Transgender

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Please be aware that the tolerance of anti-trans language on BF is at an all-time low. Jokes and insults that are trans-related, as well as anti-trans and bigoted rhetoric will be met with infractions, threadbans etc as required. It's a sensitive (and important) topic, so behave like well-mannered adults when discussing it, PARTICULARLY when disagreeing. This equally applies across the whole site.
 
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but that's all it really is - something to get used to. Mr and Mrs and Miss, as gender-specific terms, originated from Master and Mistress, words that fell out of favour and became archaic. Only the female form had to instantly divulge marital status while Mr remained perfectly noncommittal.

The noncommittal female form Ms didn't come along for a very long time. People had to get used to that. Social etiquette and tolerances changed, because they had to. The world was moving on.

This is just one more thing. One more change to get used to.

Those terms ultimately don't mean much. If you want to be called Mr or Mrs or Miss or Ms Geelong_Sicko you do you.

At the end of the day humans are mammals and we make provisions as a society based on age, sex, race etc. I don't play junior sports any more because I'm 36. I haven't been sent a free bowel cancer test kit because I'm not aged 50-74. I'm not afforded a free cervical cancer screening test every 2 years because I'm not a woman aged 18-70. I'm not eligible for Abstudy because I'm not an ATSI person nor am I studying. Etc. How many of these things should I be allowed to identify my way into?

I think once you reach the point of saying 'people who menstruate' and 'individuals with a cervix' it's getting silly.
 
Those terms ultimately don't mean much. If you want to be called Mr or Mrs or Miss or Ms Geelong_Sicko you do you.

At the end of the day humans are mammals and we make provisions as a society based on age, sex, race etc. I don't play junior sports any more because I'm 36. I haven't been sent a free bowel cancer test kit because I'm not aged 50-74. I'm not afforded a free cervical cancer screening test every 2 years because I'm not a woman aged 18-70. I'm not eligible for Abstudy because I'm not an ATSI person nor am I studying. Etc. How many of these things should I be allowed to identify my way into?

I think once you reach the point of saying 'people who menstruate' and 'individuals with a cervix' it's getting silly.
'child-bearers'
 
Those terms ultimately don't mean much. If you want to be called Mr or Mrs or Miss or Ms Geelong_Sicko you do you.

At the end of the day humans are mammals and we make provisions as a society based on age, sex, race etc. I don't play junior sports any more because I'm 36. I haven't been sent a free bowel cancer test kit because I'm not aged 50-74. I'm not afforded a free cervical cancer screening test every 2 years because I'm not a woman aged 18-70. I'm not eligible for Abstudy because I'm not an ATSI person nor am I studying. Etc. How many of these things should I be allowed to identify my way into?

I think once you reach the point of saying 'people who menstruate' and 'individuals with a cervix' it's getting silly.

I honestly think that, aside from the outright bigots and religious zealots of various stripes, it largely comes down to how flexible you are in adapting to change. All these new terms, I honestly don't care about using new terminology. Will I trip up from time to time and will I use terms I've grown up with and grown used to saying? You bet I will. I guarantee that I will f*ck it up at some point.

But its never going to come from a place of malice.

I'll persevere with it and I'll learn and I'll hopefully become a better person for sticking at it. I really think it's just too much change far too soon for some, and I think its that way for many people who show concern on this topic and not actual bigotry or transphobia.
 

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Shame kirsti seems to have been hounded out of here. Be interesting to hear her comments at being quoted extensively below.



There's a few weird comments in that one.

We've basically seen what happens when you take women and pump them full of testosterone in the 70s and 80s already. They still don't break men's world records.

There's some evidence that in ultra-endurance events women close the gap to men, to the point of sometimes winning them outright, but I wouldn't think the 3000m Steeplechase, Triathlon or Marathon are anywhere near long enough for that to occur.

Seems like an article very light on for evidence to support what people are saying, including that 'Tyler' example.
 
Until you know what...

167115568_10158082489910976_1144471372070132304_n.png
 
Shame kirsti seems to have been hounded out of here. Be interesting to hear her comments at being quoted extensively below.


Last 2 lines says it all.

“My dream is to divide sport by categories of physical ability, and not have one or two categories, so athletes are celebrated for being humans, not male or female.”
 
Last 2 lines says it all.

“My dream is to divide sport by categories of physical ability, and not have one or two categories, so athletes are celebrated for being humans, not male or female.”
The * are they talking about?

They want to create the English Football Association of running?
 
The fu** are they talking about?

They want to create the English Football Association of running?
Sounds like they want weight divisions and not gender divisions for all sports. Well that will eliminate all females from sport.
 
I do wonder where you draw the line on being nice though. Do you pander to someone's mental illness? Or do you address it?
We pander to greedy rich billionaires like clive custard guts palmer

Tell me hes mentally stable

We bend over backwards to pander to sociopathic arsewipes all the time - take a look at Gina and her father
 
That's just one scenario. Caitlyn Jenner was immediately accepted as a woman by some before any snippy snippy took place.

A journo in the UK who gave birth to a child applied to be listed as the child's father. Right, so who is the child's mother then? People who are born as one sex and transition are able to have their birth certificates altered to say otherwise. This stuff is dangerous. We shouldn't be giving people carte blanche to make up their own definitions and rules to suit how they feel about their identity.
Isnt it amazing that the right can say that last sentence with a straight face....
 

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Lang was a good bloke in the 70s.

<<< Mr Hancock, who discovered iron ore in the Pilbara, once called for part-Aboriginals to be sterilised.

He also dismissed indigenous land claims, saying: “The question of Aboriginal land rights and things of this nature shouldn’t exist.”

He referred to part-Aboriginal people as “no-good half-castes” and said to deal with those who were unemployed he would “dope the water up so that they were sterile and would breed themselves out in the future>>>

Sensational bloke .......
 
<<< Mr Hancock, who discovered iron ore in the Pilbara, once called for part-Aboriginals to be sterilised.

He also dismissed indigenous land claims, saying: “The question of Aboriginal land rights and things of this nature shouldn’t exist.”

He referred to part-Aboriginal people as “no-good half-castes” and said to deal with those who were unemployed he would “dope the water up so that they were sterile and would breed themselves out in the future>>>

Sensational bloke .......
Tell me both of you are mentally stable...
 
1500 m, not a 4 minute mile, who is confused? A mile is 1610 metres.
FYI Herb Elliot ran a 1500m world record at 1958 of 3.36. At that time he also held the world mark for the mile of 3.54.
Can you read?

The line literally (not figuratively, don't get confused now) states '1500m' not 'a mile'.
 
Bruce Jenner should stfu.

C'mon Gough, just because Caitlyn is a conservative transgender person that doesn't invalidate her chosen identity. According to this article though, her own views and that of the Republican Party that she is a member of are somewhat dysphoric.

Caitlyn Jenner says transgender girls in women's sports is 'unfair'
Jenner changed her position on trans people competing in sports in what some are calling an effort to pander to Republican voters.
May 4, 2021, 1:56 AM AEST

Caitlyn Jenner, the former Olympic champion and reality TV personality now running for governor in California, said she opposes transgender girls competing in girls' sports at school.

Jenner, a 1976 decathlon gold medalist who came out as a transgender woman in 2015, told a TMZ reporter on Saturday that it's “a question of fairness.”

“That's why I oppose biological boys who are trans competing in girls' sports in school. It just isn't fair. And we have to protect girls’ sports in our schools,” Jenner said Saturday during a brief interview in a Malibu parking lot.

It was Jenner's first comment on the issue since announcing her candidacy to replace Gov. Gavin Newsom, a Democrat, in a recall election. Five states have passed laws or implemented executive orders this year limiting the ability of transgender youths to play sports or receive certain medical treatment. There’s been a vehement outcry from supporters of transgender rights.

Jenner, a Republican, supported Donald Trump in the 2016 presidential election but later criticized his administration for some discriminatory actions against transgender people.

Many transgender rights advocates have criticized Jenner, saying she has failed to convince them that she is a major asset to their cause...


...Equality California, an LGBTQ advocacy organization, wrote: "Here are the facts: Caitlyn Jenner is willing to sacrifice the health & well-being of trans kids to win votes. Gavin Newsom is not. It’s that simple."

Others pointed out that, as recently as last year, Jenner supported trans athletes competing on the sports teams that align with their gender identity.

“I think every trans person, if they’re into athletics, should have an opportunity to compete and to improve themselves," Jenner said in April 2020 on theOutsports podcast, The Trans Sporter Room, according to Forbes. "I think sports is such a great way to learn a lot about yourself... Hopefully they’ll have the opportunity in the future to do whatever they can do. I’m all for it. I’m all for it.”

She echoed a similarly supportive sentiment in 2015, when she received the Arthur Ashe Courage Award at the ESPY Awards, and spoke about issues affecting trans people.

“I also want to acknowledge all the young trans athletes who are out there — given the chance to play sports as who they really are,” she said in her acceptance speech. “And now, as of this week, it appears that trans people will soon be serving in the military. That’s a great idea. We have come a long way. But we have a lot of work to do.”

Advocates say Jenner's flip-flop is evidence that she's changed her public view just to attract the attention of California's Republican voters.

But trans people say that her comment won't be without consequence, and that it could help people behind anti-trans legislation justify their views.

"Jenner is gonna be America's 'some of my friends are trans' trans woman that allows countless conservatives a little cover to decimate our rights," trans filmmaker and author Leigh Finke said. "Not that they'll succeed, but it's the elbow room they need to better make their case, and hurt our kids."

I think it's a similar situation to what Peter Garrett found when he joined the Australian Labor Party. Many of his own political beliefs had to be locked up tight and hidden from Party direction and Party views.

I guess the lesson here is to be careful who you sell your soul to.
 
Vote Jenner!

But what if she's in there to destroy the Grand Old Party from within? What if staunch U.S religious conservatives have an identity crisis and start doubting their own existence on that nation's political spectrum? Are you really saying "vote to destroy the Republican Party through transgender inclusion?"

You might be onto something here, FK;)
 
But what if she's in there to destroy the Grand Old Party from within? What if staunch U.S religious conservatives have an identity crisis and start doubting their own existence on that nation's political spectrum? Are you really saying "vote to destroy the Republican Party through transgender inclusion?"

You might be onto something here, FK;)
I'm a progressive man, with progressive ideas. Just gotta destroy the DNC too though, get some new parties in not run by rich old corrupt warmongers.
 
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