Autopsy Rd 16 Blues last quarter comeback ends in heartbreak

[TBellicious]

Not good enough

The effort in the first half was disgraceful

We had 11 players with less than 5 disposals at half time

 

[FRUMPY]

I love Carlton, but that was some bloody frustrating crap to watch.
I think I put my shoulder out in the last minute of play from being so angry.
Need to go the Physio this morning.
Anyway, back to the game.
We were so bad in the first half. Our skill & delivery is sub par.
Umpires were bad & inconsistent, but not blaming them!
And Lang, think that was your last chance, and you blew it!
Want to single out these players for poor delivery effectiveness:
Mc Gov 20%, Jones 40%, Kennedy 37%, Sam Walsh 48%, Dow 57%, Plowman, 53%, SPS 58%, Gibbons 58%. This is not good enough for AFL level. If this was 10% better we win by 5 goals.
I am afraid that instead of a winning culture, we are building a catch-up from behind culture.
This is mindset problem. There is no player guilty of this more than Plowman. He plays & Looks cocky, and does not have the skill to back it up. Get more serious mate and tighten the f**# up.
We look better when our running players are in space. They can recover a poor kick a little easier.
When it gets congested, we cough it up way too easy. Handballs straight to opposition.
They need to practice passing and handballing under pressure more.
Big shout out to Jack, he has arrived. Was one of our winners.
Also Kennedy, Levi & Kruezer.
PS. If Setterfield's goal conversion was closer to 50%, rather than 3 goals 11 points, we would have notched up at least 2-3 more wins.
Looking forward to having Charlie, Harry & Cunningham back.
That's it rant over. Off to the Physio.

All this talk about our disposal but Melbourne's was just as bad if not worse, if they were 10% better they would have been up by 10+ goals. It was 16th vs 17th, there is a reason both of us are there, skills aren't good enough. I think both sides lack of skill mitigated each other and they were the better side for longer than us.

 

[Blue and Blue]

All in all. While the win would have been good in the very basic sense I don't actually think the win under those circumstances is a good thing in the long run.

These players have got to learn that one quarter isnt good enough in the effort stakes. Whether its professional sport or amateur days its a case of when you pull on the jumper there is a cost. A price to pay. The cost is putting your whole body and mind on the line.
The last thing we need is a team that thinks its easy and they can turn it on at some stage in the game after putting in a half effort till then.

The obvious task for Teague is to sort out why they think they are busting a gut when they really arent.
Yesterday there was a fair spell of going through the motions. So they need confronting with the basic fact of; if they can do that for a quarter why won't they do it for a match.

Its not a case of can't. Dont try to tell me that it was opposition skill or coaching or greater effort that made us second to the ball. It was the lack of the decision by Carlton players to play hard and play in front. I am sure they intended to start well but an intention is far too vague. It must be a decision and an incontrovertible and unequivocal standard. And it will never exist from words. Only by actions.

All in all I think we have had a big win. In the form of Teague now having something really tangible to work with. Two wins and two narrow losses will start to hurt far more than 20 thrashings with excuses. They have a taste of the sweet and the bitter.
If we had got the points his words would have fallen on deaf ears.

 

[FRUMPY]

Not good enough

The effort in the first half was disgraceful

We had 11 players with less than 5 disposals at half time

Its amazing so many players can play a half of footy and barely touch it. While stats/possession don't mean everything, you would like Fisher, Dow, Setterfield, SPS etc to find it another 5-10 times each and be more involved in the game.

But its also our style of play. You look at doggies and Melbourne (to a lesser extent) and they have so many disposals but most of them mean bugger all. How many doggies players had over 30 against us and they won by less than a goal.

 

[David Sylvian]

It took till 2:30am, but I finally made to the end of this thread.

Observations of the game, having attended.

We were putrid for 2 1/2 qtrs. Intensity and skill level were below standard with a couple of notable exceptions (jsos,walsh, kruz)
Melbourne missed a lot of easy shots. We should have been out of the game at qtr time. The final margin flattered us.
Umpiring was bewildering
I love Jonesy, but fmd whats wrong with a fb playing shoulder to shoulder with the ff?

I love Jonesy too, however his enthusisasm to impact very contest also whiffs of a lack of trust in his teammates to play there role, you can almost see weiters and marchbank looking back going wtf? as jones appears from nowhere when the situation was in hand.As you say BB, a subtle word from amos to stand beside the FF is all that is needed. Having said that, who doesnt love a chest mark 10ft off the ground rising from behind a pack of 5 players at a pivotal moment?

 

[FRUMPY]

My favourite piece of play was actually from Melbourne, when instead of going fwd, chipped it across and then back and then across again, with every kick missing the target and eventually going out of bounds about 100m back towards our goal where the play started. Was hilarious and makes me shake my head at modern football and how its played

 

[Macca43]

Gee whiz there are some negative nellies on here.

Who would have thought just a month ago we would kick 100 points with 3 of our 4 leading goal scorers out of the side?

Who would have thought that we would have a side with so much belief they could come back from 5 goals plus down 5 times in 4 weeks?

Who would have thought that Jack Silvagni would be able to nullify Fyfe and Oliver AND kick 3 goals in a half up forward while being instrumental in numerous others?

Who would have thought Kennedy would be a legitimate marking forward?

Who would have thought we would get 11 goals from Casboult, Silvagni, Setterfield and Kennedy?

Yes we have a long way to go and yes it is frustrating we let another winnable game slip but if you can't see the growth we have had in this group and the bright future lying ahead I feel sorry for you.

 

[FRUMPY]

I love Jonesy too, however his enthusisasm to impact very contest also whiffs of a lack of trust in his teammates to play there role, you can almost see weiters and marchbank looking back going wtf? as jones appears from nowhere when the situation was in hand.As you say BB, a subtle word from amos to stand beside the FF is all that is needed. Having said that, who doesnt love a chest mark 10ft off the ground rising from behind a pack of 5 players at a pivotal moment?

But then again how many times does he leave his man and take a saving mark. When it works its awesome, when it doesn't it kills us. He has to find the happy medium and when he has an off day he gets it wrong way too much.

 

[Macca43]

Its amazing so many players can play a half of footy and barely touch it. While stats/possession don't mean everything, you would like Fisher, Dow, Setterfield, SPS etc to find it another 5-10 times each and be more involved in the game.

But its also our style of play. You look at doggies and Melbourne (to a lesser extent) and they have so many disposals but most of them mean bugger all. How many doggies players had over 30 against us and they won by less than a goal.

If we didn't kick it straight to Melbourne every time we were coming out of defensive 50 in the first quarter those 4 would have had a lot more of the ball.

On Dow in the last 3 weeks he has only had 3 clearance while kicking 3 goals and having 3 goal assists - if you haven't picked it up from watching he is no longer spending any real time through the middle but instead playing off a HFF. Hard for him to get involved when the ball spent 90% of the ifrst quarter in the demons forward half.

 

[Macca43]

But then again how many times does he leave his man and take a saving mark. When it works its awesome, when it doesn't it kills us. He has to find the happy medium and when he has an off day he gets it wrong way too much.

Leaving McDonald in the second quarter was just Dumb!!

 

[chunkylover53]

Fight back good, look 10x better than the first half of the year, Setters, Kennedy, Silvagni etc. all positive but what's really ******* annoying is Melbourne now skips 8 points ahead of us and that locks us in for a bottom 4. We would've jumped Melbourne and could realistically looking at a 13th-14th placed finish which would be amazing all things considered.

JSOS has A-grade traits imo. We may have underrated him.. Same height as Cripps, moves well on ball, finds the ball drifting forward, good hands. Lacks pace but so do a lot of others. Another 3-4kg's and he can cause some headaches as more than just a tagger I think.

Jones - wowee that was a terrible individual performance. 6 kicked on him in 3QT by Tom McDonald is not pretty. Especially when he was directly responsible for a lot of them by either running off him to (fail to) impact a separate contest, lose a 1v1 or have a direct turnover. He wasn't exactly under siege either. Unpopular opinion and I've said it before but I truly think he upsets our back 6 balance. A back line ot Weiters, Jones, Plowman and Marchbank is too tall and all play a similar role. Again unpopular, but if we want to land some players via trading picks, then Jones is our best asset. 28yo, durable KPD could net a second rounder or so. Allows us to put time into BSOS and a few others.

Newman had a stinker but he's been a godsend this year whilst Docherty has been down, I can get over 1 shitty game.

Plowman is Plowman, easy to knock him but he was drafted as a mid and has been relegated to a back pocketer, he will always struggle at times but more often than not he does his job. What gave me the shits was his effort at the final contest just watching the ball and misjudging it in the air. He had plenty of time to attack it and either try to trap it or get a foot to it just getting it out of there.

SPS we need more mate. In all our wins he's had more than 24 touches. No surprises today we lose and he only has 17. He had a few costly turnovers too - hates kicking it long. Why?

Dow - something has to be up. Lacks intensity and 1 pressure act is telling. Would not be adverse to wrapping his season up now and getting his body right. He would be absolutely exhausted with an interrupted pre-season too.

Setters - Hopefully that gives him some general confidence and he can move into the midfield next year

Kennedy - Looks good down forward but if all of CC, McKay and Cunningham come in how do we fit him in?

Anyway, hopefully Weitering is alright and we can get the aforementioned in next week and do some damage. If we can win GC, StK and cause one more upset I will be stoked and Teague should get the gig.

 

[FRUMPY]

If we didn't kick it straight to Melbourne every time we were coming out of defensive 50 in the first quarter those 4 would have had a lot more of the ball.

On Dow in the last 3 weeks he has only had 3 clearance while kicking 3 goals and having 3 goal assists - if you haven't picked it up from watching he is no longer spending any real time through the middle but instead playing off a HFF. Hard for him to get involved when the ball spent 90% of the ifrst quarter in the demons forward half.

Im not basing it on yesterdays game, I mean in general we need these guys to be involved more and get 5 or 10 possession more than they are getting it.

Ive liked Dow fwd, seems to be smart up there and in the right spots.

 

[deadoralive]

Was there yesterday and it only confirmed one significant impact for me. Teague is the right man for the job. With a senior figure other than Walls to have a look.

Add Cripps, McKay and Cuningham next week and we should beat Sydney, providing we start better. Mentally the switch needs to be better from the start. Crucial and necessary. I'd drop McGovern in a heartbeat at the moment, unless Weitering can't get up, send him to the backline and have McKay, Casboult, Kennedy, JSOS (matchup depending), Cuningham and Gibbons up forward.

There's hope and development to see. Setterfield, Kennedy, JSos had improved in the last fortnight out of sight. And that's either Teague or confidence or both. Still gutted yesterday, but we were our own worst enemy early and our best friend late.

 

[Soapy V]

I was very disappointed in the efforts of Murphy & Curnow in the first half. The side was struggling and players were jogging but they didn't talk or try and lift the side or any players. There was no physicality or presence. I watched them closely and they just did their job. Thought it was poor leadership especially after last week. It was actually Walsh and the efforts of Silvagni that lifted us and got us back into the game.

IMO we lacked leadership and the sooner we get Cripps & Docherty into that side the better.

 

[ShanDog]

Just catching up after a busy evening and holy hell...

 

[Gethelred]

I actually don't think they should review no balls under any circumstances, next to bowled they are the easiest decision an umpire can make.

And yes, I have umpired.

in the case of LBW I think it can, and should be, used for assessing where the ball pitched and even strikes. Surely it's accurate during actual ball pitch and not theoretic.

I do agree with the rest of your post.

Bear in mind, you do not need Hawkeye to see where the ball pitched, you can just use video for that provided the camera takes above a certain number of frames sufficient to capture the place the ball landed, and ditto with impact point.

I agree that no balls should not be difficult to adjudicate, but at park level you're not getting people running in and bowling at 130+ every ball for 5 hours, either (unless the spinners are on). Could be that it's rather a good deal harder to look at the no ball line and watch the ball at that level of pace.

 

[Macca43]

Im not basing it on yesterdays game, I mean in general we need these guys to be involved more and get 5 or 10 possession more than they are getting it.

Ive liked Dow fwd, seems to be smart up there and in the right spots.

Really strong hands in a marking contest as well.

 

[FRUMPY]

Murphy trying to bump pruess was funny, preuss didnt move and murphy hit he deck hard

 

[Blue__Balls]

Carlton were s**t.
Melbourne were s**t.
The umpires were s**t.
And yet at the death the game was about as exciting as you could ever hope to see.

Think Teague is, very specifically, trying to teach the players something Bolton couldn't/wouldn't, how to use "chaos football" to our advantage. Under Bolton we'd have been trying to minimise the margin rather than steal the win.

The playing group should gain a lot of belief in their ability to chase a score, and hopefully we gain a psychological edge over opponents who panic when we kick goals late in the game.

 

[LanceRomance]

Anyway how bout that JSOS huh?! Rippa.

Looking forward to when we call SOS "father of jack"

 

[ESKIE]

I agree that if you post on a public forum you have to be prepared for the fact that there will be people who will post in disagreement with you. I don't think anybody would dispute that.

Personally attacking and ridiculing people for having a different view should never be acceptable however ,regardless of how disagreeable you find that view.

We all view things differently and these autopsy threads after a loss will always be a place where people come to vent. Personally,, i prefer to wait until the next day when i have had time to compose myself.

I agree Gab personal attacking etc is not acceptable particularly if someone disagrees.... like you I wait a bit post game

Also posting after the game pissed is not a good idea either and bleating about umpires ...it’s not going to end well

We all love our Blues that’s one thing for sure !

 

[ESKIE]

I’m going to put myself through the replay...:0

 

[lukep_86]

Them scoring 12 goals from frees is a *ing joke but you can't blame the loss on that..turning up for a quarter and a bit of footy just isn't good enough. I love that we've been able to come back but hopefully the boys learn quickly that they need to be on from the first bounce.

Also, do we have a tackling coach? If yes, they need to be replaced and if not, we need one asap

On SM-G960F using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[JohnnyFontane90]

plowman's ball use coming out of defense was bad but he had plenty of mates. liam jones' defensive positioning and decision making was straight outta 2018. his boneheaded play gifted melbourne as many goals as plowman and newman did at least.

but even with all that it was simpson who made the critical error at the end clearing the ball straight to oliver to set up their goal.

JSOS was outstanding. teague has had 4 games and in every game we've had a career best performance from someone in the team (cripps, charlie, ed, JSOS)

on a side note, where would casboult be in our B&F this year? Top 5?

 

[JohnnyFontane90]

Im not basing it on yesterdays game, I mean in general we need these guys to be involved more and get 5 or 10 possession more than they are getting it.

Ive liked Dow fwd, seems to be smart up there and in the right spots.

i'm not a fan of Dow forward. not a criticsm of his performance but i see him as midfielder long term so i don't think his development his helped by filling a role in the forward line. reckon when cuningham comes back he's better off playing midfield for northern blues than forward for carlton.