2nds Reserves Scratch Matches 2020

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caesar88 said:
We took him as a defender
Click to expand...

Despite saying we’d like to start him a defender, does not a defender make. He had no history as an Australian Rules Footballer.

He had no position coming in. Fair point on him playing as a ruck but to suggest he had a position because we suggested he’d start in defence because just about all of our (and most) Irish recruits start as defenders doesn’t mean the club shouldn’t be exploring his capabilities given as I said earlier, he had never played the sport before.

This predetermined position talk particularly for rookie listed players is nonsense anyway. They are a flip of the coin compared to their more (perceived or otherwise) talented counterparts from the main draft and clubs may have other plans for them.
 
TheMase said:
Despite saying we’d like to start him a defender, does not a defender make. He had no history as an Australian Rules Footballer.

He had no position coming in. Fair point on him playing as a ruck but to suggest he had a position because we suggested he’d start in defence because just about all of our (and most) Irish recruits start as defenders doesn’t mean the club shouldn’t be exploring his capabilities given as I said earlier, he had never played the sport before.

This predetermined position talk particularly for rookie listed players is nonsense anyway. They are a flip of the coin compared to their more (perceived or otherwise) talented counterparts from the main draft and clubs may have other plans for them.
Click to expand...

We had been training him as a defender all pre-season. So it wasn't me predetermining his position, it was the club doing that. I'm only going off what the club has said about O'Connor.

My point was less about the issue of playing blokes in different roles and positions, and more about doing it under the circumstances 2020 has thrown up. If you have a full length NEAFL season with full length NEAFL matches, you've got plenty of time to work with in terms of changing players around and giving them new challenges.

In a shortened season with reduced opportunities to show what you can do, if you are spending half of those opportunities being thrown into different roles spontaneously, I'm not sure what the club is expecting of these guys to show.
 
caesar88 said:
We had been training him as a defender all pre-season. So it wasn't me predetermining his position, it was the club doing that. I'm only going off what the club has said about O'Connor.

My point was less about the issue of playing blokes in different roles and positions, and more about doing it under the circumstances 2020 has thrown up. If you have a full length NEAFL season with full length NEAFL matches, you've got plenty of time to work with in terms of changing players around and giving them new challenges.

In a shortened season with reduced opportunities to show what you can do, if you are spending half of those opportunities being thrown into different roles spontaneously, I'm not sure what the club is expecting of these guys to show.
Click to expand...

Given they have 1 year contracts perhaps (show) something or they’re out the door. With the weeks dwindling and list position cuts potentially on the horizon, perhaps they are giving them (particularly Rowles) every chance to stay on the list in different roles.

It’s not like BOC hasn’t played in defence earlier this year. I don’t mind giving him some football education in different parts of the ground given the game is foreign to him.

In regards to the unique 2020 season, you could also compromise a players development by not giving them other development opportunities.

Training as something doesn’t predetermine anything either in a case like BOC which is clearly different to a normal draftee. I would expect a player who has never played the game to first play behind the ball and be trained as such at AFL level at least.

Anyways moving on I think...
 

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TheMase said:
Given they have 1 year contracts perhaps (show) something or they’re out the door. With the weeks dwindling and list position cuts potentially on the horizon, perhaps they are giving them (particularly Rowles) every chance to stay on the list in different roles.

It’s not like BOC hasn’t played in defence earlier this year. I don’t mind giving him some football education in different parts of the ground given the game is foreign to him.

In regards to the unique 2020 season, you could also compromise a players development by not giving them other development opportunities.

Training as something doesn’t predetermine anything either in a case like BOC which is clearly different to a normal draftee. I would expect a player who has never played the game to first play behind the ball and be trained as such at AFL level at least.

Anyways moving on I think...
Click to expand...

Yeah we ain't agreeing on this one.
 
TheMase said:
Despite saying we’d like to start him a defender, does not a defender make. He had no history as an Australian Rules Footballer.

He had no position coming in. Fair point on him playing as a ruck but to suggest he had a position because we suggested he’d start in defence because just about all of our (and most) Irish recruits start as defenders doesn’t mean the club shouldn’t be exploring his capabilities given as I said earlier, he had never played the sport before.

This predetermined position talk particularly for rookie listed players is nonsense anyway. They are a flip of the coin compared to their more (perceived or otherwise) talented counterparts from the main draft and clubs may have other plans for them.
Click to expand...
Sorry but you do not take into account his position in Gaelic Footy. Defender. He was drafted because of his ability to totally blank opposition and run off them with great dexterity. He is 197cm for *'s sake. If he manages to get to the level he will be a wonderful find. That is why he was training with the defensive group.

As to your supposition that he does not come from our code so therefore what he has done previously does not count is absolute bullshit. He was drafted because of his abilities as a defender in his code.

On JAT-L29 using BigFooty.com mobile app
 

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Wolftone said:
Sorry but you do not take into account his position in Gaelic Footy. Defender. He was drafted because of his ability to totally blank opposition and run off them with great dexterity. He is 197cm for fu**'s sake. If he manages to get to the level he will be a wonderful find. That is why he was training with the defensive group.

As to your supposition that he does not come from our code so therefore what he has done previously does not count is absolute bullshit. He was drafted because of his abilities as a defender in his code.

On JAT-L29 using BigFooty.com mobile app
Click to expand...

Thanks for your input. Again doesn’t mean he shouldn’t be tried in other positions. Also he is 193cm.

Found this a bit odd for a Gaelic star defender though:

“The 20-year-old, who started at half-forward during the Leinster championship first round against Louth, is the son of George, who enjoyed a great hurling career.”


www.balls.ie

Exciting Wexford Prospect O'Connor Signs For Sydney Swans | Balls.ie

Young Wexford star Barry O'Connor has signed a two-year deal with Syndey Swans after impressing on a trial earlier this year.
www.balls.ie www.balls.ie

And this:

“O'Connor, who is 193cm tall and is viewed as a forward or backline player, comes from good stock.”

www.theage.com.au

Swans bring another gem from Emerald Isle to Emerald City

The Sydney Swans believe they've struck more Irish gold with the signing of Gaelic football prodigy Barry O'Connor on a two-year rookie deal.
www.theage.com.au www.theage.com.au

I also didn’t say it doesn’t count, but it is a different sport entirely and therefore it’s at best a guide, and as above not a particularly as clear cut as you’ve made it out.

But it’s certainly a totally different pathway and therefore his development, including exposure to different positions, is imo different than most draftees.

Now I was making this post as BigFooty crashed yesterday and all the posts disappeared and then as we went back in time, just by chance, I found this post and had a giggle...

Wolftone said:
He was a defender in Gaelic Footy so is not used to playing in attack. Could be a fish out of water deal there. But he needs to get experience there anyway.
Click to expand...

... which was more my point.
 
Wolftone said:
But actually being played as a forward is the hilarity

On JAT-L29 using BigFooty.com mobile app
Click to expand...

I wouldn't be opposed to trying him as a forward ordinarily, especially given he's an international recruit who needs to learn the game.

I just think opportunities are scarce this year. They can't even get consistent matches happening on a weekly basis, and the ones they do are only 60-minute scrimmages. To me that's an environment not conducive to being thrust into different roles and expected to pick them up. IMO we need to just back guys like O'Connor and Rowles in the roles we initially had intended for them, and hope they show something, and if they don't then we cut them. It's really harsh but with impending list cuts I think it's just not an ideal year to be tinkering with rookies. In theory it's giving them more opportunities, but in practice it's probably just making things even harder for them.
 
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