Adelaide Vs North - The start of their rebuilds

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The Rocks said:
I like this philosophy especially the drafting of key defensive backs first. All else fails you have the solid defence to build upon!

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Right now, North's defence is currently by far their best position spread and they've got Ben McKay to hold out that #1 shut-down role for the next decade. If you were to take out his poor game against Freo his contested loss rate is better than Weitering and Andrews, and he hasn't been playing on easy opponents either, Lynch, Kennedy, Dixon and Hawkins to name a few he's played on.
 
The Rocks said:
I like this philosophy especially the drafting of key defensive backs first. All else fails you have the solid defence to build upon!

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Well Nathan Bock and Ben Rutten both started up forward then spent their best years in the backline, so I get your point.
 

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the Ziebull said:
Finals 2014-2016

2017 is when it started
So yeah 3 years now, 1 more year near the bottom then we launch ala lions
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I have posted this before.

I was shocked North got Bottom 4 in 2017. Yes theygot 15th, posted a 6-16 record and lost 3-5 games by under a goal. Freo got 14th that year and had north pinched one close win vs freo in 2017, North and freo would of sqitched ladder spots in North getting 14th and Freo getting 15th.

2018 North were motivated proved that 2017 was a fluke and they proved they were not a bottom 4 side in 2018. They got 12 wins in 2018. Beat the saints by 23 points in that final game of 2018 and got pick 10. they could of tanked and lost that game and got pick 7 instead but didnt.
 
Freomaniac said:
You are very optimistic as a north fan if you think north are going to make finals next season
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Obviously would be irrationale to think so, I think it'll be 2023 since I'm quite optimistic and with the standards Ben Buckley has set, yeah it's not looking too good for Noble
 
Instincts said:
Obviously would be irrationale to think so, I think it'll be 2023 since I'm quite optimistic and with the standards Ben Buckley has set, yeah it's not looking too good for Noble
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It's not impossible but in a way it's doable.

Freo went 0-17 in 2001 and somehow make finals 2 years later.

We can talk about the demons under that dreaded time they had Mark Neeld as coach in 2012-13. They somehow miraculously recovered and made a prelim final in 2018.

With Norths current position, I can see them go from bottom 2 in 2020 to finals in 5th to 8th spot in 2023.

North need to recruit some good youth and a some good free agents for a quick rise up the ladder.
 
So a little more info now that we are 2/3 through the season. The crows played very well at the start of the season, with a nice blend of youth and experience. It does look like he wheels have fallen off as we approach the end of the season but there are plenty of positives. North is the opposite, barely being called a footy side for the first 1/3 of the season, but everything seems to be clicking now and we are now ultra competitive. The difference in the two doggies games highlights this.

The point of this thread was to contrast the way the rebuilds were progressing and to discuss the manner it which the football departments have gone to achieve their desired outcome.

Adelaide have seemed to go with the traditional line of thinking that you go KPP first given they take time and mids come on quicker.

Fogarty - first picked in 2017 and whilst he didn’t have a set position, it seems the crows have baulked him up to play KPF.

Jones - first picked in 2018 and doesn’t fit my narrative.

McAsey - first picked in 2019 and a KPD

Thilthorpe - doesn’t need explaining

Main point is 3/4 of these valuable first draft selections have been used on KPP.

Meanwhile North have over the same period down the complete opposite targeting mids, building from the inside out. Personally I feel that the wider afl community is a little asleep to the future midfield North has put together:

Jy Simpkin (age 23) - is now basically a 30 possession per week player. Future captain. He tricks but can be inconsistent with disposal.

LDU (age 22) - what were glimpses are now regular occurrences. As he’s got fitter he’s literally exploding in performance and from packs. Watching him set up goals while avoiding 4 tackles is a thing of beauty.

Stephenson (age 22) - doubts on midfield potential were bitch slapped out of town after a blistering 38 disposal game last week. Obviously versatile and still a work in progress but if he can play to 80% of this game on a regular basis he becomes one of the best wingman in the comp.

Thomas (age 21) - also exploded into the second highest ranked under 22 player in the comp (ahead of the superstar sam Walsh). Like Stephenson it’s still up in the air as to how he is best utililised but versatility can only be a good thing.

Tom Powell (age 19) - drafted as a ball pig, and I believe averaged the most disposals out of all the draftees. Looks composed, tough, great handball, neat skills and quicker than I was expecting.

Will Phillips (age 19) - some said North made a mistake taking Will over Logan McDonald. I may be proved wrong but i wanted them to take Will at the time and would make the same decision again right now. He’ll be the anchor of our midfield in 5 years time.

Pick 1/2 2021 - I have no doubt we will use this pick on the best mid available this year. Horne if pick 1, Callaghan if pick 2.

The point of the above is that it will be 7 first round picks on mids (stevo was a trade), completely different to how the crows have gone.
 
Really like what both sides are doing.

Adelaide have a couple gems coming through that aren't getting spoken about anywhere near enough IMO - Schoenberg, Berry, Butts. As well as the high prized pick in Thilthorpe. Obviously the Jones, McAsey & Fog drafts hurt a little bit, but it's still early days and they could very well come on. Obviously been quite a bit of investment in their spine & expecting a midfielder to be taken with their first this year. I'm also a big fan of Nicks, think he's going to be a fantastic coach.

North have invested big in the midfield & hoping that we add Horne or Callaghan to complete our 7 u23 midfield group - Simpkin, Davies-Uniacke, Stephenson, Thomas, Phillips, Powell & ???. The midfield is without a doubt our strength, however the investment we've made there, has left holes in other areas - particularly our back 6 & forward line. Hoping we can address those over the next two drafts.
 
the big lebowski said:
So a little more info now that we are 2/3 through the season. The crows played very well at the start of the season, with a nice blend of youth and experience. It does look like he wheels have fallen off as we approach the end of the season but there are plenty of positives. North is the opposite, barely being called a footy side for the first 1/3 of the season, but everything seems to be clicking now and we are now ultra competitive. The difference in the two doggies games highlights this.

The point of this thread was to contrast the way the rebuilds were progressing and to discuss the manner it which the football departments have gone to achieve their desired outcome.

Adelaide have seemed to go with the traditional line of thinking that you go KPP first given they take time and mids come on quicker.

Fogarty - first picked in 2017 and whilst he didn’t have a set position, it seems the crows have baulked him up to play KPF.

Jones - first picked in 2018 and doesn’t fit my narrative.

McAsey - first picked in 2019 and a KPD

Thilthorpe - doesn’t need explaining

Main point is 3/4 of these valuable first draft selections have been used on KPP.

Meanwhile North have over the same period down the complete opposite targeting mids, building from the inside out. Personally I feel that the wider afl community is a little asleep to the future midfield North has put together:

Jy Simpkin (age 23) - is now basically a 30 possession per week player. Future captain. He tricks but can be inconsistent with disposal.

LDU (age 22) - what were glimpses are now regular occurrences. As he’s got fitter he’s literally exploding in performance and from packs. Watching him set up goals while avoiding 4 tackles is a thing of beauty.

Stephenson (age 22) - doubts on midfield potential were b*tch slapped out of town after a blistering 38 disposal game last week. Obviously versatile and still a work in progress but if he can play to 80% of this game on a regular basis he becomes one of the best wingman in the comp.

Thomas (age 21) - also exploded into the second highest ranked under 22 player in the comp (ahead of the superstar sam Walsh). Like Stephenson it’s still up in the air as to how he is best utililised but versatility can only be a good thing.

Tom Powell (age 19) - drafted as a ball pig, and I believe averaged the most disposals out of all the draftees. Looks composed, tough, great handball, neat skills and quicker than I was expecting.

Will Phillips (age 19) - some said North made a mistake taking Will over Logan McDonald. I may be proved wrong but i wanted them to take Will at the time and would make the same decision again right now. He’ll be the anchor of our midfield in 5 years time.

Pick 1/2 2021 - I have no doubt we will use this pick on the best mid available this year. Horne if pick 1, Callaghan if pick 2.

The point of the above is that it will be 7 first round picks on mids (stevo was a trade), completely different to how the crows have gone.
Click to expand...

We've also selected McHenry, and Pedlar with first-round picks in this period (Pedlar was chosen before Powell), as much as Ned was a hail mary of sorts to replace Cameron as a defensive small forward. So, we haven't completely discounted the midfield side of things (along with Jones, who after a rocky start is starting to piece together some good football).
 

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Golumless said:
We've also selected McHenry, and Pedlar with first-round picks in this period (Pedlar was chosen before Powell), as much as Ned was a hail mary of sorts to replace Cameron as a defensive small forward. So, we haven't completely discounted the midfield side of things (along with Jones, who after a rocky start is starting to piece together some good football).
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Ah yes forgot you had 2 firsts last year
 
Psicosis said:
Really like what both sides are doing.

Adelaide have a couple gems coming through that aren't getting spoken about anywhere near enough IMO - Schoenberg, Berry, Butts. As well as the high prized pick in Thilthorpe. Obviously the Jones, McAsey & Fog drafts hurt a little bit, but it's still early days and they could very well come on. Obviously been quite a bit of investment in their spine & expecting a midfielder to be taken with their first this year. I'm also a big fan of Nicks, think he's going to be a fantastic coach.
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Butts looks outstanding. Beats his man but looks to have lots of potential as an interceptor too. Really like what he's done this year. I agree with you on the Crows. I like what they're building and, like us, I reckon they've struck a good balance between playing youth and supporting them with the right senior players.
 
What happened here? Adelaide are a long way ahead of North, despite both clubs starting their rebuilds at the same time.

Adelaide aren't far behind Fremantle in their rebuild now, despite Fremantle starting their rebuild before Adelaide.

At least we now know North can afford to bottom out. Remember when people said North would be in danger of folding if they bottomed out? North have won 11 games since the start of 2020 and are in no danger of folding.
 
Taper said:
What happened here? Adelaide are a long way ahead of North, despite both clubs starting their rebuilds at the same time.

Adelaide aren't far behind Fremantle in their rebuild now, despite Fremantle starting their rebuild before Adelaide.

At least we now know North can afford to bottom out. Remember when people said North would be in danger of folding if they bottomed out? North have won 11 games since the start of 2020 and are in no danger of folding.
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You been living under a rock?
 
Taper said:
What happened here? Adelaide are a long way ahead of North, despite both clubs starting their rebuilds at the same time.

Adelaide aren't far behind Fremantle in their rebuild now, despite Fremantle starting their rebuild before Adelaide.

At least we now know North can afford to bottom out. Remember when people said North would be in danger of folding if they bottomed out? North have won 11 games since the start of 2020 and are in no danger of folding.
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What do you mean? They have the best youth. Just ask a BigFooty poll from 2020 that North fans still try to use as justification in 2023
 
Can you imagine if Taylor Walker hadn't already signed that one year contract extension when he was exposed for saying something regrettable to an opponent?

Adelaide are enjoying his, at least recent, career best form and were weeks away from him being shown the door years ago.
 
Adelaide is an example of doing a rebuild right (with the right infrastructure in place). North on the other hand have turned an 'aggressive reset' at the end of 2016 into a near decade of futility and despair.

Think we're on the right path now but don't have the track record to back that up.
 
Taylor said:
Can you imagine if Taylor Walker hadn't already signed that one year contract extension when he was exposed for saying something regrettable to an opponent?

Adelaide are enjoying his, at least recent, career best form and were weeks away from him being shown the door years ago.
Click to expand...

he never said anything to an opponent
 
Ocha905 said:
Adelaide is an example of doing a rebuild right (with the right infrastructure in place). North on the other hand have turned an 'aggressive reset' at the end of 2016 into a near decade of futility and despair.

Think we're on the right path now but don't have the track record to back that up.
Click to expand...

Taper said:
What happened here? Adelaide are a long way ahead of North, despite both clubs starting their rebuilds at the same time.

Adelaide aren't far behind Fremantle in their rebuild now, despite Fremantle starting their rebuild before Adelaide.

At least we now know North can afford to bottom out. Remember when people said North would be in danger of folding if they bottomed out? North have won 11 games since the start of 2020 and are in no danger of folding.
Click to expand...

Loss of the $3m from Tas will hurt their bottom line. Other Clubs will come for their few good youngsters. Not sure if their games at Docklands have improved this year.

Still buying overrated players on good coin who let them down. They fill the team sheet with the result the team selected is not all that young.

the Clarko appointment and winning their first two games helped put pep into the step of their fans but with no end in sight of the current losing streak, their crowds will likely drop.
 
Grand Uncle Horace said:
Loss of the $3m from Tas will hurt their bottom line. Other Clubs will come for their few good youngsters. Not sure if their games at Docklands have improved this year.

Still buying overrated players on good coin who let them down. They fill the team sheet with the result the team selected is not all that young.

the Clarko appointment and winning their first two games helped put pep into the step of their fans but with no end in sight of the current losing streak, their crowds will likely drop.
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With the chances of North either merging or relocating not being a possibility anymore, it's either survive or fold.

Do you think North could fold? I personally think we'll all be dead before North fold. The club is like a cockroach when it comes to surviving.

If North haven't been in danger of folding despite winning 11 games since the start of 2020, having their prized number 1 draft pick walk out on them and refusing to take an ice bath, along with the coaching situations they've had to deal with on top of all that, then it's safe to say North are here to stay.
 
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