Will Giannis Antetokounmpo stay with the Bucks?

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Marcel Proust

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ojnarowski] ESPN Sources: MVP Giannis Antetokounmpo's 3-hour lunch with Bucks co-owner/governor Marc Lasry on Friday covered the season, how Bucks can improve roster, Lasry confirming willingness to spend into luxury tax and agreement they’ll talk again after Giannis returns from a vacation.
 

Marcel Proust

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Why would they give him away for nothing? They'll be garbage in 2020/21 without any benefit.

He was an all star this year and nearly took a team that lost Westbrook and George out of the first round.

What is the motivation of OKC to turn two years of Paul at $40m into 3 or 4 years of Bledsoe, Middleton, Hill, whoever?

Teams want CP3, he has value. If OKC are smart they will offload him this year for picks/young players/expiring contracts for next year.

You sure? He is 36 with 85million dollars left on his contract.

They probably want to be garbage. That's what rebuilding is. Draft picks and cap room..
 
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I read somewhere today Boston are a quiet dark horse in the background (offering Jaylen Brown, Hayward and a couple of future first round picks).

I would only do that deal if Giannis agreed to a Max contract extension with the Celtics..

But my gut feeling is Giannis will stay with the Bucks, they haven't got miserable old miserable Herb Kohl as owner anymore. Greek Freak strikes me as the loyal type provided they give him a decent support cast.
 

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beatnik

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I read somewhere today Boston are a quiet dark horse in the background (offering Jaylen Brown, Hayward and a couple of future first round picks).

I would only do that deal if Giannis agreed to a Max contract extension with the Celtics..

But my gut feeling is Giannis will stay with the Bucks, they haven't got miserable old miserable Herb Kohl as owner anymore. Greek Freak strikes me as the loyal type provided they give him a decent support cast.

well, they have a year to make him happy...I don’t think he will sign an extension, I think he’ll wait and see whether the Bucks front office deliver on their promises first
 
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You sure? He is 36 with 85million dollars left on his contract.

They probably want to be garbage. That's what rebuilding is. Draft picks and cap room..

Yep, that's why they parted with Westbrook and George. They got picks, SGA and Gallinari with an expiring contract. Win, win, win.

CP3 is absolutely up for trade, but they're not giving him away for nothing.
 

beatnik

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Yep, that's why they parted with Westbrook and George. They got picks, SGA and Gallinari with an expiring contract. Win, win, win.

CP3 is absolutely up for trade, but they're not giving him away for nothing.

It’s not as simple as that though, is it? Yes, he’s been superb this year but he’s difficult to trade as his contract is super max-sized and he’s in the late twilight of his career

If the Thunder got Middleton for Paul, then they’ve made out like bandits...Middleton is a younger, taller All-Star with a much better contract so he’s much easier to on-trade if the fit is not great with SGA

Chris Paul was amazing this year but let’s not get carried away about his dog of a contract 👍
 

Marcel Proust

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Yep, that's why they parted with Westbrook and George. They got picks, SGA and Gallinari with an expiring contract. Win, win, win.

CP3 is absolutely up for trade, but they're not giving him away for nothing.

It would have been for okc to get Wiseman/ball/Edwards instead of being stuck in no man's land

They did so well this season, they even lost their first rounder to the sixers(iirc)

Paul has veen brilliant but I'm not sure how many teams will view a 37/38 year old on 45 million dollars as a 'positive asset'
 
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Marcel Proust

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well, they have a year to make him happy...I don’t think he will sign an extension, I think he’ll wait and see whether the Bucks front office deliver on their promises first

I think

If he want the 'supermax' contract he has to sign within 4 weeks , or something?

Not everyday someone passes up 300 odd million dollars Us$
 
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It’s not as simple as that though, is it? Yes, he’s been superb this year but he’s difficult to trade as his contract is super max-sized and he’s in the late twilight of his career

If the Thunder got Middleton for Paul, then they’ve made out like bandits...Middleton is a younger, taller All-Star with a much better contract so he’s much easier to on-trade if the fit is not great with SGA

Chris Paul was amazing this year but let’s not get carried away about his dog of a contract 👍

His contract becomes less of an issue each year. OKC took him on with 3 years left after a couple of poorish years with the Rockets. Then this year he played 70 games, made the All Star game and was big in the playoffs.

Middleton's on the hook for another 4 years rising to $41m in the last year of the deal. That's Klay Thompson money. Klay is good enough to be a second scoring option and previously played as a third. Middleton is good enough to play as a third and plays as a second.

If Milwaukee could straight swap two years of Paul for 4 years of Middleton (salaries don't balance) they'd make out like bandits.
 

beatnik

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His contract becomes less of an issue each year. OKC took him on with 3 years left after a couple of poorish years with the Rockets. Then this year he played 70 games, made the All Star game and was big in the playoffs.

Middleton's on the hook for another 4 years rising to $41m in the last year of the deal. That's Klay Thompson money. Klay is good enough to be a second scoring option and previously played as a third. Middleton is good enough to play as a third and plays as a second.

If Milwaukee could straight swap two years of Paul for 4 years of Middleton (salaries don't balance) they'd make out like bandits.

...but after 2 years of Middleton, OKC still have an all-star, all-nba-level wing to trade, whereas Paul will retire and/or leave to chase a ring as a vet minimum

Look, I’m not saying your argument has no merit, I’m saying it has a regency bias based on Paul playing so well this year...Paul’s stocks are as high as they can get, while Middleton‘s stocks are temporarily dampened by the disappointing playoff run by his team

My point is simply that OKC would be better in the medium to long-term with Middleton than with Paul (if Paul tweaks a hamstring at any point, Middleton is better for them in the short term too)
 
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...but after 2 years of Middleton, OKC still have an all-star, all-nba-level wing to trade, whereas Paul will retire and/or leave to chase a ring as a vet minimum

Look, I’m not saying your argument has no merit, I’m saying it has a regency bias based on Paul playing so well this year...Paul’s stocks are as high as they can get, while Middleton‘s stocks are temporarily dampened by the disappointing playoff run by his team

My point is simply that OKC would be better in the medium to long-term with Middleton than with Paul (if Paul tweaks a hamstring at any point, Middleton is better for them in the short term too)

I see your point, but I guess I don't rate Middleton as highly as you do. He has made two All Star Games but he's playing for the team that has had the best record in the NBA the last two seasons. Beal and Booker missed All NBA selection and only Booker made the All Star Game as an injury reserve. They are both better players than Middleton. If you did a straight swap CP3 for Middleton I doubt Middleton is a 2021 All Star playing for a garbage OKC team.

NBA salary cap rules being what they are there are $30-35m a year players and there are $30-35m a year players. Mlddleton and Harris making as much money as Butler and Kawhi isn't a reflection of their abilities. The risk for OKC (or Milwaukee if Giannis bails in free agency) is getting stuck with 3-4 years of a top 20 salary for a top 50-100+ output player. Two years of CP3 for Milwaukee is fine. One year would be ideal, but the contract was signed years ago. It's a one year gamble for a title a la Toronto 2019. 3 or more years, hell no. That's Horford territory.
 

beatnik

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I see your point, but I guess I don't rate Middleton as highly as you do. He has made two All Star Games but he's playing for the team that has had the best record in the NBA the last two seasons. Beal and Booker missed All NBA selection and only Booker made the All Star Game as an injury reserve. They are both better players than Middleton. If you did a straight swap CP3 for Middleton I doubt Middleton is a 2021 All Star playing for a garbage OKC team.

NBA salary cap rules being what they are there are $30-35m a year players and there are $30-35m a year players. Mlddleton and Harris making as much money as Butler and Kawhi isn't a reflection of their abilities. The risk for OKC (or Milwaukee if Giannis bails in free agency) is getting stuck with 3-4 years of a top 20 salary for a top 50-100+ output player. Two years of CP3 for Milwaukee is fine. One year would be ideal, but the contract was signed years ago. It's a one year gamble for a title a la Toronto 2019. 3 or more years, hell no. That's Horford territory.

Great post, agree 👍
 

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Marcel Proust

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Yep, that's why they parted with Westbrook and George. They got picks, SGA and Gallinari with an expiring contract. Win, win, win.

CP3 is absolutely up for trade, but they're not giving him away for nothing.

Didn't get much in the end.

It'll be nice for Booker to get some help. Ayton will probably go 5o another level too
 
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Miami is the biggest threat to Milwaukee imo.

Great coach, Pat Riley, a team that made the finals last season, plus the babes and surf in South Beach.

If he wants to win a ring, without looking like a KD sellout, The Heat is Giannis' best option imo.
 

Marcel Proust

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Miami is the biggest threat to Milwaukee imo.

Great coach, Pat Riley, a team that made the finals last season, plus the babes and surf in South Beach.

If he wants to win a ring, without looking like a KD sellout, The Heat is Giannis' best option imo.

He signed the supermax like 10 hours ago. 5 years, more money than Lillard

Milwaukee dynasty upcoming

Edit - apparently player option, last season of the deal
 
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He signed the supermax like 10 hours ago. 5 years, more money than Lillard

Milwaukee dynasty upcoming

Well good. At least it wasn't with the Lakers or Dubs.

Good to see some loyalty in the NBA for a change.
 

Marcel Proust

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Well good. At least it wasn't with the Lakers or Dubs.

Good to see some loyalty in the NBA for a change.

His success(?) will be Dirk like.

If they end up a superteam, it's cause Giannis made them one.

No way the Bucks include Middleton in a deal for Paul.

I reckon he stays. If not, Miami or Dallas will have room.

Without knowing the contracts - if they could add cp3 to Jrue Middleton giannis. That would be decent.

Assuming it doesn't work out for 5hr suns.

I think Jrue can play the 2 spot

Cp3. Jrue. Middleton. Giannis ? (Onelucky big bloke)
 
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Chose money over a championship. Disappointing.

Best record in the NBA the last two years. He didn't join the Knicks. I hope the Bucks can do better in the playoffs next year with Holiday but having Giannis for another 5 years keeps them relevant and competitive. He walks for nothing as a free agent and they turn into the Cavs without LeBron. If Holiday opts out they have $27m to play with. If he doesn't, they have his $27m and Middleton's $35m as trade assets.

The supermax is a bit overplayed anyway. It's 35/5 so currently $45m a year for 5 years, compared to about $40m a year for 4 years. The extra security of the 5th year is nice but it's not like Giannis would've gone hungry if he joined the Heat or whoever as a free agent. James Harden was offered another 2 years @ $50m a year to extend with the Rockets and said no because he wants out. Giannis is only 26, injury permitting he'll probably sign another big contract when his 5 years are up, as he would after 4 years. Like with the AFL, money is generally more important to role players than superstars. Jingles went from $5m over 3 years to $10-15m a year. That's huge. Delly got his career contract at $38m over 4 years, now back near the vet minimum. If you are in the All Star to All NBA to MVP candidate bracket you are going to get $35-50m a year depending on how many seasons you have played. And you'll get shoe deals and endorsements etc. It's a superstars' league. If Giannis wanted to be in Miami with Butler and Bam next year, he would be.
 

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Best record in the NBA the last two years. He didn't join the Knicks. I hope the Bucks can do better in the playoffs next year with Holiday but having Giannis for another 5 years keeps them relevant and competitive. He walks for nothing as a free agent and they turn into the Cavs without LeBron. If Holiday opts out they have $27m to play with. If he doesn't, they have his $27m and Middleton's $35m as trade assets.

The supermax is a bit overplayed anyway. It's 35/5 so currently $45m a year for 5 years, compared to about $40m a year for 4 years. The extra security of the 5th year is nice but it's not like Giannis would've gone hungry if he joined the Heat or whoever as a free agent. James Harden was offered another 2 years @ $50m a year to extend with the Rockets and said no because he wants out. Giannis is only 26, injury permitting he'll probably sign another big contract when his 5 years are up, as he would after 4 years. Like with the AFL, money is generally more important to role players than superstars. Jingles went from $5m over 3 years to $10-15m a year. That's huge. Delly got his career contract at $38m over 4 years, now back near the vet minimum. If you are in the All Star to All NBA to MVP candidate bracket you are going to get $35-50m a year depending on how many seasons you have played. And you'll get shoe deals and endorsements etc. It's a superstars' league. If Giannis wanted to be in Miami with Butler and Bam next year, he would be.
Losing Bledsoe, gaining Holiday won’t make that much of a difference.

I really don’t wanna see a LBJ Lakers dynasty, Giannis moving would’ve been a game-changer. Staying at the Bucks is more of the same with a record breaking pay packet.

Harden joining the Nets would be interesting.
 
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Losing Bledsoe, gaining Holiday won’t make that much of a difference.

I really don’t wanna see a LBJ Lakers dynasty, Giannis moving would’ve been a game-changer. Staying at the Bucks is more of the same with a record breaking pay packet.

Harden joining the Nets would be interesting.

Bledsoe did nothing in the playoffs. Again. Highest score was 16 points. Jrue Holiday played 9 games in his last playoff run and managed 16+ in all bar one game with a high of 41. I don't think he's going to tip them from a conference finalist/semi finalist to a champion, but he's an upgrade on Bledsoe. Cocking up the Bogdanovic deal will hurt them as they don't have a lot of outside shooting, though Bryn Forbes is about on par with Middleton in that dept.

In any event Holiday is a one year proposition if he opts out or a two year proposition if he opts in. Giannis is in for 5 years after this one. LAL gave up their future to give LeBron AD. LAC gave up theirs to give Kawhi PG13. Lakers won the title, Clippers choked in the conference semis. Both teams have kept adding to their rosters this year. If 2020/21 doesn't go to plan for the Bucks they should be looking at what to do with the assets they have to build around Giannis.
 

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