Review Geelong tries its best to lose and finds a way to stagger to a 4 point win over Demons

[CatToTheFuture]

That defensive clusterf$#% is a defined strategy so why are we doing it? My half arsed theory is that CS thinks sides are going to look at the reduced time and burn themselves out trying to maintain full intensity the whole match. So the strategy is to absorb pressure and then try and push them in the second half.

If this is something we're choosing to do then 0/2 success rate is not looking good. But is this the first choice strategy? Surely not. I think it's highky likely that we have come back from lockdown in worse shape than much of the comp and the Hawks dropping their collective bundle hid it. Coaching group may be attempting to come up with something that keeps us in games late. This also goes a way to explaining why the kids aren't being played as the older players will benefit from their higher endurance base and the residual fitness this gives. The kids that are in are ones that have good endurance bases already like miers and Henry

That's my best shot at an explanation for this snoozefest. If I'm right then a few more matches should be all it takes to get to a more attacking strategy so I guess we're going to find out soon enough.


To focus on positives:

I really liked what parfitt did. Henry was better. Fort was beaten but it wasn't embarrassing. Guthrie and Menegola were good I thought, MOC the odd mistake but by and large did well after Stewart went down. Steven was better i guess but still not great and I probably wouldn't play him next week.

Changes are required however.

Obvious ones:
Atkins out for Fogarty surely has to happen now.
Stewart out Taylor in a straight swap.

Up for discussion:
Bews out for Clark. We're looking to do one of two things at all times right now. 90% of the time we're playing keepings off and 10% of the time we're attacking. Both require effective foot skills and Clark is the man for that playing off half back.

 

[hamG]

I have all of Patrick O’Brians book series (relating to the Master and Commander Movie).

I challenge you to most pages read during our sh*t games (this year) of those books

Discovering the books that were stolen by movies is one of my favorite past times. Unless it was Fight Club. Amazing movie, weirdly just not a good book.

I am happy to accept however I recommend to you Robin Hobb, Assassins Apprentice followed by the trilogy. It has changed the life of every person I've suggested read it.

 

[David the Cat]

A

Discovering the books that were stolen by movies is one of my favorite past times. Unless it was Fight Club. Amazing movie, weirdly just not a good book.

I am happy to accept however I recommend to you Robin Hobb, Assassins Apprentice followed by the trilogy. It has changed the life of every person I've suggested read it.

Are you posting in the right thread??

 

[AWOL]

Greatest positive of all today; it’s great to score 4pts whilst walking away with all the learnings of a loss.

I think we’re the kind of team that will stand up better to the top teams and then play to the level of lower teams.

Hopefully scrounge enough wins to be in with a chance when the time comes.

 

[Sttew]

Best home and away game in recent memories. Tops the Rd 14 Geel Vs Stk in 09

And we went onto bigger things in 09

 

[Pure_Ownage]

Tom atkins 1 disposal for the entire game.

Yep narkle definately should of been dropped.

Atkins was injured and only kept playing on for our rotations.

 

[My Tilly]

I think we’re the kind of team that will stand up better to the top teams and then play to the level of lower teams.

Based on finals performances to date, why do you think this?
We already got defeated by a top team (GWS).

 

[Chinacats]

Good training run to build up the kicking skills. Just too timid and cautious. Not a winners mentality I think.
Media talking about the ugly game. Cats head of the list. Oh dear!

 

[cats_09]

Article on Fox Footy focused on comments by Clarkson & Scotty about the current state of footy - it's a good read:

Two premiership coaches have savaged the standard of footy, with Hawthorn’s Alastair Clarkson declaring the game is “in a dreadful space” and pleading for change.

Both Clarkson and Geelong coach Chris Scott spoke about the state of the game in their post-match press conferences on Sunday. They were both victorious, but neither were happy with how footy looks right now...

Full article - https://www.foxsports.com.au/afl/af...s/news-story/67688945dccee68933a39e9f7d33145b

 

[Live in hope]

In a round of really watchable footy, this game was excruciatingly bad. For all our justified agonising, spare a thought for Demons fans - a mix of both young and seasoned talent in every line of their team and yet they are so mediocre. Goodwin has to be under pressure.

Our game style is entirely what our coaches want - cautious movement, to work through zones and avoid turn over goals, scoring through a lead opening up or a kick to deep forward opening up some crumbing/tackling opportunity. Although it reflects Scott and Scarlett’s defensive ethos, it is also born of necessity due to our lack of rebounding speed and talented outside mids. I’m sure it was also a tactical instruction today - 2 players down meant that Geelong couldn’t play a run and gun for 3 quarters.

The MC are also aware that the ‘next Gen’ aren’t sufficiently fit or talented to promote en masse and that due to COVID there was to be a final 8 placement to keep belief with sponsors and supporters. Whilst understandable, they also need to have at least incremental change now - injuries to Stewart and Atkins means that at least one next Gen should come in - (say) Fog for Atkins. Would like that ‘22nd’ spot earmarked for next gen throughout rest of the season.

 

[dazbroncos]

Menegola made some horrendous mistakes but he runs and runs and creates a target. Without guys like him we are just bombing down the line.

Far from a good game but I’d say he beat Tomlinson (600k). I mean 25 touches and plenty of metres gained.

All valid points that are correct.

However, in accepting that - Menegola's poor disposal on 3 occassions lead diretly to turn overs and Melbourne scores must be accepted.

His decision making and skill execution is extremely poor. Im not suggestng hes alone - but he caught my ususally forgiving eye and kept doing it all game long. And after last weeks similar efforts with the same issues - im over it.

Go Catters

 

[juzcat]

Is Boris still at the club?

How can he and Scarlo not do something?

Maybe that is the problem. We have a defenders as the attacking coach

Sent from my SM-N975F using Tapatalk

 

[steady2]

Seems Clark has been training with the defensive unit - hard to know though where they see him long term

Listening to Mathew Knights pre-game he said that Clark was working on his defensive skills but they think he can develop as a mid-fielder both as a winger and in the middle. We might see him soon.

 

[steady2]

Agree,

We are NOT in a premiership window.

Last year we played in a Prelim against the eventual premiers, we had two of our key midfielders injured and our key forward suspended yet were 20 points up at half time and could have been 35 points up. With a little luck, Duncan, Clark and Hawkins playing we could have held on and won that game and possibly had a premiership. Scott talking after the 2011 GF said. "you cannot over-estimate the part played by luck in winning a premiership". We have lost only Kelly from that team.

i’d rather we got blown away in a “down the guts ‘gun fight’“ (we have to play the Geelong way), to this rubbish brand of football that has been adopted by our football department.

I would rather win, as we did yesterday rather than be "blown away".

 

[Seeds]

All valid points that are correct.

However, in accepting that - Menegola's poor disposal on 3 occassions lead diretly to turn overs and Melbourne scores must be accepted.

His decision making and skill execution is extremely poor. Im not suggestng hes alone - but he caught my ususally forgiving eye and kept doing it all game long. And after last weeks similar efforts with the same issues - im over it.

Go Catters

At least menegola plays direct and tries to make things happen rather than just take the safe option side ways like half the team. He had a bad disposal day. But usually his disposal is better.

 

[Seeds]

Listening to Mathew Knights pre-game he said that Clark was working on his defensive skills but they think he can develop as a mid-fielder both as a winger and in the middle. We might see him soon.

Cos thats all that scott cares about. Defense.

Probably brainwashing him to not take the play on like the other defenders.

 

[Seeds]

That defensive clusterf$#% is a defined strategy so why are we doing it? My half arsed theory is that CS thinks sides are going to look at the reduced time and burn themselves out trying to maintain full intensity the whole match. So the strategy is to absorb pressure and then try and push them in the second half.

If this is something we're choosing to do then 0/2 success rate is not looking good. But is this the first choice strategy? Surely not. I think it's highky likely that we have come back from lockdown in worse shape than much of the comp and the Hawks dropping their collective bundle hid it. Coaching group may be attempting to come up with something that keeps us in games late. This also goes a way to explaining why the kids aren't being played as the older players will benefit from their higher endurance base and the residual fitness this gives. The kids that are in are ones that have good endurance bases already like miers and Henry

That's my best shot at an explanation for this snoozefest. If I'm right then a few more matches should be all it takes to get to a more attacking strategy so I guess we're going to find out soon enough.


To focus on positives:

I really liked what parfitt did. Henry was better. Fort was beaten but it wasn't embarrassing. Guthrie and Menegola were good I thought, MOC the odd mistake but by and large did well after Stewart went down. Steven was better i guess but still not great and I probably wouldn't play him next week.

Changes are required however.

Obvious ones:
Atkins out for Fogarty surely has to happen now.
Stewart out Taylor in a straight swap.

Up for discussion:
Bews out for Clark. We're looking to do one of two things at all times right now. 90% of the time we're playing keepings off and 10% of the time we're attacking. Both require effective foot skills and Clark is the man for that playing off half back.

Why fogarty? He is bascially just an atkins clone. Bring back narkle or clark.

 

[Seeds]

The problem with the game is not contests. Its chip kicking, switching sides of the ground in defence and holding the play up. The exact same thing makes soccer terribly boring.

One rule fixes everything wrong with the game. No kicks backwards can be marked and a mark can only be allowed for 20 metre kicks or more. Some of the chip kicks paid as marks on the weekend were so ridiculously small it was silly.

 

[Spazz Cat]

Why fogarty? He is bascially just an atkins clone. Bring back narkle or clark.

Yeah. Not really a mid. Not a natural forward with any instinct or flair.
Your right. Atkins. Strange pick.

 

[Spazz Cat]

Last year we played in a Prelim against the eventual premiers, we had two of our key midfielders injured and our key forward suspended yet were 20 points up at half time and could have been 35 points up. With a little luck, Duncan, Clark and Hawkins playing we could have held on and won that game and possibly had a premiership. Scott talking after the 2011 GF said. "you cannot over-estimate the part played by luck in winning a premiership". We have lost only Kelly from that team.
I would rather win, as we did yesterday rather than be "blown away".

I gotta say I enjoyed the Carlton loss more than I enjoyed yesterday's win. And I really didn't enjoy that!
At least there was a lot of fun at the end.
Bad supporter? Yeah probably. I'm just one of those people that would rather feel something than nothing.

 

[iameviljez]

Anyone watching the players reaction after the siren went?

Any other team would've celebrated, our players just seemed relieved and almost disappointed.

Leaves a sour taste in your mouth.

No issue with their reaction whatsoever, it basically mimicked mine.

 

[iameviljez]

A lot of baby out with the bath water tonight.

Few tweaks sure but most experts had Melb above us. We controlled them for 45 minutes playing well below par. Long season with lots of upsets. We have plenty of scope to improve.

No, the anger over our playing style is completely justified because it has been coming since 2017. For three years, we have been hugely stagnant and risk-averse, gone continually sideways and slowly out the back of the defence, been nigh-on allergic to moving the ball directly through the middle, and given Hawkins, Rohan and Ratugolea next to no chance.

In 2018 and 2019 we had the lowest total score against in the entire league (despite finishing 8th in 2018). This isn't because we have Scarlett, Jakovich, Enright and Hodge in the backline - it's because we play such risk-averse footy that we would do anything other than risk losing our structure behind the ball.

We don't trust our backline to cover for our midfield if caught out on the break. If our backline was Enright, Taylor and Lonergan, Bews and Zuthrie - i.e. slow as a wet week or very vulnerable in the air - that might make sense. But it's not that any more. Blicavs and Stewart are superb one-on-one and have great ground coverage.

 

[iameviljez]

due to COVID there was to be a final 8 placement to keep belief with sponsors and supporters.

I (nicely) disagree with this. We can miss the finals for a few years and we'll be fine. The actual club itself is in a great state and has far better, more solid support than it did 20 years ago.

 

[iameviljez]

One rule fixes everything wrong with the game. No kicks backwards can be marked and a mark can only be allowed for 20 metre kicks or more. Some of the chip kicks paid as marks on the weekend were so ridiculously small it was silly.

I know we've discussed this and disagreed before, but I will disagree again...

... your suggested change helps, but it isn't the panacea IMHO. It doesn't stop players from holding the ball up and kicking the ball relatively short distances out toward the flanks - at which point they hold the ball up, and if they can't hit another short target, kick it long along the line.

The thing that makes sides go so slow to pick their way through is the cluster. Kicking through 18 players packed in front of you is exceptionally tough. I'm in agreement with Chris Scott here that fewer players and hopefully more exhaustion is the way to go.

 

[Spazz Cat]

I know we've discussed this and disagreed before, but I will disagree again...

... your suggested change helps, but it isn't the panacea IMHO. It doesn't stop players from holding the ball up and kicking the ball relatively short distances out toward the flanks - at which point they hold the ball up, and if they can't hit another short target, kick it long along the line.

The thing that makes sides go so slow to pick their way through is the cluster. Kicking through 18 players packed in front of you is exceptionally tough. I'm in agreement with Chris Scott here that fewer players and hopefully more exhaustion is the way to go.

When I was a little kid I played YMCA footy.
About six kids had arm bands and they were the only ones who could run all over the ground.
Can't remember if it worked, but it would stop everyone getting in front of the ball for sure.