Expansion 3rd Western Australian club

[RedV3x]

WA doesnt want a bubble with any other states,

Who says ? If you say stuff like that you have to put "IMO" in front of it.

 

[Ned_Flanders]

Who says ? If you say stuff like that you have to put "IMO" in front of it.

WA is refusing to say when they will open borders with any state

how can they have a bubble if opening borders isnt on their agenda??

 

[RedV3x]

WA is refusing to say when they will open borders with any state

W.A. is taking the sensible approach saying it will re-open borders w.r.t. to prevailing conditions NOT pure time lines.

how can they have a bubble if opening borders isnt on their agenda??

Are you comprehension-challenged or something.
Opening the borders is definitely on W.A.'s agenda but it is based on prevailing conditions NOT an irrelevant time line.
W.A.'s borders would be open NOW if the right conditions prevailed.

 

[Ned_Flanders]

W.A. is taking the sensible approach saying it will re-open borders w.r.t. to prevailing conditions NOT pure time lines.



Are you comprehension-challenged or something.
Opening the borders is definitely on W.A.'s agenda but it is based on prevailing conditions NOT an irrelevant time line.
W.A.'s borders would be open NOW if the right conditions prevailed.

So you support the border lockdown, say it will end when conditions allow it, but are pissed no bubble involving wa exists because of East coast?

Why would anyone negotiate a bubble with wa when for now wa won't let anyone in?

You're an idiot

 

[RedV3x]

So you support the border lockdown, say it will end when conditions allow it,

are pissed no bubble involving wa exists because of East coast?

No. where have I aid that?

Why would anyone negotiate a bubble with wa when for now wa won't let anyone in?

What are you going on about? I'm talking TASMANIA NOT MAINLAND EAST COAST

You have the comprehension of that below a child. I'll simplify it for again.
W.A. to Tasmania DIRECT. Cmprendez. verstehen sie.

 

[Ned_Flanders]

No. where have I aid that?




What are you going on about? I'm talking TASMANIA NOT MAINLAND EAST COAST

You have the comprehension of that below a child. I'll simplify it for again.
W.A. to Tasmania DIRECT. Cmprendez. verstehen sie.

tasmania has a closed border except for workers.

wa has a closed border except for exemptions

why the * would QANTAS service two states who have closed borders with each other, when the traffic is minimal under normal circumstances?

 

[RedV3x]

when the traffic is minimal under normal circumstances?

You really are a neddy aren't you.
Haven't you noticed that things aren't normal.
Haven't you noticed that Qantas has heaps or planes laying idle.
Haven't you noticed what I have been saying, that in essence business cannot sit around waiting for things to return to 'normal'.
Businesses have to constantly adjust and airlines are just another business.

 

[Ned_Flanders]

You really are a neddy aren't you.
Haven't you noticed that things aren't normal.
Haven't you noticed that Qantas has heaps or planes laying idle.
Haven't you noticed what I have been saying, that in essence business cannot sit around waiting for things to return to 'normal'.
Businesses have to constantly adjust and airlines are just another business.

So they should just fly empty planes?

You are an idiot

 

[RedV3x]

So they should just fly empty planes?

neddy, neddy, neddy the complete neddy.
Airline routes are based patronage and airlines fly all the time to Tasmania as you should well know.
Seemingly you don't, otherwise you wouldn't have answered in such a pathetic way.
So you are saying that a weekly service from Perth to Tasmania would not be patronised under the prevailing circumstances?
IMO a weekly service from Perth to Tasmania would be patronised under the prevailing circumstances?

Are you playing at being a complete idiot or are you just a tiresome idiot?

 

[Ned_Flanders]

neddy, neddy, neddy the complete neddy.
Airline routes are based patronage and airlines fly all the time to Tasmania as you should well know.
Seemingly you don't, otherwise you wouldn't have answered in such a pathetic way.
So you are saying that a weekly service from Perth to Tasmania would not be patronised under the prevailing circumstances?
IMO a weekly service from Perth to Tasmania would be patronised under the prevailing circumstances?

Are you playing at being a complete idiot or are you just a tiresome idiot?

Yes, I'm saying there are not enough people able to go to tassie from Perth given both states are locked off from the rest of the country

 

[Obeanie1]

I agree there should be a 3rd WA team (and probably a 4th in time), but the argument against is usually that there is nowhere to put it, although if people think a team can be based across the entirety of Tasmania, then I don't see why a team can't be based across the entirety of Perth (or WA more generally).

It would run into big opposition from the vested interests though...The WA clubs of course (and their fans) who are afraid of competition, but it would also run into issues with the dynamic between WAFC & AFL over ownership, finances and control (both of the club and the game).

BTW...700K per team in Perth V 600K per team in Vic...You're comparing a state to a city...the difference is even bigger.

What difference is bigger?

 

[telsor]

What difference is bigger?

Read the post I was responding to.....4 years ago!

 

[an unbiased carlton man]

no

 

[Obeanie1]

Read the post I was responding to.....4 years ago!

Ha. I just saw this thread title as I was scrolling down about expansion in WA. I cant even read the dates on posts.

 

[Carringbush2010]

Who says ? If you say stuff like that you have to put "IMO" in front of it.

Actually Marky Mark did mention he doesn't want a bubble with any other state on 6pr when interviewed by Ollie Peterson a couple of weeks back.

 

[RedV3x]

Actually Marky Mark did mention he doesn't want a bubble with any other state on 6pr when interviewed by Ollie Peterson a couple of weeks back.

IMO, on that subject of bubbles it would have been discussed internally some time ago w.r.t. N.T. and S.A.
but the N.T. and S.A. weren't up to keeping the Eastern staters out.
Tasmania and N.Z. are out because Qantas doesn't provide a service.

 

[Carringbush2010]

IMO, on that subject of bubbles it would have been discussed internally some time ago w.r.t. N.T. and S.A.
but the N.T. and S.A. weren't up to keeping the Eastern staters out.
Tasmania and N.Z. are out because Qantas doesn't provide a service.

Correct, boil it down and dissect anyway you will the WA gov. is keeping it's border up. Not really anything an outside entity like the AFL can do.

 

[RedV3x]

Not really anything an outside entity like the AFL can do.

???? The AFL could have desisted on bringing it's contingent of hangers-on. I believe that was the sticking point.

 

[Freomaniac]

Port also started in the AFL with largely Port personnel (Cahill, Wanganeen) and continued with Port personnel (Williams, Tredrea). Seems like Fremantle didn't have a strong Fremantle connection until Bell and McManus were leading them. And of course, Fremantle were in the bottom 5 for their first 8 years, whereas Port won a premiership in their first 8 years.

Yeah Port Adelaide Power Have the Port Magpies connection when they started. Yes John Cahill coached the Port Magpies to many Flags in the 1980s and 1990s.

Gavin Wanganeen was Port Powers 1st AFL captain. Yes he played for Essendon for 6 seasons before Joining the Power. And Yes he did Play for the Port Adelaide Magpies in 1990 as a 16 year old and played in the 1990 SANFL Grand final winning side too. However he came from Salisbury. Scott Hodges who kicked 158 goals in that 1990 SANFL season came from Salisbury too.

Salisbury isnt a Port Adelaide Area. Port Adelaide and Alberton oval is in the Western Suburbs.

Salisbury is in the Northern Suburbs and its Near Elizabeth oval. If you are from Salisbury or in Elizabeth, you are Part of Central Districts zone in the SANFL.

Freo were in the bottom 6 for most of their 1st decade from 1995-2004 because they were poorly run and made bad trading and drafting choices.

A long line of incompetence and running away from their own heritage. Going off a sourced statement from Wikipedia, the WAFC deliberately tried to avoid any South or East Fremantle people being involved, because they wanted the club to appeal to people outside Fremantle too. This resulted in them being run by hockey players, politicians and Cameron Schwab, who you might recall had already been mediocre at Richmond. And as mentioned above, the coach and captain were from Claremont.

To this day I don't think they've had a single coach from South or East, and I think Bell is the first administrator to be from one of those clubs. And now they're based in Cockburn and chose to align with Peel Thunder over either South or East. So it seems to me they've never really had a big connection with the Fremantle identity outside of playing at Fremantle Oval. Ironically the Eagles probably had a bigger influence from South and East (John Todd, Worsfold, Mainwaring, Sumich, Matera, Jakovich).

Heres the thing. I do agree with Parts of your post.

I have posted this before and do it again.

WAFC did try to distance the dockers from the East Freo and South Freo roots, to try and broaden the dockers fan base.

Most people will Bag out the Dockers for Choosing Gerard Neesham as the 1st freo dockers coach and Also Bag him out for getting a lot of Claremont players from other AFL clubs.

People can have their opinions on about a lot of Claremont guys on that dockers list in 1995. But heres how I see it. Before Neesham was the dockers coach in 1995, he was coaching claremont from 1987-1994. He won WAFL premierships in 1987, 1989, 1991 and 1993. Look at the 1991 AFL draft. John Hutton, Andrew McGovern and Jason Norrish were all taken in the top 5 picks in 1991. they were dockers players in 1995.

I dont Blame Gerard Neesham getting as many ex Claremont players from the other AFL clubs. The dockers did have 8-12 1st round picks like GWS and Gold coast had. Ben Allan was a good choice as the 1st Dockers captain. Yes he too was an Ex Claremont player. Before he was a docker, he played for Claremont from 1987-89 and got a premiership medal that 1989 grand final. He then goes to the hawks and plays 98 games for them from 1990-94. One of those games was the 1991 grand final and he got a premiership medal there too.


Again.... I dont Blame Gerard Neesham getting as many ex Claremont players from the other AFL clubs. He was Familiar with guys Like Ben Allan, Dale Kickett

Dale Kickett

Age

55

Ht

179cm

Wt

81kg

Pos.

Def

Career

Season

Last 5

D

16.4

4star

K

9.1

4star

HB

7.3

5star

M

3.1

3star

T

2.2

4star

No current season stats available

D

17.0

5star

K

9.4

4star

HB

7.6

5star

M

4.2

4star

T

2.0

4star

, Peter Mann, Jason Norrish etc as they played under him at claremont and played AFL at other clubs too. So that idea to a degree made sense. This isnt Like Brisbane in 1987 where it was made up of Old players or rejects from other clubs or How GWS and Gold coast was set up with them having a massive list and a massive amount of 1st rounders with a lot of teenagers on the list.

No different to Graham Cornes, who was Crows coach in 1991, recruited a lot of Glenelg players on the crows list. Cornes last coaching job was coaching glenelg from 1985-1990 and he got 2 SANFL flag in 1985-6. Crows 1st coach was Chris McDermott, His SANFL club? You guessed it, Glenelg.

If you look back then, only a few east freo fans supported freo, the rest stayed at west coast. A lot of South Freo fans embraced the dockers, Partly due to the dockers training at South Freos home ground.

Now Days, Depending on which WAFL team you support, you Follow either the eagles or the dockers.

Yes Some East Freo fans follow the dockers. Most of the South Freo fans follow the dockers. Some Claremont fans Follow the dockers due to Gerard Neesham being the dockers 1st coach and the claremont players he brought in. Some Peel fans follow freo due to Peel being the Dockers ressies side in the WAFL.


I wont deny the dockers were Poorly run in the 1st 10 years from 1995-2004.

But despite the success, or lack there of, Have a moderate supporter base due to certain things done back in 1995.

 

[Established1870]

Salisbury isnt a Port Adelaide Area. Port Adelaide and Alberton oval is in the Western Suburbs.

Salisbury is in the Northern Suburbs and its Near Elizabeth oval. If you are from Salisbury or in Elizabeth, you are Part of Central Districts zone in the SANFL.

Port Adelaide is defined as being a north western suburb. Salisbury and Elizabeth are and have been Port strongholds for decades in terms of support and Salisbury was one of our recruiting zones for the longest time which is how we got Wanganeen and Hodge in the first place. It only stopped being our recruiting zone because of the merger when we had to give them up. Both Wanganeen and Hodges were die hard Port fans growing up as well.-

 

[Tonatopia]

---bump----

Ive never been to Perth, is someone able to give me a summary on the football dynamics in Perth, without me going thru the 39 pages,
specifically;

1. If Perth was 'allowed' to make an entry, would it be a WAFL (owned) initiative, or other?
2. Considering the Eagles exist, why would people support Perth? Is there a demand?
3. Does Perth Stadium 'sell out' for every Eagles home game? If so, how many Eagles supporters miss out on a seat (estimate)?

thank you

 

[Royalbeagle]

---bump----

Ive never been to Perth, is someone able to give me a summary on the football dynamics in Perth, without me going thru the 39 pages,
specifically;

1. If Perth was 'allowed' to make an entry, would it be a WAFL (owned) initiative, or other?
2. Considering the Eagles exist, why would people support Perth? Is there a demand?
3. Does Perth Stadium 'sell out' for every Eagles home game? If so, how many Eagles supporters miss out on a seat (estimate)?

thank you

I’m no expert but I think two teams in WA is enough and that it would be financially very difficult to establish and maintain a second club - especially these days (it was a massive effort for Fremantle to achieve admission).
Despite that, West Coast have a massive waiting list for membership and sell out most games if not all. Not sure about Fremantle - faring less well but surviving.
The other issue would be the fact that WAFL support is very minimal here now since the establishment of West Coast. Both clubs have established clear identities, divisions have been drawn, and any tokenistic affiliation to the WAFL Perth Demons would unlikely have any influence in garnering support.
I reckon I would probably follow them though as it’s a nice thought (albeit an unrealistic one).

 

[Freomaniac]

jokes aside, i thought they would kill it because they have a historic footy culture unlike the eagles.

both the eagles and crows however showed the power that comes with being set up as the "state" team

Were the eagles a "State" Side? Yes they were. Did they have access to all WA talent? No they didnt. They didnt get the likes of Mark Bairstow, Nicky Winmar and earl Spalding in 1987.

out of the 35 eagles players, only 5 or 6 of them played for VFL clubs, One was an ageing Ross Glendenning, another is an injury prone Phil Narkle. So essentially, the VFL forced the Eagles to choose a lot of 18-21 year olds which was a blessing in disguise as 6 years later, those 18-21 year olds in 1987 were 24-27 year olds in 1992, the year West coast won their 1st flag.

Crows Had access to SANFL talent. But Stephen Kernahan and Richard Champion and John Platten Didnt join the crows in 1991. I was suprised the Crows didnt look at Mark Naley after he left Carlton in 1990. Sure he was 30 years old, but he Played 4 years at Carlton and played in their premiership in 1987. He won the Magary medal in 1991, the equivalent of a Brownlow medal.

 

[Tonatopia]

I’m no expert but I think two teams in WA is enough and that it would be financially very difficult to establish and maintain a second club - especially these days (it was a massive effort for Fremantle to achieve admission).
Despite that, West Coast have a massive waiting list for membership and sell out most games if not all. Not sure about Fremantle - faring less well but surviving.
The other issue would be the fact that WAFL support is very minimal here now since the establishment of West Coast. Both clubs have established clear identities, divisions have been drawn, and any tokenistic affiliation to the WAFL Perth Demons would unlikely have any influence in garnering support.
I reckon I would probably follow them though as it’s a nice thought (albeit an unrealistic one).

Thank you.
Ok, so working on the membership backlist for Eagles, if games are not accessible for many supporters, would you see opportunity, if a license was available, to start a new club?
If so, would it be founded by the WAFL, or more likely by an opportunistic privateer?

But boy oh boy, West Coast is a superpower. They need some of that energy dispersed into a future Perth team.

Forget the AFL for a second, if Perth was to enter a team, would supporters jump on board?

 

[Freomaniac]

Thank you.
Ok, so working on the membership backlist for Eagles, if games are not accessible for many supporters, would you see opportunity, if a license was available, to start a new club?
If so, would it be founded by the WAFL, or more likely by an opportunistic privateer?

But boy oh boy, West Coast is a superpower. They need some of that energy dispersed into a future Perth team.

Forget the AFL for a second, if Perth was to enter a team, would supporters jump on board?

here's my take on it. Some fans will jump on board, even some eagles and dockers fans will sign in to help prop them up.

But we gotta talk how they will be for the 1st 5-10 years. I think for the 1st 5 years they will struggle to pull 20,000 a game. But once they make finals and play finals in years 6-9 like GWS did, they will get a few casuals and bandwagon fans and go up to 30-35,000 fans a game