Coach Chris Scott re-signs to 2022 (aka the Chris Scott discussion Part IV)

[Cattery]

I don't know if this was the reason in the finals but I was told in 2016 by someone employed by the club that the coaches and other defenders love the way Blicavs can play in the midfield and run back hard to help our defence. Blicavs in the middle effectively equals an extra defender.

Worked a treat Friday night, all that great work he did in defence very nearly got us over the line.

Blicavs in the middle effectively equals one less midfielder is another way of looking at it as well.

 

[Partridge]

Worked a treat Friday night, all that great work he did in defence very nearly got us over the line.

Blicavs in the middle effectively equals one less midfielder is another way of looking at it as well.

It wouldn't surprise me if that was the case. But I'd prefer the match committee look at how well he can actually play midfield first.

 

[Cattery]

It wouldn't surprise me if that was the case. But I'd prefer the match committee look at how well he can actually play midfield first.

What really staggers me is they play him in one position all year where he does so well he gets in the AA squad, then move him at the most vital part of the season into a position where he stinks.

Lose lose as I see it, missing a good defender and playing one midfielder short as well.

 

[Seeds]

Home and away games a year - 22
Finals 1-4

Anyone who says you overachieve for 22 games and show true form in the 1-4 finals is an idiot. Its the other way round. We are just massive chokers.

 

[STPer18]

Home and away games a year - 22
Finals 1-4

Anyone who says you overachieve for 22 games and show true form in the 1-4 finals is an idiot. Its the other way round. We are just massive chokers.

Four blokes making the AA22, six in the squad, the second and fourth most valuable players in the comp according to the coaches, and we're going to have two of the top five Brownlow placings tonight - it's not a convincing argument that our list is just bog average. We don't need a similar lineup to the 07-11 team, we've had the cattle to at least make a GF '13-'19, in my opinion of course.

 

[Seeds]

Four blokes making the AA22, six in the squad, the second and fourth most valuable players in the comp according to the coaches, and we're going to have two of the top five Brownlow placings tonight - it's not a convincing argument that our list is just bog average. We don't need a similar lineup to the 07-11 team, we've had the cattle to at least make a GF '13-'19, in my opinion of course.

We have one of the best lists in the comp and have for most of the past 7 years. We should of reached multiple grand finals with this list.

 

[ablett09]

None of this means anything

Many inferior sides have won pressure finals

Prime example Hawks in 2008 won the GF as the underdogs, oh GWS against the Pies is another.

Strange how we can overachieve all through the year but not in finals

Yes inferior sides can win finals, we've seen sides more inferior to their opponents win than we were to Richmond. However more often than not it does not happen and when it does its usually starts with the better side underperforming. Had we kicked straight in 08 we most likely win.

Are you suggesting Scott is a good coach during the season but loses all his coaching ability come finals ?

 

[ablett09]

Worked a treat Friday night, all that great work he did in defence very nearly got us over the line.

Blicavs in the middle effectively equals one less midfielder is another way of looking at it as well.

I was told this back at the start of 2016. Have no clue what the logic behind the move was last against Richmond.

If Scott had a bad coaching night we lose by 10 goals not 3. 3 goals is about the gap between the 2 sides. I would love to be in a GF but we simply have a side that's good but just short of being in the best 2. We have the 3rd-6th best side.

 

[ablett09]

We were both referencing the 2019 finals?

But I will concur that our finals record over the last 8 years makes poor reading.

I didn't say that. I said he f**ked up in week one, and decided to continue on with it in the hope people like yourself would respond just like that.

Tuohy and other players summed it up well. Supporters like me and everyone else on this board don't see the full picture with these decisions.

 

[Cattery]

If Scott had a bad coaching night we lose by 10 goals not 3.

Or looking at it from another angle, if Scott had a good coaching night we "may" be preparing for a GF next week.

Tuohy and other players summed it up well. Supporters like me and everyone else on this board don't see the full picture with these decisions.

Be nice then if they came out and explained the reasons behind what to a lot of people seemed like inexplicable decisions.

 

[maxy87]

Four blokes making the AA22, six in the squad, the second and fourth most valuable players in the comp according to the coaches, and we're going to have two of the top five Brownlow placings tonight - it's not a convincing argument that our list is just bog average. We don't need a similar lineup to the 07-11 team, we've had the cattle to at least make a GF '13-'19, in my opinion of course.

All this really indicates is that our list is structured like a pyramid. A small elite group at the top and a whole bunch of fairly limited or not yet mature players underneath.

 

[Crest]

Yes inferior sides can win finals, we've seen sides more inferior to their opponents win than we were to Richmond. However more often than not it does not happen and when it does its usually starts with the better side underperforming. Had we kicked straight in 08 we most likely win.

Are you suggesting Scott is a good coach during the season but loses all his coaching ability come finals ?

No

I'm implying that we have a great side that is capable of defeating a lot of sides without Scott's input, as demonstrated by his lack of moves

However a better coach would of taken this side to a GF

1st final cost us and that's on Scott, another coach couldn't have been as stupid not to play Stanley or another ruckman

 

[ablett09]

No

I'm implying that we have a great side that is capable of defeating a lot of sides without Scott's input, as demonstrated by his lack of moves

However a better coach would of taken this side to a GF

1st final cost us and that's on Scott, another coach couldn't have been as stupid not to play Stanley or another ruckman

Great ? You think this Geelong side is as good as our 07-11 side ?

I am a bit confused 1 minute Scott makes no moves the next minute his making awful moves that costs us games.

Mate when I get home I will go through all the deficiencies with our side.

 

[ablett09]

Or looking at it from another angle, if Scott had a good coaching night we "may" be preparing for a GF next week.



Be nice then if they came out and explained the reasons behind what to a lot of people seemed like inexplicable decisions.

If your like me and you think Richmond are about 3 goals better than us plus no Hawkins and Duncan you would say Scott coaches well.

Agree I would like to hear the reasons. The club could communicate better with the fans. Seems they are very protective with their inside knowledge.

 

[year of the cat]

Home and away games a year - 22
Finals 1-4

Anyone who says you overachieve for 22 games and show true form in the 1-4 finals is an idiot. Its the other way round. We are just massive chokers.

It's completely bizarre - even more so when you consider that Lynch really was the ideal match up for him! I could almost cop him not starting on him - after 2-3 goals my patience had been well and truly exhausted.

 

[feelinfeline]

Home and away games a year - 22
Finals 1-4

Anyone who says you overachieve for 22 games and show true form in the 1-4 finals is an idiot. Its the other way round. We are just massive chokers.

Some might argue we overachieved for 12 games and showed our true form from then on.

 

[STPer18]

Some might argue we overachieved for 12 games and showed our true form from then on.

When you look back a bit further though:

2014 finished 3rd on the ladder yet bundled out in straight sets by North Melbourne of all teams
2016 finished 2nd on the ladder, won at the death in the QF after Isaac Smith missed a regulation shot then absolutely pummeled by Sydney in the PF
2017 finished 2nd on the ladder, 51 point loss to Richmond, bounced back against the Swans then slaughtered by 10 goals against Adelaide in the PF
2019 finished 1st on the ladder of course, then the rest we know how that played out.

We can't have simply 'overachieved' in all those years during the H&A to finish so high up the ladder, only to crumble come finals. Over these four years, 88 H&A games played, 65 wins, 1 draw, 22 losses. That to me is a big enough sample to say we are a pretty good team, you don't put a record like that simply down to luck. Yet over those same years 10 finals played, 3 wins, 7 losses.

 

[feelinfeline]

When you look back a bit further though:

2014 finished 3rd on the ladder yet bundled out in straight sets by North Melbourne of all teams
2016 finished 2nd on the ladder, won at the death in the QF after Isaac Smith missed a regulation shot then absolutely pummeled by Sydney in the PF
2017 finished 2nd on the ladder, 51 point loss to Richmond, bounced back against the Swans then slaughtered by 10 goals against Adelaide in the PF
2019 finished 1st on the ladder of course, then the rest we know how that played out.

We can't have simply 'overachieved' in all those years during the H&A to finish so high up the ladder, only to crumble come finals. Over these four years, 88 H&A games played, 65 wins, 1 draw, 22 losses. That to me is a big enough sample to say we are a pretty good team, you don't put a record like that simply down to luck. Yet over those same years 10 finals played, 3 wins, 7 losses.

I agree. This season, though, I think it's pretty clear that we played very well for the first 12 weeks but at best inconsistently from then on, i.e. after the bye.

It's puzzling that we can suddenly lose form and confidence like that, and it does suggest a mental component. And obviously it's not a coincidence that this started after the bye.

 

[Boxhead_31]

I agree. This season, though, I think it's pretty clear that we played very well for the first 12 weeks but at best inconsistently from then on, i.e. after the bye.

It's puzzling that we can suddenly lose form and confidence like that, and it does suggest a mental component. And obviously it's not a coincidence that this started after the bye.

Suggest people go back and watch our first half of the season, then watch our season after the bye.

We changed our gameplan after the bye, we went from a fast free moving game plan to a measured safe option kick around the boundry line game plan.

 

[ablett09]

The main reason for blicavs not going to full back is scott is stubborn.He couldnt play him in the ruck again after the first final disaster but he didnt want to admit moving him away from full back was wrong so he didnt put him back there.

The second reason is scott loves defenders and wasnt willing to drop one of kolo or henry. So he didnt and moved some defenders up the field. Taylor, henderson, kolo, henry, touhy and blicavs have all spent finals in the past four years playing out of defence because scott cant fit all the defenders in defence but doesnt want to drop any of them.

In short what your saying is that Scott makes key decisions based on emotions rather than logic.

Can you explain how this has not been picked up by the best footy manager in the game Neil Balme, the best CEO in the game Brian Cook and the current operations manager for the AFL Stephen Hocking ?

 

[feelinfeline]

Suggest people go back and watch our first half of the season, then watch our season after the bye.

We changed our gameplan after the bye, we went from a fast free moving game plan to a measured safe option kick around the boundry line game plan.

That definitely played a part too.

 

[Geelong_Sicko]

I agree. This season, though, I think it's pretty clear that we played very well for the first 12 weeks but at best inconsistently from then on, i.e. after the bye.

It's puzzling that we can suddenly lose form and confidence like that, and it does suggest a mental component. And obviously it's not a coincidence that this started after the bye.

So does anyone actually KNOW what the team does during a bye? Do they go home to their families? Hit the piss? Banish thoughts of footy to the land of wind and ghosts?

 

[ablett09]

When you compare apples to apples Scott out performs Clarkson over the same period of time.

Clarkson came to Hawthorn in 05 when they had bottomed out and required a rebuild the same as Bomber with Geelong in 2000.

The Geelong side Bomber build would reach its prime from 07-11 while Clarkson Hawks would peak from 2012-2015.

So let's compare how Scott performed with a Geelong side past its best vs Clarksons Hawthorn side past its best.

Scott 7th, 3rd, 5th and 10th.
Clarkson 5th, 12th, 5th and 9th.

Scott 1 finals win.
Clarkson 0 finals wins.

Scott can coach.

 

[romeohwho]

We have one of the best lists in the comp and have for most of the past 7 years. We should of reached multiple grand finals with this list.

Our list looks better this year but our list has had plenty of deficiencies over the past 7 years. Or if we have had such a great list -does that still equate to making the GF every year?
Probably from 2005- 2011, we had just about the best list and have three flags to show for it, not 7 flags. They just don’t grow on trees. You have to be a bit realistic surely?

 

[Biggy_Boy]

Our list looks better this year but our list has had plenty of deficiencies over the past 7 years. Or if we have had such a great list -does that still equate to making the GF every year?
Probably from 2005- 2011, we had just about the best list and have three flags to show for it, not 7 flags. They just don’t grow on trees. You have to be a bit realistic surely?

No one said GF every year. You make top 2 four times and top 4 five times in a 7-year period, though, and it's probably fair to expect a couple of grand finals, particularly when all but one final during that period was played outside of Victoria.