Current Julie Cutler - Murder - 1988 - Cottesloe WA *To the Coroner

[BFew]

Inquest into the Suspected death of Julie CUTLER

https://www.coronerscourt.wa.gov.au/_files/Inquest_2023/CUTLER, Julie Leanne.pdf (49 pages)
'[2023] WACOR 19
JURISDICTION : CORONER'S COURT OF WESTERN AUSTRALIA
ACT : CORONERS ACT 1996
CORONER : SARAH HELEN LINTON, DEPUTY STATE CORONER HEARD :
3 - 4 NOVEMBER 2022 DELIVERED : 6 APRIL 2023
FILE NO/S : CORC 830 of 2019
DECEASED : CUTLER, JULIE LEANNE'

 

[Alwayswatching]

Reading over the old articles which are almost all the same anyway. A few things:

Senior male employee who spoke to her only saw her standing at her passenger door. Someone else must have seen the couple and Julie in her car & only recently we heard of the sighting of her turning out of the car park alone, so there were a few 'eyes' on her.

Quite a few mentions of the kidnapping/abduction possibility over the following 3 weeks. Sister still suspecting an abduction by day 13, didn't believe phone call. Cops looking at all possibilities including kidnapping 19 days later. Kind of fizzles out without a demand though I guess, which Im pretty sure they'd have paid if they could. I wonder if the court transcripts had gone missing by 88 though? PD did you ever find out?

I'd also forgotten the family received calls from someone afterwards that they couldnt trace.
Roger Cutler "He said he and his family received strange phones calls after her disappearance.
"The man was not rude or abusive but asked a series of strange questions that made us wonder if he knew something of the case," he said.
"They went on for some time and though there were efforts made to trace the calls, they came to nothing".

She didnt smoke Shiraz Only.

Both rear doors were locked Melsy.

Black stockings found with the shirt (one of only 37 total, hers was a size 14) Not so generic Always Watching?

I think they're her clothes & she was wearing those stockings when she left but Im stuck with 3 possibilities and each one is totally different in all respects yet completely plausible...so, I guess I know s**t.

Maybe not generic but maybe so. Depending on when exactly the shirt was left there. As I understand it may not be exactly the night of her disappearance unless records where kept of when lost property was handed in. And hotel shirts are often passed onto the next staff member. The ones I wore when I worked in a hotel were from previous stafff members. Washed of course haha. I’m not convinced it was hers or if it was it may even have been picked up elsewhere on a different day and been left behind by a Good Samaritan. What I mean to say is it’s all very uncertain.

 

[Alwayswatching]

Maybe not generic but maybe so. Depending on when exactly the shirt was left there. As I understand it may not be exactly the night of her disappearance unless records where kept of when lost property was handed in. And hotel shirts are often passed onto the next staff member. The ones I wore when I worked in a hotel were from previous stafff members. Washed of course haha. I’m not convinced it was hers or if it was it may even have been picked up elsewhere on a different day and been left behind by a Good Samaritan. What I mean to say is it’s all very uncertain.

 

[one eyed spy]

JC disappeared in June. Why would she carry around an unused diary for 6 months? There's precious little space in a handbag to carry something that large for no reason IMO.

She wouldnt, ugly brown diary slung into the glovebox only useful to test a pen on. But if they were hers, whoever took her bag from the car wouldnt have known it was blank and might've grabbed it.
Or, she hadnt been using that bag recently & the diary was in there for months unused. Grabbed that bag that night because its the perfect size to smuggle some glasses out in. Whoever took the bag left them or she took the glasses out so they didnt roll around & smash in her bag.

 

[FTY1]

this is why i always put ... and ... in between statements...

It could be read they aren't the cigarette type Julie smoked or we know Julie didn't smoke.

or... It could be...

"They were from a type of cigarette we know Julie didn't smoke....and it might prove to be the lead we need...."


could also be the case of tailor made vs roll your own.....this would be a telling tale sign....


And i am so sorry for having my own opinion.....

The articles at the time were often inconsistent. As an example there were about 3 different years for the fiat and the type of car. The incorrect statements often went into future years reporting as well. The find a grave is ambiguous and that is what I said.

 

[Melsy]

Two attempts wasn't it. When was the first attempt on Julie Cutler? Its just coincidence.


1. HMS Challenger - 1 Apr 25th 1829

2. Parmelia - June 1st

 

[petedavo]

Two attempts wasn't it. When was the first attempt on Julie Cutler? Its just coincidence.


1. HMS Challenger - 1 Apr 25th 1829

2. Parmelia - June 1st

There are lots of coincidences. But that's all they are. Eg, there was a shipping disaster in 1988 the Singa Sea and another in 1991 the Kirki within a week of Cutler and Turner. But unless you believe that an evil presence caused both the shipping disasters and Julie's disappearance and Kerry's murder, they're merely coincidences.

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[petedavo]

She wouldnt, ugly brown diary slung into the glovebox only useful to test a pen on. But if they were hers, whoever took her bag from the car wouldnt have known it was blank and might've grabbed it.
Or, she hadnt been using that bag recently & the diary was in there for months unused. Grabbed that bag that night because its the perfect size to smuggle some glasses out in. Whoever took the bag left them or she took the glasses out so they didnt roll around & smash in her bag.

I think I missed the bit where it was Brown. Can you reference the article? Thanks.

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[Melsy]

There are lots of coincidences. But that's all they are. Eg, there was a shipping disaster in 1988 the Singa Sea and another in 1991 the Kirki within a week of Cutler and Turner. But unless you believe that an evil presence caused both the shipping disasters and Julie's disappearance and Kerry's murder, they're merely coincidences.

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Yeah, but the victim wasnt abducted from Singa Sea Hotel, and an accused wasn't living at Kirki parade

And neither of those variables relate to the fact is was 1988 Bicentenary with Dorothy dumped at Centenary Ave

There are a load of other variables. But we don't have to entertain those if it makes you feel uncomfortable.

 

[petedavo]

Yeah, but the victim wasnt abducted from Singa Sea Hotel, and an accused wasn't living at Kirki parade

And neither of those variables relate to the fact is was 1988 Bicentenary with Dorothy dumped at Centenary Ave

There are a load of other variables. But we don't have to entertain those if it makes you feel uncomfortable.

Let's stick to Cutler. If we accept that the coincidence is deliberate, then what else about the significance of the foundation of Perth could be used to find her? There are localities named after settlers & ships who came over to WA in 1829. Which one would be most likely?
https://membership.wags.org.au/1829-ships/
http://www.wanowandthen.com/First-Fleet.html

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[Melsy]

Let's stick to Cutler. If we accept that the coincidence is deliberate, then what else about the significance of the foundation of Perth could be used to find her? There are localities named after settlers & ships who came over to WA in 1829. Which one would be most likely?
https://membership.wags.org.au/1829-ships/
http://www.wanowandthen.com/First-Fleet.html

Disturbed mind megalomaniac serial killer leaves clues to his residing address. Streets in the mindset. Who said it was done in a UBD?

Julies car left opposite Forrest street, abducted from Parmelia. Girl gets dumped on Centenary drive in 1988 Bicentenary year. Girls go missing from Stirling and Stirling. Another girls car left on Dance st. Someone had a house on Challenger. Some girls from Iona (Iona on Bayview Tce). Lives on Fountain, adjacent Shamrock and Patrick way.

Probably just coincidence. Maybe serial killer alluding to residing address and identity.

 

[Melsy]

A targeted victim with political ties?

Fearis, a conservative man who is the Western Australian chairman of Australians for Constitutional Monarchy,

Devils Garden, The Claremont Killings
Chapter 18.

 

[petedavo]

Disturbed mind megalomaniac serial killer leaves clues to his residing address. Streets in the mindset. Who said it was done in a UBD?

Julies car left opposite Forrest street, abducted from Parmelia. Girl gets dumped on Centenary drive in 1988 Bicentenary year. Girls go missing from Stirling and Stirling. Another girls car left on Dance st. Someone had a house on Challenger. Some girls from Iona (Iona on Bayview Tce). Lives on Fountain, adjacent Shamrock and Patrick way.

Probably just coincidence. Maybe serial killer alluding to residing address and identity.

Now you're dancing.
This is better than pentagrams, arcs, and numbers.
The only problem I see is there being too many streets and localities associated with WA's first settlers that a perpetrator could use to leave a trial of clues, for anyone to predict a pattern and thus solve where a body is, or predict his next move.
Knowing that he deliberately had such a scheme when there's so many possibilities seems only useful to show this as his "signature", after the crimes have been done.
However, if this is a signature, then he is tagging his ownership of these crimes.
We could theoretically say, these crimes were done by the same perpetrator.
But I think we need something to prove it.
Maybe WAPol will find a book or some document on WAs history with all these names highlighted together with a street directory with the same names highlighted when searching a house one day.
Our chances of finding something like that would only occur if the perpetrator blogged or had such documents upon his own website. We'd have to be damn lucky to find something like that IMO.

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[one eyed spy]

I think I missed the bit where it was Brown. Can you reference the article? Thanks.

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Last paragraph first page of the latest Post article "Bouncer admitted Murder".

 

[GreyCrow]

I think I preferred Sothiris and the Moon Dancers

 

[Melsy]

Now you're dancing.
This is better than pentagrams, arcs, and numbers.
The only problem I see is there being too many streets and localities associated with WA's first settlers that a perpetrator could use to leave a trial of clues, for anyone to predict a pattern and thus solve where a body is, or predict his next move.
Knowing that he deliberately had such a scheme when there's so many possibilities seems only useful to show this as his "signature", after the crimes have been done.
However, if this is a signature, then he is tagging his ownership of these crimes.
We could theoretically say, these crimes were done by the same perpetrator.
But I think we need something to prove it.
Maybe WAPol will find a book or some document on WAs history with all these names highlighted together with a street directory with the same names highlighted when searching a house one day.
Our chances of finding something like that would only occur if the perpetrator blogged or had such documents upon his own website. We'd have to be damn lucky to find something like that IMO.

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5 murders. SARAH - Australia Day weekend. Jane - . Ciara - St Patricks Weekend

I see Jane as the only anomaly. St Columba day of Iona. But maybe this was the only window, and someone had to go.

Sarah and Jane, birthdays on the 12th.


The Macro taskforce officers do a quick mental check. Sarah abducted in summer, Jane in winter, Ciara in autumn. Is there some pattern in this? All disappeared on long weekend holidays. Sarah on Australia Day; Jane, the Queen's birthday (not celebrated in WA) and Ciara, Canberra Day in the ACT. There is five months between Sarah and Jane. Nine months between Jane and Ciara.
Nine between Jane and Ciara
.Why has the killer's cooling-off period become longer, instead of shorter as is their usual pattern? Has the police heat kept him lying low? Or has he, God forbid, acted somewhere else in the meantime, moving back to Claremont out of a desperate, uncontrollable urge to return?

The Commissioner, too, is highly visible. A hush descends on the normally rowdy crowd at a night football game at Subiaco Oval, near Claremont, when Bob Falconer makes an unscheduled, emotional address for them to help police solve the Claremont mystery. He also makes a plea through the press. Alarmed at the 'panic, paranoia, fear and mistrust' that have gripped the city, he urges the community 'not to self-destruct'.

Devils GARDEN - The Claremont Killer
Chapter 21

 

[petedavo]

I wonder how common it would be for ex soldiers to commit crimes of extortion?
Besides David Everett and Roger Payne that is.

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[petedavo]

I wonder how common it would be for ex soldiers to commit crimes of extortion?
Besides David Everett and Roger Payne that is.

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Alexander Robert MacDonald, former soldier. https://vwma.org.au/explore/people/797743
Tried to extort money back in the 70's using threats to blow up the victim's businesses

Pictures courtesy of R. Wilkinson, facebook.

Later in life, MacDonald became a bank robber, escaped prison and murdered a man to steal his identity.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.he...y/news-story/f3c7234a460696663cd38e14427e2159
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[Kurve]

Later in life, he became a bank robber, escaped prison and murdered a man to steal his identity.

Who was the guy that threatened to blow something up unless he was paid X amount of money, he stole an armoured tanker and took the police on a high speed chase through the streets of Perth?

And he was using the indicators at turns ....

 

[petedavo]

Who was the guy that threatened to blow something up unless he was paid X amount of money, he stole an armoured tanker and took the police on a high speed chase through the streets of Perth?

And he was using the indicators at turns ....

Gary Allan Hayes.
https://geocaching.com.au/cache/ga7430
He died 22/7/2017
http://m.westannouncements.com.au/o...-hayes&pid=186207476&referrer=0&preview=false

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[Kurve]

Gary Allan Hayes.
https://geocaching.com.au/cache/ga7430
He died 22/7/2017
http://m.westannouncements.com.au/o...-hayes&pid=186207476&referrer=0&preview=false

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Thanks PD.

Classic. And a very interesting story.

 

[BlueE]

Gary Allan Hayes.
https://geocaching.com.au/cache/ga7430
He died 22/7/2017
http://m.westannouncements.com.au/o...-hayes&pid=186207476&referrer=0&preview=false

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Why do I get the feeling that if he was listened to or believed that the miscarriages of justice such as in Mickleberg, Andrew Mallard, Gene Gibson etc etc cases may not have occurred?

https://geocaching.com.au/cache/ga7430

 

[Melsy]

The man of the oppressed people.

He would be 57 now. Divorced and remarried.

The golden triangle.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opium_production_in_Myanmar

I would have thought an SAS man might just grab their victim and pull them into the shadows at home in the silence. Not some elaborate careless narcissistic open pursuit that was not executed well at all the first time prior Eric st railway crossing.

The calamity of error just doesn't ring true of SAS abduction. The other examples are regular army.

This abduction appears almost like dinner and a show. A bad black and white terror silent movie. Theatrics of grand delusion.

 

[GreyCrow]

The man of the oppressed people.

He would be 57 now. Divorced and remarried.

The golden triangle.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opium_production_in_Myanmar

I would have thought an SAS man might just grab their victim and pull them into the shadows at home in the silence. Not some elaborate careless narcissistic open pursuit that was not executed well at all the first time prior Eric st railway crossing.

The calamity of error just doesn't ring true of SAS abduction. The other examples are regular army.

This abduction appears almost like dinner and a show. A bad black and white terror silent movie. Theatrics of grand delusion.

He died 22/7/2017
http://m.westannouncements.com.au/o...-hayes&pid=186207476&referrer=0&preview=false

 

[petedavo]

Thanks PD.

Classic. And a very interesting story.

Interesting Geocache member. Probably an ex copper

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[Melsy]

Cuz Friday night, is speedway night!