Past #7: Jack Ziebell [Part II] - retires post-RFC game/280gm&183gl/6yr captain - Shinboner - assaulted post-RFC game& in hospital - get well soon JZ

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Ziebell should no longer be captain but the bigger problem is we have nobody to replace him. Sure Tarrent could do it but he is 31 next year, and the less said about JMac the better.
 
Elite Master said:
Ziebell should no longer be captain but the bigger problem is we have nobody to replace him. Sure Tarrent could do it but he is 31 next year, and the less said about JMac the better.
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Too true, I can’t see anyone replacing his duties in the near future.

Doesn’t he also host some of the teenagers?
 
Elite Master said:
Ziebell should no longer be captain but the bigger problem is we have nobody to replace him. Sure Tarrent could do it but he is 31 next year, and the less said about JMac the better.
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Why can't Tarrant take the captaincy for 2 years - he deserves it and is an obvious a replacement that exists.

Then in 2 years time it goes to who is next in line - by then someone will have stepped up - could be youngster like Zurhaar/TT/Jy/Bailey Scott/Larkey or it could be an older guy like a Marley Williams for a couple of years.

We shouldn't be thinking we have to keep JZ on because there is no one else - there is and its obvious in Tarrant.
 

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If the captain is the barometer of the team and relies upon getting up to kick crucial goals or acts in the field to lift the side week in week out consistently.

Pray tell why we let that barometer fall onto Jack. He can't have a consistent set of games to save himself, Swallow would at least provide something even on his worst day.

When Jack is off, he's practically invisible, and his goal kicking as a forward has to be the most hot/cold of any player.

roos_fanatic08 said:
If we are relying on that to get us up then we don’t play finals again while he is captain.
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Exactly this.
 
shintemaster said:
Agree. It's a balance related issue like many others. With JZ forward then Garner, Zurhaar, Wood becomes too many 3rd tall types for mine. It works sometimes, but won't work too often unless all four of them are capable of playing more upfield. I think this is an issue that is solveable off season though. It's frustrating to watch JZ in the middle banging it forward but it says just as much about the rest of the midfield group IMO - they could barely even get their hands on the ball, at least Ziebell can find it.
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Yeah, i was critical of the entire midfield group in the washup thread.

Going forward I think Brown/Larkey/Wood are good primary forwards, when you think of an opposition's best defenders how many good ones do they have, if someone like Ziebell is getting the 4th string defender that can be a really tough matchup for oppositions. At times last year we really exposed the Ziebell vs whomever contest and at times the other forwards decoyed and Ziebell was there one-out and it really worked out well for us. Obviously different teams have different matchups some will work better than others but it should be our Plan A to expose their 4th string defender but only do so when it is a good option. We should always look to hit the best option and that is more of an option when you move the ball quickly and utilise the corridor.

At the moment we have Zurhaar and Garner filling the other two roles, realistically we would want two small roving types with X factor, the Rioli types that produce crumbing goals, but we haven't recruited players like that for some time.

At the end of the day, we need to have a structure and gameplan that is going to kick approximately 15 goals on average a game. If you have a gun FF who can kick 10 goals a game from 3/4 of the entries banged at him and the rest of the spillage produces 5 goals then it doesn't matter if it's not a desired structure if you can make it work.

At present we are getting 2.6 goals average from Brown, 1.5 from Zurhaar, 1.3 from Larkey, 1.2 from Wood, 1.1 from Ziebell and 0.9 from Thomas, that is a total of 8.6 and our mids are not generating 6.4 goals on average because they aren't run and carry players who push aggressively into the scoring range.

Higgins is averaging 0.5, Anderson 0.4, Simpkin 0.3, Cunnington 0.3, Dumont 0.2 and Polec 0.7 which is 2.4 goals, 11 average is about a 36% more output we need from the forwards and mids, part of that can be achieved by having a better system of getting and moving the ball forward and having the mids become more offensive, the other part can be better efficiency at shooting for goal, particularly in the corridor, not sure if it is just my imagination but we seem to miss a lot more corridor shots than other sides and the vast majority of our bigger bodied players struggle to make the distance from 50m and have to swing around like a boomerang to try and get a few extra metres and usually botch the accuracy in the process.

I don't know how a professional football can't kick 50m over a tall man on the mark, this is a distance teenagers who have never been to a gym can kick.
 
shintemaster said:
Agree. It's a balance related issue like many others. With JZ forward then Garner, Zurhaar, Wood becomes too many 3rd tall types for mine. It works sometimes, but won't work too often unless all four of them are capable of playing more upfield. I think this is an issue that is solveable off season though. It's frustrating to watch JZ in the middle banging it forward but it says just as much about the rest of the midfield group IMO - they could barely even get their hands on the ball, at least Ziebell can find it.
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What you said, a fwd line of Brown, larkey, JZ, Zurhaar and two nimble types and Bob's your aunty. No room for Wood and Garner. Off to the trade thread :p
 
All the best mids in the game blast the footy out of packs.

All of them.

Our issue is we constantly seem to allow the opposition to have 3-4 spare men behind the footy when the game is a slog fest.

Geelong hacked a truckload of kicks that we picked off last night.
 
King Corey said:
You'd keep Jack as a pure forward over Mason?
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Mason - if he stays fit - is a far better forward that Jack - much more dangerous in the air (taller and a stronger mark) and a better set shot. Yes he is not as physical as JZ but as an overall forward MW is far better.

I would rate Garner and JZ about par as forwards - both aggressive tacklers and good marks on their day but just far too unreliable in kicking toward goal.

Mason is the 3rd forward for us with CZ as the 4th - JZ and Garner are 5th and 6th in my book.
 
shimaburnsgrieg said:
Mason - if he stays fit - is a far better forward that Jack - much more dangerous in the air (taller and a stronger mark) and a better set shot. Yes he is not as physical as JZ but as an overall forward MW is far better.

I would rate Garner and JZ about par as forwards - both aggressive tacklers and good marks on their day but just far too unreliable in kicking toward goal.

Mason is the 3rd forward for us with CZ as the 4th - JZ and Garner are 5th and 6th in my book.
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Agree.
 

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Harris 10 said:
One puts his head over the footy and tries his guts out every week, the other doesn’t.
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One goes through the midfield and captains the club as well.

People have short memories here. Last season Jack kicked 35/29 with probably 10 odd OOF. He converts another 10 of those shots and it's AA numbers. He also laid 77 tackles and had 13 score assists.

On SM-G975F using BigFooty.com mobile app
 
archereleven said:
One goes through the midfield and captains the club as well.

People have short memories here. Last season Jack kicked 35/29 with probably 10 odd OOF. He converts another 10 of those shots and it's AA numbers. He also laid 77 tackles and had 13 score assists.

On SM-G975F using BigFooty.com mobile app
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He also created the most scoring shots from turnovers inside F50 for us.
 
TennisPlayerAndy said:
All the best mids in the game blast the footy out of packs.

All of them.

Our issue is we constantly seem to allow the opposition to have 3-4 spare men behind the footy when the game is a slog fest.

Geelong hacked a truckload of kicks that we picked off last night.
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He does is far too often, also it's not just out of pack he does it in general play too, feels perceived pressure and just kicks it.
He has a nice kicking style so he looks good when kicking it, however too often straight to the opposition.
Cant question his courage, strength, tackling ability, toughness, passion for the club, however his lack of pace and inability to play consistently has been the same for 5,6,7 years now.
I don't know if Garner can play midfield, but the only way we can keep JZ is if we move him either back or forward, im not too keen on the former.
obviously just about everyone here would take Cunners over JZ, unfortunately with Cunners inability to cover ground means JZ cant be running around our midfield.
 
Themanbun said:
It bothered me that he virtually copied word for word what Rhyce said in the press conference. Carve your own path, JZ.
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Heath has cloned him amazingly.
Straight out of the Brad Scott copyright playbook.
It’s like listening to Swallow with less umming and arring
 
Billy Not Really said:
Thought his post-game interview was pure cliche trite trash.

It was about as bad as that time Jamie Macmillan said "We don't need to win, but we'd like to"
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It was insulting to members what he said post match.
Bag him all we want but Heppels reaction was genuine and of a man who was hurting. Jack was already looking forward to next week.
 
I am probably going to get howled down here but you know who I would make captain, Cam Zuurhaar as I believe he would be an excellent leader. He has already shown that and giving him the captaincy would make him better I think. He just wants the ball and goes and gets it. Can use it better than others we have had as captain and has a bit of X factor. I know he is young but so was Wayne. Couldn't be any worse
 
kangafruity said:
I am probably going to get howled down here but you know who I would make captain, Cam Zuurhaar as I believe he would be an excellent leader. He has already shown that and giving him the captaincy would make him better I think. He just wants the ball and goes and gets it. Can use it better than others we have had as captain and has a bit of X factor. I know he is young but so was Wayne. Couldn't be any worse
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Have you heard Zurhaar speak?
No chance now or easily next few years
 
Has AFL commented on the non free from Saturday night?
 
kangafruity said:
I am probably going to get howled down here but you know who I would make captain, Cam Zuurhaar as I believe he would be an excellent leader. He has already shown that and giving him the captaincy would make him better I think. He just wants the ball and goes and gets it. Can use it better than others we have had as captain and has a bit of X factor. I know he is young but so was Wayne. Couldn't be any worse
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