Analysis 2019 List Management Discussion

[Beer n Skittles]

We don't know what a new coach will want, but without doubt they'll dislike the players I dislike and ask SOS to chase the players I do like

 

[Soapy V]

Be interesting to see what happens with Simpson Daisy & Murphy. I can see a new coach getting rid of at least 2 of them if not all.

 

[HereComesJuddy]

We don’t know what a new coach will want. I don’t where the Papley talk has come from but can’t see it happening.

Strong talk Jack Martin will come to us. IMO he’d be a good addition. Mid/Fwd with some zip and skill. Good tackler as well.

Need to add a Ruck like Darcy Cameron and a State League player like Goddard from WA.

I’d be happy to add Atley from PA and Brodie from GCS as young players ready to step up.

Then add a couple of good mature bodies from other clubs and maybe state leagues. A couple of FAs would be awesome especially if they were Ellis & Cuningham.

Hopefully we can add a “big fish” over next 2 years.

If the talent keeps developing along with an improving fitness level I expect a much improved 2020. Really is starting to come together.

Martin would be a good get Soap! We are only 3 or 4 players off a complete team in my opinion.

Papley is the dream and exactly the type we need. And if the talk of him wanting to come back to Victoria is true as i think Barass had mentioned, we should def go after him.

Id be more than happy to walk away from this years trade period with Martin, Papley a FA as long as we hold next years 1st.

Brodie is a guy we should go after but i don't think he is ooc until the end of next year. Whitfield again a dream but next year as a FA.

I really think even if we somehow go martin and papley this year and held onto our 2020 1st, it puts us in a really strong position going into 2021.

 

[footyfan1978]

Not so sure new coach will have say on list decisions like some of you guys thinking.
From what Cain Liddle said the idea is to appoint a coach to build on what we been doing with the list plans of build through the draft what we been doing and now next phase continue to build the list to support what we built up already. We are not ripping apart any of the great work done already to build up with elite youth from the mess the list was in at end of 2015. The new coach will need to be aligned with how club see where list is and path we on. If Simmo and Daisy retired it will be a collective decision by them and the club, not some new comer coming in with a different mindset to what the club have.

 

[Soapy V]

Not so sure new coach will have say on list decisions like some of you guys thinking.
From what Cain Liddle said the idea is to appoint a coach to build on what we been doing with the list plans of build through the draft what we been doing and now next phase continue to build the list to support what we built up already. We are not ripping apart any of the great work done already to build up with elite youth from the mess the list was in at end of 2015. The new coach will need to be aligned with how club see where list is and path we on. If Simmo and Daisy retired it will be a collective decision by them and the club, not some new comer coming in with a different mindset to what the club have.

Have to disagree FF. Coach has a major input. We have a List Management committee of which the coach is a part of. SOS & Co job is to draft the best players and trade for players/types they have all agreed to.

The strategy won't change but the names/types may

 

[Soapy V]

Martin would be a good get Soap! We are only 3 or 4 players off a complete team in my opinion.

Papley is the dream and exactly the type we need. And if the talk of him wanting to come back to Victoria is true as i think Barass had mentioned, we should def go after him.

Id be more than happy to walk away from this years trade period with Martin, Papley a FA as long as we hold next years 1st.

Brodie is a guy we should go after but i don't think he is ooc until the end of next year. Whitfield again a dream but next year as a FA.

I really think even if we somehow go martin and papley this year and held onto our 2020 1st, it puts us in a really strong position going into 2021.

I'd be happy to get Papley but just can't see it. Martin would be a strong chance. I'm also confident in the development of Owies, hopeful on Lebois and believe Garlett will really step up now he can play with more freedom. Who knows what's happening with Pickett & Fasolo? Thomas & Murphy could easily play for another year as well. More questions than answers at the moment

 

[footyfan1978]

Have to disagree FF. Coach has a major input.

I think you missed my main point Soaps which he needs to come in aligned with where we see list already. If he is not he will not get the job to even have a say. So no coach is going get job and then say, this guy is not what we need and disagree with you guys keeping him on... etc etc. So we will not be getting a coach that is on a different page to how we see the list as a club. They have to fit with where we are at. We are not fitting to suit an outsider come in and say this , this and this I need changed from your list plans.. etc etc. Just not going to happen. The coach we get will already be on board and have input going forward if they are aligned. Cain Liddle made this very clear on weekend in some interviews I heard.

 

[Soapy V]

Funny thing is... next year our age profile doesnt look too bad. I dont think we need to add players in their 30s to our squad tbh.

If we look at our 22 that played this weekend and the age they will be next year during the season we are starting to look better.

Cripps - 25
Walsh - 19
Ed - 30
SPS - 22
Setters - 22
Gibbons - 25
Charlie - 23
Weiters - 22
Newman - 27
Thomas - 33
Cas - 30
Simpson - 36
LOB - 20
Fish - 22
Mitch - 25
Marchy - 23
Kruezer - 31
Harry - 22
Plow - 25
Dow - 20
Cuners - 23
JSOS - 22

Then theres the likes of:

Murph: 32
Kennedy - 23
Docherty - 25
Williamson - 21
Deluca - 24

With us crying out for mature talent, the age of list has continued to grow. If anything, we need another top mid, a player like papley and maybe a ruckman. I dont think its now about age, its about talent

Would this do okay next year with another pre season?

B: Docherty Jones Marchbank
HB: SPS Weitering Williamson
C: Cuningham Cripps O'Brien
HF: Stocker McKay DeLuca
F: Charlie TDK Martin
Foll: Kruezer Curnow Walsh
Int: Gibbons Dow Plowman Setterfield

Not saying this is best 22 but it's a strong line up and I have left a lot of quality out. Only added Martin. We will also add another 5-6 players minimum.

 

[Soapy V]

I think you missed my main point Soaps which he needs to come in aligned with where we see list already. If he is not he will not get the job to even have a say. So no coach is going get job and then say, this guy is not what we need and disagree with you guys keeping him on... etc etc. So we will not be getting a coach that is on a different page to how we see the list as a club. They have to fit with where we are at. We are not fitting to suit an outsider come in and say this , this and this I need changed from your list plans.. etc etc. Just not going to happen. The coach we get will already be on board and have input going forward if they are aligned. Cain Liddle made this very clear on weekend in some interviews I heard.

I'm not disagreeing with that part FF. Plan will stay. I'm more talking about who the players are

eg. If we have the opportunity for one of Grundy or Gawn and the coach prefers Gawn that's who we would get

 

[AT97]

I'd rather shake down GWS for Coniglio and Bonar, shake down West Coast and Freo's lists in the event they grab Coniglio, as well as plumbing the Eagle's depth in some areas, then look at the draft.

I still can’t see how gws let Coniglio go as a free agent. A matching of any offer than a Dangerfield like trade is surely the scenario.

 

[Jimmae]

How is Whitfield and Papley wiping out an entire draft, while Coniglio and Bonar isn't? Surely the latter two would be the more expensive option...

Edit - Also don't the first two address your listed area of needs more than your preferred two? Why list area of needs then throw up players who don't fit?

I still can’t see how gws let Coniglio go as a free agent. A matching of any offer than a Dangerfield like trade is surely the scenario.

Theoretically they can be priced out if they can't get players to move on that are commanding too much salary (or if Coniglio's offer breaks their wage structure significantly).

It's possible that forcing their hand on Coniglio opens up a less demanding trade, and either way should open the door for us to secure Bonar as well.

As for the question of pace, Coniglio is faster than Whitfield and Papley on the burst, and is able to win the ball inside. We can feed guys like those two all we want then, and there'll be plenty of those at the draft (such as Jeremy Sharp).

Papley in the spotlight atm and rightly so but if we can't get him i'd still consider Ronke.

Perhaps we should consider the system that makes them look good too?

 

[Keyza]

We have around 20 players out of contract at the end of the year.
Who will make a call on them before the end of the year?
Surely we can't wait until a new coach is appointed leaving so many players in limbo.

 

[Robertio]

I'm not disagreeing with that part FF. Plan will stay. I'm more talking about who the players are

eg. If we have the opportunity for one of Grundy or Gawn and the coach prefers Gawn that's who we would get

Can't we have both.

 

[Robertio]

We have around 20 players out of contract at the end of the year.
Who will make a call on them before the end of the year?
Surely we can't wait until a new coach is appointed leaving so many players in limbo.

I would presume it would be the List Managers job.

 

[HARKER]

We have around 20 players out of contract at the end of the year.
Who will make a call on them before the end of the year?
Surely we can't wait until a new coach is appointed leaving so many players in limbo.

Likely to get a contract - JSilvagni, Kreuzer, Jones, Cuningham, ECurnow, Kerr, Schumacher, Goddard, Gibbons - 9

Possible retirees - Simpson, Thomas (although Thomas likely get one more year). Murphy is contracted, but I feel he may retire - 2

One the cusp - Lang, Garlett, Phillips, Fasolo, Pickett (although it's up to him) LeBois, Casboult, Lobbe, DeLuca, Cottrell - 10
(Bolded are the three I see being retained)

 

[Eiffel 65]

Likely to get a contract - JSilvagni, Kreuzer, Jones, Cuningham, ECurnow, Kerr, Schumacher, Goddard, Gibbons - 9

Possible retirees - Simpson, Thomas (although Thomas likely get one more year). Murphy is contracted, but I feel he may retire - 2

One the cusp - Lang, Garlett, Phillips, Fasolo, Pickett (although it's up to him) LeBois, Casboult, Lobbe, DeLuca, Cottrell - 10
(Bolded are the three I see being retained)

We have to retain two of Simpson, Murphy and Thomas.

My feeling is that Simpson may retire.

We're not in a position where we can lose too much experience and leadership in one season. Must be done progressively.

 

[Prem17]

The club has already said (think it was Liddle) that we will trade Adelaide's first rounder because we don't need anymore junior talent.
We will have DeLuca in the team next year who should slot in without much fuss. He will bring a lot to the side. His disposal efficiency is only mid 60's but he does a lot of work in close but can also work on the outside. That will be a huge bonus for Cripps.
what I would like to see though is a trade that no one sees coming, like Neale to Brisbane.
Jack Martin is no big deal. He might be a handy pick up for a good side but will he be the difference between Cripps being run into the ground or playing like he did against Brisbane? I very much doubt it.
If we can get a young, fit, elite superstar like Neale who can star as much as Cripps and allow Cripps to play like he did on the weekend, then surely that is worth giving up picks for? Also keep in mind that SOS would most likely get a pick in return as well.
IF Lyon becomes coach, then we could target someone like Blakely. Runs hard, tackles hard and kicks well. Not saying he is worth 2 first rounders but he could be one to target if Lyon was the new coach.
DeGoey?
Gaff?
Blakely?
Yeo?
Oliver?
Cerra?
Wines?
Papley?
Parker?
Shuey?
Bontempelli?

As I say, no one expected Neale to go anywhere until the whispers appeared.
We should be aiming a LOT higher than Jack Martin.

 

[Beer n Skittles]

Theoretically they can be priced out if they can't get players to move on that are commanding too much salary (or if Coniglio's offer breaks their wage structure significantly).

It's possible that forcing their hand on Coniglio opens up a less demanding trade, and either way should open the door for us to secure Bonar as well.

As for the question of pace, Coniglio is faster than Whitfield and Papley on the burst, and is able to win the ball inside. We can feed guys like those two all we want then, and there'll be plenty of those at the draft (such as Jeremy Sharp).


Perhaps we should consider the system that makes them look good too?

I'd competely forgotten that Conglio is a free agent. You're right Bonar could very easily be forced out.

Next question is do we need Bonar? I remember him being a big bodied raw athlete type which can be very boom or bust. IMO we've already gone overboard on the big bodied mids too. Or is he more of a De Goey / Caddy type forward?

 

[HARKER]

We have to retain two of Simpson, Murphy and Thomas.
My feeling is that Simpson may retire.
We're not in a position where we can lose too much experience and leadership in one season. Must be done progressively.

I may not be our choice though.

All three may well stay, but I just have a feeling.
It wasn't as though we lost a lot on the weekend without Murphy, was it?

 

[Eiffel 65]

I'd competely forgotten that Conglio is a free agent. You're right Bonar could very easily be forced out.

Next question is do we need Bonar? I remember him being a big bodied raw athlete type which can be very boom or bust. IMO we've already gone overboard on the big bodied mids too. Or is he more of a De Goey / Caddy type forward?

Bonar would be the 2nd quickest over 20m in our team, only coming second to Pickett.

His pace gives him a point of difference over every other big bodied midfielder in our team.

 

[Eiffel 65]

I may not be our choice though.

All three may well stay, but I just have a feeling.
It wasn't as though we lost a lot on the weekend without Murphy, was it?

I'd still prefer to be in a situation where our younger players force the older ones out with good form.

 

[David Sylvian]

I f we do trade the first round pick, which team needs it the most, from where i sit it would be north, western bulldogs and sydney, papley from sydney is the player we need, cunnington would also be ideal, i dont see doc coming back as the same player but i can see Johannisen as a great replacement esp if simmo and daisy ride off into the sunset

 

[Red Bull]

I'd still prefer to be in a situation where our younger players force the older ones out with good form.

Reckon we are just about there.
This summer should see the change over.

 

[FairKouta]

SIER Looks a player. A real Bull not as flat footed as kennedy

 

[M_I_G]

SIER Looks a player. A real Bull not as flat footed as kennedy

Have wanted him in blue since his first or second game last year
Would add heaps