List Mgmt. 2019 List Management: Contracts, Trading, Drafting, Academy

[Giant Strides]

Sorry to interrupt ...but our midfield is all the same ...180 - 182 cm one paced players ...no size

Greene is exactly the player we need .....or we gamble on Kemp

I'm guessing there's a chance we offer you some gambling $$$.

 

[WaynesWorld19]

I'm guessing there's a chance we offer you some gambling $$$.

Not sure why the Jacobs trade is taking so long ....would have thought #59 was on the money

Unless something else is brewing

 

[Giant Strides]

Not sure why the Jacobs trade is taking so long ....would have thought #59 was on the money

Unless something else is brewing

If there's another trade in the wind (with Adelaide for #4), I'd assume Jacobs would be thrown in. If we trade with Melbourne instead, then something like that will occur I'd guess.

 

[WaynesWorld19]

If there's another trade in the wind (with Adelaide for #4), I'd assume Jacobs would be thrown in. If we trade with Melbourne instead, then something like that will occur I'd guess.

Reid keeps saying in interviews, if we don't split #4 ....who knows ATM .....this trade pick swapping is getting very complicated

I can't see who we would trade #4 with

 

[Colonial]

 

[Giant Pete]

Trade period is a week too long imo. Instead of hanging out having your breakky televised... get to work!

 

[Callums_Guns]

Not sure why the Jacobs trade is taking so long ....would have thought #59 was on the money

Unless something else is brewing

I reckon Crows trying to trade for Hately, would be in their 22 straight away

 

[WaynesWorld19]

I reckon Crows trying to trade for Hately, would be in their 22 straight away

Yes our board seems keen on any Sth Aust player .....mostly it's just a Sth Aust bias & players rarely return ....for good reason, if you've been to ADEL

Club though seems more set on getting draft picks, than trading for players ....particularly given we have no coach

But if Matthew Nicks gets appointd ....that may change

 

[Callums_Guns]

Yes our board seems keen on any Sth Aust player .....mostly it's just a Sth Aust bias & players rarely return ....for good reason, if you've been to ADEL

Club though seems more set on getting draft picks, than trading for players ....particularly given we have no coach

But if Matthew Nicks gets appointd ....that may change

You would think the announcement would be Monday for Nick's. They couldnt do 2 press conferences in 1 day yesterday....lol
Mind you the review should have been wrapped up prior to the trade period starting

We have the options to work something out with both Melbourne and Adelaide
Going to be a interesting 3 days of trade period, especially the last hr.........

Next years draft is a weird 1 alot of father son and academy picks (most ever), i can see us moving 1 of our futures on which we haven't done yet

 

[WaynesWorld19]

You would think the announcement would be Monday for Nick's. They couldnt do 2 press conferences in 1 day yesterday....lol
Mind you the review should have been wrapped up prior to the trade period starting

We have the options to work something out with both Melbourne and Adelaide
Going to be a interesting 3 days of trade period, especially the last hr.........

Next years draft is a weird 1 alot of father son and academy picks (most ever), i can see us moving 1 of our futures on which we haven't done yet

Yes, they're saying this draft is not as good as last years ...but better than nxt years Draft, because it's so compromised

I'm gathering the Coaching announcement will be mid week, after trade period has finished

Not sure how you can advance your draft order ....unless it's #6 and a player ....you simply don't have the picks

What's the knock on Bonar ?

 

[Danny88]

Yes, they're saying this draft is not as good as last years ...but better than nxt years Draft, because it's so compromised

I'm gathering the Coaching announcement will be mid week, after trade period has finished

Not sure how you can advance your draft order ....unless it's #6 and a player ....you simply don't have the picks

What's the knock on Bonar ?

Had a brilliant first year. Has all the attributes of side speed and power, just hasn’t been consistent enough

We drafted a bunch of young guys last year which put him under pressure and they jumped him

I think we all rate him... but I also think we all acknowledge he might go for more opportunity

 

[Andre the Giant]

Yes, they're saying this draft is not as good as last years ...but better than nxt years Draft, because it's so compromised

I'm gathering the Coaching announcement will be mid week, after trade period has finished

Not sure how you can advance your draft order ....unless it's #6 and a player ....you simply don't have the picks

What's the knock on Bonar ?

He showed flashes in year 1 and regressed this year.

To me he looks like he has some nice assets (hard head, strong body). Maybe in a different team he could do better but frankly I’m a bit disappointed in him that he didn’t perform more consistently this year in NEAFL. With all our injuries it’s a poor indictment on him his inability to get a spot in the team and to fall behind first year players.

He doesn’t get a lot of the ball, goes missing and seems to have very limited hurt factor. Maybe his best chance is as a 3rd tall but I haven’t seen evidence he kicks many goals?

Perhaps he was a man child that dominated when he was against kids but is now being exposed? I’m happy to cut losses here, he is so far back in the pack it’s not funny.

 

[WaynesWorld19]

He showed flashes in year 1 and regressed this year.

To me he looks like he has some nice assets (hard head, strong body). Maybe in a different team he could do better but frankly I’m a bit disappointed in him that he didn’t perform more consistently this year in NEAFL. With all our injuries it’s a poor indictment on him his inability to get a spot in the team and to fall behind first year players.

He doesn’t get a lot of the ball, goes missing and seems to have very limited hurt factor. Maybe his best chance is as a 3rd tall but I haven’t seen evidence he kicks many goals?

Perhaps he was a man child that dominated when he was against kids but is now being exposed? I’m happy to cut losses here, he is so far back in the pack it’s not funny.

Bonar also had limited exposure at U18 level , due to injury .....but he has all the attributes physically ....we just don't know how mentally mature these kids are, or how motivated they are

 

[Giant Pete]

He showed flashes in year 1 and regressed this year.

To me he looks like he has some nice assets (hard head, strong body). Maybe in a different team he could do better but frankly I’m a bit disappointed in him that he didn’t perform more consistently this year in NEAFL. With all our injuries it’s a poor indictment on him his inability to get a spot in the team and to fall behind first year players.

He doesn’t get a lot of the ball, goes missing and seems to have very limited hurt factor. Maybe his best chance is as a 3rd tall but I haven’t seen evidence he kicks many goals?

Perhaps he was a man child that dominated when he was against kids but is now being exposed? I’m happy to cut losses here, he is so far back in the pack it’s not funny.

I’d like us to give him one more year with a good preseason.

 

[Giant Pete]

Has someone got a nice graphic which shows the spread of ages for our list?

 

[Giant Strides]

23​	Shaw, Heath	308​	33yr 10mth	27 Nov 1985	183cm​	86kg​	Northern Knights	Defender
41​	Mumford, Shane R	192​	33yr 3mth	5 Jul 1986	197cm​	105kg​	Geelong	Ruck
7​	Deledio, Brett	275​	32yr 5mth	18 Apr 1987	188cm​	88kg​	Murray Bushrangers	Midfield Forward
26​	Simpson, Dawson	48​	30yr 7mth	17 Feb 1989	210cm​	109kg​	Murray Bushrangers	Ruck
50​	Reid, Samuel R	90​	29yr 11mth	7 Nov 1989	188cm​	85kg​	Uws Giants	Defender Forward
24​	De Boer, Matthew	187​	29yr 7mth	10 Mar 1990	189cm​	86kg​	Claremont	Forward
8​	Ward, Callan	217​	29yr 6mth	10 Apr 1990	187cm​	84kg​	Western Jets	Midfield
25​	Keeffe, Lachlan	58​	29yr 5mth	14 Apr 1990	204cm​	102kg​	Queensland Under 18s	Defender
1​	Davis, Phil	166​	29yr 1mth	30 Aug 1990	197cm​	96kg​	North Adelaide	Defender
38​	Lloyd, Daniel	39​	27yr 7mth	18 Feb 1992	187cm​	86kg​	Killarney Vale	Forward
19​	Haynes, Nick	128​	27yr 4mth	18 May 1992	193cm​	89kg​	Dandenong Stingrays	Defender
40​	Kennedy, Adam	115​	27yr 2mth	12 Jul 1992	182cm​	80kg​	Western Jets	Defender
43​	Buckley, Dylan R	41​	26yr 6mth	16 Mar 1993	179cm​	75kg​	Northern Knights	Forward
18​	Cameron, Jeremy	154​	26yr 6mth	1 Apr 1993	196cm​	96kg​	Dartmore	Forward
12​	Patton, Jonathon	89​	26yr 4mth	20 May 1993	198cm​	101kg​	Eastern Ranges	Forward Ruck
20​	Tomlinson, Adam	140​	26yr 2mth	10 Aug 1993	194cm​	96kg​	Oakleigh Chargers	Midfield
4​	Greene, Toby	145​	26yr	25 Sep 1993	182cm​	83kg​	Oakleigh Chargers	Forward
21​	Buntine, Matthew	59​	25yr 11mth	19 Oct 1993	189cm​	84kg​	Dandenong Stingrays	Defender
11​	Sheridan, Thomas	82​	25yr 11mth	28 Oct 1993	187cm​	82kg​	Calder Cannons	Midfield
3​	Coniglio, Stephen	133​	25yr 9mth	15 Dec 1993	182cm​	86kg​	Swan Districts	Midfield
42​	Stein, Jake R	5​	25yr 8mth	17 Jan 1994	195cm​	94kg​	Penrith	Defender
35​	Corr, Aidan	83​	25yr 4mth	17 May 1994	195cm​	95kg​	Northern Knights	Defender
6​	Whitfield, Lachie	133​	25yr 2mth	18 Jul 1994	187cm​	81kg​	Dandenong Stingrays	Defender Midfield
29​	Williams, Zachary	102​	25yr	20 Sep 1994	185cm​	84kg​	Narrandera	Defender
22​	Kelly, Joshua	118​	24yr 7mth	12 Feb 1995	184cm​	82kg​	Sandringham Dragons	Midfield
17​	Langdon, Zac	24​	23yr 10mth	13 Nov 1995	177cm​	80kg​	Claremont	Forward
31​	Finlayson, Jeremy	38​	23yr 8mth	9 Feb 1996	196cm​	92kg​	Hills Eagles	Defender Forward
27​	Himmelberg, Harrison	65​	23yr 5mth	8 May 1996	194cm​	92kg​	Mangoplah Cookardinia United Eastlakes	Forward
2​	Hopper, Jacob	67​	22yr 8mth	6 Feb 1997	187cm​	87kg​	North Ballarat Rebels	Midfield
30​	Flynn, Matthew	0​	22yr	13 Sep 1997	200cm​	102kg​	Narrandera	Ruck
44​	Buckley, Jack R	0​	21yr 9mth	17 Dec 1997	193cm​	85kg​	Swans Academy	Midfield Forward
14​	Taranto, Tim	63​	21yr 8mth	28 Jan 1998	187cm​	87kg​	Sandringham Dragons	Midfield
28​	Sproule, Zachary R	1​	21yr 4mth	12 May 1998	197cm​	92kg​	Albury	Midfield Forward
13​	Cumming, Isaac	7​	21yr 2mth	11 Aug 1998	184cm​	80kg​	Broken Hill	Defender
36​	Perryman, Harry	36​	20yr 9mth	19 Dec 1998	184cm​	80kg​	Collingullie	Defender
10​	Bonar, Aiden	6​	20yr 7mth	8 Mar 1999	188cm​	86kg​	Dandenong Stingrays	Midfield Forward
16​	Daniels, Brent	33​	20yr 7mth	9 Mar 1999	170cm​	72kg​	Bendigo Pioneers	Forward
15​	Taylor, Sam	30​	20yr 5mth	5 May 1999	196cm​	87kg​	Swan Districts	Defender
34​	Shipley, Nicholas	2​	20yr 3mth	25 Jun 1999	188cm​	95kg​	Gws Academy	Midfield
32​	Briggs, Kieren	0​	20yr	6 Oct 1999	199cm​	101kg​	Pennant Hills	Ruck
37​	Hill, Ian	8​	19yr 8mth	9 Feb 2000	175cm​	75kg​	Perth	Midfield Forward
33​	O'Halloran, Xavier	0​	19yr 3mth	11 Jul 2000	186cm​	84kg​	Western Jets	Midfield
39​	Idun, Connor	1​	19yr 2mth	29 Jul 2000	190cm​	92kg​	Geelong Falcons	Defender Forward
46​	Brown, Callum R	0​	19yr 1mth	15 Aug 2000	189cm​	91kg​	County Derry	Defender
5​	Caldwell, Jye	2​	19yr	28 Sep 2000	184cm​	80kg​	Bendigo Pioneers	Midfield
9​	Hately, Jackson	7​	18yr 11mth	21 Oct 2000	190cm​	82kg​	Central District	Midfield

GWS Giants Football Club Player List

GWS Giants full AFL playing list and stats.

www.footywire.com

 

[Giant Strides]

Breaking that down into age groups, we have (simply based on current age & current squad):
18-21: 16 players
22-25: 13 players
26-29: 13 players (-2 for Tommo & General's departures)
30 & over: 4 players (-2 for Lids & Dawson's retirements)

 

[Giant Strides]

OK, so in my view, pick 6 is in no-man's-land for us. If a bid for Tom Green comes in at #3, 4 or 5 then we either match with #6 or don't match and lose him. If we'd kept 12 & 18, matching a bid at #3 would have pushed our second pick back to #38, and if it came at #5 the second bid would have been #26 - so we're worse off in terms of our second pick after moving up. Of course, with our original selections, with 11 other picks before ours there was a large (I'd say 100%!) chance that someone would bid on Green, so we are better off in that we've increased our chances of getting both he and someone else - but still as it currently stands there's a significant risk of having to match for Green and our second pick is sure to be #40 (below any likely result if we'd held #12 & #18).

So, I conclude that it's one of about 3 things:

1. Our team is stupid and can't work this out. Unlikely. 1a. Accepting risk & chancing our arm. Possible.

2. We're not going to bid on Green. Let's face it, he's not exactly what we need this year, so it could be a giant bluff to get a club ahead to take Green. With Rowell and Anderson certain to go at 1 & 2, taking Green (if we don't think he's a list match for us) simply frees up someone we do want, to still be there at #6. The converse is, if Green proves to be what he's described as - another Cripps or Josh P Kennedy - then we'll have egg on our face for having him in our grasp and not selecting him. Possible.

3. We are still planning to move up to #3 or 4, where I think we need to be to get ahead of a bid. Melbourne may not want Green, because also for them he's a terrible list fit, but that doesn't stop them blackmailing us by threatening to bid unless we pay them a bounty (which is what I don't like about this system) or more likely they sell it to another club (such as Geelong, for mutiple first round picks) who would select Green. While I think Adelaide would be also more suited to a running midfielder, I think they'd bid for Green because he's probably what they'd want in the next 1 to 2 years anyway, and they have a history of bidding early on GWS Academy kids.

Our current later picks (#40, 59, 60) are not enough points to pay for a Green if we do get ahead of a bid; nor even if we get Patton for Hawk's #42 (which I'm sure they don't want to give because they need to pay for Finn Maginniss), so I'd also conclude that GWS are going to put either next year's first round pick or a player on the table. I can't see Bonar being enough - we've mentioned wanting him for around/inside #30, but I'm not sure any club will pay that (and in which case we also have the problem of more picks than list spots available so we can't use them all anyway). He could be used to enable a move earlier from #6 - but that means Melbourne or Adelaide would have to want him, and he wouldn't get full value. So, while it's possible, I think we might end up with someone else on the table.

I hate to say it but someone like Caldwell to Melbourne or Hately to Adelaide seem like possibilities in my mid. Or next year's first rounder as I previously mentioned. Example trades would be:

GWS #6 + Bonar for Melbourne #3 + #50 (2507 points, rates Bonar at 756 points or pick #25). Gives GWS #6, #40, #50, #59, #60 plus the pick for Patton (#42 or #61). Even with the Hawks' pick #42 we are 226 points low on matching Green - which would come off our first round pick next year. We also have the issue of not enough free list spots to carry all of those picks, so we may try to consolidate in that case. All-in-all, not a great scenario for us.

GWS #6 & 2020 1st Round for Melbourne #3 and 2020 2nd round (but may need GWS 1st and third round, or only 3rd round back given the potential finishing places in 2020). The potential that we get screwed is large, because Melbourne will play the view that GWS will finish high and Melbourne low as per this year, but in all likelihood we'll be lower and them higher than in 2019.

GWS #6, #59, #60 & Jackson Hately (total 2055 points) for Adelaide #4, #23 & Sam Jacobs (total 2849 points, values Hately roughly as pick 19 so a bargain for Crows). That would leave GWS with #4 (and hoping that Melbourne or if someone buys #3 they don't bid on Green), #23, #40 and the Patton trade (#42 or #61). #42 from Hawks would leave us with pick #61 for a third selection, while getting #61 from Hawks instead would leaves us in deficit for 2020. (We may also play off the last pick to Hawks rather than Crows to ensure we get #42.) The benefit of this is that Crows would get a player with 12 months and several AFL games to help replace their losses, plus a couple of draft picks given they need to go to the draft big time. We lose some later draft picks and consolidate in fewer picks early, meaning our few open spots aren't an issue. (If we take Jacobs in this scenario but lose a player, we stay on 35 list spots used and therefore 5 picks available. We could even then upgrade a rookie and still take 3 draftees for 39 list spots.)

I'm not proposing this, just noting some of the possibilities that I see.

Thoughts, comments?

 

[Andre the Giant]

I think Melbourne love Hayden Young and want to take him. I feel for us to trade up we either do that very late on Wednesday when all the possible machinations are known or on draft night again when it’s known which players are going where. Melbourne won’t bid on Green but Adelaide and Sydney will. If we want this player we will have to accept losing on the deal....initially.

 

[Determinant]

Great post mate, unfortunately I think that latter is most likely.. If so Green better be worth it given the similarities in the two players

 

[Giant Strides]

Yes, I did mean to mention that I suspect we'll aim to hold off as long as possible and see which way the wind is blowing on other trades. Probably having discussions with each of Melbourne and Adelaide to see what they would want and take. Getting Patton's trade done as well would clarify. We are probably looking at how best to trade for Jacobs - is a separate trade better or include him in the job lot? Obviously, if we wait until the pick only trading period to do any swapping around, we've gone past the time limit to include Jacobs - so I think there's a lot of balancing options and machinations for us.

If Melbourne are keen on Young (and I would be if I was them!) then Lachie Ash seems likely for us - again, no issues with that.

 

[Giant Pete]

I think Melbourne love Hayden Young and want to take him. I feel for us to trade up we either do that very late on Wednesday when all the possible machinations are known or on draft night again when it’s known which players are going where. Melbourne won’t bid on Green but Adelaide and Sydney will. If we want this player we will have to accept losing on the deal....initially.

We’ll be fine. Our team know exactly what they are doing.

 

[bossman111]

Trade Radio: Hold up on Patton is haggling over 3rd or 4th round pick

We need the points but also need his salary ($700k) off the books

 

[Danny88]

Trade Radio: Hold up on Patton is haggling over 3rd or 4th round pick

We need the points but also need his salary ($700k) off the books

But they wont be absorbing that money... my understanding is that he is forgoing the last year of his contract to sign a new contract at less money.

We should push to get the 3rd rounder

 

[Danny88]

Seems we have dropped off our interest in Murray... mind you that is understandable if we are panning on trading up to a player like ash or young