List Mgmt. 2019 Trade Thread - Part III

[gringo2011]

bad influence

And can't get on the park. He's a waste of a spot.

 

[gringo2011]

Every year, every club can probably point to a player taken later in the draft that they missed… I don't understand the whinging unless you called it beforehand… ironically Gringo and I were pretty keen on Bont before the draft from memory, but he was more of a risk at the time.

Billings is a gun, if he was playing in a good team he'd look even better.

Paddy and Hughy were mistakes in hindsight, not Billings.

I wanted Bont but then talked myself out of him. I remember I said I thought if he couldn't play mid he might end up too tall and be an Andreas Everett. I also said the same about another draft bolder in Paddy Cripps, I said there was a chance he wouldn't make it as an AFL mid at that height. Hmmmm good calls.

 

[gringo2011]

So if a player taken later in any draft becomes better than your pick, it is considered a failure? That was the logic.

Hunter Clark a failure if Naughton is the better player long term. Bummer.

The main thing is to end up with a bunch of quality players, Billings is definitely that… absolute least of our drafting concerns.

I think Billings is going to always be measured against Bont. MB was back to his best this year after a pretty average 2018. He's a match winner and probably a champion player at the end of his career. I don't mind people measuring him off against the Billings, it's the kind of depressing myopic thing I'd do myself just for the thrill of it.

 

[Virgin Dog]

The Dogs already had a few strong drafts of young talent in (including 3 free hits with F/S picks in Libba, Wallis and Hunter) so they could afford to take a high risk/high reward chance that Bont was.

We on the other hand, were in year 1 of the rebuild. We couldn't take the chance to take risks with a top 3 pick. We'd already gone with a high risk/high reward pick in Spencer White the previous year anyway. JB was a consensus top 3 pick... I've never heard anyone state otherwise.

So whether you want to consider that choice the wrong one or not, you should consider the context of the decision when it was made.

This is an extremely important thing to note - if Saints had a highly rated FS/academy pick coming through this year, then I'm sure they'd be happy to take a punt on someone like Kemp, who is obviously a huge talent, but it's not clear what his best role would be at senior level (and whether he'd actually "make it"). Not that this is actually a rebuild, but Saints seem to have flagged their interest in drafting some elite talent, so definitely don't want to take too high of a risk. Kemp is the very definition of a high risk/high reward type. Very comparable to the Billings/Bont year as you were talking about. If you are starting a rebuild, of course you take the guy who was almost certainly going to be an A-grader in Billings, but you can't risk going for the potential superstar/potential dud in Bontempelli. We could afford to take the risk here. If those FS picks hadn't panned out in the years preceding the 2013 draft, we may not have been as hot on Bont. Stuff up the first year of your rebuild, and you're setting the club back an entire year, which can have huge knock-on effects.

The Saints were right to pick Billings, and there's no use getting caught up on "what-ifs". Billings is far from a poor pick, and looks like a potential AA-level player. Jonathan O'Rourke went at Pick 2, as did Bennell. THOSE are bad picks. Billings is a great prospect

 

[Lenny2020]

I wanted Bont but then talked myself out of him. I remember I said I thought if he couldn't play mid he might end up too tall and be an Andreas Everett. I also said the same about another draft bolder in Paddy Cripps, I said there was a chance he wouldn't make it as an AFL mid at that height. Hmmmm good calls.

I'm predicting the tall midfielder trend to reverse and clubs will start taking tiny midfielders that can run between the legs of all of these tall midfielders. Potentially a game-changer.

I'm pitching it to a few clubs as we speak.

My presentation is called: Tiny mids. They're the next big thing.

 

[gringo2011]

I'm predicting the tall midfielder trend to reverse and clubs will start taking tiny midfielders that can run between the legs of all of these tall midfielders. Potentially a game-changer.

I'm pitching it to a few clubs as we speak.

My presentation is called: Tiny mids. They're the next big thing.

Lauchie Neale did their chances no harm this year. Outstanding little player.

 

[SaintsSeptember]

Well that is amazing. Did these guys have no clue or is it that there is always bit of unknown when drafting kids. While the Bont was low, what about P. Cripps?

I remember some of the phantom drafts had us taking Cripps with the pick that ended up being Acres.

Pies were pretty unlucky in that draft , after trading to get pick 6.

 

[mightymalaka]

I'm predicting the tall midfielder trend to reverse and clubs will start taking tiny midfielders that can run between the legs of all of these tall midfielders. Potentially a game-changer.

I'm pitching it to a few clubs as we speak.

My presentation is called: Tiny mids. They're the next big thing.

Like this idea!

Takes me back to when Paul Callery punched Robert Walls in the balls!
And it was a straight right hander!

 

[SaintsSeptember]

I'm predicting the tall midfielder trend to reverse and clubs will start taking tiny midfielders that can run between the legs of all of these tall midfielders. Potentially a game-changer.

I'm pitching it to a few clubs as we speak.

My presentation is called: Tiny mids. They're the next big thing.

Saints ahead of the pack...

Gresham 179.
Hind 180
Hannebery 181.
Sinclair 181.

the piece d resistance.... we put Jack Lonie in the middle. 175 cm.

 

[L_W_P]

StK never wins a trade according to the AFL media. It takes about 30 seconds of research and an absence of cognitive bias to actually look at a trade with any accuracy.

It took them 3 season to realise that we didn't give up #5 for JC and grow Gresh in a pot plant at Seaford.

I still like us losing out on Pick 12 for Tom Lee, pick 24 and pick 43.

Kevin Sheehan (then AFL Talent Manager) had Lee going to Carlton at pick 11. He was the best KPF in the draft not named Daniher and was a walk up start for a team that had Nick Riewoldt and nothing else.

 

[BigPowerForward]

I hope he stays myself.

Personally I don't want to see him go, but without getting a long term deal from the Saints, Bruce would be worse off. He has a young family and the Bulldogs deal would provide him with security going forward. If the Bulldogs really want him then the trade will happen. Hopefully we can turn that trade into a diamond and not a stone.

 

[kernelT]

Saints ahead of the pack...

Gresham 179.
Hind 180
Hannebery 181.
Sinclair 181.

the piece d resistance.... we put Jack Lonie in the middle. 175 cm.

Brad Gotch was before his time.

 

[mightymalaka]

Personally I don't want to see him go, but without getting a long term deal from the Saints, Bruce would be worse off. He has a young family and the Bulldogs deal would provide him with security going forward. If the Bulldogs really want him then the trade will happen. Hopefully we can turn that trade into a diamond and not a stone.

But he is a Big Power Forward man!
We are more likely to turn it into a pebble!

We had a Stone once. He wore glasses!

Next you will be telling me you have gone off Bacon!
What has the world come to?

 

[LeonardHayes87]

I still like us losing out on Pick 12 for Tom Lee, pick 24 and pick 43.

Kevin Sheehan (then AFL Talent Manager) had Lee going to Carlton at pick 11. He was the best KPF in the draft not named Daniher and was a walk up start for a team that had Nick Riewoldt and nothing else.

I remember watching this thinking we’ve found an absolute star...

 

[BigPowerForward]

But he is a Big Power Forward man!
We are more likely to turn it into a pebble!

We had a Stone once. He wore glasses!

Next you will be telling me you have gone off Bacon!
What has the world come to?

I'm still eating bacon MM
I tried being vegan for a while but that was a big missed steak

 

[L_W_P]

I remember watching this thinking we’ve found an absolute star...

He absolutely had the talent.

Richo just did not want him because he lacked any kind of physical aggression when playing. Given we were his 2nd AFL chance AND he was a mature pick up, that was him done at the top level.

Stick him in next year's team under Ratten and I think he would thrive.

 

[Impatient Saint]

He absolutely had the talent.

Richo just did not want him because he lacked any kind of physical aggression when playing. Given we were his 2nd AFL chance AND he was a mature pick up, that was him done at the top level.

Stick him in next year's team under Ratten and I think he would thrive.

I agree Richo stymied more careers than he enhanced during his time. He was the developer of 'diddly squat'!

 

[gringo2011]

Personally I don't want to see him go, but without getting a long term deal from the Saints, Bruce would be worse off. He has a young family and the Bulldogs deal would provide him with security going forward. If the Bulldogs really want him then the trade will happen. Hopefully we can turn that trade into a diamond and not a stone.

I just don't want to be short ourselves, I think we need him one more year. Stuff Bruce, just don't want to expose King or even worse if King goes down we are playing Membrey and maybe Battle as KPFs. Ryder apparently wants Essendon and have asked them to go higher on their offer -somewhere between ours and theirs.
We might have one ruck and Alabakis who was playing Ammos because he wasn't up to VFL standard and no KPF. Doesn't sound like good management. Bruce will still be worth the same next year as well. It's no like his value will drop unless he goes down injured.

 

[gringo2011]

I agree Richo stymied more careers than he enhanced during his time. He was the developer of 'diddly squat'!

I still think it was drafting not development. I think when you have mature cores then the kids get to develop in a protected environment and gain confidence but it's not like they do a heap different at other clubs. I actually think Richo got quite a bit out of his limited list except for last year. Still right to start again because he was partly responsible for list management.

 

[gringo2011]

He absolutely had the talent.

Richo just did not want him because he lacked any kind of physical aggression when playing. Given we were his 2nd AFL chance AND he was a mature pick up, that was him done at the top level.

Stick him in next year's team under Ratten and I think he would thrive.

His shoulders were ****ed for a large part of his time with us. He didn't get diagnosed until the end of his time with us, he lacked a projection of bone that stopped his shoulders popping. They'd just grafted him when he got cut. Richo left out a lot of Watters boys like Siposs etc as well. He was pretty stubborn on a few that should have been given games. Like White he did everything he was asked by the club and they found new reasons not to b in the side. He was pretty frustrated by the end.

 

[mightymalaka]

He absolutely had the talent.

Richo just did not want him because he lacked any kind of physical aggression when playing. Given we were his 2nd AFL chance AND he was a mature pick up, that was him done at the top level.

Stick him in next year's team under Ratten and I think he would thrive.

Lacking any kind of physical aggression when playing can't be good for a start!

Especially knowing the Richo man wanted his players to be Strong in the contest like Weller!

 

[gringo2011]

I remember watching this thinking we’ve found an absolute star...

He played a WAFL v VFL side and he was unbelievable, was launching on shoulders and kicked a bag.

 

[kernelT]

Cho doesn't like no fluffy-headed mofos

 

[Snuffaluphagus]

Liam Henry .

Just behind Rowell & Anderson with the recruiting guys I was with at Championships.

AFL website also completely wrong he is not a Small Forward ..that is Ian Hill at the Giants .

Henry is an elite winger but can see him playing exactly like Jetta does at West Coast later in career.

Please tell me your fibbing a bit. Just behind Rowell/Anderson? That makes it a bit harder. I mean. I like him, but top 5???

 

[St Neil]

Ok boys and girls, I was just reading Rahul's twitter post where he questions why the Swans would be looking at Daniher when they already have two similar forwards in Buddy & young Blakey. Their cap is still apparently in tight spot, especially considering Buddy's last 2 years reportedly being $1m+.

It got me thinking about our predicament if Brucey heads west & we have a young tall forward who hasn't played a game, an undersized KPF and a ruckman suited to being a... well ruckman.

Would you do it?

Would you pull the trigger and bring Bud in for the last 2 years of his deal? Its another salary dump for Sydney that we could benefit enormously from, especially if we can tie him into the Zak Jones deal and get a bargain (pick wise, definitely not cap wise!).

Lets face it, even with Hill's mega-deal, we have oodles of space & $$ to spend. Do we spend it on Buddy, who can look after Minx and still do plenty of damage himself?

It's pretty tempting in my opinion... and maybe it's the missing piece in why Bruce is on the block and why Daniher seems Sydney bound.

His best mate Rough is already in the club so it wouldn't be the strangest thing...

Yes. Absolutely.

It will help our young develop lads, generate excitement, sell membership, make the club sexier to the media.

And possibly win us a few games. The only caveat is his body. Is he broken down?