Stopping the Tigers 2020

[Grrr]

This is a thread asking for a blueprint to beat the tigers, you are the worst clearance team in the comp bar none that is a fact. If you are going to try and beat the tigers this is the area most teams are going to focus on, doing something with that clearance dominance. Rance is gone so we can forget he existed, wasn't like he was there last year anyway. Grimes fills that role now and I reckon teams should almost tag him out of the game and keep him to 0 intercept marks.

Don't get your knickers in a knot every time someone picks on a part of your team, that is the idea of the thread.

The worst clearance team does not make a shithouse midfield. It's not about getting my knickers in a knot, it's about making simplistic statements. We may be the worse clearance team but I would bet we are about the best in the business at counterattacking.
Example. A couple of years ago we played Sandilands to Fyfe. You could do nothing about stopping Fyfe getting the ball, he is that good. So we let him get it and then gang tackled him when he did. He inevitably did not then use the ball well, and when he turned it over we torched them.

There are not many Fyfe's going around. Neale got 55 possessions against us, but by and large they were ineffectual. Prestia waited on the lose ball and pounced and was easily the most influential player on the ground. But everyone talked about Neal because of the numbers. Edwards forward handball was 2x the distance of the next best mid in 2018. In other words, he got the ball and sent it into attack just about every time he got it. He is the best user of the ball at Richmond by some way. He is one of the league in goal assists players every year. Jack Graham is not much of a midfielder, but his pressure is manic and he never stops. He rarely gets first tough but he causes sides to turn the ball over. Even in the Prelim. with a dislocated shoulder and spending a fair bit of time on the bench, he was still topped the pressure acts for the game.
You don't win Premierships with a shithouse midfield and a good backline.

 

[nineteen eighty]

Couldn't have said it better myself, hot tip anyone who wants to bring up age is usually 13-17 when you get older you want to forget all about it.

grow up child.

In case you weren’t aware, my original post is one above yours. In its full.

 

[Tenny]

This is a thread asking for a blueprint to beat the tigers, you are the worst clearance team in the comp bar none that is a fact. If you are going to try and beat the tigers this is the area most teams are going to focus on, doing something with that clearance dominance. Rance is gone so we can forget he existed, wasn't like he was there last year anyway. Grimes fills that role now and I reckon teams should almost tag him out of the game and keep him to 0 intercept marks.

Don't get your knickers in a knot every time someone picks on a part of your team, that is the idea of the thread.

Wait. If dominating clearances is the key to beating Richmond, then how come no one could beat us after the bye, despite Richmond being dominated in clearances?

 

[Senor M]

This is a thread asking for a blueprint to beat the tigers, you are the worst clearance team in the comp bar none that is a fact. If you are going to try and beat the tigers this is the area most teams are going to focus on, doing something with that clearance dominance.

As Richmond are the worst clearance team in the competition in 2019– yet still win the premiership; wouldn’t it show that focusing on clearances isn’t effective in beating the Tigers??

 

[Tenny]

I really hate repeating myself, I said the key to beating them is to convert that clearance dominance into scores.

Learn to read or leave me alone.

So the key to beating Richmond is to score more. Got it.

 

[Senor M]

So the key to beating Richmond is to score more. Got it.

I think that’s the part of the game plan Ross Lyon never figured out....

 

[Tenny]

How good is the rest of our team if our midfield is s**t

 

[Grrr]

You must have missed what I said

Clearly you are very good at negating opposition mids from causing too much damage otherwise you wouldn't have won 2 flags with a midfield that can't win its own ball, clearly my point was in order to beat you teams need to get better at converting that domination onto the scoreboard which no one is doing right now but it is how the tigers will get beaten.

Understand the point of the thread and the context behind what you are responding to, you win a flag and you still cry like it's the end of the world honestly.

The point is clearance do not mean much unless you have good uses of the ball. Pendelbury types hurt because they use the ball well, Neale types do not. Neale gets a lot more ball than Pendlebury, but is half the player. So yes if you can get a few Pendelbury's in your side you will trouble us. But then you'd probably be the side winning GF's. But Prestia, Edwards, Cotchin, Martin rarely waste a possession either.

 

[Forward Press]

Clearance numbers don't matter that much. Obviously better to win them than not but there are plenty of ways to win games and flags. The Eagles of 2018 consistently conceded clearances to the opposition, think we had some of the worst clearance differentials of a premiership side in modern AFL history.

 

[Tenny]

Well you haven’t really offered any riveting insight. You’ve just said a midfield comprising two Brownlow medalists and a current BNF winner is “s**t”. Then you’ve gone on to state the obvious that if sides can convert more they will beat us.

 

[Wallaby]

As Richmond are the worst clearance team in the competition in 2019– yet still win the premiership; wouldn’t it show that focusing on clearances isn’t effective in beating the Tigers??

I think clearance statistics (as recorded in the AFL) is not a significant statistic at all.

Richmond were the worst clearance team in the competition - only winning the clearance count in 5 out of 25 games.
Geelong finished on top (level with Richmond) - won 11 clearance counts and lost 12. In their 3 finals, they won the clearances in both games they lost, and drew in the final they won.
Brisbane finished 2nd (equal with Geelong and Richmond) - and won 13 clearance counts out of 24. OK - pretty good, right? They won the clearances in their last 3 games (Rd 23 and finals) - and lost all 3 games.
Collingwood finished 4th, and won 9 out of 24 clearance counts.
The team that won the clearances in the highest % of their games was Port Adelaide. Adelaide was 2nd.

In 2018, Richmond were even more dominant through the season (up to the PF) and their clearance stats were even worse than 2019.

Clearances are a rather useless stat in assessing who is winning the game. There is basically no correlation.

 

[A Bit Dusty]

Clearance numbers don't matter that much. Obviously better to win them than not but there are plenty of ways to win games and flags. The Eagles of 2018 consistently conceded clearances to the opposition, think we had some of the worst clearance differentials of a premiership side in modern AFL history.

Nobody cares about what West coast did in 2018

 

[nick1408]

This is a thread asking for a blueprint to beat the tigers, you are the worst clearance team in the comp bar none that is a fact. If you are going to try and beat the tigers this is the area most teams are going to focus on, doing something with that clearance dominance. Rance is gone so we can forget he existed, wasn't like he was there last year anyway. Grimes fills that role now and I reckon teams should almost tag him out of the game and keep him to 0 intercept marks.

....

I really only wanted to discuss the clearance point you raised but I think there is something about the backline you may have hit upon, although I don't agree entirely. Richmond finished 18th in clearances and won a Grand Final. Clearly this is not the way to stop Richmond because every club was able to do that. Clearances weren't a big deal to Richmond's gameplan, it was the secondary ball after the clearance.

My feeling is to concentrate on shutting down Houli and the like running the ball out of the backline. If they are allowed to do as they like it makes it too easy for Richmond to slingshot.

6-6-6 was supposed to be the end of Richmond and clearly that didn't work. Teams didn't capitalise on Richmond having less players behind the ball. This is a pretty basic look at the Richmond ball movement though. In 2019 Richmond had three different game plans - pre-bye, post-bye and finals. Finals is the easy one to look at - two rucks, two key forwards and a fairly solid defence. More or less a 'traditional' setup. Pre-bye was a hybrid of the 2017/18 gameplan tailored to cover the loss of key players (Riewoldt, Rance, Cotchin, Caddy, Lambert, Nankervis etc), post-bye when players came back was a hybrid of pre-bye and 2017/18. One thing that didn't change in the gameplans was the backline. While Rance was gone and Astbury was missing at times. The only time it really changed was agains the dogs when Grimes was the only key back. Personnel certainly changed but the backline operated more or less the same. Here is where I feel Richmond can be exploited through familiarity.

The forward line and midfield both adapted so may be a bit harder to exploit immediately but you know what you are going to get with the backline. It isn't Grimes to target either - he is going to do what he does. Nor Astbury. It's Houli, Broad and Baker. Houli mostly as he is the playmaker off the backline. I'd start with running a player with Houli (and maybe Baker) and force Broad to be the playmaker and adjust from there.

 

[Tiger71]

Cotchin is near retirement and Martin isn't a full time midfielder, Prestia was their only mid inside the top 35 clearance players which is why they were 18th for clearances last year.

Richmond's strength has always been in its ability to stop teams scoring and getting the ball back not dominating out of the middle.

Wow you have no idea lol.

Our midfield is setup to our game structures. It's not about just center clearance, I could explain it but judging by your attitude it wont be worth it

 

[Robertio]

That's what he said, if you can convert the clearance to a score. Stop trying to be a smart arse and read other peoples posts even if you don't understand them.

 

[strongandbold12]

We let the opposition get the ball first and just hope they fu** up because it's a part of our structure, said no one ever.

hes just saying that richmond's gameplan doesnt hinge on winning the clearances. Its just a bonus if we do. thats it. R U OK?

 

[Tenny]

Every team in the league has a bnf midfielder, if this is the logic I am to argue against I am out.

You don’t rate Prestia? Coaches rated him the in the top twenty players for the season. Equal 13th to be exact. Best and Fairest in a premiership year. Robbo had him as the 8th best player in the league at the end of the season.

 

[Tenny]

We let the opposition get the ball first and just hope they fu** up because it's a part of our structure, said no one ever.

18th in the league for scoring from stoppages and 1st in the league for scoring from turnovers probably suggests we’re not overly concerned about clearances.

 

[nineteen eighty]

So the key to beating Richmond is to score more. Got it.

He's a genius isn't he?! Feckin mastermind.

 

[strongandbold12]

I said every single team in the comp will have a BNF midfielder, I said nothing about Prestia.

You basically highlight the point I am trying to make, opponents beat you out of the middle and waste the ball going forward and you score grandma goals over the top. If teams want to beat the tigers they need to stop wasting those clearance balls.

"grandma goals" Get this dude a analyst spot. This guy is changing the way we analyze footy. A prodigy unveiling before our very eyes. Incredible.

 

[Tenny]

I said every single team in the comp will have a BNF midfielder, I said nothing about Prestia.

And they’re all very good players, so I don’t know where you were going with it.

You basically highlight the point I am trying to make, opponents beat you out of the middle and waste the ball going forward and you score grandma goals over the top. If teams want to beat the tigers they need to stop wasting those clearance balls.

Fair enough.

 

[Grrr]

We let the opposition get the ball first and just hope they fu** up because it's a part of our structure, said no one ever.

Pretty sure that's exactly what I said in regard to my Sandilands to Fyfe post.

 

[Robertio]

He's a genius isn't he?! Feckin mastermind.

Read the thread title, if you are offended that someone is coming up with something right or wrong, see if you can get the mods to make it Richmond supporters only. Then you all can agree.

 

[Grrr]

Read the thread title, if you are offended that someone is coming up with something right or wrong, see if you can get the mods to make it Richmond supporters only. Then you all can agree.

Yes but you need to make an argument that is based on evidence. Not just quote a stat that has shown to not mean much, see Wallaby's post at 3:42pm.

 

[Grrr]

So you don't get it then

Get what. You have an pretty thing point.