Review Good vs GWS

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Who would have thought 2 years later that the most exciting player from that trade wasn't the X factor forward on $800k/year (Gov), or the 1st rounder from the Superdraft (McHenry), but rather the unfit SANFL player on a diet of pies and frothies, that got thrown in as steak knives!



Yeah it's been pretty unreal. I thought he was a bit of an almost player and was pretty sceptical tat he would amount to anything. The weirdest thing is he's probably still not very fit (in AFL terms), but he looks like he is.
 
We're probably no different to any other supporters, but people generally call for rebuilds and lack the patience that comes with having lots of young players.

People are quick to write off Jones and Fog. If Himmelberg and Keays can improve out of sight, then you would have to be confident that Fog and Jones will be fine (obviously not guaranteed).

McHenry is one who hasn't really shown anything. But given how wrong I've been on Himm, Keays and McAdam, I'm not going to make a call for a while.
What we have seen with EH, Keas, McAdam, Stengle is that you need a block of 10 or so games with some good support from senior players in the side. This in and out business we have done for years doesn't help. Also having senior players who's effort appears conditional makes it harder.

It starts with a few good things here and there like Schoenberg is doing now, then they gradually become more consistent throughout the game and week to week like Berg is now showing.

Let's wait until Ned, Jones, McAsey, Hamill, Scholl, McPherson, Schoenberg get a big PS in the gym, and a block of 10 games next year and watch them blossom.
 

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I'm not as convinced. Keays has been good this year, no doubt. And much better than we had any reason to expect.
However, his best games were as an inside mid when the rest of the team were terrible.

He is now playing primarily on the wing, where he just doesn't have the skill level. He's a really good trier, but his skills are poor. Happy for him to have had a go and everything, but if we become a decent team, he should be passed by better players pretty quickly.
Don't get me wrong he still needs to prove himself long term, the only way he holds his spot is if he makes himself irreplaceable in amongst the highly rated mids we draft. Still has a long way to go but looks promising. He is contributing every game recently and his run and break from and through congestion is outstanding at this stage. We aren't port Adelaide with the gold passes after all where 6 months of good coaching in 2014 gets you a lifetime coaching stint.

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I think everyone in here who is still dark on Darcy Fogarty should take the time to read the posts about Elliot Himmelberg last night and today.

Big boys take time to develop, that's a given. Some take a lot of time!

I think Darcy will be absolutely fine, but we need to stop thinking that he's modern footy's Wayne Carey as a 20 year old, and anything below that is a bust!

Would love to see him work with someone like Carey or Tredrea in the off-season.

He still goes into marking contests expecting the defenders to be no match for him size and weight-wise. Also looks to mark on his chest a lot, which is seeing him miss a lot of easy grabs. It's fixable but just needs someone who knows what they are doing (which rules out Hart) to work with him.
 
We're probably no different to any other supporters, but people generally call for rebuilds and lack the patience that comes with having lots of young players.

People are quick to write off Jones and Fog. If Himmelberg and Keays can improve out of sight, then you would have to be confident that Fog and Jones will be fine (obviously not guaranteed).

McHenry is one who hasn't really shown anything. But given how wrong I've been on Himm, Keays and McAdam, I'm not going to make a call for a while.
I think McHenry needs to find some balance to his game. If he is a fitness machine I feel at his size perhaps he needs to shelve the physical stuff and play an outside running game. But for me he needs some more sanfl development.

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What we have seen with EH, Keas, McAdam, Stengle is that you need a block of 10 or so games with some good support from senior players in the side. This in and out business we have done for years doesn't help. Also having senior players who's effort appears conditional makes it harder.

It starts with a few good things here and there like Schoenberg is doing now, then they gradually become more consistent throughout the game and week to week like Berg is now showing.

Let's wait until Ned, Jones, McAsey, Hamill, Scholl, McPherson, Schoenberg get a big PS in the gym, and a block of 10 games next year and watch them blossom.
Actually Stengle is one who I think has done quite well from day one for a small forward. He's one I've always thought would make it.
 
I think everyone in here who is still dark on Darcy Fogarty should take the time to read the posts about Elliot Himmelberg last night and today.

Big boys take time to develop, that's a given. Some take a lot of time!

I think Darcy will be absolutely fine, but we need to stop thinking that he's modern footy's Wayne Carey as a 20 year old, and anything below that is a bust!
I think he has the brain of a smart skillful midfielder with the body of a key forward. The crows are trying to train him to be a Tex replacement when in reality Himmelberg should be our ff. Fog should be asked to lose weight and get him more into a big bodied midfielder role pinch hitting into the forward line. He is a genuine smart footballer who has shown some good form in the middle of the ground when given space to work.

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He does have a bit of a point though, i've started seeing a big social media push to re-signing Brad Crouch now, people are thinking spike again next year instead of continuing to rebuild.

Brad's current form is the best thing for us at the moment if it allows us to get pick #2, not that he's worth a new long-term deal.
Honestly don't think we are getting pick 2 compo for Brad if he did leave. If we can't get that then he stays.
I don't think he is worth a 5 year deal either. 3 would be what I put in front of him with some performance based goals to trigger a 4th year.
 
Good.
Shane McAdam attacks the ball like its 30 seconds to go and 1 point in it and can mark it.
Himmelberg >>> Frampton
Getting Tyson Stengel in was a good move, class, poise and is getting up the ground a lot
Laird is now a mid, keep him there.
ROB's ruckwork has been fantastic the last few weeks.
Matt Crouch's reimagination as a hard tackling inside mid.
Our ability to shut down GWS's sideways movement out of defence

Bad
Its easy to get excited and think we have turned a massive corner, next season will have some dark times where it will be Fagans/Chapmans/Triggs/Tippetts/Robert Shaws fault somehow but as long as we get 5-6 wins and some kids start to get more involvement/influence in games we will all be okay.

Ugly
dominated inside 50s but kicked it to GWS defenders a lot.
 
Good.
Shane McAdam attacks the ball like its 30 seconds to go and 1 point in it and can mark it.
Himmelberg >>> Frampton
Getting Tyson Stengel in was a good move, class, poise and is getting up the ground a lot
Laird is now a mid, keep him there.
ROB's ruckwork has been fantastic the last few weeks.
Matt Crouch's reimagination as a hard tackling inside mid.
Our ability to shut down GWS's sideways movement out of defence

Bad
Its easy to get excited and think we have turned a massive corner, next season will have some dark times where it will be Fagans/Chapmans/Triggs/Tippetts/Robert Shaws fault somehow but as long as we get 5-6 wins and some kids start to get more involvement/influence in games we will all be okay.

Ugly
dominated inside 50s but kicked it to GWS defenders a lot.
Just on the inside 50's. I'm not too worried about that going forward given the strides that our young forward line are taking. Before McAdam, Stengle, and Berg came on we had 1 form of entry. High to the 2 or even 3 on 1 key forward. Over and Over and Over!

Now these kids hands are gaining the trust of the mids I think we will see a lot more variance in our angle's of attack. Which will in the end re-open the clogged leading lanes that have stopped us from being able to hit FOG and TEX on the lead for years.

Our strength now is the awkwardness of matchups that Stengle, Berg and McAdam present! All we need to do is keep working on the symmetry and chemistry of that unit.
 
I love that we are a chance in the air

Yes, it is remarkable.

And what is that all about? A winless club with just about every senior player doing a Gibbs impression, barely capable of winning a quarter, let alone a game wins two in a row. I know the breaks may have helped. I know Hawthorn have problems. GWS are always flakey on the road.

It troubles me somewhat. Wild inconsistency almost always equals off field issues. I don't like the fact that our senior players can let us go 0-13, then turn it on to jag some wins.
The turnaround didn't just happen over the last 2 weeks. We were showing signs in the Essendon and Geelong games as well, they just didn't finish it off the way they did against Hawthorn and GWS.

I think the scars from the previous administration ran deep, and Nicks has been fighting an uphill battle all season to get the players back onside. I think he's finally got them into a good place mentally and emotionally, and we're now seeing the difference that enjoyment, happiness and confidence can make.
 

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Just on the inside 50's. I'm not too worried about that going forward given the strides that our young forward line are taking. Before McAdam, Stengle, and Berg came on we had 1 form of entry. High to the 2 or even 3 on 1 key forward. Over and Over and Over!
This is simply not true at all. It was "high to the 2 or even 3 on 1 small forward. Over and Over and Over!".:p:p:p
 
Just on the inside 50's. I'm not too worried about that going forward given the strides that our young forward line are taking. Before McAdam, Stengle, and Berg came on we had 1 form of entry. High to the 2 or even 3 on 1 key forward. Over and Over and Over!

Now these kids hands are gaining the trust of the mids I think we will see a lot more variance in our angle's of attack. Which will in the end re-open the clogged leading lanes that have stopped us from being able to hit FOG and TEX on the lead for years.

Our strength now is the awkwardness of matchups that Stengle, Berg and McAdam present! All we need to do is keep working on the symmetry and chemistry of that unit.
I've noticed over a few weeks the forwards really don't lead hard. It's a k"ick it over there and I'll run that way".

We've been lucky to be take a few contested marks, but that's not a robust system going forward.

You need strong leading patterns, long fast leads and the contested marks as a variation. If we don't lead and don't kick to leads, then those defenders will peel off and go for the contested situation, reducing the influence of Berg and McAdam.

The leading forwards find it hard to be fair due to the overuse of handball we are seeing through the midfield. I don't know if that's the game plan, but I think it needs to be more cohesive with the leading forwards - something to continue to work on.
 
I think he has the brain of a smart skillful midfielder with the body of a key forward. The crows are trying to train him to be a Tex replacement when in reality Himmelberg should be our ff. Fog should be asked to lose weight and get him more into a big bodied midfielder role pinch hitting into the forward line. He is a genuine smart footballer who has shown some good form in the middle of the ground when given space to work.

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He won't ever be fit enough to do that role. Best he will be is a KPP who pinch hits in the midfield Roughead style.
 
The turnaround didn't just happen over the last 2 weeks. We were showing signs in the Essendon and Geelong games as well, they just didn't finish it off the way they did against Hawthorn and GWS.

I think the scars from the previous administration ran deep, and Nicks has been fighting an uphill battle all season to get the players back onside. I think he's finally got them into a good place mentally and emotionally, and we're now seeing the difference that enjoyment, happiness and confidence can make.
2 weeks or 4 weeks, it’s still dramatic

It’s the same administration, and that’s what I’m getting at. Feels like the first 10 games were a protest, then the prospect of being a winless team finally got them into gear.
 
Good.
Shane McAdam attacks the ball like its 30 seconds to go and 1 point in it and can mark it.
Himmelberg >>> Frampton
Getting Tyson Stengel in was a good move, class, poise and is getting up the ground a lot
Laird is now a mid, keep him there.
ROB's ruckwork has been fantastic the last few weeks.
Matt Crouch's reimagination as a hard tackling inside mid.
Our ability to shut down GWS's sideways movement out of defence

Bad
Its easy to get excited and think we have turned a massive corner, next season will have some dark times where it will be Fagans/Chapmans/Triggs/Tippetts/Robert Shaws fault somehow but as long as we get 5-6 wins and some kids start to get more involvement/influence in games we will all be okay.

Ugly
dominated inside 50s but kicked it to GWS defenders a lot.
Part of this was because of how we structured our side.
We constantly pushed our half forward up to the contest and had them sit off the back of all contests. It meant we were able to shut down their easy clearance, and we had an easy outlet. GWS let that happen and tried to set up for intercept marks. It worked for both sides, but in the end it worked most for us as we won!
 
Gee how things turn, I posted quite sometime ago I wanted to see us have a couple of wins, and got hounded down by some,reward for effort and to give the young ones some belief and confidence
Now everyone is walking round with a woody
TBF I think most of the posters here wanted that. I certainly did...not so much the woody, but some wins.

Woodies are easy.
 
Good: the way I felt after our second win. It confirms that last weeks win was no fluke. It doesn't mean that we have suddenly turned into a great team but it does say that we have turned a corner. The players have started to gel.

More good news is that we have a few youngsters who are showing a little of what they are capable of and this means we have room for further development from these guys. Berg, Scholl, 2nd Berg, Stengle, Keays, Hamill (when he comes back), McPherson, McAdam and even DoeDee..he still has only played 30 games.

Further good news is we have the opportunity of the draft provided we can get our selections correct.

With these two wins it demonstrates we are moving forward and it gives us the strength to move on more of our under-performing senior players. It also suggests that next year may not be as dark as this year. We might not get pick one. I dont expect us to get back into finals but I do see us slowly regaining the respect that we have lost.

No rose coloured glasses but I am feeling a little more positive about the future.
 
He won't ever be fit enough to do that role. Best he will be is a KPP who pinch hits in the midfield Roughead style.
He can lose some muscle and bulk by just increasing his cardio and staying out the gym. If he can lose 5kg of his frame he will move around alot easier. I just think he was earmarked as a Tex replacement and they got excited. He just doesn't know how to use his bulk. Defenders just sit off him and he isnt tall enough to really cause a concern with most defenders either and he also isn't a strong marking forward. I just feel he is lost. No point persisting in something that clearly isn't working. Especially when Himmelberg is showing he could be the answer up forward with McAdam and Stengle.

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