Bluemour Melting Pot XXI - Like seriously, the polar ice caps have got nothing on us

[mochacinolatte]

 

[Blue__Balls]

There's probably a position somewhere between taking up pitchforks and gulping down the Kool-Aid, don't you think, folks?

Not many gulping Kool-aid.

At the moment it's pitchforks because we "failed" and ridicule of the pitchforks because we just made a small step in the right direction rather than a jump. Improvement is improvement, some are just greedy.

 

[Fat Kent]

Perhaps it’s just as well we‘ve retained our primary picks for next year. I have a feeling Wines may be in play.

I wouldn't be surprised if we trade pick 9 for a future first as well to increase our bargaining power.

 

[Blue__Balls]

In fairness, I haven’t read anywhere that we offered 9 on its own for Paps. Everything was with a second coming back. It’s entirely possible that SOS out a price and didn’t go above it.

I would be disappointed if we didn’t offer 9 on its own.

Sydney.

Were.

Offering.

Pick.

Nine.

To.

Essendon.

Clear indication that whatever we'd lined up for Papley was acceptable to them provided it would secure Daniher.

 

[FairKouta]

They won't end it, but they won't be helping propell us to anything more than mid table mediocrity either.

tbh getting papely and martin was not going to make us a top 4 team

 

[slowhand clape]

What happens if we miss on Martin ?

There’ll be a very calm and measured response on here

 

[Opine]

I wouldn't be surprised if we trade pick 9 for a future first as well to increase our bargaining power.

Hmm, I didn’t think of that.

 

[Blue__Balls]

Has there been correspondence from the club that we actually will draft a small forward at 9 ?.
I suspect we'll be going for another mid .

Depends who is available, is my assumption.

There are a few thereabouts (Serong, Flanders) who would probably start in a pocket.

There are a few slightly deeper (Weightman, Taylor) who are genuine small forwards if we want to try trading down.

If the club determines we need another dedicated small (which I'm assuming they will), we have options. Probably wait til Pick 9, see who's there, and if it's a flanker or tall we look to flip 9 for two later picks.

 

[Styxx]

Remember the time Terry Daniher lost his mind in the 1990 Grand Final and knocked Brown and Starcevich out?

Adrian Dodoro clearly doesn't.

 

[rampar]

Who supposedly don't have as much room in their cap as we do.

is it too late to make room through delistings etc?

 

[Robertio]

Nope, but we don't blow smoke up their arse for doing a fantastic job during the trade period.

We had a plan A, seem devoid of a plan B or C.

I think plan B for Martin would have been to get him in the pre season draft.

 

[Mr_Plow]

a person inside the club has told me that Gold Coast are unlikely to pick up Martin in draft. They just wanted to send a message that they are going to be a hard negotiating team in the future. Not sure if Melbourne are interested in picking him up.

I suspect this is actually the case.

Under AFL instruction to act like tough mother****ers for the first time in their existence.

A necessary change, but yet again, AFL intervention happens at the expense of Carlton, never the other clubs.

 

[Lukeblueboy]

All good get Martin in psd, give Bennell and Murray a life line and we’re flying. Massive upside if this came off imo

 

[Iamcarlton]

Butler played 7 games this year
Taylor played 5.

They are both nothing players.

Im not a huge fan of either but I think your underselling their talents both are in top 4 sides Butler in particular the premiers with a plethora of small forwards .
Given our lack of quality in the area they play Imo at least one of them would have added something to our list .
I dont think they are list cloggers rather players seeking more opportunity .

 

[Garters]

With Betts playing Small Forward I reckon Gibbons could have a fair go at the other Wing as well.

Can't argue with this. I liked Gibbons last year. Whether in the guts or out wide, having a full pre season under his belt and now used to the tempo, well positioned for a big uptick in output

 

[Funk]

Funk my view:

Both clubs included next year’s Carlton second in their trades. We included a third Vs their 6 pick downgrade. On points the difference in offers is non existent.

Therefore I don’t think any characterisation of GC offer as ‘unreasonable’ compared to ours is fair. They left us a first rounder and were giving us Martin. May not have been our preference but I think the cold light of day will show it’s ridiculous these two clubs couldn’t sort that after 2 weeks. Truly ridiculous.

How about we swapped next year’s our first with their 11 and throw in a second rounder? How about their trade and swap thirds back in our favour to sweeten? How about work with them over the two weeks to move up the 15 slightly with another club?

It’s just not good work by either club to have gotten this close and not sorted it.

Fair points.

However as Paul Connors made clear in the last week “there is a big difference between contracted and out of contract players”.

When a player is in contract - the club has the power.

Out of contract - the player has the power “due to possibility of PSD and other mechanisms”.

GCS can make whatever demands they want with Martin - but if he doesn’t want to play there then there are other options for a manager to get him to his club of choice (and GCS get nothing).

Plenty of water still to go under the bridge.

Need to let this play out before judgements are made.

 

[Arr0w]

You don't reach for a small forward, or any other type at pick 9 in the draft, you draft best available

 

[bigm386]

Goldcoast to me are disgusting. Easy to play hardball and lose players for free when you are gifted everything from the AFL. More amateur administration. Stand up to Carlton but gift players to your cross town rivals. Makes sense.

 

[Gethelred]

I suspect Papley and Martin will both be sharing the blame around liberally, and with justification, especially in Martin's case.

And Cameron's final offer was not massive overs... It was slight overs, like what West Coast paid for an uncontracted Kelly, because they get it.

You think what WC paid for Kelly was slight overs?

 

[Funk]

No no, did not intend to imply equivalence of Martin and Kelly as players. Just saying that in some cases, thee is merit in paying (in my view) slight overs for an UNcontracted player, and Kelly is the only real analogue in this trade period.

In my view, Martin for a future second and a downgrade from 9 to 15 this year, was not an unreasonable offer, especially when the Suns had the option of walking away from the deal completely, thanks to their AFL package. West Coast paid slightly more than pick 1 for Kelly, but we couldn't pay slightly more than a future second for Martin. I guess the "slightly more" could be quantified as the points difference between 9 and 15 (in a draft we have never cared about anyway!).

Obviously there is a diversity of views. But I disagree with the idea that "Martin free in PSD = all good", because the industry is built on relationships.

Industry consensus seemed to be that Martin was only worth a R2 Pick.

If true then Martin outcome is more likely to reflect more poorly on GCS than Blues.

 

[Stamos]

SOS should have been the one setting the agenda instead of cowtailing to other clubs ******* about.

Should have came out and said if Essendon/Sydney didn't have a deal ready by midday #9 was off the table and he was moving on to other possibilities.

Seriously, what would that have achieved?
We would be in exactly the same position, except SOS would have looked pig headed unnecessarily.

 

[ESKIE]

Glad some of you aren’t negotiating anything for me...

 

[Blue__Balls]

You don't reach for a small forward, or any other type at pick 9 in the draft, you draft best available

At risk of opening a can of worms, if the player you rate at 9 is a mid, and the player you rate at 10 or 11 is a small forward, and you reeeeallly need a small forward - it's not really a reach.

Wouldn't take Weightman at 9, but if Flanders or Serong are on the board I think you take them.

 

[james Dean]

So what did we ended up trading to bring in Holman?

 

[Heres Waite]

Im not a huge fan of either but I think your underselling their talents both are in top 4 sides Butler in particular the premiers with a plethora of small forwards .
Given our lack of quality in the area they play Imo at least one of them would have added something to our list .
I dont think they are list cloggers rather players seeking more opportunity .

People are making out that not getting them is a massive failure. I’m just pointing out that neither player is moving the needle for us.