Footy Developments in NSW and Queensland

[Les Malone]

Bullshit. I might listen if you offer up an actual clinical opinion from a medical or psychological expert, but I won't be convinced by some BF random.


Why? If pokies are so harmless, the size of the establishment shouldn't matter.


Utter trash. You've failed to actually read my opinion and you're just carrying on with self-righteous nonsense. Not once have I said pokies should be banned altogether, I just think they need a mandatory precommitment scheme, probably need a limit on the number outside casinos, and shouldn't be owned by AFL clubs if they have any pretense to moral character. I also consider hard drugs to be immoral but I don't want them banned either.


Cry me a river.


Sweet, sweet irony.

LOL, self righteous nonsense....

But we should ban them from a moral standpoint ....

cry me a river

you are one seeking to take away freedoms - not me.

 

[Johnny Bananas]

But we should ban them

Thanks for confirming you don't read things before replying.

 

[BringBackTorps]

1. So it begins...

...Abolition of pokies (not proposed in NSW laws- but many want this)?... Pre-Commitment of Loss, with ID, Cards, in totally cashless pokie dens?...Status quo, to "save thousands of jobs"?.

The Echo Ballina (NSW) 9.10.20

Former pokie addict

"The addiction takes everything, & so much more than just measurable financial loss. The machines are designed to condition people, & they do that well...".

"In response to (poker machine) industry claims that Clubs & Pubs would collapse without pokie revenues,...Dr K. De Costa pointed to the example of pokies-free WA where NO such collapse has occurred (In their doomsday predictions, the pokie industry hates WA being mentioned- my words & emphases)".

Kickin' the Punt responds to proposed NSW pokie reforms – The Echo

Ben Hamilton from Ballina-based gambling reform group Kickin' the Punt has reacted to NSW Minister Victor Dominello's proposal of a gambling card to be used by gamblers in poker machine venues.

www.echo.net.au

2. SMH R. Masters 1.2.18

Masters said, re NSW pokie dens

" In the last 15 years, the number of machine players has reduced by 36%. Of those:

. Only 6% of gaming revenue comes from people under the age of 35.
. More than 60% of revenue comes from people over the age of 60.
. The majority of large Clubs are totally reliant on gaming profits.

The details are 3 years old and, since then, revenue from poker machines played by young people has further deteriorated, while there has been no growth from more senior age groups.
If only 6% of the age group 18-35 currently play the pokies, by the time they reach 60, NO ONE will be gaming...
Some Sydney Clubs expect to announce a decline in revenue on last year of up to $2m (ie $2m each- my words & emphases)".

Peter Beattie ignoring local politics when he talks up rugby league expansion

If former Queensland premier Peter Beattie wishes to woo Sydney clubs to support him as the incoming chairman of the Australian Rugby League Commission, he ignored local politics when he recently talked up expansion.

www.smh.com.au

Therefore, many NSW & Qld. NRL clubs, & many GR RL Clubs, are sitting on a funding & demographic time bomb. They have had a major reliance on, & greatly benefited from, pokie clubs' profits- but those days are certainly numbered. Inevitable RL decline almost certainly awaits.

In NSW & Qld., conversely, these demographic pokie gaming habits will, eventually, deliver a strong benefit for the AFL, & GR AF, growth (relative to the NRL & GR male contact RL decline).




EDIT:

3. In the Masters' link above, he also says

" I believe up to three of the starting players at some (NRL) Clubs are short of the desirable standard.

...they (new, possible expansion teams) will have to wait until a Sydney Club falls over (due to so many NRL substandard players currently...my words & emphases".

Masters, therefore, agrees with A. Johns, B. Fittler, P. Gallen, P. Gould, (P. Sterling, by implication), B. Slater, C. Smith, Ch. 9 executives (eg T. Malone etc.), & other NRL experts, that the NRL should not expand beyond 16 teams- because the skills of the average player & game would drop to unacceptable levels.

The significant, long term decline in GR male contact RL regd. nos. appears to be having a detrimental effect on the current skill levels in the NRL; & its ability to expand to more than 16 teams, with acceptable skill levels.

 

[Pippen94]

1. So it begins...

. Abolition of pokies?....compulsory ID & Pre-commitment of loss Cards in totally cashless pokie dens?...status quo to "save thousands of jobs"?.

The Echo Ballina (NSW) 9.10.20

Former pokie addict

"The addiction takes everything, & so much more than just measurable financial loss. The machines are designed to condition people, & they do that well...".

"In response to (poker machine) industry claims that Clubs & Pubs would collapse without pokie revenues,...Dr K. De Costa pointed to the example of pokies-free WA where NO such collapse has occurred (In their doomsday predictions, the pokie industry hates WA being mentioned- my words & emphases)".

Kickin' the Punt responds to proposed NSW pokie reforms – The Echo

Ben Hamilton from Ballina-based gambling reform group Kickin' the Punt has reacted to NSW Minister Victor Dominello's proposal of a gambling card to be used by gamblers in poker machine venues.

www.echo.net.au

2. SMH R. Masters 1.2.18

Masters said, re pokie dens

" . Only 6% of gaming revenue comes from people under the age of 35.
. More than 60% of revenue comes from people over the age of 60.
. The majority of large Clubs are totally reliant on gaming profits.

The details are 3 years old and, since then, revenue from poker machines played by poker machines has further deteriorated, while there has been no growth from more senior age groups.
If only 6% of the age group 18-35 currently play the pokies, by the time they reach 60, NO ONE (my emphasis) will be gaming.
Some Sydney Clubs expect to announce a decline in revenue on last year of up to $2m ".


Therefore, many NSW & Qld. NRL clubs, & many NSW & Qld. GR RL Clubs, are sitting on a funding, demographic time bomb. They have had a major reliance on, & greatly benefited from, pokie clubs' profits- but those days are certainly numbered. Inevitable RL decline awaits.

In NSW & Qld., these demographic pokie gambling habits will, eventually, deliver a strong benefit to the AFL & GR AF, growth (relative t the NRL & GR RL).

Afl clubs rely on pokies money too. Right now all teams in northern states receive big handouts from afl. If Victorian clubs lose income pressure will fall on teams propped up by central funding.

 

[Colonial]

Afl clubs rely on pokies money too. Right now all teams in northern states receive big handouts from afl. If Victorian clubs lose income pressure will fall on teams propped up by central funding.

Lol

 

[Pippen94]

Lol

Team at home bush entirely dependent on afl for existence - club's own annual report states that

 

[Colonial]

Team at home bush entirely dependent on afl for existence - club's own annual report states that

And?

If you think pokies affects AFL clubs more than the Sydney NRL clubs you are absolutely having a laugh.

I know this is hard for you but the Giants and Swans aren’t going anywhere. They are staying in Sydney and will continue to grow.

Unlike your mob.

Oh we are based at Olympic Park, seperate to Home Bush. For someone who can’t shut up about supposedly knowing Sydney more than anyone here you should know this.

 

[TWLS]

1. So it begins...

...Abolition of pokies (not proposed in NSW laws)?...Compulsory ID & Pre-commitment of Loss Cards, in totally cashless pokie dens?...status quo to "save thousands of jobs"?.

The Echo Ballina (NSW) 9.10.20

Former pokie addict

"The addiction takes everything, & so much more than just measurable financial loss. The machines are designed to condition people, & they do that well...".

"In response to (poker machine) industry claims that Clubs & Pubs would collapse without pokie revenues,...Dr K. De Costa pointed to the example of pokies-free WA where NO such collapse has occurred (In their doomsday predictions, the pokie industry hates WA being mentioned- my words & emphases)".

Kickin' the Punt responds to proposed NSW pokie reforms – The Echo

Ben Hamilton from Ballina-based gambling reform group Kickin' the Punt has reacted to NSW Minister Victor Dominello's proposal of a gambling card to be used by gamblers in poker machine venues.

www.echo.net.au

2. SMH R. Masters 1.2.18

Masters said, re pokie dens

" . Only 6% of gaming revenue comes from people under the age of 35.
. More than 60% of revenue comes from people over the age of 60.
. The majority of large Clubs are totally reliant on gaming profits.

The details are 3 years old and, since then, revenue from poker machines played by poker machines has further deteriorated, while there has been no growth from more senior age groups.
If only 6% of the age group 18-35 currently play the pokies, by the time they reach 60, NO ONE (my emphasis) will be gaming.
Some Sydney Clubs expect to announce a decline in revenue on last year of up to $2m ".

Peter Beattie ignoring local politics when he talks up rugby league expansion

If former Queensland premier Peter Beattie wishes to woo Sydney clubs to support him as the incoming chairman of the Australian Rugby League Commission, he ignored local politics when he recently talked up expansion.

www.smh.com.au

Therefore, many NSW & Qld. NRL clubs, & many NSW & Qld. GR RL Clubs, are sitting on a funding, demographic time bomb. They have had a major reliance on, & greatly benefited from, pokie clubs' profits- but those days are certainly numbered. Inevitable RL decline awaits.

In NSW & Qld., these demographic pokie gambling habits will, eventually, deliver a strong benefit to the AFL & GR AF, growth (relative t the NRL & GR RL).

RE The Comments about WA grassroots sports clubs - Anecdotally speaking -The guy who does my lawnmowing is President/ Chief fund raiser for his Masters Hockey Club. They are attached to a Senior Hockey Club and raise money by what ever means. Bar Sales, Chocolate promotions, Raffles, donations, Sponsorships, etc etc and now in WA - The brand new refundable deposit of 10 cents scheme on each bottle and can, which he said will be very good and they have built a huge lockable cage to hold the collection.
What you dont have you dont miss -And WA Clubs all operate without the pokies.

 

[Pippen94]

And?

If you think pokies affects AFL clubs more than the Sydney NRL clubs you are absolutely having a laugh.

I know this is hard for you but the Giants and Swans aren’t going anywhere. They are staying in Sydney and will continue to grow.

Unlike your mob.

Oh we are based at Olympic Park, seperate to Home Bush. For someone who can’t shut up about supposedly knowing Sydney more than anyone here you should know this.

NSW & Qld combined with have most of population so that's why afl is propping up teams. Of course no other sporting league has spent as much keeping teams afloat. Afl ratings dipped in Sydney this year - tell me about that growth.

 

[Colonial]

NSW & Qld combined with have most of population so that's why afl is propping up teams. Of course no other sporting league has spent as much keeping teams afloat. Afl ratings dipped in Sydney this year - tell me about that growth.

It’s funny, if your clubs owner spent that much on your mob you would be over the moon.

Dipped? Really? Foxtel numbers were up from what I saw.

Unlike the Foxtel numbers for the Wanderers. Now there is a car crash.

 

[Colonial]

NSW & Qld combined with have most of population so that's why afl is propping up teams. Of course no other sporting league has spent as much keeping teams afloat. Afl ratings dipped in Sydney this year - tell me about that growth.

You bring up NSW and qld populations. Isn’t that the heartland of your sport? Yet you get nationally what we get in Sydney.

If you lot worried about your sport you clearly love instead of this hilarious garbage you push here the sport may be in a better place.

 

[Les Malone]

RE The Comments about WA grassroots sports clubs - Anecdotally speaking -The guy who does my lawnmowing is President/ Chief fund raiser for his Masters Hockey Club. They are attached to a Senior Hockey Club and raise money by what ever means. Bar Sales, Chocolate promotions, Raffles, donations, Sponsorships, etc etc and now in WA - The brand new refundable deposit of 10 cents scheme on each bottle and can, which he said will be very good and they have built a huge lockable cage to hold the collection.
What you dont have you dont miss -And WA Clubs all operate without the pokies.

that's right they do and good on them, its just in WA just one person owns all the pokies, that's probably even worse

just because a club has poker machines it doesn't stop clubs affiliated or even the club itself from doing all those sort of things you state and in fact i know it does happen

its not as though a club that has poker machines doesn't engage in other community minded activities to raise money

 

[Pippen94]

You bring up NSW and qld populations. Isn’t that the heartland of your sport? Yet you get nationally what we get in Sydney.

If you lot worried about your sport you clearly love instead of this hilarious garbage you push here the sport may be in a better place.

To each their own - follow whatever sport you want.
My observation is afl fans will the failure of other sports more than anybody else.
In USA, baseball fans don't track performance of NBA, NFL & NHL hoping they'll fold.
This forum is proof of what I'm saying - don't know why either?? Does it validate fans if more ppl watch product?!

 

[teddyrichardsgoat69]

NSW & Qld combined with have most of population so that's why afl is propping up teams. Of course no other sporting league has spent as much keeping teams afloat. Afl ratings dipped in Sydney this year - tell me about that growth.

Given the lowly years which the 2 syd teams have had after the highs its hardly a surprise. I've watched every swans game this year and nearly all have been on foxtel and were generally at dead times. One year a trend does not make. I fully expect them to resume growth in the next 2 years

 

[Colonial]

To each their own - follow whatever sport you want.
My observation is afl fans will the failure of other sports more than anybody else.

What garbage. You’re here in an Aussie Rules forum pretending to be an AFL fan and trolling the sports inroads into the northern states, particularly Sydney and NSW.

I’m a member of multiple football forums and don’t have an AFL fans trying that, or NRL for that matter.

In USA, baseball fans don't track performance of NBA, NFL & NHL hoping they'll fold.
This forum is proof of what I'm saying - don't know why either?? Does it validate fans if more ppl watch product?!

Lol this is literally all you have done since you got here.
You’re the football fan who loathes the sport coming into an AFL forum.
You’re also the one that brings up our supposed catastrophic FTA figures in Sydney and have been death riding the Giants since you got here.
So take some of you’re own advise?

 

[Pippen94]

Given the lowly years which the 2 syd teams have had after the highs its hardly a surprise. I've watched every swans game this year and nearly all have been on foxtel and were generally at dead times. One year a trend does not make. I fully expect them to resume growth in the next 2 years

TV ratings aren't growing for anybody - whatever sport whatever show. Those numbers won't improve

 

[Pippen94]

What garbage. You’re here in an Aussie Rules forum pretending to be an AFL fan and trolling the sports inroads into the northern states, particularly Sydney and NSW.

I’m a member of multiple football forums and don’t have an AFL fans trying that, or NRL for that matter.


Lol this is literally all you have done since you got here.
You’re the football fan who loathes the sport coming into an AFL forum.
You’re also the one that brings up our supposed catastrophic FTA figures in Sydney and have been death riding the Giants since you got here.
So take some of you’re own advise?

C'mon, be honest. Look at all of BringBacktorps posts - he's googling to find articles from years back & even citing rugby in nz?! A thread for positive news stories on other codes was created because non afl one has become a cesspool.
This very thread is even titled; can sport become no.1 in NSW & qld??!!!!

 

[Colonial]

C'mon, be honest. Look at all of BringBacktorps posts - he's googling to find articles from years back & even citing rugby in nz?! A thread for positive news stories on other codes was created because non afl one has become a cesspool.
This very thread is even titled; can sport become no.1 in NSW & qld??!!!!

And you, a football fan who doesn’t like the sport of Aussie rules, has created a troll account to bag the sport on its own forums.

He is at least honest about himself. He is just showing the articles with the sports growth and articles showing it is getting to the opposition codes, you are just whinging and whining that an AFL forum is promoting AFL.

What’s wrong with the thread title? It isn’t bagging other sports or trolling.
I’m sure, as a football fan, you hope one day Football will grow in stature in Australia. Probably even discuss how it can be done on your Wanderers forums. I doubt you get insecure AFL or NRL fans creating bogus accounts to bag the sport there. I could be wrong, but we don’t get them on the Skyblues forums.

Only a wanderbaby would be so insecure.

 

[Pippen94]

And you, a football fan who doesn’t like the sport of Aussie rules, has created a troll account to bag the sport on its own forums.

He is at least honest about himself. He is just showing the articles with the sports growth and articles showing it is getting to the opposition codes, you are just whinging and whining that an AFL forum is promoting AFL.

What’s wrong with the thread title? It isn’t bagging other sports or trolling.
I’m sure, as a football fan, you hope one day Football will grow in stature in Australia. Probably even discuss how it can be done on your Wanderers forums. I doubt you get insecure AFL or NRL fans creating bogus accounts to bag the sport there. I could be wrong, but we don’t get them on the Skyblues forums.

Only a wanderbaby would be so insecure.

What I've written is honest & you've confirmed it in a round about way... But why are afl fans keen to see other sports fail & their's reign?? You didn't answer that

 

[Rob]

1. So it begins...

...Abolition of pokies (not proposed in NSW laws- but many want this)?...Compulsory ID & Pre-Commitment of Loss Cards, in totally cashless pokie dens?...Status quo, to "save thousands of jobs"?.

The Echo Ballina (NSW) 9.10.20

Former pokie addict

"The addiction takes everything, & so much more than just measurable financial loss. The machines are designed to condition people, & they do that well...".

"In response to (poker machine) industry claims that Clubs & Pubs would collapse without pokie revenues,...Dr K. De Costa pointed to the example of pokies-free WA where NO such collapse has occurred (In their doomsday predictions, the pokie industry hates WA being mentioned- my words & emphases)".

To be fair, pubs in WA are pretty s**t, and expensive. I paid $13.50 for a pint of 150 lashes the other day, highway robbery. Adelaide pubs s**t all over Perth pubs (for example). They're better and cheaper., and I put that mainly down to pokies subsidising everything else.

That doesn't mean I want to see pokies in WA (far from it), but I reckon you can add $10 to the price of a parmy and pint if you take them away.

 

[Colonial]

What I've written is honest & you've confirmed it in a round about way... But why are afl fans keen to see other sports fail & their's reign?? You didn't answer that

You haven’t written anything honest, not even the sporting team you follow is honest.

Haven’t seen anyone deathriding any other sport except funnily enough you, a supposed Sydney fan who has never actually posted about Sydney AFL besides to talk down the crowds, bash the ratings and argue about the grassroots.



So insecure Tsk tsk

 

[Pippen94]

You haven’t written anything honest, not even the sporting team you follow is honest.

Haven’t seen anyone deathriding any other sport except funnily enough you, a supposed Sydney fan who has never actually posted about Sydney AFL besides to talk down the crowds, bash the ratings and argue about the grassroots.



So insecure Tsk tsk

Guess you don't wanna answer.
Honestly I enjoy all sports but never knew main football codes were in competition with cricket until I found this forum

 

[Colonial]

Guess you don't wanna answer.
Honestly I enjoy all sports but never knew main football codes were in competition with cricket until I found this forum

I did answer.

Point me to one post you have made on here that is pro Aussie Rules growth.

Point me to 1 post you have made about the Swans. Cheering them, talking about their players, drafting/trading, anything.

Anything pro Aussie rules in Sydney.

 

[jatz14]

that's right they do and good on them, its just in WA just one person owns all the pokies, that's probably even worse

just because a club has poker machines it doesn't stop clubs affiliated or even the club itself from doing all those sort of things you state and in fact i know it does happen

its not as though a club that has poker machines doesn't engage in other community minded activities to raise money

It does happen, but not to the same degree. If a club needs to generate $100k to keep afloat, and pokies generate $70k, it has to generate another $30k, which it probably can, but the WA club sets out at the start of the year knowing it needs to generate the whole $100k, so it does.

What is occurring, is clubs generating $30k, are looking at that $70k shortfall, and thinking, omfg, if we lose the pokies, we are dead. When in fact, if they go in from the start planning on getting the $100k without pokies, they probably can.

Hard reality is, if they are right, and they cannot raise it, then they probably deserve to go under.

 

[Les Malone]

It does happen, but not to the same degree. If a club needs to generate $100k to keep afloat, and pokies generate $70k, it has to generate another $30k, which it probably can, but the WA club sets out at the start of the year knowing it needs to generate the whole $100k, so it does.

What is occurring, is clubs generating $30k, are looking at that $70k shortfall, and thinking, omfg, if we lose the pokies, we are dead. When in fact, if they go in from the start planning on getting the $100k without pokies, they probably can.

Hard reality is, if they are right, and they cannot raise it, then they probably deserve to go under.

Just using one example and this is about footy is Cazalys in Cairns, our direct cash contribution is in the millions to the clubs, ovals, umpires and the kids to support our great game AFL in the Far north.

CAZALYS $60,000 COMMUNITY FUND WINNERS 2018 | Cazalys

The 11th annual Cazalys Cairns $60,000 Community Fund, wrapped up on Tuesday the 4th September with a presentation ceremony held at Cazalys. Over 80 dignitaries and worthy recipients were in attendance to see how the $60,000 had been allocated this year. Cazalys has contributed a massive...

cazalys.com.au

in that link is plenty of other sporting orgs and community orgs that receive funding.

We can stand by and see Cairns AFL drop a stack of notches in standard both on the field and off the field as money drys up, Wagga Rules club is the same, same as plenty of clubs in Canberra, Ainslie has done the same thing, donates to many other affiliated clubs and community orgs and has built a class oval (stadium) next to its clubhouse.

Now if you are happy to see all that work from people in the North of the country fall by the wayside, sobeit, i think to play a poker machine is and should be a personal choice and not more control from the Government on what we can and cant do.

I know literally hundreds of people who play them, i play them when East, i grew up in a place where every club had them, i have yet to see one life wrecked from playing the pokies, but yes , i am sure it happens, but have seen plenty from grog and even smoking dope.