Past #6: Taylor Garner - delisted end '21 - 49 NM games/37 NM goals - go well Garns

Groin guru

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A lot of this utter twaddle is coming from the absolutely unprovable claim that drinking alcohol affects training performance

Personally I cannot believe that having say 8-10 drinks enuf to get lagered shall we say on a sat nite will undo the 20 hours or so of weights running etc the players do
Agree the pissed in public is not good but think the physical damage by drinking line is a crock
Asker Jeukendrup (one of the world's experts when it comes to Sports Nutrition):

Beer in moderation (1-2) and diluted or consumed with water can help post-exercise hydration. There is a little carbohydrate in beer that can help restoration of energy stores. There is no reason not to have one beer, it will help a lot of people and athletes to relax, but we always have to keep in mind the negative effects of larger amounts of beer/alcohol.
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The reasoning behind 1-2 is that actually hydrating is better than not at all. It can be quite hard to get athletes to hydrate especially when you're asking them to consume ~600mL of fluid an hour during training/games. Adding sodium in the beer can be helpful. So players pour some salt in your beer and make sure you have some carbs with it.

One issue behind these studies is the red tape that typically exists behind getting athletes to drink and then do testing on them. Human ethics at research level is tough. It's why we don't know more about marijuana and performance/recovery and WADA just opts to ban it until more is known. We'd know more if it was easier to get our hands on athletes and test them. You also have to understand you can't just turn up to a sports team and say "hey can we get your players drunk and poke and prod them afterwards"
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https://mental.jmir.org/2018/1/e23/

We know that sleep is vital for recovery. Well...alcohol impacts your sleep funnily enough.

The study revealed that alcohol reduced the restorative quality of sleep. Specifically, a low alcohol intake decreased the physiological recovery that sleep normally provides by 9.3%.

Even as little as one drink was shown to impair sleep quality. Moderate alcohol consumption lowered restorative sleep quality by 24%, and high alcohol intake by as much as 39.2%.

These results were similar for men and women, and alcohol consumption affected sedentary and active people alike. Interestingly, the harmful effects of alcohol were more pronounced among young people compared with seniors.

_________________________________________________________________________________________________________
Again you are thinking in absolutes. Drinking 8-10 drinks won't undo 20 hours of hard work, but it will still hinder it vs. not drinking the 8-10 drinks.

Elite athletes are on different levels. Players have caffeine 60-90 mins before the game and at halftime because research suggests it may improve their performance by 2-3%. 2-3% can be a lot especially when you're almost at peak performance. You do things to add %, not subtract. That's just counterproductive.

But again, Why are people focusing on 1 point? There are several reasons why people were disappointed in what happened. For the love of god, it is the sum of all parts. Not just the alcohol, not just that they went out, not that they got kicked out of a bar/club. It is everything together + the fact they are 2 weeks into pre-season and had s**t 2018 seasons. If you have an issue recovering and you're just getting over wrist surgery is it wise to be doing something that impacts your recovery? Worst case scenario Luke gets in a push and shove in this altercation...reinjures the wrist he just had fixed...that's an issue ("but walk outside hit by bus scenario" :drunk:)

This whole saga was designed to test me wasn't it? Well it worked. This reminds me of when God tested Abraham. I'm done. See all of you sinners in hell!!!

giphy.gif



 
A lot of this utter twaddle is coming from the absolutely unprovable claim that drinking alcohol affects training performance

Personally I cannot believe that having say 8-10 drinks enuf to get lagered shall we say on a sat nite will undo the 20 hours or so of weights running etc the players do
Agree the pissed in public is not good but think the physical damage by drinking line is a crock
You seem well versed in utter twaddle...

The effects of alcohol on training performance has been well and truly proven.

I suggest starting here for a bit of a primer

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3257708/

Sent from my F8331 using Tapatalk
 
So many seem to be missing the point.

Again, this isn’t an incident related issue, moreso it’s an attitude and behavioral one.
No one has done anything wrong here that requires sanctioning or club intervention.

The facts as they stand are if you are an AFL player with a 3 year contract on your head and are yet to prove yourself as a footballer, then heading out to the St.Kilda Baths every Saturday night is literally taking the piss out of yourself, the club and it’s members. Moderation doesn’t exist here folks.

Understand that really the only ones being let down here are the lads themselves because this will only fuel what could be potentially wasted careers. Their priorities are nowhere near the level needed for ultimate success.

2019 just got a whole lot more interesting and intriguing for these two.
 

Reginald0

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Jul 30, 2012
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You seem well versed in utter twaddle...

The effects of alcohol on training performance has been well and truly proven.

I suggest starting here for a bit of a primer

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3257708/

Sent from my F8331 using Tapatalk

Thank you so much

5. Conclusion
Both the affects of alcohol on human physiology and the parameters that determine athletic performance are multi-factorial and extremely complicated. A significant body of literature has established an array of adverse symptoms caused by acute alcohol ingestion. However the notion that alcohol consumption effects performance has not received enough consistent validation to advance beyond being anecdotal. Nevertheless, just because alcohol is not yet comprehensively shown to have a negative influence on performance, does not imply this review advocates its use prior to, or following competition. Indeed, the data demonstrates a severe lack of analysis on the possible detrimental action of alcohol in the recovering athlete. However, based on the available experimental evidence in cellular and rodent-models, athletes should remain wary of ingesting alcohol following intense exercise, focusing instead on effective dietary strategies proven to enhance recovery.
 
Sep 11, 2014
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Garner looks in good nick to me, maybe his first pre-season since 2017?

I reckon many young players get s**t faced but no one knows about it. None of it really matters unless garner and Lmac stink it up in 2019 and onwards
 

Groin guru

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Thank you so much

5. Conclusion
Both the affects of alcohol on human physiology and the parameters that determine athletic performance are multi-factorial and extremely complicated. A significant body of literature has established an array of adverse symptoms caused by acute alcohol ingestion. However the notion that alcohol consumption effects performance has not received enough consistent validation to advance beyond being anecdotal. Nevertheless, just because alcohol is not yet comprehensively shown to have a negative influence on performance, does not imply this review advocates its use prior to, or following competition. Indeed, the data demonstrates a severe lack of analysis on the possible detrimental action of alcohol in the recovering athlete. However, based on the available experimental evidence in cellular and rodent-models, athletes should remain wary of ingesting alcohol following intense exercise, focusing instead on effective dietary strategies proven to enhance recovery.
So you're just going to cherry pick 1 sentence that fits your narrative and bypass all the points I made in my response to you. Welcome to science, where if you give definitive conclusions someone will call you out years later and those people will also call you out for not having definitive responses.

So many seem to be missing the point.

Again, this isn’t an incident related issue, moreso it’s an attitude and behavioral one.
No one has done anything wrong here that requires sanctioning or club intervention.

The facts as they stand are if you are an AFL player with a 3 year contract on your head and are yet to prove yourself as a footballer, then heading out to the St.Kilda Baths every Saturday night is literally taking the piss out of yourself, the club and it’s members. Moderation doesn’t exist here folks.

Understand that really the only ones being let down here are the lads themselves because this will only fuel what could be potentially wasted careers. Their priorities are nowhere near the level needed for ultimate success.

2019 just got a whole lot more interesting and intriguing for these two.
I'm going to reject this criticism and take it that you want both to have no freedom!!!
 

Heaps of fun

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Not sure when it became a crime on here to wish our very well paid players to be less "free" and more disciplined to bring home our fifth flag. We're not a big club, we're not a rich club and if they want ultimate success then they need to personally hold themselves to a higher standard than many of their peers. It's not ideal, but it's the truth. If a player isn't ready to do that then they should ask for a trade to Carlton.
 
So you're just going to cherry pick 1 sentence that fits your narrative and bypass all the points I made in my response to you. Welcome to science, where if you give definitive conclusions someone will call you out years later and those people will also call you out for not having definitive responses.


I'm going to reject this criticism and take it that you want both to have no freedom!!!

You jumped from wowserism about footy players to claiming most workplaces should have the right to even know or care what employees get up to outside work hours. You can't extrapolate like that and then claim to have some scientific cred however many letters you've got after your name. Somehow we need to adjust your avatar so there is some recursive dissappearing thing above that bald noggin #overeggingit
 

Groin guru

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You jumped from wowserism about footy players to claiming most workplaces should have the right to even know or care what employees get up to outside work hours. You can't extrapolate like that and then claim to have some scientific cred however many letters you've got after your name. Somehow we need to adjust your avatar so there is some recursive dissappearing thing above that bald noggin #overeggingit
It's called trying to relate things to people so they understand. You see, knowledge translation is important. When you come across people that have an opinion on an issue despite never having worked with that population you have to relate it to them. Now I tried, but people will continue to kick up a fuss and move the goal posts and rightfully/ignorantly miss the point (like clutching to a player's freedom instead of taking in all points made). It may be my fault for not relating it well enough but I don't think that's the case in my opinion.

I can claim to have scientific cred based on the letters I have after my name, I've earned that right. No amount of complaining changes that because if you and I write a manuscript and submit it to a journal one gets marked as spam, the other gets published. If myself and an accountant turned up to help someone with their finances I would be ushered out the door. People have credibility over others in various situations. You may disagree but the majority would not.

Instead of continuing in this circle of you missing points and engaging for the sake of engaging perhaps for the betterment of this thread it should be left alone. Please direct all continuing messages to https://www.bigfooty.com/forum/members/tigs2010.93319/
 

Reginald0

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Instead of continuing in this circle of you missing points and engaging for the sake of engaging perhaps for the betterment of this thread it should be left alone.




How patronising
A couple of us have picked you up on your moralistic crapola and then flatly rejected your idiotic alcohol comments
It is not the footy season, they are not 'performing'

You posted 15 times deliberately trying to get these blokes in hot water
It is not a good look
 

Groin guru

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Not the only one sleepy reading this rubbish

On [device_name] using BigFooty.com mobile app
Given your responses in this thread that doesn't phase me in the slightest.
How patronising
A couple of us have picked you up on your moralistic crapola and then flatly rejected your idiotic alcohol comments
It is not the footy season, they are not 'performing'

You posted 15 times deliberately trying to get these blokes in hot water
It is not a good look
Idiotic alcohol comments? You mean the two posts you refused to acknowledge because you were proven wrong. You jumped over the facts and selected 1 sentence from the article Blackshadow posted. Highlighting that some people only hear what they want to hear.

1) I never brought it up
2) We've been told on multiple occasions that no one gives a s**t about bigfooty.
3) I haven't posted anything to get players in trouble
Condescension is the weakest part of your posting
Thank you for your feedback. I'll be sure to work on how to correctly engage people that complain about freedom and alcohol whilst missing the point. It's a weakness of mine to try and inform and encourage critical thinking. Clearly a lost cause in this case.
 
Oct 22, 2014
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Thank you for your feedback. I'll be sure to work on how to correctly engage people that complain about freedom and alcohol whilst missing the point. It's a weakness of mine to try and inform and encourage critical thinking. Clearly a lost cause in this case.
Just for reference back handed compliments are my weakness.

My point was there is a lot of effort being put into this thread for no significant gains for anyone. Of all the pointless discussions we have here on BF, my preference would be that people waste their time elsewhere.
 

Reginald0

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Jul 30, 2012
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Given your responses in this thread that doesn't phase me in the slightest.

Idiotic alcohol comments? You mean the two posts you refused to acknowledge because you were proven wrong. You jumped over the facts and selected 1 sentence from the article Blackshadow posted. Highlighting that some people only hear what they want to hear.

1) I never brought it up
2) We've been told on multiple occasions that no one gives a s**t about bigfooty.
3) I haven't posted anything to get players in trouble

Thank you for your feedback. I'll be sure to work on how to correctly engage people that complain about freedom and alcohol whilst missing the point. It's a weakness of mine to try and inform and encourage critical thinking. Clearly a lost cause in this case.


no your weakness is that you are an opinionated loudmouth i wld let this go but you post a lot and you have at other times carried on about players having a drink
 
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