List Mgmt. Carlton's 2018 Draft Thread (cont. in Part 2)

[Arr0w]

so what's the 4 day thing harker mentioned?

4 days before a break in trading of picks

 

[gandaal]

Is anyone else worried about the number of high draft picks we are stockpiling and the effect it will have on our salary cap in a few years time ala GWS.
As good as it is to have an abundance of talent all about the same age, we have seen the effect it has had on GWS when it comes to retention, while we don't have quite the number they had we still have a lot of first round picks who will all be looking for substantial pay increases in a few years time.

Even Gold Coast have had the same issue once there players move into there 2nd and 3rd contracts, how we manage this will be interesting to watch which is probably why we have the 3 key personnel dealing with this area.

Talent aquisition and drafting to Brodie. Trading, contracts TPP Agresta and of course Silvagni overseeing both departments as a whole to ensure some sort of parity and oversight.

This system with luck will help us to avoid the pitfalls the other two clubs have fallen into by having a better overall picture of where we are at and where we are heading and what we can and can't afford as far as the TPP goes.

I guess all we can do is hope they know what they are doing which I think after all the shit that SOS went through with the brown paper bags under the table fiasco he will be keeping a very close eye on our salary cap issues now and into the future.
Hence I think tpp may have a bearing on whether we trade pick 1 for 3 & 6 as that adds an extra first round pick to squeeze into our TPP which may be fine now but what about 4-5 years down the line when there contracts are up for renewal for the third time.

Yes I too am very concerned about having too many superstar players. It keeps me up at night.

 

[Arr0w]

Is anyone else worried about the number of high draft picks we are stockpiling and the effect it will have on our salary cap in a few years time ala GWS.
As good as it is to have an abundance of talent all about the same age, we have seen the effect it has had on GWS when it comes to retention, while we don't have quite the number they had we still have a lot of first round picks who will all be looking for substantial pay increases in a few years time.

Even Gold Coast have had the same issue once there players move into there 2nd and 3rd contracts, how we manage this will be interesting to watch which is probably why we have the 3 key personnel dealing with this area.

Talent aquisition and drafting to Brodie. Trading, contracts TPP Agresta and of course Silvagni overseeing both departments as a whole to ensure some sort of parity and oversight.

This system with luck will help us to avoid the pitfalls the other two clubs have fallen into by having a better overall picture of where we are at and where we are heading and what we can and can't afford as far as the TPP goes.

I guess all we can do is hope they know what they are doing which I think after all the shit that SOS went through with the brown paper bags under the table fiasco he will be keeping a very close eye on our salary cap issues now and into the future.
Hence I think tpp may have a bearing on whether we trade pick 1 for 3 & 6 as that adds an extra first round pick to squeeze into our TPP which may be fine now but what about 4-5 years down the line when there contracts are up for renewal for the third time.

I doubt we would have that issue, similar to any other established club

GWS's issues were unique, they had a multitude of early draft picks, along with an extended list and still having to meet salary cap minimum payments.

 

[Eiffel 65]

Max King measuring in at 204cm.

If he grows another 2-3cm and maintains his speed and agility, he'll be unstoppable.

 

[BlueTang]

Max King measuring in at 204cm.

If he grows another 2-3cm and maintains his speed and agility, he'll be unstoppable.

Hunk of a munk, ‘you would just feel so safe in those arms’

 

[Brutalitops]

Max King measuring in at 204cm.

If he grows another 2-3cm and maintains his speed and agility, he'll be unstoppable.

They'll need to tie a brick to his head at this rate

 

[ParapMarkets]

4 days before a break in trading of picks

And boy oh boy do we need that break, it’s hard to keep up with all the activity.

 

[Del122324]

Max King measuring in at 204cm.

If he grows another 2-3cm and maintains his speed and agility, he'll be unstoppable.

Just give us one of the kings for our future first already!!!! FFS

 

[Omega Blue]

That's the problem you can't keep growing taller, maintaining agility while being strong enough to out body opponents.

 

[HARKER]

http://www.afl.com.au/news/2018-11-12/tomorrows-heroes-sam-walsh

Tell me you don't want him.

 

[dlb99]

The other thing is that Port may prefer to draft 2 players of their choice (first preference) rather than just selecting 3 best available players that may or may not suit their list needs.

A bit like us, there will be players in the top echelon that they will not have an interest in drafting because they'll be a surplus to their list.

They may, but I seriously doubt it.

Port has a number of needs.

I think they need to use all three picks.

I doubt they are sell-the-bank desperate for Rankine, they may like Luko more. Port always seems to be a team that recruits best available even if they are Victorian, plus they seem better at retention than Adelaide.

I would be stunned if they turn 3 top 15 picks into 2.

 

[DIG]

http://www.afl.com.au/news/2018-11-12/tomorrows-heroes-sam-walsh

Tell me you don't want him.

I love what he said about Carlton, he wants us so much.

One of, if not the best player in the draft would’ve been telling SOS how badly he wants to be a part of our journey. SOS must be so tempted if not in love already!

 

[Arr0w]

http://www.afl.com.au/news/2018-11-12/tomorrows-heroes-sam-walsh

Tell me you don't want him.

Great fallback position if we don't trade the pick

 

[HereComesJuddy]

http://www.afl.com.au/news/2018-11-12/tomorrows-heroes-sam-walsh

Tell me you don't want him.

And thats why we would demand overs. He is the best prospect going around. Mixing him into our already young but talented midfield... im licking my lips at the thought

 

[HARKER]

Great fallback position if we don't trade the pick

Of course. Good fallback.
Why would you want to take the best player in the draft when you can take the third best player and a pick in the 20's?

People say that pick #1 doesn't guarantee you the best player and have supported this by highlighting recent picks, but let's try it this way.
Where were the best mids taken.

2011: 1st mid taken was Coniglio @ #2
2012: 1st mid taken was Whitfield @ #1
2013: 1st mid taken was Kelly @ #2 and then Bontempelli @ #4
2014: 1st mid taken was Brayshaw @ #4
2015: 1st mid taken was Mills #3 and then Oliver @ #4
2016: 1st mid taken was Taranto @ #2 and then McCluggage at #3

Looks different now, doesn't it?

 

[8inmylife]

http://www.afl.com.au/news/2018-11-12/tomorrows-heroes-sam-walsh

Tell me you don't want him.

Thank you very much. He’ll do. Take the punt on this kid being a star. Imagine if we trade 1 away and he turns out to be Voss, Cotchin, Selwood. We would be lynching the recruiting team. Add him to what we already have, bring in a FA in 2019 and we’re off and running in 2020. Outside mid for 2019 while he beefs up.


On iPad using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[HereComesJuddy]

Of course. Good fallback.
Why would you want to take the best player in the draft when you can take the third best player and a pick in the 20's?

People say that pick #1 doesn't guarantee you the best player and have supported this by highlighting recent picks, but let's try it this way.
Where were the best mids taken.

2011: 1st mid taken was Coniglio @ #2
2012: 1st mid taken was Whitfield @ #1
2013: 1st mid taken was Kelly @ #2 and then Bontempelli @ #4
2014: 1st mid taken was Brayshaw @ #4
2015: 1st mid taken was Mills #3 and then Oliver @ #4
2016: 1st mid taken was Taranto @ #2 and then McCluggage at #3

Looks different now, doesn't it?

It can go either way but i wholeheartedly agree Harks. Its when kpp are top picks that it becomes difficult to judge.

If we take walsh and he turns out similar to Kelly, Taranto, mills, Whitfield etc in how good he could be, its the right decision imo. Only would trade 1 for 3 and 6, nothing later than those 2 picks.

 

[HereComesJuddy]

Thank you very much. He’ll do. Take the punt on this kid being a star. Imagine if we trade 1 away and he turns out to be Voss, Cotchin, Selwood. We would be lynching the recruiting team. Add him to what we already have, bring in a FA in 2019 and we’re off and running in 2020. Outside mid for 2019 while he beefs up.


On iPad using BigFooty.com mobile app

He may not become the best out of the draft. But theres many other aspects involved. Seems to have captained each team he played for this year. Thats a big plus imo

 

[Arr0w]

Of course. Good fallback.
Why would you want to take the best player in the draft when you can take the third best player and a pick in the 20's?

People say that pick #1 doesn't guarantee you the best player and have supported this by highlighting recent picks, but let's try it this way.
Where were the best mids taken.

2011: 1st mid taken was Coniglio @ #2
2012: 1st mid taken was Whitfield @ #1
2013: 1st mid taken was Kelly @ #2 and then Bontempelli @ #4
2014: 1st mid taken was Brayshaw @ #4
2015: 1st mid taken was Mills #3 and then Oliver @ #4
2016: 1st mid taken was Taranto @ #2 and then McCluggage at #3

Looks different now, doesn't it?

None of us have questioned the ability of Walsh, but some have highlighted that he may not be the best player, nor the best midfielder in the draft

So let's use the draft years you have highlighted, while adding later picks 3 & 24 and who would have been available

2011: 1st mid taken was Coniglio @ #2 - Wingard & Ross
2012: 1st mid taken was Whitfield @ #1 - McCrae/Wines & Nothing of note, McIntosh probably the best at an early 2nd
2013: 1st mid taken was Kelly @ #2 and then Bontempelli @ #4 - Bont & M. Crouch/Merrett
2014: 1st mid taken was Brayshaw @ #4 De Goey & Miller/Maynard
2015: 1st mid taken was Mills #3 and then Oliver @ #4 Oliver & Dunkley/Sier
2016: 1st mid taken was Taranto @ #2 and then McCluggage at #3 McCluggage & Fisher

Not bad combinations, wouldn't you say?


Edited: Let's extend that further

2017: 1st mid taken was Brayshaw @ 2 Dow/Cerra & Kelly/Ryan

 

[dlb99]

Only would trade 1 for 3 and 6, nothing later than those 2 picks.

Agreed.

If I was chief there would be two options only:

- we keep pick 1
- we trade pick 1 for 3 & 6

No touching our 2019 1st round pick to equalise a trade with GC. If GC trades it needs to be weighted heavily in our favour.

I would take Walsh at 1.
With 3 & 6 I would take Smith and Caldwell.

 

[HereComesJuddy]

Agreed.

If I was chief there would be two options only:

- we keep pick 1
- we trade pick 1 for 3 & 6

No touching our 2019 1st round pick to equalise a trade with GC. If GC trades it needs to be weighted heavily in our favour.

I would take Walsh at 1.
With 3 & 6 I would take Smith and Caldwell.

Rozee and Smith for me (if thats how it would play out)

 

[HARKER]

None of us have questioned the ability of Walsh, but some have highlighted that he may not be the best player, nor the best midfielder in the draft

So let's use the draft years you have highlighted, while adding later picks 3 & 24 and who would have been available

2011: 1st mid taken was Coniglio @ #2 - Wingard & Ross
2012: 1st mid taken was Whitfield @ #1 - McCrae/Wines & Nothing of note, McIntosh probably the best at an early 2nd
2013: 1st mid taken was Kelly @ #2 and then Bontempelli @ #4 - Bont & M. Crouch/Merrett
2014: 1st mid taken was Brayshaw @ #4 De Goey & Miller/Maynard
2015: 1st mid taken was Mills #3 and then Oliver @ #4 Oliver & Dunkley/Sier
2016: 1st mid taken was Taranto @ #2 and then McCluggage at #3 McCluggage & Fisher

Not bad combinations, wouldn't you say?

I simply set out to demonstrate that things look different when discussing the first player taken in the draft compared to the first mid taken, in the draft.
Nothing to do with any further picks.....simply the first mid taken in the draft and on the evidence I provided, I'd suggest there isn't a fail there.

 

[Arr0w]

I simply set out to demonstrate that things look different when discussing the first player taken in the draft compared to the first mid taken, in the draft.

Nothing to do with any further picks.....simply the first mid taken in the draft and on the evidence I provided, I'd suggest there isn't a fail there.

No, your argument was not trading out pick 1 for picks 3 and 24 and taking the best mid. When history shows that the best player/midfielder are not generally the first selected. Also the combination of 2 picks has greater reward to the overall talent of a group

 

[HARKER]

No, your argument was not trading out pick 1 for picks 3 and 24 and taking the best mid. When history shows that the best player/midfielder are not generally the first selected. Also the combination of 2 picks has greater reward to the overall talent of a group

No. The two points were distinctly seperate.

 

[La Dispute]

Walsh has every reason to campaign for going to Carlton - otherwise he’s headed to Gold Coast. May as well
play the percentages and put your intentions out there, as either way he’s the likely first selection.

Nothing to see in that video we don’t already know about him: good character, leadership, highly regarded by his teammates, and a well-rounded and clever footballer.

He’s an easy pick if we keep Pick 1, but I’m still firmly in the Smith camp.