Player Watch #44 Sydney Stack

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_RT_ said:
Stack gained more metres in games played as a forward than he did as a defender. Today he gained 205m coming off HB, Short gained 545m & Baker gained 346m off the wing. As I said earlier Stack needs to become more of an attacking weapon from HB to play the role that we want our rebounding defenders to play.
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He needs to model his game on Bachar .

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_RT_ said:
Stack gained more metres in games played as a forward than he did as a defender. Today he gained 205m coming off HB, Short gained 545m & Baker gained 346m off the wing. As I said earlier Stack needs to become more of an attacking weapon from HB to play the role that we want our rebounding defenders to play.
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Richmond lost the two games and copped a lot of goals

Short will play r1, how long he is in the best team we will see

id back Stack to win the race long term assuming they are going for similar spots
 
furthermore you have to look at the content of the 500 m gained

the five bounces , long kick (bad kick made look good by boltons brilliance) play the zone simply shuffles across the ground

a short sharp kick in the middle might open things up more than the conservative option

Vassp said:
- George......appart from one great goal I’ll bite my tongue.
+ Rioli..... had a great first half, best ive seen him play in ages.
+ stack....was impressive- should be playing forward.
+ pickett....was good.
+ cotchin.....was good.
-+Tom.....took a half to find himself but was great when he did.
- Jack.....looked out of sorts.
+Dusty.....was pretty good as usual.
-+Short......too short for backline. But does get high metres gained.
+ caddy.....was good.

the rest l cannot remember.

Third quarter we looked very disjointed.

our game plan works when all our players are covering ground, filling holes and then smashing teams into submission with our high intensity.
we only did this for a quarter of footy today.
no excuses....we tried to win but we didn’t.
which is a good thing because to win another cup this year we need to improve.
we need at least 3 players coming through the twos.
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Marcel Proust said:
Richmond lost the two games and copped a lot of goals

Short will play r1, how long he is in the best team we will see

id back Stack to win the race long term assuming they are going for similar spots
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We lost the 2 games but played about 2 real quarters of footy out of 8.

As someone else mentioned earlier Stack could be the long term replacement for Houli given he is close to the end of his career.
 
_RT_ said:
We lost the 2 games but played about 2 real quarters of footy out of 8.

As someone else mentioned earlier Stack could be the long term replacement for Houli given he is close to the end of his career.
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what matters is tigers lost twice and copped many goals

short is not only arguably the weak point of the back 6 but the team. feel free to pick a player and argue otherwise

the main bit of defending is the defensive bit an not shorts strong point. he is often exploited and targeted by the oppo - Cogs being simply too good for short yet another example. Baker and Short (and Stack) down there looks a bit dodgy for mine

Stack to me offers more in the 'lock down' capabilities and has more grunt. Even if like short, back line is not natural to them
 
Marcel Proust said:
what matters is tigers lost twice and copped many goals

short is not only arguably the weak point of the back 6 but the team. feel free to pick a player and argue otherwise

the main bit of defending is the defensive bit an not shorts strong point. he is often exploited and targeted by the oppo - Cogs being simply too good for short yet another example. Baker and Short (and Stack) down there looks a bit dodgy for mine

Stack to me offers more in the 'lock down' capabilities and has more grunt. Even if like short, back line is not natural to them
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Losing twice and copping many goals doesn't mean s**t, it's the preseason, all we were looking at getting out of the games was miles in the legs as we build into the season proper which is where things really matter. As I said we played about 2 quarters of footy where we ramped things up to somewhere near our normal level of pressure and when we did we were able to dominate both the Pies & Giants during those times. The rest of the time we ran around playing bruise free footy.

Shorts game isn't to be a defensive stopper, that's the role of guys like Grimes Vlastuin Astbury Broad in our defensive structure, Shorts game, along with Baker & Houil, is to launch quick counter attacks that doesn't give the opposition time to then get back and set up their defensive structures. He does that role better than anyone else in our side, outside Houli at his best.

As I've said a number of times now, if Stack can add the attacking rebounding run and carry to his game he becomes the better option in the side, but he hasn't shown a willingness to do that so far, so he finds himself on the fringes rather than being a lock.
 
shaky said:
Great to see the Heraldscum doing it’s usual high standard of work. Headline about Pickett and start the article talking about him then use a quote from Dimma about Stack.
I suppose in their defence, they all do look the same.......
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All look the same?.... Do you mean Pickett, Stack & Dimma Or all Hun reporters ? 🤪.......😉
 
It matters somewhat otherwise they would not have practice games. much of these views as based on seasons of short in the backline, not the last two games.

In a back6/7 of Vlastuin, Astbury, etc. there is no shame in being a weaker link

Shorts primary job is not the stopper but the reality is for much of the football game the back pocket type needs to defend. More so when teams are targeting you for your perceived lack of defensive ability, size, strength, 1v1 record etc.

Clubs will continually try and get Cogs, Cripps, Danger, Fyfe etc. matched up on Jayden and kick there in the chess match

_RT_ said:
Losing twice and copping many goals doesn't mean s**t, it's the preseason, all we were looking at getting out of the games was miles in the legs as we build into the season proper which is where things really matter. As I said we played about 2 quarters of footy where we ramped things up to somewhere near our normal level of pressure and when we did we were able to dominate both the Pies & Giants during those times. The rest of the time we ran around playing bruise free footy.

Shorts game isn't to be a defensive stopper, that's the role of guys like Grimes Vlastuin Astbury Broad in our defensive structure, Shorts game, along with Baker & Houil, is to launch quick counter attacks that doesn't give the opposition time to then get back and set up their defensive structures. He does that role better than anyone else in our side, outside Houli at his best.

As I've said a number of times now, if Stack can add the attacking rebounding run and carry to his game he becomes the better option in the side, but he hasn't shown a willingness to do that so far, so he finds himself on the fringes rather than being a lock.
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Marcel Proust said:
It matters somewhat otherwise they would not have practice games. much of these views as based on seasons of short in the backline, not the last two games.

In a back6/7 of Vlastuin, Astbury, etc. there is no shame in being a weaker link

Shorts primary job is not the stopper but the reality is for much of the football game the back pocket type needs to defend. More so when teams are targeting you for your perceived lack of defensive ability, size, strength, 1v1 record etc.

Clubs will continually try and get Cogs, Cripps, Danger, Fyfe etc. matched up on Jayden and kick there in the chess match
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When have you ever seen Short play on the likes of Coniglio Cripps Dangerfield Fyfe when they go forward? You won't cause it won't happen.

Our structure is set up so that one of Grimes or Astbury is the deepest defender and they will take whichever opponent plays the deepest forward. So if a Coniglio Cripps Dangerfield or Fyfe was to play forward we'd either use one of them or have the likes of Broad or Vlastuin come across on to them.

We've worked out that there is nothing to be gained from going flat out for 8 quarters of footy in preseason games. All we do is get miles into the legs get to feel a bit of genuine heat from an opponent rather than a teammate. We play a couple of quarters of genuine hard at it footy to ensure that our game plan stacks up, but we're not going to give the opposition a free look at how we do things for full games.

Finally Houli Short Baker Stack aren't back pocket types, we play them as half backs to either intercept incoming footy or to be the outlets once we win position so we can hit the opposition on the counter attack before they can get set up defensively.
 

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_RT_ said:
Losing twice and copping many goals doesn't mean s**t, it's the preseason, all we were looking at getting out of the games was miles in the legs as we build into the season proper which is where things really matter. As I said we played about 2 quarters of footy where we ramped things up to somewhere near our normal level of pressure and when we did we were able to dominate both the Pies & Giants during those times. The rest of the time we ran around playing bruise free footy.

Shorts game isn't to be a defensive stopper, that's the role of guys like Grimes Vlastuin Astbury Broad in our defensive structure, Shorts game, along with Baker & Houil, is to launch quick counter attacks that doesn't give the opposition time to then get back and set up their defensive structures. He does that role better than anyone else in our side, outside Houli at his best.

As I've said a number of times now, if Stack can add the attacking rebounding run and carry to his game he becomes the better option in the side, but he hasn't shown a willingness to do that so far, so he finds himself on the fringes rather than being a lock.
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Thought he went alri
_RT_ said:
When have you ever seen Short play on the likes of Coniglio Cripps Dangerfield Fyfe when they go forward? You won't cause it won't happen.

Our structure is set up so that one of Grimes or Astbury is the deepest defender and they will take whichever opponent plays the deepest forward. So if a Coniglio Cripps Dangerfield or Fyfe was to play forward we'd either use one of them or have the likes of Broad or Vlastuin come across on to them.

We've worked out that there is nothing to be gained from going flat out for 8 quarters of footy in preseason games. All we do is get miles into the legs get to feel a bit of genuine heat from an opponent rather than a teammate. We play a couple of quarters of genuine hard at it footy to ensure that our game plan stacks up, but we're not going to give the opposition a free look at how we do things for full games.

Finally Houli Short Baker Stack aren't back pocket types, we play them as half backs to either intercept incoming footy or to be the outlets once we win position so we can hit the opposition on the counter attack before they can get set up defensively.
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Well Green, Coniglio and Langdon all too contested marks on the weekend, and a couple on Short from memory. It will happen because opposition coaches might see to it if they have any brains. 3 x 180cm and under players in the back half is one or two to many.
 
Grrr said:
Thought he went alright
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Thought Stack was solid enough, but didn't really display that willingness to take the game on apart from that one run and carry moment from a Dusty handball.

Well Green, Coniglio and Langdon all too contested marks on the weekend, and a couple on Short from memory. It will happen because opposition coaches might see to it if they have any brains. 3 x 180cm and under players in the back half is one or two to many.
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Not saying he won't get out marked in a contest, just that when the side plays with their proper defensive structure they won't allow for Short to be isolated deep in 1-1 contests and even if it does happen they will have an extra teammate in the contest as support. Don't recall many times that I've seen our backs out marked in 1-1 contests when we have the defensive structure up and running properly.
 
_RT_ thought Stack almost ran the length of the ground in the 4th against GWS on the week end. I think that's the next step for him to do that consistently in games. It's a real weapon of his I think & his delivery into the forward line will.be amazing...
 
TJTIGER said:
_RT_ thought Stack almost ran the length of the ground in the 4th against GWS on the week end. I think that's the next step for him to do that consistently in games. It's a real weapon of his I think & his delivery into the forward line will.be amazing...
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Not sure if it was the Dusty moment you've mentioned?
 
TJTIGER said:
_RT_ thought Stack almost ran the length of the ground in the 4th against GWS on the week end. I think that's the next step for him to do that consistently in games. It's a real weapon of his I think & his delivery into the forward line will.be amazing...
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I think it's a case of needing to feel comfortable with his place in the team to start doing it. Short & Baker when they first came in were similar in they didn't really take the game on early in their careers, but once they got a bit of confidence and licence from the coaches, they have started taking the game on more.
 
_RT_ said:
When have you ever seen Short play on the likes of Coniglio Cripps Dangerfield Fyfe when they go forward? You won't cause it won't happen.

Our structure is set up so that one of Grimes or Astbury is the deepest defender and they will take whichever opponent plays the deepest forward. So if a Coniglio Cripps Dangerfield or Fyfe was to play forward we'd either use one of them or have the likes of Broad or Vlastuin come across on to them.

We've worked out that there is nothing to be gained from going flat out for 8 quarters of footy in preseason games. All we do is get miles into the legs get to feel a bit of genuine heat from an opponent rather than a teammate. We play a couple of quarters of genuine hard at it footy to ensure that our game plan stacks up, but we're not going to give the opposition a free look at how we do things for full games.

Finally Houli Short Baker Stack aren't back pocket types, we play them as half backs to either intercept incoming footy or to be the outlets once we win position so we can hit the opposition on the counter attack before they can get set up defensively.
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last game remember?

teams will try to get A grade small/mid fwds, A grade resting mids onto short

Broad and Vlastuin cant be everywhere at once and teams like GWS, Pies, WCE etc. will try exploit short knowing he is a poor defender

A Tiger 4 lyf said:
Short is locked in as a key member of the side


Sent from my iPhone using BigFooty.com
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dunno very much part of the bottom 6
 
Marcel Proust said:
last game remember?

teams will try to get A grade small/mid fwds, A grade resting mids onto short

Broad and Vlastuin cant be everywhere at once and teams like GWS, Pies, WCE etc. will try exploit short knowing he is a poor defender
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You might not have noticed but Short was part of the team for 15 games last year and there weren't many times that clubs were able to isolate him in 1-1 contests, because we have systems in place that stop that from happening.

Unless the opposition has 6 dangerous forwards, we will always be able to rotate the likes of Vlastuin Grimes Broad Houli Short Baker into positions where they aren't going to be put into situations where they are exposed defensively.

With Houli & Short in particular being dangerous rebounding options most teams are going to look to put a defensive forward on them to try and curb their run, if they do put an attack minded forward on them, they then open themselves up to be exposed the other way as once we get the ball those 2 will take off and run and within second will have the ball inside our F50 with the way we move the footy.
 
_RT_ said:
You might not have noticed but Short was part of the team for 15 games last year and there weren't many times that clubs were able to isolate him in 1-1 contests, because we have systems in place that stop that from happening.

Unless the opposition has 6 dangerous forwards, we will always be able to rotate the likes of Vlastuin Grimes Broad Houli Short Baker into positions where they aren't going to be put into situations where they are exposed defensively.

With Houli & Short in particular being dangerous rebounding options most teams are going to look to put a defensive forward on them to try and curb their run, if they do put an attack minded forward on them, they then open themselves up to be exposed the other way as once we get the ball those 2 will take off and run and within second will have the ball inside our F50 with the way we move the footy.
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the load being carried by Grimes, Vlastuin etc. is too high

they cannot continue to play like demigods forever. the dam will break eventually :(

need a more balanced contribution if the success if to continue imo
 
The teams we will have to beat in September do have six dangerous forwards.

Short rarely takes the game on. The long kicks to the wing that he gains most of his metres with are defensive plays, not attacking. Attacking is bringing the ball back inside from half back, which he does less than any other defender besides Down The Line Dave Astbury.
 
richoatthedisco said:
The teams we will have to beat in September do have six dangerous forwards.

Short rarely takes the game on. The long kicks to the wing that he gains most of his metres with are defensive plays, not attacking. Attacking is bringing the ball back inside from half back, which he does less than any other defender besides Down The Line Dave Astbury.
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With all due respect I'd suggest the club doesn't see Short long kicks as defensive plays the way that the general public or even Champion Data would.

Short ranked 3rd for R50s per game for us last year, behind Houli & Vlastuin, so it's clear that we want the ball in his hands when we're clearing our D50. I'd also suggest that part of our game plan is designed to get the ball into the fattest part of the ground which stretches the oppositions defensive zone wider, which then opens up space through the corridor when we do come back inboard from the wing. This gives space for our mids to run into, the fat side of the F50 for our forwards to move into, but also means that our defensive set up behind the ball is defending a smaller area of the oppositions F50 as they are less likely to want to bring the ball back into the corridor from the wing as a turnover would open the flood gates into our F50 as well.

There are others coming out of the back line like Houli Stack Martin(when down there) Edwards who will take on the more attacking kick through the corridor but they are more penetrating kicks than what Short is, so are given the licence to take on that option.

As for the oppositions forward lines that we'd face in finals, the only one I'm personally worried about is the Pies if they have De Goey Stephenson Thomas WHE Cox Mihocek Elliot available as that has clearly caused us problems in the past. None of the other sides have the same sort of variety/potency as that mix IMO.
 
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