Final 2019 attendance ladder

[South of the Yarra]

Yes, my point was that teams like Collingwood, Richmond, Essendon, Carlton etc constantly play year on year in big blockbusters against each other bringing in the crowds along with their other crowds. Now compared to each other of course that cancels out and shows they each have the big crowds but different to the rest of the league.

But Collingwood has the biggest crowds and we only played Carlton once.

 

[Vintage]

Interesting numbers.

Don’t understand why so many seem to measure their own self worth based on how many people turn up to watch the team they support?

 

[Bunk Moreland]

The best way to measure attendence is home Average v Interstate teams IMO.
Still trying to go through the numbers.

I'm not sleeping because of Ben ******* Stokes so I knocked this up.

Home games only vs interstate opposition only.

Club - games - average

1. West Coast - 10 - 53,041
2. Richmond - 5 - 51,018
3. Adelaide - 10 - 43,911
4. Collingwood - 5 - 42,518
5. Essendon - 5 - 41,160
6. Fremantle - 10 - 39,350
7. Carlton - 5 - 34,888
8. Port Adelaide - 10 - 32,377
9. Sydney - 10 - 31,198
10. Geelong - 4 - 28,498
11. Brisbane Lions - 10 - 24,962
12. St Kilda - 6 - 20,492
13. Melbourne - 6 - 20,100
14. Hawthorn - 6 - 19,610
15. Western Bulldogs - 5 - 18,916
16. North Melbourne - 5 - 15,600
17. GWS - 10 - 11,883
18. Gold Coast - 10 - 11,189

 

[PetterdHoisted]

I'm not sleeping because of Ben ******* Stokes so I knocked this up.

Home games only vs interstate opposition only.

Club - games - average

1. West Coast - 10 - 53,041
2. Richmond - 5 - 51,018
3. Adelaide - 10 - 43,911
4. Collingwood - 5 - 42,518
5. Essendon - 5 - 41,160
6. Fremantle - 10 - 39,350
7. Carlton - 5 - 34,888
8. Port Adelaide - 10 - 32,377
9. Sydney - 10 - 31,198
10. Geelong - 4 - 28,498
11. Brisbane Lions - 10 - 24,962
12. St Kilda - 6 - 20,492
13. Melbourne - 6 - 20,100
14. Hawthorn - 6 - 19,610
15. Western Bulldogs - 5 - 18,916
16. North Melbourne - 5 - 15,600
17. GWS - 10 - 11,883
18. Gold Coast - 10 - 11,189

Can't sleep either!
Lyon missed run out...wtf keeps replaying in my mind

That's a decent comparison, for the Melb clubs it scales closely with overall member numbers

 

[sprockets]

Yes, my point was that teams like Collingwood, Richmond, Essendon, Carlton etc constantly play year on year in big blockbusters against each other bringing in the crowds along with their other crowds. Now compared to each other of course that cancels out and shows they each have the big crowds but different to the rest of the league.

Ok so let's say your team, StKilda, played against the Big 4 teams instead of playing only against the 'smaller' teams... Hang on a sec, I see you DO play against those teams. As a matter of fact only Richmond had to play against Big 4 sides as many times as your club (5) this year. What am I missing? That when the Big 4 clubs play each other it's usually a 'blockbuster'? There's a reason for that.

 

[dean33]

Wow Richmond average just over 50,000 to games with over 100,000 members. That is an excessively poor turn up rate.

We just have supporters willing to back the club financially without needing anything back in return. As opposed to the pies who have supporters that go to games not wanting to back their club financially. Just a different type of people I guess...

 

[Grin]

Wow Richmond average just over 50,000 to games with over 100,000 members. That is an excessively poor turn up rate.

How insecure are Collingwood supporters?

 

[iluvparis]

Big drop off from 7th to 8th on that list.

Carlton should be stoked with that - keep on improving and they'll be around top in a couple of years.

Nah that's just what you expect when you are a Big 4 club

 

[Hawkk]

Hawks have seemingly fallen off a cliff without finals and success. Probably explains the ‘topping up’ list management.

Pretty much...

It’s a shame as Hawthorn are in financial turmoil

Didn’t Hawthorn get 31,000 against Gold Coast? The Hawks home crowds in Melbourne this year have been decent except for the game against GWS.

I don’t recall Hawthorn playing Essendon, Carlton, Sydney or Adelaide at the MCG. Instead home games against WB, North and Gold Coast played a part in the low averages.

Below were all our Melbourne and Tasmanian based attendances so make of that what you will

Good example of this is looking at Hawthorn’s home and away crowd disparity.

Hawthorn started playing 4 home games abroad in 2006 and between 2006 and 2009 the difference in home and away attendance was approx 3,000 per season.

From 2010 onwards the gap between home and away attendances have been mostly growing every season, save 2015. In 2012, 2014 and 2017 Hawthorn topped the AFL for away attendances (46,897, 45,845 and 45,529) whilst our home attendance were relatively modest (34,105, 36,573 and 33,527)

In 2019 our home attendances were the lowest in 14 years (31,077) but our away attendances will probably clear 40,000 (currently 38,992 with a game against West Coast to come)

View attachment 732133

No other Victorian club has the disparity in home and away attendance like Hawthorn. Which given our home game schedule, below, is not all that surprising...

Round 2 v W Bulldogs at MCG 39,368 (3.20pm Sunday)
Round 3 v North Melbourne at MCG 36,174 (3.20pm Sunday)
Round 5 v Geelong at MCG 66,347 (3.20pm Monday)
Round 6 v Carlton in Tasmania 15,888 (3.20pm Sunday)
Round 8 v GWS 14,636 at MCG (3.20pm Sunday)
Round 10 v Port Adelaide in Tasmania 11,637 (1.45pm Saturday)
Round 15 v West Coast at MCG 31,985 (1.45pm Saturday)
Round 16 v Collingwood at MCG 66,407 (7.50pm Friday)
Round 17 v Fremantle in Tasmania 13,006 (2.10pm Saturday)
Round 19 v Brisbane in Tasmania 15,157 (1.45pm Saturday)
Round 22 v Gold Coast at Marvel Stadium 31,331 (4.40pm Sunday)

Plus Melbourne based away games against...

Round 4 St Kilda at Marvel Stadium 35,883 (3.20pm Sunday)
Round 7 v Melbourne at MCG 40,864 (1.45pm Saturday)
Round 9 v Richmond at MCG 64,936 (3.20pm Sunday)
Round 13 v Essendon at Marvel Stadium 44,836 (7.50pm Friday)
Round 18 v Geelong at MCG 53,536 (1.10pm Sunday)
Round 20 v North Melbourne at Marvel Stadium 33,226 (7.50pm Friday)

Now in relative terms, our home games...

- the Rd 2 Dogs game was the 4th largest Dogs game all season (behind just the Collingwood and Essendon games in Melb)
- the Rd 3 North game was Kangaroos 6th largest North game all season (behind Essendon, Collingwood and Carlton games in Melb)
- the Rd 5 Geelong game was the Cats 2nd largest Cats game all season (behind round 1 v Collingwood)
- the Rd 16 Collingwood game was the Pies 6th largest game all season (behind away games against Rich, Ess and home games against Rich, Carl and Geel)
- the round 22 Gold Coast game was the Suns 4th largest game all season (just behind Carl, who drew 31,765 in the 2.10 Sat timeslot)

In terms of away games...

- the Saints Rd 4 game was the Saints 2nd largest home game for the season (behind 40,963 for the Tigers game)
- the Demons Rd 7 game was the Dees 2nd largest home game for the season (behind 52,475 for the round 2 game v Essendon)
- the Tigers Rd 9 game was the Tigers 5th biggest home game for the season (behind Coll, Ess (Dreamtime), Melb (ANZAC Eve) and was 300 people short of Geelong)
- the Bombers Rd 13 game was the Dons 2nd largest Docklands home game for the season (behind NM)
- the Cats Rd 18 game was the Cats second largest home game for the season (behind Ess)
- North’s Rd 20 game was the Roos 2nd largest home game for the season (behind Ess)

We’ve had some poor media this year but pound for pound our Melbourne based crowds are pretty strong. The devil for us is in the allocation of home games and the schedule of those games (ie a flurry of 3.20 Sunday games and a number of ‘away’ Friday Night games)

Evidently the home attendance was 31,077 and the away attendance was 40,488

Interestingly Hawthorn played 5 Sunday twilight home games (4 of 7 in Melbourne)

Given Hawthorn’s contribution to equalisation, hoping for a better schedule next year

 

[Back Pocket Rocket]

Hawks have seemingly fallen off a cliff without finals and success. Probably explains the ‘topping up’ list management.

Maybe playing 4 matches in Tassie with a capacity of under 20k would explain it

 

[mattwa]

We actually did ok considering 2 of our games were at ballarat. The 9 at marvel would be 33 to 35k av

 

[Hawkk]

Maybe playing 4 matches in Tassie with a capacity of under 20k would explain it

Plus the spread of games

If you look at the opponents Hawthorn play in Tasmania, the corresponding fixtures drew the following attendances for Melbourne based Hawthorn home games...

Fremantle x 6 games in Tasmania (2 games in Melbourne inc 43,583, 31,925)
GWS x 2 games in Tasmania (3 games in Melbourne inc 14,858, 17,906, 26,805)
Gold Coast x 5 games in Tasmania (3 games in Melbourne inc 31,331, 27,532, 28,011)
Brisbane x 10 games in Tasmania (2 games in Melbourne inc 35,492, 39,007)
Port Adelaide x 5 games in Tasmania (4 games in Melbourne inc 28,657, 27,532, 21,287, 33,527)
Adelaide x 2 in Tasmania (5 games in Melbourne inc 26,693, 37,470, 45,781, 33,524, 32,583)
West Coast x 3 games in Tasmania (6 games in Melbourne inc 31,892, 28,011, 42,977, 32,587, 50,023, 29,138)
Carlton x 2 games in Tasmania (2 games in Melbourne inc 33,182, 69,814)
St Kilda x 4 games in Tasmania (3 games in Melbourne inc 32,924, 42,453, 36,069)
W Bulldogs x 4 games in Tasmania (5 games in Melbourne inc 39,892, 48,080, 42,198, 47,474, 31,982)
N Melbourne x 5 games in Tasmania (4 games in Melbourne inc 36,174, 50,657, 42,218, 42,508)
Sydney x 1 game in Tasmania (9 games in Melbourne inc 48,398, 49,527, 44,484, 36,007, 54,894, 72,760, 63,319, 61,552, 52,181, 32,784)
Geelong x 1 game in Tasmania (10 games in Melbourne inc 69,584, 68,628, 78,578, 65,235, 76,300, 72,254, 73,584, 62,360, 59,598, 66,346)

Hawthorn pushing only low drawing games to Tasmania is a bit of a myth. If you look at games drawn in Melbourne (and Hawthorn has played every club in Melbourne based home games)

Geelong - 69,350 (1 game in Tasmania)
Sydney - 51,587 (1 game in Tasmania)
Carlton - 51,537 (2 games in Tasmania)
N Melbourne - 42,860 (5 games in Tasmania
W Bulldogs - 42,028 (4 games in Tasmania)
Fremantle - 37,754 (6 games in Tasmania)
Brisbane - 37,259 (10 games in Tasmania)
St Kilda - 37,149 (4 games in Tasmania)
West Coast - 35,783 (3 games in Tasmania)
Adelaide - 35,274 (5 games in Tasmania)
Gold Coast - 28,958 (5 games in Tasmania)
Port Adelaide - 27,752 (5 games in Tasmania
GWS - 19,898 (2 games in Tasmania)

There is a myth that Hawthorn have dumped their low drawing games in Tasmania. This has been a myth, the spread of home games is relatively even between Melbourne and York Park.

The notable exception is Brisbane which is bizarre (as the two games in Melbourne back in 2007 and 2012 both drew 35k plus)

Another myth is that these games would by and large be lost making games in Melbourne. Aside from the GWS fixtures the average across all opponents would be break even or profit drawing in Melbourne. In fact games against Geel, Syd, Carl, NM, WB, BL, St K and even WC and Adel would be money spinners in Melbourne.

On the numbers Fremantle would be too but I won’t be so cheeky to suggest that (the GF reply helped but the other fixture it should be noted did draw 32,000 in 2011)

This year Hawthorn played Carlton (51,537 in Melb average), Fremantle (37,754 in Melb average), Brisbane (37,259 in Melb average) and Port Adelaide (27,752 in Melb average) in Tasmania.

Based on demonstrated attendances (and I’m sure the Brisbane and Carlton numbers would have risen and Fremantle dropped circumstantially) that’s another 99,277 slapped on for Hawthorn games...

Interestingly Hawthorn’s numbers were just 5500 lower then its peak 2010 attendance (922,316 ~ 41,925 per match). That, if anything, is not too bad

Good thing we don’t have an AFL overdraft like some

 

[MC Extra Dollop]

not only are they exaggerated but 1/4 to 1/2 of the fans at the game support the away team most of the time

Admittedly I haven't gone to watch Geelong play the Giants or Suns up there for some, but if they're getting 50-75% of the crowd these days, that's quite an improvement.

 

[South of the Yarra]

How insecure are Collingwood supporters?

Nope just find it astounding. Either botched figures or a very uncommitted following.

 

[andon]

Club - Attendance - Average

1. Collingwood - 1,207,662 - 54,894
2. Richmond - 1,118,360 - 50,835
3. Essendon - 1,060,983 - 48,226
4. West Coast - 985,780 - 44,808
5. Carlton - 868,366 - 39,471
6. Geelong - 835,164 - 37,962
7. Adelaide - 788,328 - 35,833
8. Hawthorn - 787,621 - 35,801
9. Fremantle - 742,420 - 33,746
10. Port Adelaide - 729,811 - 33,173
11. Melbourne - 718,788 - 32,672
12. Bulldogs - 681,734 - 30,988
13. Sydney - 678,483 - 30,840
14. St Kilda - 638,253 - 29,012
15. North Melbourne - 603,438 - 27,429
16. Brisbane - 595,285 - 27,058
17. Gold Coast - 435,828 - 19,810
18. GWS - 432,070 - 19,640

Total - 6,954,187 - 35,122

Courtesy Footywire.com

Imagine how big Essendons numbers would be if we played at the G as our home ground again.

 

[99cents]

Their home attendances are definitely exaggerated by the afl.

Bollocks Mr county

 

[kranky al]

I'm not sleeping because of Ben ******* Stokes so I knocked this up.

Home games only vs interstate opposition only.

Club - games - average

1. West Coast - 10 - 53,041
2. Richmond - 5 - 51,018
3. Adelaide - 10 - 43,911
4. Collingwood - 5 - 42,518
5. Essendon - 5 - 41,160
6. Fremantle - 10 - 39,350
7. Carlton - 5 - 34,888
8. Port Adelaide - 10 - 32,377
9. Sydney - 10 - 31,198
10. Geelong - 4 - 28,498
11. Brisbane Lions - 10 - 24,962
12. St Kilda - 6 - 20,492
13. Melbourne - 6 - 20,100
14. Hawthorn - 6 - 19,610
15. Western Bulldogs - 5 - 18,916
16. North Melbourne - 5 - 15,600
17. GWS - 10 - 11,883
18. Gold Coast - 10 - 11,189

Actually went to bed when the soapies had 3 wickets in hand fairly smug and too tired to stay up

Mate messages me - just got 2 quick wickets

I dive out and turn tv on - we lose - i sit stunned and cant sleep till 2 am....

 

[Rezza Tiger]

Wow Richmond average just over 50,000 to games with over 100,000 members. That is an excessively poor turn up rate.

How dare we have the highest membership and highest home attendances

Also how is 59,987 JUST over 50,000? I'm glad your not my accountant

 

[MemoryLane]

I hope all the people making their little tables are excluding all of the sold home games.


It really should just be matches at your normal home ground.

But then of course that actually works in tje favour of those melb clubs who sell all their non-blockbuster home games.

Result: these tables are neither accurate or useful.

 

[South of the Yarra]

How dare we have the highest membership and highest home attendances

Also how is 59,987 JUST over 50,000? I'm glad your not my accountant

Glad your not anyone's accountant as Richmond averaged under 51.000 to their games (yes just over 50,000). The Tigers are like an Instagram account. Lots of likes but no real support. A nice little local brand who gets a few people to home games but has no national drawing power.

 

[HTT]

Actually went to bed when the soapies had 3 wickets in hand fairly smug and too tired to stay up

Mate messages me - just got 2 quick wickets

I dive out and turn tv on - we lose - i sit stunned and cant sleep till 2 am....

I’m operating off 4 and a half hours sleep after watching that last night. Fair to say I’m not happy.

 

[HTT]

Glad your not anyone's accountant as Richmond averaged under 51.000 to their games (yes just over 50,000). The Tigers are like an Instagram account. Lots of likes but no real support. A nice little local brand who gets a few people to home games but has no national drawing power.

Home games v travelling teams paints a great picture. Clear west coast 1 tigers 2. Daylight 3.
All Victorian teams pretty close to 50% of their membership base.
Pretty clear the Pies had a handy draw to boost them above the larger clubs.

 

[South of the Yarra]

Home games v travelling teams paints a great picture. Clear west coast 1 tigers 2. Daylight 3.
All Victorian teams pretty close to 50% of their membership base.
Pretty clear the Pies had a handy draw to boost them above the larger clubs.

Actually the opposite. Collingwood only played Carlton once. Richmond just cannot get people through the gate

 

[Hawkk]

How dare we have the highest membership and highest home attendances

Also how is 59,987 JUST over 50,000? I'm glad your not my accountant

Yeah pretty much...

I've been very critical of Richmond in the past (I'm not going to lie), especially when it comes to attendances against non Victorian clubs but the numbers don't lie...

Highest Melbourne based average against non Victorian clubs

Richmond 51,218 (5 games) in 2019
Hawthorn 50,103 (3 games*) in 2016
Essendon 46,868 (3 games) in 1999
Hawthorn 45,588 (2 games*) in 2015
Hawthorn 44,735 (3 games*) in 2014
Collingwood 43,873 (4 games) in 2012
Collingwood 43,742 (4 games) in 2011
Hawthorn 43,699 (2 games*) in 2007
Collingwood 43,447 (5 games) in 2019

*Hawthorn played Frem, GC (2016), GC, BL (2015), BL, WCE (2014) and WC, PA (2007) which would have brough their average down had they been scheduled in Melbourne.

Pound for pound Richmond's 2019 attendances are extremely impressive. Not only did they play basically the maximum number of non Victorian teams in Victoria (5 of their 11 home games) but one of those games was against the Swans at Docklands, easily the highest drawing non Victorian club.

Interestingly Richmond's 2018 total crowds were 60,000 larger than 2019 but their attendances against non Victorian clubs was much lower (39,936 across 3 games)

This to me indicates that 2019 was a much stronger drawing year for Richmond than 2018.

It also helps that they broke the attendance record for a Melbourne based club against a non Victorian club, they actually smashed the 2014 record of 72,760 against the Swans (by more than 4,000 against the Lions)

I wonder what that game against the Swans (which drew 40,000 plus) at Docklands would have drawn at the MCG - probably 60,000

 

[South of the Yarra]

Home games v travelling teams paints a great picture. Clear west coast 1 tigers 2. Daylight 3.
All Victorian teams pretty close to 50% of their membership base.
Pretty clear the Pies had a handy draw to boost them above the larger clubs.

You do not come close to our drawing power.