Club Focus Gold Coast 2020 - Atkins, Markov, Hollands

[Lore]

Data from footywire. To check the draft order (updated weekly) see the thread here.

 

[Johnny Bananas]

As far as players in the draft are concerned no matter how highly they are rated pre draft there is still a lottery element to how they turn out as compared to a proven player eg. Josh Fraser (Pick 1), Jack Watts(1), Jared Brennan(3), Colin Sylvia(3), Matt Luenberger(4), Jack Trengove(2), Jonathan O'Rourke(2), Tom Boyd(1), Paddy McCartin(1).

It obviously isn't a guaranteed thing, but most superstars come from high draft picks. Drafting has got a lot better in the past several years compared to what came before it, since recruiters have learned from their mistakes and have a better idea what to look for. None of the players you mentioned are from the last four drafts, and the two most recent ones busted due to repeated injury.

I'm not saying I wouldn't ever trade a high pick away for an established player. Just not #2 this year for Wines, it isn't a smart idea.

 

[OB11]

Once Rowell and Anderson get there I'm sure that they will feel even better about their future prospects of success with the Suns moving forward.

Don't you think so Crow Till I Die?

 

[Crow till I die]

Once Rowell and Anderson get there I'm sure that they will feel even better about their future prospects of success with the Suns moving forward.

Don't you think so Crow Till I Die?

Sure they will..but I'd love to know who you are trading to Melbourne to get pick 2 - Ben King?

 

[Juzzk1d]

Sure they will..but I'd love to know who you are trading to Melbourne to get pick 2 - Ben King?

I think he's under the impression they'll be getting a priority pick.

 

[Crow till I die]

I think he's under the impression they'll be getting a priority pick.

surely not..he knows that there has been too much pushback from the clubs re compromising live pick trading and he knows Gil's own words last year on the subject of PP's to think that is at all likely to happen. But then again, from his comments on here he does seem bewildered

 

[DangerSloane]

IF gold coast get a PP it wont be at the pointy end.
Mid first round maybe
End of first round likely.

 

[Elmer_Judd]

IF gold coast get a PP it wont be at the pointy end.
Mid first round maybe
End of first round likely.

With all due respect, that is more wishful thinking I suspect.

The Suns have apparently spent months making a huge sales pitch to the AFL requesting why they should get a pre first 1 draft pick.

They ain't going in for this half-assed, they genuinely think they have a legit shot at it (getting a PP)

 

[Crow till I die]

With all due respect, that is more wishful thinking I suspect.

The Suns have apparently spent months making a huge sales pitch to the AFL requesting why they should get a pre first 1 draft pick.

They ain't going in for this half-assed, they genuinely think they have a legit shot at it (getting a PP)

180 degrees the other way - GC will present for a front ended PP and will be told no but will get a raft of other measures to help. The AFL know the clubs won't swallow a front end PP and Gil himself last year highlighted reasons why no front end PP's were given and 1 year on those reasons hold as true today as they did back then. It really will be knock us over with a feather stuff if the AFL go against the clubs and their own stance last year

 

[GcSunsfan]

IF gold coast get a PP it wont be at the pointy end.
Mid first round maybe
End of first round likely.

They will definitely get a priority pick at the start of the first round.
You can take that to the bank

 

[Elmer_Judd]

180 degrees the other way - GC will present for a front ended PP and will be told no but will get a raft of other measures to help. The AFL know the clubs won't swallow a front end PP and Gil himself last year highlighted reasons why no front end PP's were given and 1 year on those reasons hold as true today as they did back then. It really will be knock us over with a feather stuff if the AFL go against the clubs and their own stance last year

Come on, we had a few basket case clubs last season where awarding a PP would have hurt.

Now we have a situation where several of the bottom 6 picks belong to clubs that made the finals last season.

That will play a significant part in The Suns being awarded a pre first round draft pick.

The AFL do U Turns all the time, especially on umpiring changes. It's nothing new.

 

[Crow till I die]

Come on, we had a few basket case clubs last season where awarding a PP would have hurt.

Now we have a situation where several of the bottom 6 picks belong to clubs that made the finals last season.

That will play a significant part in The Suns being awarded a pre first round draft pick.

The AFL do U Turns all the time, especially on umpiring changes. It's nothing new.

again, the big problem the AFL have in doing that is not just its commentary last year on why they did not award PP's but live pick trading has thrown a massive massive spanner in the works. Any fair minded person understands that there are other better longer term measures that are available to help GC than a PP which compromises the benefits of live pick trading. The clubs have made their anger known and therefore it is safe to assume that no front end PP will be issued. as it stands, based on the commentary out there from the clubs so far and what the AFL had said last year, it is likely 99% no front ended PP and 1% PP

 

[GcSunsfan]

180 degrees the other way - GC will present for a front ended PP and will be told no but will get a raft of other measures to help. The AFL know the clubs won't swallow a front end PP and Gil himself last year highlighted reasons why no front end PP's were given and 1 year on those reasons hold as true today as they did back then. It really will be knock us over with a feather stuff if the AFL go against the clubs and their own stance last year

Gill pretty much confirmed it will be a start of the 1st round priority pick last week in a interview on sports days radio.

He also said he will not give the suns extra salary cap space (the old Sydney cola) and that there was not point giving them a middle or end of first round pick and making them trade it because suns can’t afford to pay a star playing and clubs would just screw them alway knowing they had to trade the pick

 

[Crow till I die]

Gill pretty much confirmed it will be a start of the 1st round priority pick last week in a interview on sports days radio.

He also said he will not give the suns extra salary cap space (the old Sydney cola) and that there was not point giving them a middle or end of first round pick and making them trade it because suns can’t afford to pay a star playing and club would just screw them alway knowing they had to trade the pick

provide link?

 

[GcSunsfan]

provide link?

 

[Happy Idiot]

again, the big problem the AFL have in doing that is not just its commentary last year on why they did not award PP's but live pick trading has thrown a massive massive spanner in the works. Any fair minded person understands that there are other better longer term measures that are available to help GC than a PP which compromises the benefits of live pick trading. The clubs have made their anger known and therefore it is safe to assume that no front end PP will be issued. as it stands, based on the commentary out there from the clubs so far and what the AFL had said last year, it is likely 99% no front ended PP and 1% PP

I think where any argument against the priority pick at the top of the draft falls short, is that the AFL is absolutely trying to help solve our retention issues. And like you say, there will definitely be a raft of long-term options considered.

But the silver bullet (for the PP) here is the mate-ship of the projected 1 & 2. The AFL knows without the two of them together the Suns will be drafting a flight risk — and relying on a third party to deal with the Suns in good faith for pick 2 is not sensible at all. Whereas some arguments can be made about the effectiveness of priority picks, it's simply not about improving performance in this instance. It's a retention decision that the AFL can help with/solve in one quick, easy blow (especially with Gil taking extra cap off the table).

I think you know that and I think you know that's why it'll happen.

Edit: And then the snowball of creating a pretty elite-level core of young talent training and living amongst each other (sprinkle in some mature-agers), is absolutely the best chance of retaining Luko and King. Exactly why we won't be trading him out this year.

 

[Crow till I die]

listening to that Gil was big on getting the right people to GC, improving retention was mentioned but nothing specific on retention allowance, help where they need it will be discussed. Nothing there at all implies a front ended PP is a given at all. As has been noted that the commission will discuss the options. In fact he kept referring to Brisbane as a comparison and model for GC.

 

[Crow till I die]

I think where any argument against the priority pick at the top of the draft falls short, is that the AFL is absolutely trying to help solve our retention issues. And like you say, there will definitely be a raft of long-term options considered.

But the silver bullet (for the PP) here is the mate-ship of the projected 1 & 2. The AFL knows without the two of them together the Suns will be drafting a flight risk — and relying on a third party to deal with the Suns in good faith for pick 2 is not sensible at all. Whereas some arguments can be made about the effectiveness of priority picks, it's simply not about improving performance in this instance. It's a retention decision that the AFL can help with/solve in one quick, easy blow (especially with Gil taking extra cap off the table).

I think you know that and I think you know that's why it'll happen.

Edit: And then the snowball of creating a pretty elite-level core of young talent training and living amongst each other (sprinkle in some mature-agers), is absolutely the best chance of retaining Luko and King. Exactly why we won't be trading him out this year.

I don't blame your club at all for asking - ask for everything and then whatever you get will be something. Just feel very comfortable that a front ended PP will be rebuffed by the clubs. As for trading Luko or King, sure you want to keep them. the only way it would happen is if either wants out and is very clear they won't be there after next year if forced to stay - but that is speculation only at this stage as there is nothing other than inuendo and rumor about either player

 

[Jirik13]

I am pretty sure other clubs would prefer Suns getting PP1 than getting extra salary cap (cola type) as cola would allow Suns to attract their players by overpaying. There were plenty of PPs given at the beginning of 1st round to Melbourne clubs between 2000 -2009. Some clubs received multiple of them. PP affecting live trading? Are you serious? One position drop does not make really any difference. Most important, I did not hear Eddie complaining about it so yes, I also predict Suns will get PP1.

 

[Crow till I die]

I am pretty sure other clubs would prefer Suns getting PP1 than getting extra salary cap (cola type) as cola would allow Suns to attract their players by overpaying. There were plenty of PPs given at the beginning of 1st round to Melbourne clubs between 2000 -2009. Some clubs received multiple of them. PP affecting live trading? Are you serious? One position drop does not make really any difference. Most important, I did not hear Eddie complaining about it so yes, I also predict Suns get PP1.

without having to regurgitate the interviews, yes PP's very much affect live pick trading. Clubs do predictive models that they base their drafting and trading on and these become redundant when outside influence changes things

 

[Elmer_Judd]

I don't blame your club at all for asking - ask for everything and then whatever you get will be something. Just feel very comfortable that a front ended PP will be rebuffed by the clubs. As for trading Luko or King, sure you want to keep them. the only way it would happen is if either wants out and is very clear they won't be there after next year if forced to stay - but that is speculation only at this stage as there is nothing other than inuendo and rumor about either player

The clubs do not get the final say whether the AFL awards a team a PP or not. They take their views under advisement, but the Crows publicly admitting they are considering trading away the pick they got from Carlton hardly makes The Crows case strong for a no to GC getting a PP.

 

[Crow till I die]

The clubs do not get the final say whether the AFL awards a team a PP or not. They take their views under advisement, but the Crows publicly admitting they are considering trading away the pick they got from Carlton hardly makes The Crows case strong for a no to GC getting a PP.

I'll take the clubs recruitment and list strategy commentary and their avowed pushback based on evidence that they are presenting to the AFL over a vested interest supporter base from the club benefiting and carlton flogs with a chip on their shoulder. I have provided commentary from the clubs and also why PP's were not considered last year and that the rationale used then is very much still as it is for now in terms of lists etc. All i have heard from the pro PP lobby is floury language and that the club is applying for one

 

[Cleric]

With all due respect, that is more wishful thinking I suspect.

The Suns have apparently spent months making a huge sales pitch to the AFL requesting why they should get a pre first 1 draft pick.

They ain't going in for this half-assed, they genuinely think they have a legit shot at it (getting a PP)

If Carlton and Brisbane didn't get one then no way GC do.

 

[DangerSloane]

With all due respect, that is more wishful thinking I suspect.

The Suns have apparently spent months making a huge sales pitch to the AFL requesting why they should get a pre first 1 draft pick.

They ain't going in for this half-assed, they genuinely think they have a legit shot at it (getting a PP)

Yeh thats great but the push back from other clubs means the AFL wont give them pick 2 (this is just my opinion obviously).

I cant see it happening.
Shouldnt be rewarded for being a bucket shop.
Especially when they were expected to lose every game this season and won what 3?

Dont forget how Carlton petitioned the AFL for one only a couple of years ago. They got nuffin

 

[DangerSloane]

They will definitely get a priority pick at the start of the first round.
You can take that to the bank

Yes. I'll take it to the 'Bank of Things That Wont Happen'

What is their current deposit rate?

 

[DangerSloane]

Come on, we had a few basket case clubs last season where awarding a PP would have hurt.

Now we have a situation where several of the bottom 6 picks belong to clubs that made the finals last season.

That will play a significant part in The Suns being awarded a pre first round draft pick.

The AFL do U Turns all the time, especially on umpiring changes. It's nothing new.

What relevance does making the finals last year have?

What an absolutely stupid thing to say.

The other thing is does anyone actually believe anotehr top pick will do anything for Gold Coast?
Ironically we're discussing this in a thread about a top pick likely to leave after 1 season.