Society/Culture Why I blame Islam for the fact it's raining today....

[SaintsSeptember]

This is the end game.

When merely agreeing with a 'criminal' in any form is a 'crime'

https://www.theage.com.au/world/asi...iang-into-a-police-state-20190502-p51jfg.html

The app requires police officers to enter data including a person's blood type, height and any travel. It flags 36 "person types" who are suspicious, including someone who doesn't socialise with neighbours, collects money for mosques with enthusiasm, or has returned from abroad.

A person who "used smartphones in the past but has stopped altogether, or using only analog phones" is another suspicious type.

When a person's phone or ID card goes "off-grid" police are instructed by the app to investigate.

Why is the regime in China more of a nightmare for Muslims than it is for Buddhists or Christians?

 

[its free real estate]

Being a suspect isn't committing a crime.
I've long said that the cops should investigate anyone who has a Ferrari/Lambourghini/McClaren etc registered.

- Has a filthy rich dad .... No suspicion.
- Has a successful ( for the time being ) marketing company. ...No suspicion.
- Lives in Cranbourne, 27 years old, with only tenuous ties to legitimate business activities. .....hmmmmm

At this point it can't be said that any of them have committed a crime, and driving the Ferrari is hardly committing a crime.

Salim Mehajer.

 

[Pessimistic]

Why is the regime in China more of a nightmare for Muslims than it is for Buddhists or Christians?

Depends if you are flavour of the month. Our leaders don't seem to be great protectors of freedoms either.

Like I said, you don't know when the switch is thrown on your particular set of beliefs, but because you did nothing when it was just 'muzzies' you let the disease fester.

Neck minute - you are regarded as odd when you don't carry a smartphone everywhere

 

[SaintsSeptember]

My point is it would be so 'easy' but in fact you have more to fear from your own government than any terrorist threat. And by many many factors

Rubbish.
The Chinese government have always been a bunch of pricks , they aren't my Government.

 

[Pessimistic]

Rubbish.
The Chinese government have always been a bunch of pricks , they aren't my Government.

Every time there's an incident they (our government) come looking for more intrusive powers? Our police already have target groups (not just muslims). its a shallow slope but its a slope and its being enabled by technology originating in the west.

I'm not sure if this is totally relevant but isnt the bigfooty crackdown impinging on our freedom to 'self-discipline'? in a small way? driven by google?

 

[Kwality]

This is the end game.

When merely agreeing with a 'criminal' in any form is a 'crime'

https://www.theage.com.au/world/asi...iang-into-a-police-state-20190502-p51jfg.html

The app requires police officers to enter data including a person's blood type, height and any travel. It flags 36 "person types" who are suspicious, including someone who doesn't socialise with neighbours, collects money for mosques with enthusiasm, or has returned from abroad.

A person who "used smartphones in the past but has stopped altogether, or using only analog phones" is another suspicious type.

When a person's phone or ID card goes "off-grid" police are instructed by the app to investigate.

Crime prevention trumps crime investigation IMHO. No problem if any Authority held that info on me OR anyone I know.

 

[JackOutback]

Crime prevention trumps crime investigation IMHO. No problem if any Authority held that info on me OR anyone I know.

Ah, the old ‘if you have nothing to hide, you have nothing to fear’ argument. As Snowden said, it’s as intellectually rigorous as saying we don’t need freedom of speech because you have nothing to say.

 

[its free real estate]

Ah, the old ‘if you have nothing to hide, you have nothing to fear’ argument. As Snowden said, it’s as intellectually rigorous as saying we don’t need freedom of speech because you have nothing to say.

Yeah but what are you going to do about it? China are the rising world power and are very interested in monitoring you.

 

[Kwality]

Ah, the old ‘if you have nothing to hide, you have nothing to fear’ argument. As Snowden said, it’s as intellectually rigorous as saying we don’t need freedom of speech because you have nothing to say.

Yep, not an argument for me, its transparent. I can change my mind without concern, unlike most of the PC army.
More specific to Islam here in Australia, many/most Muslims disown violence.

 

[ferball]

Being a suspect isn't committing a crime.
I've long said that the cops should investigate anyone who has a Ferrari/Lambourghini/McClaren etc registered.

- Has a filthy rich dad .... No suspicion.
- Has a successful ( for the time being ) marketing company. ...No suspicion.
- Lives in Cranbourne, 27 years old, with only tenuous ties to legitimate business activities. .....hmmmmm

At this point it can't be said that any of them have committed a crime, and driving the Ferrari is hardly committing a crime.

Why?

 

[ferball]

Crime prevention trumps crime investigation IMHO. No problem if any Authority held that info on me OR anyone I know.

So you want to live in a police state?

There are some disturbing posts in this thread.

 

[Kwality]

So you want to live in a police state?

There are some disturbing posts in this thread.

Be honest, authorities can know everything about you now, unless you run to an alias, no bank account, no credit card, no phone ... IF you need to hide something you need to work bloody hard to do it, if it needs to be fair dinkum & you've got to be off the radar.
Take the earlier comment about buyers of expensive sportys, reckon the tax man might have a list of sales of all say Lambo's, 134 for last year.

 

[ferball]

Be honest, authorities can know everything about you now, unless you run to an alias, no bank account, no credit card, no phone ... IF you need to hide something you need to work bloody hard to do it, if it needs to be fair dinkum & you've got to be off the radar.
Take the earlier comment about buyers of expensive sportys, reckon the tax man might have a list of sales of all say Lambo's, 134 for last year.

There is a difference between legally data matching between govt departments (even tho its a bit much in itself) and actively invstigating people for legal recreational purchases. Especially on the basis of your social class. If you live in the wrong suburb and buy a car that's not for your sort of person the cops can start watching you.

That's essentially what SaintsSeptember said.

And about your point - "crime prevention trumps crime investigation" - sure but only within really strict limits. (We can argue about them some other day maybe.) We live in a society that holds the presumption of innocence as a fundamental legal principle. That means unless knowledge of a crime is brought to the attention of the authorities they don't go investigating people. The GWoT has certainly put that idea under stress but we haven't chosen to abandon it in the face of terrorism. That would be letting the terrorists win.

Crime prevention by trawling thru data and investigating people on the basis of their behaviour not the report of a crime goes directly against this principle.

It might be necessary in the face of an existential threat under certain supervision (tho I don't think so) - certainly that's the yarn we were sold re anti terror legislation. But over the 1000 year history of the legal system we live under we've moved away from it as a wholesale policy on the basis that its antithetical to a free society.

Ideas like that one you mentioned here:

Crime prevention trumps crime investigation IMHO. No problem if any Authority held that info on me OR anyone I know.

Are dangerous because they are a threat to a free society. A fundamental threat to it on a meta level if you like because they undermine ideas like the presumption of innocence.

Wayne Kerr can bang on about the dangers of Sharia Law to our society and way of life till the cows fall from the sky but ideas like the one you promote have threatened our way of life and free society for as long as people have spouted them.

Frankly they don't belong in a civilised discussion about a free nation like Australia.

 

[its free real estate]

There is a difference between legally data matching between govt departments (even tho its a bit much in itself) and actively invstigating people for legal recreational purchases. Especially on the basis of your social class. If you live in the wrong suburb and buy a car that's not for your sort of person the cops can start watching you.

That's essentially what SaintsSeptember said.

And about your point - "crime prevention trumps crime investigation" - sure but only within really strict limits. (We can argue about them some other day maybe.) We live in a society that holds the presumption of innocence as a fundamental legal principle. That means unless knowledge of a crime is brought to the attention of the authorities they don't go investigating people. The GWoT has certainly put that idea under stress but we haven't chosen to abandon it in the face of terrorism. That would be letting the terrorists win.

Crime prevention by trawling thru data and investigating people on the basis of their behaviour not the report of a crime goes directly against this principle.

It might be necessary in the face of an existential threat under certain supervision (tho I don't think so) - certainly that's the yarn we were sold re anti terror legislation. But over the 1000 year history of the legal system we live under we've moved away from it as a wholesale policy on the basis that its antithetical to a free society.

Ideas like that one you mentioned here:



Are dangerous because they are a threat to a free society. A fundamental threat to it on a meta level if you like because they undermine ideas like the presumption of innocence.

Wayne Kerr can bang on about the dangers of Sharia Law to our society and way of life till the cows fall from the sky but ideas like the one you promote have threatened our way of life and free society for as long as people have spouted them.

Frankly they don't belong in a civilised discussion about a free nation like Australia.

The argument is illiberalism wins in the long run. Medieval sharia or surveillance capitalism: choose one.

 

[ferball]

That's a stupid argument.

 

[its free real estate]

That's a stupid argument.

It isn’t. The stupid argument is the one that assumes liberalism wins in the end.

 

[Echoes]

Religion of peace living up to its name, once again.

https://www.google.com.au/amp/s/amp...eeast/saudi-executions-terror-intl/index.html

 

[Kwality]

ideas like the one you promote

Exactly what am I promoting that concerns you most, am i promoting it or expressing an opinion.

 

[TheUnit1]

Is there a way I can express my views on Islam without being banned or getting attention from the powers on this site.

Mohamed the Prophet married a nine year old Aisha. Not only is this morally wrong, but she is NINE YEARS OLD, this is rape and pedophilia. It’s disgusting and unacceptable

 

[CM86]

Is there a way I can express my views on Islam without being banned or getting attention from the powers on this site.

Yep. Do it legitimately. * Islam.

Mohamed the Prophet married a nine year old Aisha. Not only is this morally wrong, but she is NINE YEARS OLD, this is rape and pedophilia. It’s disgusting and unacceptable

Disgusting.
What do you think about the recently convicted George Pell?

 

[shniko11]

Yep. Do it legitimately. **** Islam.

Disgusting.
What do you think about the recently convicted George Pell?

That's not very nice thing to say about Islam reported for racism.

 

[CM86]

That's not very nice thing to say about Islam reported for racism.

Tryhard...

 

[shniko11]

Tryhard...

We know you are.

 

[CM86]

We know you are.

Meta

 

[AbrahamS]

Yep. Do it legitimately. **** Islam.

Disgusting.
What do you think about the recently convicted George Pell?

Equally disgusting an unacceptable.