MFC Fans Only 2018/2019 Summer Sports Talk

[Topkent]

No he didn't.

He said reverting back to the culture that caused this incident would be stupid. Pretty logical really

Just for the record when Border took over the captaincy we were not good at cricket, far from it.

Sledging and aggression doesn't cause you to ball tamper. 2 blokes sitting in a room deciding to cheat does.

Btw Faf Du Plessis was done for ball tampering twice so the south African culture must be a complete failure aswell

 

[Demonkings]

The difference in the playing quality of the two teams is chalk and cheese. I don't think Green is a wonderful leader, but certainly not as bad as you made out, while there's lots of anecdotal feedback (Symonds, Katich etc.) that Clarke was not a good leader. And he has carried himself appallingly over past 48 hours

Appalling? I disagree. I think he’s well within his rights to hit back at Whateley in this case, an armchair critic nerd if ever there was one. This genteel Australian cricketer that’s Whateley is yearning for has never existed in his lifetime, back in the 70’s the Australians were complete ferals. It is how Australians play cricket. The only way an Australian cricket team gets accepted by the Australian public is by winning. Clarke obviously didn’t win enough because it seems to be open slather on him even though he’s had nothing to do with the test team for years. Whateley is obviously smart at picking a target though because it seems a lot of people hate Clarke based more on his personality than what he did/did not achieve in his career.

 

[00Stinger]

Sledging and aggression doesn't cause you to ball tamper. 2 blokes sitting in a room deciding to cheat does.

Btw Faf Du Plessis was done for ball tampering twice so the south African culture must be a complete failure aswell

Difference between the SA public and the Australian public is we don't stand for cheating.

Hence the difference in sentences

 

[00Stinger]

He said the ball tampering incident can be linked back to Clarke's tenure. That's crap.

I didn't say we were good when Border took over but from the time we won the ashes in England to when Clarke was captain we played aggressive cricket and no one gave a s**t.
May aswell blame Allan Border for Smith and Warner being cheating campaigners

Alan Border didn't come out and say the s**t Clarke did first though. We need to play tough cricket blah blah blah.

Whateleys comments were in response to Clarkes comments. That is what is getting missed

 

[saj_21]

Australia also bowled out SAF for 96 in that match. And Clarke made 151 in the first innings. It resulted in an 8 wicket loss. If Green could have played similarly as captain down in Geelong maybe he could have limited the damage to a regulation 100 point hammering, and stopped it blowing out to a 31 goals. Cricket teams bat out poor innings, it happens, even for good sides. 186 stands alone as the biggest smashing of the modern afl era, which is food for thought when considering some of the teams GWS, Gold Coast and Carlton have put out in recent years.

Just out of interest why so defensive of Clarke?

Last word on 186 we as melbourne supporters are past having to remember that, not even Garry Ablett senior in his prime could single handedly make up a difference of 86 points. Regardless individual efforts in cricket are far more effective on outcomes than football.

From my point of view brad green has nothing to do with my opinion of Clarke. You asked our opinions on Clarke, he was a great cricketer but in my eyes a complete fake of a person.

 

[Cannon82]

Clarke was probably a product of his circumstances. Came into the side as the only young bloke in among a team of legends who were brash confident and cocky. They and we all viewed him as the young up an coming star. Scored a century on debut in India and at home and essentially had the cricket world at his feet. I'm not surprised his ego exploded.

If he debuted now I'm not sure he'd have become what he became but who knows.

Nah, it started before he came into the Australian team. He was "anointed" as the future of Australian cricket by the Don. The guy always had plenty of tickets on himself - he clashed with teammates due to his arrogance and selfishness. Takes a fair bit of provocation for Katich to have someone by the throat up against the wall.

 

[Cannon82]

Mmmmm, Whatleys point was to go back to the attitude and culture that ****** Australian cricket is stupid.

I don't think he has blamed Clarke directly for the ball tampering incident, it was more the culture that he installed in the dressing room had festered for years after and led to this incident. To say we need to go back to the same attitude that caused the Australian cricket teams downfall is ******* stupid.

You don't have to install a ******** attitude in order to win, that mentality is stupid.

Fact is, Clarke would be loving this. He is a self centered knob and there is a reason that channel 7 did not give him a gig. Maybe if he comes out hard hitting in his limited media exposure a network might give him a go, hell I wouldn't be surprised if his pr team have told him to do this.

From refusing to field where he was told early on his career, to demanding to be part of the selection committee when he was a player, to getting Katich booted out of the Australian team for pulling him up from being a w***er, to leaving a tour to break up with his girlfriend, to making sure he got a farewell tour that he though he deserved in the world cup when he shouldn't have played, to being one half of a partnership that suspended 4 players for not doing homework. Clarke is a w***er!

While I disagree with this idea that ball tampering is somehow Clarke's fault (directly or for instilling some "culture" or other meaningless term) despite him having nothing to do with today's side other than having played with some of the current members, your summary of why he is a ***** is on point.

 

[Demonkings]

Just out of interest why so defensive of Clarke?

Last word on 186 we as melbourne supporters are past having to remember that, not even Garry Ablett senior in his prime could single handedly make up a difference of 86 points. Regardless individual efforts in cricket are far more effective on outcomes than football.

From my point of view brad green has nothing to do with my opinion of Clarke. You asked our opinions on Clarke, he was a great cricketer but in my eyes a complete fake of a person.

I’m not defending Clarke as a person, I don’t know him, and he could well be as much of a w***er as is alleged by many here. I just find it bizarre that he is getting talked about now, while it wasn’t on his watch that Smith and Warner cheated. Why would Whateley criticise Clarke and not go further back to Steve Waugh or the Chappell brothers? Easy answer is he’s a soft target: didn’t win as much and is perceived as a w***er by many. But all he did through his career was carry on the legacy of the previous 50 odd years of Australian cricketers.

My bringing up Green and 186 was just about Green’s decision to weigh into the debate on Twitter and throwing stones in glass houses.

 

[saj_21]

I’m not defending Clarke as a person, I don’t know him, and he could well be as much of a w***er as is alleged by many here. I just find it bizarre that he is getting talked about now, while it wasn’t on his watch that Smith and Warner cheated. Why would Whateley criticise Clarke and not go further back to Steve Waugh or the Chappell brothers? Easy answer is he’s a soft target: didn’t win as much and is perceived as a w***er by many. But all he did through his career was carry on the legacy of the previous 50 odd years of Australian cricketers.

My bringing up Green and 186 was just about Green’s decision to weigh into the debate on Twitter and throwing stones in glass houses.

I think it’s rediculos to blame anyone but Warner and Smith for what went down. They are grown men, take responsibility for your own actions.

Brad Green can still have an opinion regardless of how good or bad he was as captain. But his opinion may carry less weight than say Alan Border

 

[Cannon82]

But all he did through his career was carry on the legacy of the previous 50 odd years of Australian cricketers.

Michael Clarke is hardly someone who carried on the legacy of 50 odd years of Australian cricket. Shafting tradition and camaraderie to swan around nightclubs with Bingle wasn't a staple of Australian cricket.

 

[Demonkings]

Michael Clarke is hardly someone who carried on the legacy of 50 odd years of Australian cricket. Shafting tradition and camaraderie to swan around nightclubs with Bingle wasn't a staple of Australian cricket.

Granted he’s not one of the best captains Australia has produced over the last 50 years, but you could at least point to Kim Hughes and Smith as having worse records, maybe one or two more.

As for the Bingle relationship, I agree with you that was ill advised, hell, I bet Clarke himself would agree with you on that. He won’t be the last famous young bloke to fall for a publicity seeking bikini model though. All any young bloke can do is live and learn, and he seemed to move on from her and that bullshit pretty quickly.

Anyway, I don’t think any of us can definitely say how much of a prick or good bloke Clarke is without knowing him personally. Ultimately it will vary from person to person how much stock they take from information about Clarke’s private life and how it shapes their perceptions of him as a cricketer, captain and bloke in general.

 

[Cannon82]

Granted he’s not one of the best captains Australia has produced over the last 50 years, but you could at least point to Kim Hughes and Smith as having worse records, maybe one or two more.

As for the Bingle relationship, I agree with you that was ill advised, hell, I bet Clarke himself would agree with you on that. He won’t be the last famous young bloke to fall for a publicity seeking bikini model though. All any young bloke can do is live and learn, and he seemed to move on from her and that bullshit pretty quickly.

Anyway, I don’t think any of us can definitely say how much of a prick or good bloke Clarke is without knowing him personally. Ultimately it will vary from person to person how much stock they take from information about Clarke’s private life and how it shapes their perceptions of him as a cricketer, captain and bloke in general.

I played cricket with a handful of blokes who worked at CNSW and another who was Katich', Hauritz', Khawaja's, etc coach at Randy-Petes. Heard plenty of perceptions on Clarke from people who dealt with him first hand. They didn't have a lot of positive things to say about the guy.

 

[Crusty Demon]

Big bash isn't cricket, a game completely geared towards batsmen that holds no fear from fast bowlers. It's entertaining but it's not cricket. The wicket doesn't disintegrate during the game, batsmen don't have to survive they just have to get lucky.

Bowlers can't bowl anything legside and there's ******* fielding restrictions.


It's not cricket

People saying T20 isn't cricket need to get their heads out of the sand. Times have changed. Test cricket may be what we grew up with and still love, but no kids are talking about test cricket. Test cricket will potentially be dead in a couple of decades. The new generation of people have an attention span that has no tolerance for a game that goes for 5 days. Cricket would be on its knees now if it wasnt for T20. I love my test cricket, but lets be honest, no one under 21 is talking about it.

Numbers in local cricket are dwindling. I stopped playing cricket maybe 7 or 8 years ago. My old club had 3 senior mens teams, 2 senior womens teams, and a stack of junior teams. Now they have 1 womens team, 1 mens team and a mixed team of juniors and seniors who play in a T20 comp. My school ran a cricket program this year sponsored and set up by the Melbourne Stars. Times have changed whether you like it or not. T20 will eventually, if it hasn't already, take over what we call cricket.

 

[Topkent]

People saying T20 isn't cricket need to get their heads out of the sand. Times have changed. Test cricket may be what we grew up with and still love, but no kids are talking about test cricket. Test cricket will potentially be dead in a couple of decades. The new generation of people have an attention span that has no tolerance for a game that goes for 5 days. Cricket would be on its knees now if it wasnt for T20. I love my test cricket, but lets be honest, no one under 21 is talking about it.

Numbers in local cricket are dwindling. I stopped playing cricket maybe 7 or 8 years ago. My old club had 3 senior mens teams, 2 senior womens teams, and a stack of junior teams. Now they have 1 womens team, 1 mens team and a mixed team of juniors and seniors who play in a T20 comp. My school ran a cricket program this year sponsored and set up by the Melbourne Stars. Times have changed whether you like it or not. T20 will eventually, if it hasn't already, take over what we call cricket.

It's got nothing to do with acknowledging t20s popularity. T20 is clear number 1 and test cricket will be dead within 20 years.

That's not the point though, it's not cricket. It's akin to saying AFLX is Aussie rules football. It isn't. It's a shitty gimmick aimed at impressing brain dead millenials.

T20 isn't cricket. It has so far from the original sport it may aswell be called something different.
The wicket conditions don't change
The bowler has to bowl straight or outside off. But tight outside off.
Limit of short deliveries
Field restrictions
Powerplays
Switch hitting
Franchises
No foot movement

It's essentially baseball. Stand and deliver.

I couldn't care less that it's helping cricket survive. The original sport is dead and it's been taken over by something linked by less and less every day

 

[Crusty Demon]

It's got nothing to do with acknowledging t20s popularity. T20 is clear number 1 and test cricket will be dead within 20 years.

That's not the point though, it's not cricket. It's akin to saying AFLX is Aussie rules football. It isn't. It's a shitty gimmick aimed at impressing brain dead millenials.

T20 isn't cricket. It has so far from the original sport it may aswell be called something different.
The wicket conditions don't change
The bowler has to bowl straight or outside off. But tight outside off.
Limit of short deliveries
Field restrictions
Powerplays
Switch hitting
Franchises
No foot movement

It's essentially baseball. Stand and deliver.

I couldn't care less that it's helping cricket survive. The original sport is dead and it's been taken over by something linked by less and less every day

For me, test cricket will always be #1. However there are probably only 3 countries who give a sh#t about it anymore based on crowd numbers. Players like Lynn and Short who can hit a quick 40 off 20 balls will become the new cricket hero's to kids instead of the Warnes and Borders who dominated test cricket. I see it at junior level. No kid wants to field for a whole day anymore. They all want the game over in a couple of hours and move on to something else. T20 will be known as cricket soon enough. Big Bash just expanded to more games. IPL brings in more $$ over a month than tests do over a year. I think there's room for both games, however the $$ and popularity of T20 cricket will slowly see cricket change as much as some of us don't want it.

Ultimately the next generation will decide the fate of cricket, and i just dont see test cricket becoming popular with the kids anymore. There are too many other interests and more accessible sports to watch. American sports are now streamed and broadcast 24/7 now. Basketball is massive at my school and with my own 2 kids. They hate cricket. I took them.to the Big Bash last year and they were bored. Took them to see Melbourne United and they loved it. Cricket is a dying sport unfortunately and the test team desperately needs a couple of superstars to emerge that will excite the kids and the sport again. The Marsh brothers and the cronies they have in the side right now just arent getting it done on or off the field..

 

[saj_21]

I kinda see the Aussie cricket team like a bottom AFL team, when you suck supporters drop off. This year Australian attendances at test matches will be the worst since World Series cricket. India. Supporters will outnumber us. Add be fact supporters are still filthy on warner and smith, punters will vote with their feet and suppprt the big bash.

 

[Topkent]

So I had a little look and I can't find first class cricket stats anywhere on the internet?

 

[TheDarkDwarf]

So I had a little look and I can't find first class cricket stats anywhere on the internet?

This what you are after?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_first-class_cricket_records

 

[Topkent]

This what you are after?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_first-class_cricket_records

Not all time. What are the current averages in oz FC cricket.
All recordings seem to have been erased

 

[ponsdale]

We're doomed.


And he's warming up for a test match!

 

[TheDarkDwarf]

Not all time. What are the current averages in oz FC cricket.
All recordings seem to have been erased

I think you might be right, which is a bit strange, but I think this is what you are after? Maybe?
http://stats.espncricinfo.com/australia/engine/records/index.html?id=114;type=trophy

 

[Simon_Says]

In fact from 1990 to 2010 we probably had 3 teams worth of players who could have all been world champions.

Any of these blokes would play 100 tests now.

Blewett
Di Venuto
Elliot
Law
Love
Lehmann
D.Hussey
Bichel
Macgill
Bracken
Kasprowicz

Etc etc

Not that i give two shits about ICC but this takes me down memory lane

 

[Simon_Says]

The difference in the playing quality of the two teams is chalk and cheese. I don't think Green is a wonderful leader

However he was a worse leader than his predecessor, Junior. (What i would have given for us to keep him on our list, let alone appointed C)
I always though we were making the best out of a bad situation in 2011.

 

[Topkent]

I think you might be right, which is a bit strange, but I think this is what you are after? Maybe?
http://stats.espncricinfo.com/australia/engine/records/index.html?id=114;type=trophy

I went on that website, it's all time records. But it I just wanna know who's averaging what right now in FC cricket which is not on the internet. Its literally like they don't want people to have evidence of how bad Australian cricket is right now.

 

[Hotdees]

I went on that website, it's all time records. But it I just wanna know who's averaging what right now in FC cricket which is not on the internet. Its literally like they don't want people to have evidence of how bad Australian cricket is right now.

Mycricket app would give you what you want. You may not be able to download it overseas though.

You can visit the website though and should be able to find it.