PP (not given to WC). I would argue that PPs are a HUGE factor in these teams' success.




Some license here *Pendelbury was not taken as PP, Thomas was. But with no PPs, Collingwood would have missed out on Pendles. ^ Roughhead WAS taken with PP, but without it, the story goes Hawks would have taken Franklin first. So Roughy is the bonus. #Brayshaw officially FA compo, but basically a Clayton's PP as the AFL was pretending it wasn't a PP.

How is Darling and Shuey part of the PP discussion?

 

[Forty3]

Pick 1 for MM + Pick 7
Pick 7 for Shiel

Turns 1 into Shiel and MM. Your list management say the next step is recruiting a certain age bracket which would fit the above trade.

Leaves 23 and 24 to work for Setterfield or the draft.

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Whilst this trade is not nearly as horrible as people are suggesting.
Carlton cannot afford to pass up on a midfield talent such as Walsh.
MM is a very talented player and doesn’t get the credit he deserves from a lot on this board but that is mainly because he plays in a position where we consider ourselves to have the most depth.

 

[PooMonkey]

So, it’s thin air AND you want an exact time?

... as you’ve been so thoughtful . . .

Work on your cross examination techniques too, perhaps.

As I expected, nothing...
Full of it as always.

But hey, at least you can keep fishing for internet likes. We all know how much you dislike anyone challenging you...shame there’s no block feature here. You’d have a bigger wall than Trump!

 

[Toddski]

FYI, your arrow looks WAY off here....

2018 ladder

1 - Richmond: Rance
2 - West Coast: Darling, Shuey
3 - Collingwood: Pendelbury*
4 - Hawks: Roughead^
5 - Melbourne: Brayshaw#

Actually, every team in the top 5 of the ladder had at least one PP running around in 2018 (taking some license here on Melb). And not only that, but basically each team's best player over the last decade came as PP (except for Brayshaw, but he just came 3rd in the Brownlow at age 22).

PLUS Richmond, WC, Hawks and WC all had PPs in addition to those above that are either retired, traded or ended up being busts. And then I'd like to note Kennedy (WC) as a previous PP (not given to WC). I would argue that PPs are a HUGE factor in these teams' success.




Some license here *Pendelbury was not taken as PP, Thomas was. But with no PPs, Collingwood would have missed out on Pendles. ^ Roughhead WAS taken with PP, but without it, the story goes Hawks would have taken Franklin first. So Roughy is the bonus. #Brayshaw officially FA compo, but basically a Clayton's PP as the AFL was pretending it wasn't a PP.

This.

How the AFL can justify this decision is beyond me. We have arguably been the worst performing team in history recently. They stripped our picks all those years ago which we are still recovering from and now when we are told to go grovelling at their feet, the AFL lure us in and slap us back down again. What kind of sick institution is this?

As you stated, priority picks have played a key role in all of the best performing teams with the exception of Geelong, which they bypassed by having a plethora of father sons. Access to a few plodders in the state leagues? Seriously. I actually wish we stuck to our guns now and didn't even bother asking the corrupt cheats.

 

[RoyalBlues]

As I expected, nothing...
Full of shot as always.

And, given you expect nothing you can’t be disappointed.

 

[Blue__Balls]

Has shiel woken up yet ?
What time does he usually have breakfast ?

Heard a rumour he tossed out the orange juice this morning and chowed down on a blueberry muffin.

 

[PooMonkey]

Heard a rumour he tossed out the orange juice this morning and chowed down on a blueberry muffin.

Most accurate rumour yet...

 

[RoyalBlues]

As I expected, nothing...
Full of it as always.

But hey, at least you can keep fishing for internet likes. We all know how much you dislike anyone challenging you...shame there’s no block feature here. You’d have a bigger wall than Trump!

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