Review Round 3 = Collingwood 72-73 Brisbane

[Timmy from Thomastown]

If you don’t see an issue with Cox & Moore not taking a contested mark between them, I can’t help ya.

No i dont, unless its a trend that we see repeated. Otherwise its a statistical anomoly.

FYI Cox took four marks which is his career average
Moore took seven marks and his career average is 5

So its not as if they werent taking marks. You dont get bonus points for "contested marks"

 

[jjsmitty8]

Agree with most of what you said, what most people are frustrated by is the continued games of the same passengers week in week out who are not good enough. Some personnel changes are needed

And I’m absolutely on board with you all there. I could’ve reeled off a whole bunch of negatives, but then I’d just be saying what everyone else is saying haha. Gotta take some good out of it

 

[Kirby]

The annoying thing and what really stinks is that we should have won, we blew it and shat the bed.

 

[foreigner]

As per Buckley the hitout dominance is overrated. Then why in the world are we paying big bucks for a dominant ruckman if that doesn't or can't give us an advantage. Wouldn't it be better to invest that money in an area where we can get a bloody advantage?

 

[Piesinmyeyes]

On reflection, thou we probably should have won, we have much to look forward too.
Daicos and IQ are 200 game players
Cox has improved
Sier is getting form
Moore is all Australian
If half of Reed, McMahon, Macrae, Poulter, Chugg, Henry, Murphy and McCreery are any good we will be alright
Plus N Daicos next year
Not all bad methinks....

 

[DinoSoar]

Same old story for us, inefficient and we don’t capitalise when we are on top. Pretty disgraceful not being able to put away an unprepared Brisbane side. Buckley in the press conference basically said that taps don’t lead to clearances, so then why is the most paid player in our team the ruckman.

I find it useful therapy doing this after a loss.

Grundy- despite I just said was clearly on top all game. Followed up well, tackled took some hangers...was unlucky not to convert his set shot.

Pendles - was next best, did it all under pressure. Floated back with the flight to intercept at one point. That’s what you want from the captain, used his smarts to dissect the press nicely all night.

IQ - was probably third best for me. Kept Cameron from his destructive best and rebounded superbly.

Roughhead - was the next best defender, intercepted and rebounded well by foot. Coming back to some nice form.

Moore - was beaten on the night, his rebound was effective but no where near as much of it tonight.

Howe - seemed to forget about his injury in the last quarter when we needed him most. He’s a champ and he’s building confidence nicely.

Maynard- has been pretty quiet, not sure what his role was on the night. He too spent time on Cameron.

Noble - was ok. I don’t really like him with the ball, I need to learn to trust.

Madgen - was better tonight, but still too slow, no leap andhis kicking was off tonight too. I think he struggles with intensity and pressure.

Sidebottom - has one of his worst games, was just so uncharacteristically wasteful. Didn’t tackle, was getting frustrated...gave away free kicks. Very undisciplined and cost us the game ultimately.

Adams - did his thing, didn’t tackle as much and was also down on last weeks output. Turned it over by foot which was not helpful at all.

Crisp - did his usual thing also. Broke the lines, kicked well tonight. But another than only had one tackle. Tackling was a strength, that’s twice now we’ve been beaten in that department.

Thomas - had a great game for a role player. Set us up early, with some deft touches and knocks. His pressure kept us in it in the second half. Hope he continues with more of this.

Degoey - is so wasteful! I hope we don’t yield to media pressure and put him on a massive contract. Zero tackles is not acceptable.

Daicos - has so much class, and we need more of it! Rarely wastes a possession and like Pendlebury he finds a target. Needs to play four quarters which can be tough when you’re moved from position to position. He will develop into a great player.

T Brown - the kid will be a great player for us... but should really be developing in the twos! He fumbles the ball too much.

C Brown - I love how he lifts when we need the intensity to increase. He created some chances in the last term. If only he could kick! I knew that set shot was missing.

Cox - is getting himself in position, not running under the ball... but he needs to hold his marks. I love his ruck work, field kicking and his generally trick bag when the ball is in play. Must be more assertive.

Mihocek - built into the game, he’s another that lifts when you need him too. Tough night for forwards with our delivery yet again.

Sier - had his best game, cleared the ball better and was less fumbling. Tackled with intent. I liked his game.

WHE - needs to build form in the twos. He is too timid. Gifting games won’t help that.Doesn’t need many possessions to have an impact, he just needs more than 6. Dropped that uncontested mark in the 50 which is inexcusable.

Mayne - had a very Mayne. Heaps of pressure, unambitious with ball in hand but he doesn’t waste it. Love how hard he goes.

Good post, with some reasoned analysis of our disappointing loss. Thanks for that, as it adds more to the discussion and analysis than melts.

I didn’t post anything after the game last night, reading the thread on the train going home made the loss all the worse. Good to see the thread was cleaned up (thanks mods) as there was some shitposting in here last night, not cool.

 

[Timmy from Thomastown]

Shocking way to lose. Didn’t hear the siren just saw the Lions players going crazy

Game itself was more of what 2021 is looking like. Fast, less defence and more mistakes. Both sides played well

Always hurts to get out to that lead and we looked good in a lot of way. A few of the better players, Moore, Adams, De Goey were down but most of the rest played well. WHE the obvious exception

Noble. Really solid, lots of link running and provides and out let. Manages ok 1:1

Sier . Clear step up tonight, really strong game and some deft inside work

Roughy. Was immense. Best game for the club

Daics . Just class with the ball

Thomas. Very good tonight, was down last week but combined with round 1 having a good season

T Brown. Growing into the game. Goes about quietly, don’t think will ever be a star but a solid contributor

C. Brown. Worked really hard and good game apart from the miss. That hurt.

WHE. Totally devoid of confidence and not going in. Needs the VFL.

Madgen. Plenty of good moments. Dependable and plays a role

Mayne. Hard at it, solid game

WHE is the only one who goes out.

Not sure who comes in

Good summary, although youre being a bit forgiving of C Brown because I think his exposed weaknesses in that game go beyond a simple set shot for goal
You forgot Quaynor... he was fantastic.
Roughead was enormous
Mayne and Thomas huge early in the game
Sidebottom was down but he had a huge last quarter to make up for the other three quarters
I dont get the Madgen hate. Hes a key in defence for us, especially if the backline is going to proceed without Crisp. More creative and reliable than people give him credit for.
I'm a fan of Sier.

 

[pietoon]

I don’t understand all the negativity. Yep, we lost, and I’m as shattered as everyone else. I sat in my seat in silence for a good 15-20 minutes after the game, haven’t been that flat about a loss since the 2018 GF.

In saying that, there was so much to like from last night.
- How good was IQ on Charlie Cameron? The kid is a ripper.
- Brodie was back to his best. I know his competition wasn’t much, but I won’t hear a bad word about him. His follow up work and tackle pressure was first class. He had a ruthless edge to his game last night and he wanted to punish Tom Fullarton aerobically and physically and that’s what he did.
- He gets a lot of hate, but Coxy competed well all night I felt.
- I thought the Bear had a strong game too, floated in and out but I was really pleased by his game.
- Our backline is ultra reliable, arguably the best in the league. It has a great balance of key defenders, rebounding defenders and intercept marking.

To me, at the end of the day, Brisbane ARE a powerful side in the competition. We were up to our eyeballs in winning that game and probably should’ve. However, when there’s less than a goal in it, everything that’s happened for the first 100+ minutes doesn’t matter anymore, it’s how you handle the clutch moments. Brisbane handled it better, like the better side that they are, and we just didn’t measure up when the heat was on.

I’m super proud, shattered and hoping some personnel changes are made, but if we play like that most weeks and learn from our mistakes we’ll win our fair share of games and start trending upwards.

Thanks for your considered balanced summary, it was a pleasure to read after all the crap that has been posted by the overweight keyboard heroes, trolls and idiots that have NFI...

 

[jshster]

I felt like vomiting the moment I saw that Cal was taking that set shot

Yet another one of the umpire stuff ups from the night. Pendles and Cox were in the tackle ..... how the hell does Brown get the kick? I'd take Pendles and Cox any day of the week. And while it was the correct call.... how the hell can the umpire work out that the ball just fell out when he was behind Andrews.... you can't call what you don't see.

 

[BringouttheGimp]

They should dock the Madge's entire annual salary and just allow him to use the facilities for free as a nice gesture..

What a player re. What a player re.

 

[jshster]

The only thing more diabolical than the umpiring is our decision making.

And the only thing more diabolical than our decision making is our league-worst, confused as fu**, undefinable, embarrassing, preschooler-level indictment of a gameplan.

Hope you enjoy the heat you just turned on yourself, Bucks - it’s gonna get absolutely blistering soon, and the only bloke you can blame is staring you right back in the mirror.

Can you please explain to me what the Lions gameplan was compared to ours? Serious question.

 

[riddick78]

It's time for players to take resposibilty and kick for goal, instead of trying to hit up players and failing. Jeremy Howe showed us the way!

When he kicked that goal, it felt like he just had enough of watching our forwards fail and showed them how it's done.

I hate these statements. I heard it after the 2018 GF and 2019 prelim too. We led all night. We were the only team that broke out to a 25 point lead and looked likely to break the game open. If Brisbane were so deserving why were they behind all night and why did they need a kick after the siren to win?

We lost this game, Brisbane didn't win it, all we had to do was hold posession but deciced to kick down the line, which was the worse thing to do. I don't know how many times i see a Brisbane player make the ball in our fwd 50 and slingshot it back.

Biggest weakness for me after three weeks is the ability for the opposition to go from our 50 to theirs with little to no pressure.

No forward pressure, simple really, it's like our fwds rely on our backmen to slingshot it back to them, no reall attempt to keep it in our fwd 50.


I don't get the Nobel bashing, i thought he played really well.

Roughie played well in the backline, i remember seeing him in the backline in the last q when it was in our fwd 50, hunched over, he was exhausted, he still kept going though, hold your head high.

Moore wasn't his dominate self, but i get the feeling he was delegated a lock down role and Howe was intercept.

WHE, when a forward won't kick for goal and kicks it to the opposition, i loved him in 2018, even 2019, but time for him to go back to the 2's, he SHOULD NOT get rewarded with a game next week.

JDG, the man that wanted 1 million dollars, you want Dusty money, play like Dusty, tries to be cute. Only the start of the season and hoping for a break out for him, but i'm fast losing my patience with this kid.

It was good to see Grundy back to his dominate self, he was better around the ground. But really his opponent was a kid, so i'm kinda diregarding his ruck work. But really that's the way he should be against a kid, lets just hope he can dominate the more experienced/mature ruckman.

 

[Axl the great]

I can't fathom how the same errors in the way we play keep happening but are not being rectified, Our issues are 99% structural and it lies in our forward set up and our positioning and entries.
Last night was criminal to lose that game, absolutely unacceptable!!!! Some games you are forced into poor entries due to dominance by the opposition or they way they set up in defence but we had it on a platter and stuffed it big time.
We had enough time and space to enter the 50 with relatively easy possession but couldn't hit a target, the story is the same and the pattern repeats itself far too often at this club.
Our players inside 50 seem clueless as to how to create space and find pockets of space and our kickers seem too stupid to kick to advantage and use footy intelligence and find those players.
On natural instinct even park footballers could do better, that tells me there is confusion and in my opinion too much information and strategy in players heads, just let them play! sometimes less is more.
Imagine Richmond or Geelong with as many easy unpressured entries what we get most weeks? That's where we need to get too and it has been not happening for far too long.
I actually don't think we are that far off, something is hampering the team and my suspicion is the coaching staff, Oh and the fact there are 3 or 4 passengers picked every week who are not up to scratch.
We have early and talented picks playing seconds who need to be exposed early, I am sick of seeing C Brown run around and fumble and get pushed off ground contests, WHE don't even get me started about the laziness and ineffective player he is, JT puts in but is not up to it and there are probably one or two more.
Even on a winning streak under Bucks we don't have that polished, ruthless look of a really really good side and I think time is up for the lot of them to be honest.

 

[jshster]

My only comment until next week

We lost it they didn’t win it, yeah umpiring was pathetic but we butchered the ball all night, no system in the middle, hit and hope and with absolute f’ed spuds like

Noble
Brown
Brown
Madgen
Mayne
WHE
Thomas

Maynard, Crisp & Sidebottom sadly out of form, we deserve to be a bottom 4 team

I would normally be ripping the house down but really don’t care about tonight’s lose, seriously isn’t it what we expect from a team like this by now?

Until next time.


On iPhone using BigFooty.com mobile app

Quiet reminder that Crisp has 35 touches last week.... or do you mean just last night. Agree on Maynard and Sidey. Harsh on Noble, Madgen and Mayne (100% efficiency FYI). Thomas was amazing in the opening 15 minutes and then disappeared pretty much for the rest of the game.

It's all on us if you ask me. And mostly fixable with a bit of hard work ... IMO!

 

[jshster]

Oh,I forgot to mention,one Sidebottom.He’s fast joining that list of sub standard players.Every time he got the ball,he either fumbled,coughed it up,or made a turnover.Just pathetic from a player who is supposed to be one of our most skilled players.

It's early days yet but I fear Sidey might go the way of one A. Didak. Sometimes they gradually go down hill and sometimes they fall off a cliff..... and you usually don't see the cliff coming. Pendles was horrid in week 1, better but still uncharacteristic errors in week 2 but back close to his best last night. Let's hope that's the trending we see from Sidey. His run is still there but his skills are letting him down.

 

[Scodog10]

This is all in the context of me not watching the last quarter. It had a 2019 PF s**t show finish written all over it so I left at 3QT.

Last nights match was decided in the 15 minutes following Cox putting us 25 points up. At that stage I don’t think I’d even seen a contending team with their season on the line as flat as Brisbane had been. There was no run in their legs and they were scoring exclusively off the rebound and clearance. It makes obvious sense why, but all we had to do was hold that lead to HT and we win with a leg in the air.

I actually don’t know how else to break down the result. We’re a middle of the road team that just couldn’t land the KO blow against a contender that was well and truly on the ropes. It happens. It would have been nice to do it with a few more kids in the line up so they could take some lessons out of it, but I genuinely don’t know if we’d have been in the same position with McReery/ Henry>WHE/ C Brown. That would be the one concern I have with pressing pause on the kids. Although there are opportunities.

I’m growing increasingly frustrated with the use of JDG. People bang on about him being our best forward and I don’t see it. He too often gets stuck in wrestling matches and with congestion will struggle to get one out. That means he needs it coming in well on the lead which is a challenge for our midfield. Ultimately all I see is a guy that is splitting his time between mid and forward then doing neither at a consistently good standard.

WOG for me was Sidebottom. I don’t expect much more from the likes of WHE or C Brown, but some of Steele’s missed targets and poor decision making were disgraceful from a senior player. I also think the criticism of T Brown has been harsh. I’m not wrapt with how he’s building, but I’m not concerned, yet. Finally Madgen is the slowest player on our list I mean some oddly knock Murphy for pace and say Madgen can play tall or small, but I don’t see it and if Murphy is slower than Madgen I’ll buy a Carlton membership!!

 

[Chrispiesssss]

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Bloke shows more fight than JT & WHE combined.

Disgusting behaviour. Umps didn’t cost us the game.

 

[Timmy from Thomastown]

C

It's early days yet but I fear Sidey might go the way of one A. Didak. Sometimes they gradually go down hill and sometimes they fall off a cliff..... and you usually don't see the cliff coming. Pendles was horrid in week 1, better but still uncharacteristic errors in week 2 but back close to his best last night. Let's hope that's the trending we see from Sidey. His run is still there but his skills are letting him down.

Sidey was good last week and was pretty good in the clinches in the last quarter last night. He'll be fine.

 

[Linda_Lovelace]

Thew awful thing about last night was you just knew it was coming, such is the history of the club. I actually just started laughing at the predictability of it all.

When the game is slow without a lot of pressure we can move the ball OK, hit targets nicely and look half decent. But as soon as the speed and pressure of the game go up many of our players fall away. We lack leg speed all over the ground, especially in the middle. Can't break lines and with the rule changes the contested ball types are being exposed as very one dimensional. I like Sier but think he is almost redundant now.

The list is not good, the balance of the side is poor and there is not much depth. Still should have won this game, quite easily given Brisbane outs and their week re COVID. And the coaching is a real worry, lack of innovation and ability to make changes in game is really hurting us also.

Going to be a long year.

 

[JM#1]

When the final siren went, seeing WHE on the ground, it really didn't even seem like he cared. Mentally he seems checked out as if he's just playing out his contract.

 

[Rusty Beam]

Just re watched the last 3 minutes of the game.

De Goey should hang his head in shame. His complete lack of effort to first contest and then pressure with 30 seconds to go was atrocious.

 

[lenny20]

Can you please explain to me what the Lions gameplan was compared to ours? Serious question.

Sure thing – the teams set up similarly with both trying to create a spare behind the ball, and both committing numbers to the midfield contest. The stark difference between the two were the structures and ball movement.

In the back half, Brisbane were able to generate a meaningful spare man (usually Andrews) and get the ball into the hands of their elite ball users (usually Rich), allowing them to methodically short pass their way out of defence time and time again. Collingwood defended stoutly, but the Brisbane forwards worked well as a unit to separate the Pies defenders and create space. Collingwood struggled to generate any real drive off their half back line. Their ball movement was stilted and risk-averse. Their structure didn't allow them to attack the corridor like Brisbane did (most notably in the game's final play).

Most starkly, moving forward, Collingwood's structure was (and has been for years) absolutely terrible. Players struggle to generate space, find separation, or present an option for the ball carrier. Multiple players lead to the same area of the forward fifty, congesting the entire attacking zone. More often than not, this leads to a long kick to a contest in a clogged forward half. Brisbane, however, time and time again managed to hit up players on the lead, out the back, and in dangerous one-on-one contests isolated against their defender. Their leading lanes worked brilliantly, their forwards worked intelligently together to create space, and as a result the looks the Lions got were 1000% more dangerous than the looks the Pies forwards got.

Gameplan/structure wise it's like comparing a well-drilled Premier League team who work as one entity to spread and separate their opponent and create meaningful forward opportunities... to the Croydon U12's who, though they try their guts out, all just swarm to the ball and hack it forward blindly.

 

[Chrispiesssss]

Mihocek doesn’t hit up De Goey with 5 mins to go. Goes long. Turnover.

Mihocek 50 meter penalty.

 

[bucksisbest]

This is all in the context of me not watching the last quarter. It had a 2019 PF sh*t show finish written all over it so I left at 3QT.

Last nights match was decided in the 15 minutes following Cox putting us 25 points up. At that stage I don’t think I’d even seen a contending team with their season on the line as flat as Brisbane had been. There was no run in their legs and they were scoring exclusively off the rebound and clearance. It makes obvious sense why, but all we had to do was hold that lead to HT and we win with a leg in the air.

As well as he played Howe started the rot by giving away a dumb free kick for them to directly goal off.

Might seem harsh, but the team has always lacked a ruthless edge and takes the foot off and has costly avoidable mental lapses.

Langdon not rushing the behind in the 18 grand final similarly got west coast back in the game.

 

[Maggie5]

Why are you shocked he isn't a good coach

What would you have done in the last couple of minutes?