Autopsy Rd 5 BELTED! Power turns the Blues lights out

[Pentatonic Flat Fifth]

Rarely do I agree with most pundits, but I agree with all of the media whacks I've read/heard in the last 24 hours. The questions re: development, softness, Cripps, etc are all on the mark and must be addressed by the club. Even Kane fricken Cornes has our number...

I question development - however consider this, if Dow, Obrien and SPS were all playing perfect footy - we would have an almost perfect development scenario....even Owies kicked 4 on the weekend.

I have ZERO doubts about Kemp, Carroll, Stocker, Philp, Ramsay, Honey, TDK, Parks etc. Even Cunningham after a very shaky start is looking the goods.

I think Dow, O'brien and SPS are questionable, SPS is a massive liability and needs to go forward - Murphy has his role. Dow can play but needs the team around him which is injured. He's young. Obrien - meh.

These players would all be in our firsts right now but for injury -


David Cuningham
Charlie Curnow
Tom De Koning
Zac Fisher
Brodie Kemp
Jack Martin
Nic Newman
Jack Silvagni
Parks

Jack Carroll (was on fire and most likely of our picks)

 

[JustaBattler]

Last quarter was exactly as you describe - locked in our half for 20+ minutes. We would have won in the last quarter but for incredibly poor kicking at goal - this is what is freaking me out about this post match melt down. How many people have re-watched the game.? Very few I suspect.

I don't think people pay enough respect to the opposition teams in here or enough respect to the actual circumstances the Club is in. everything went perfectly right for Port and the reverse for Calton on the day. The difference between the two sides as you point out is Port has a bunch of fit A grade senior players on deck outnumbering Carlton's - all having played for years together - getting to where they are right now.

When we have so many outs from our own developing middling side - and still manage to provide the opportunity to actually win - that is a major positive. Kick the goals that were there to be kicked and we go close to winning or win. That is the positive.

 

[Pentatonic Flat Fifth]

Watch the replay.

 

[mrjones]

Not one Carlton fan is disagreeing, however when Saints lost by 90 points, Suns by 62, Bombers by 57, Hawks 49 & North are 0-5.. For the focus to be on Carlton is ridiculous.

Carlton give the Journalists a bigger target market. More of our supporters know how to read.

 

[Pentatonic Flat Fifth]

I don't think people pay enough respect to the opposition teams in here or enough respect to the actual circumstances the Club is in. everything went perfectly right for Port and the reverse for Calton on the day. The difference between the two sides as you point out is Port has a bunch of fit A grade senior players on deck outnumbering Carlton's - all having played for years together - getting to where they are right now.

When we have so many outs from our own developing middling side - and still manage to provide the opportunity to actually win - that is a major positive. Kick the goals that were there to be kicked and we go close to winning or win. That is the positive.

People desperately want to start winning after so many years and thats all they can think about - I would bet almost no one in here as re-watched this game. Its entirely different experience the second time around.

We played really well considering our position - we had terrible fumbles (SPS in front of goals, oh my god) that killed us. But it was genuinely our goal kicking that cost us - we out scored them - and totally dominated in the last.

Straight kicking and we would have won.

 

[Own The Future]

We played really well and it reflected the poor kicking for goal. Port had 2 x 10 minute patches that tore the game open. Straight kicking (even for both teams) Carlton would have won - and that would have been the upset of the entire season.

With respect - we did not play well at all.
Our game style is not reliable or sustainable.
Bombing it long into the 50 to create a “chaos ball” and keep it locked in there only works if your forwards are all high intensity, high pressure players.
At the moment, the only one who does that is Eddie.
Harry is a witches hat when the other team gets the ball. Levi cannot move. Gov has good burst of speed but doesn’t seem to actual affect/harass the opposition. The less said about Murph’s pressure acts the better.
If Fish, Fog, JSOS and Martin are in there, this approach may work. They chase hard and stick tackles.
Until then we need to employ a more lead and mark approach. Harry is almost impossible to stop on the lead, but he keeps wanting the cheap goal out the back.
Coming out of the D50 is always a nauseating experience. The only person I feel confident with the ball is Weiters (and maybe Saad). Everyone else either takes the wrong option or is inconsistent by foot - including Doc. Chip kicks sideways or backwards allows the press to come and makes us kick down the line to a contest, inevitably leading to an intercept or stoppage.
In short, we didn’t play well. We played right into Port’s hands.

 

[Brighton_Diggins]

Where is our mongrel and fight? What do the old 80's crew sitting at home watching think of this? They lost teeth and broke bones for that jumper. The connection to the past almost feels lost watching that game. It's like half the players don't realise what they're wearing. "oh so this team were really successful once and we're feared and respected"?

Where do you start with a game like this.?
I'm just gonna take a stab at a few things.
Eddie eddie eddie. ? Why lead out and take a mark inside 50 if cannot kick the distance.? I mean, seriously?
Don't leave the goal square. Don't come out. jusy stay there. or no more than a 15 metre arc.

Marc Murphy. I've said it for years. He's about 1 inch too short and 15 kgs too light. amazing player but just can't quite stick phat in the really hard contests.
SPS. out of position. He'll get traded elsewhere for peanuts and become a star. Just not being utilised properly
ZWills. Over desperate but ill pay that. tries and fights at least.
MKen. Had so many chances. revolving door player. get stocker in to replace if he's that good. why wait.
lockfog. Jet. so much upside. tried
Crippa. I've said this before . He sooks to the umpires too much. what they tells me is that he's drinking his own bath water.
Go back to basics. needs to play more on instinct. Could be danger or dusty but his disposal and polish isnt at that echelon.
Harry. Denied a good look at it. Where's the corridor service.? down game but decent f50 entries were a non event.
MMgov. needs to play back. needs to play back .needs to play back. it's so obvious. coaches wake the FORK up here.
Ljones. had a semi mare. but ill let him off he's had a good year other wise and he's saved us in the past
the doc. dropping simple marks under pressure. as a leader and senior player.? unacceptable. lacking self belief. fixable.
Walsh. this guy. the fact hes leading the way at a tender age so early in his career? nuff said for the rest. He tries, he thinks. he delivers. he does his damn job!!!!
the plow. frustrating player. he is simmo reborn. mr 50/50 . one minute good gusty mark and /or spoil. the next brain fade and dumb choice.
Weeto. 10000% ko'd and should've come off. these idiot drs sitting around reviewing footage.? please. he was in lala land. get him off and he stays off. not worth riskign a guy of this calibre when the rest of the side are'nt putting in. I wouldve had him off and jammed mcgov there for a little lesson in effort.
pitto. tries. lops around. does good thing , does a bad thing. squares the ledger. misses a soda.
tom willo. can play. confidence shot. needs a kick up the ass and a reset.
Noons. Classic passenger game.
EdC. what is this guy? what's his role.? i never see him out there. HE's like a dam wall cork.
Gibbo. I like him. he's tricky and creative and tries. in a better side he'd really impress. does enough imo.
LEvi. held the ark together last year so deserves a chance. we should've improved past him by now.
Saad. playing at 60% skills and potential and still doing just enough. not 100% fit.? why risk him?
Cottrell . tries his ring off and plays above his skill set. cant ask for more. if senior, better players lifted he's the trooper who'd follow along and lift with you.

just not good enough. thought winning was probably outta the question deep down. But that was a wet and confused lettuce effort from a lsit of players who are a lot better on paper. Teague and the coaching boys ?over to you. Fantasy football and super coach coaches wouldve done better satdee night i reckon.

 

[Pentatonic Flat Fifth]

one thing that was glaring for me was, an inability or lack of confidence, fitness to break lines and formation resets of opposition
since the Richmond game. Our boys did reset well in turnover situations in that game.
That went missing in the remaining games. The forward entries in the port game, were just dumb, over and over again, same delivery
and same exit out for them. No deliberate bringing the ball to the ground, all trying to pack mark in low percentage situations, mostly on the fat side
I also noticed, many players walking after losing the ball / turnover. Cripps was the worst defender. Its almost as that part of his game has left him .

Port won the game by several freaky break outs rebounds from our forward pressure. The last quarter it almost didn't leave our 50.

 

[Sector 7G]

I question development - however consider this, if Dow, Obrien and SPS were all playing perfect footy - we would have an almost perfect development scenario....even Owies kicked 4 on the weekend.

I have ZERO doubts about Kemp, Carroll, Stocker, Philp, Ramsay, Honey, TDK, Parks etc. Even Cunningham after a very shaky start is looking the goods.

I think Dow, O'brien and SPS are questionable, SPS is a massive liability and needs to go forward - Murphy has his role. Dow can play but needs the team around him which is injured. He's young. Obrien - meh.

These players would all be in our firsts right now but for injury -


David Cuningham
Charlie Curnow
Tom De Koning
Zac Fisher
Brodie Kemp
Jack Martin
Nic Newman
Jack Silvagni
Parks

Jack Carroll (was on fire and most likely of our picks)

For a second I though Soapy V has a new account until I saw you pot LOB. This is some A grade positivity (though I do agree the loss was not as bad as some are making out). Just need to insert some pace and skill.

 

[Pentatonic Flat Fifth]

With respect - we did not play well at all.
Our game style is not reliable or sustainable.
Bombing it long into the 50 to create a “chaos ball” and keep it locked in there only works if your forwards are all high intensity, high pressure players.
At the moment, the only one who does that is Eddie.
Harry is a witches hat when the other team gets the ball. Levi cannot move. Gov has good burst of speed but doesn’t seem to actual affect/harass the opposition. The less said about Murph’s pressure acts the better.
If Fish, Fog, JSOS and Martin are in there, this approach may work. They chase hard and stick tackles.
Until then we need to employ a more lead and mark approach. Harry is almost impossible to stop on the lead, but he keeps wanting the cheap goal out the back.
Coming out of the D50 is always a nauseating experience. The only person I feel confident with the ball is Weiters (and maybe Saad). Everyone else either takes the wrong option or is inconsistent by foot - including Doc. Chip kicks sideways or backwards allows the press to come and makes us kick down the line to a contest, inevitably leading to an intercept or stoppage.
In short, we didn’t play well. We played right into Port’s hands.

Nah. Even Levi was snapping around the corner for goals. So was Mitch. Last quarter was a shellacking - we just couldn't convert.

Thats our problem - in front of goals - thats where its been letting us down for 2 decades - man I used to cringe with Kernahan in front of goals - only Fev, Whitnall, Stevens, Silvagni, Bradley, Ratten, Diesel types have ever made me confident.

Fogarty is great, so is Charlie.

 

[Broadside]

Port lost players and put their cue in the rack near the end. If they were anywhere near threatened they would have put the hammer down. Their field kicking and kicking for goal was much better than ours because we don't apply enough pressure - we are selfish and lazy. It's why Collingwood looked like millionaires with their delivery into the forward line, no pressure was applied! It's much easier to execute skills against Carlton because of this trait.

If we think this performance against a very good side was green shoots or anywhere near acceptable, we are kidding ourselves. But for straight kicking we could have won?! spare me!

 

[Pentatonic Flat Fifth]

For a second I though Soapy V has a new account until I saw you pot LOB. This is some A grade positivity (though I do agree the loss was not as bad as some are making out). Just need to insert some pace and skill.

Melbourne and Doggies have had a pretty easy ride - reckon Tigers and Port would smash both.

We are a LOT better than people think - return of players is going to see us smash some teamsm

 

[JustaBattler]

People desperately want to start winning after so many years and thats all they can think about - I would bet almost no one in here as re-watched this game. Its entirely different experience the second time around.

We played really well considering our position - we had terrible fumbles (SPS in front of goals, oh my god) that killed us. But it was genuinely our goal kicking that cost us - we out scored them - and totally dominated in the last.

Straight kicking and we would have won.

yes, I made the observation a few times in this and other threads - no one wants to hear it or other facts. We had a few unfortunate fumbles and bumbles that cost and didn't kick the easy ones- at the end of the day that was the difference. People like to vent though and as you say very few a) know how to watch a game and b) bother to watch again.

 

[Pentatonic Flat Fifth]

Port lost players and put their cue in the rack near the end. If they were anywhere near threatened they would have put the hammer down. Their field kicking and kicking for goal was much better than ours because we don't apply enough pressure - we are selfish and lazy. It's why Collingwood looked like millionaires with their delivery into the forward line, no pressure was applied! It's much easier to execute skills against Carlton because of this trait.

If we think this performance against a very good side was green shoots or anywhere near acceptable, we are kidding ourselves. But for straight kicking we could have won?! spare me!

They didn't put their cue in the rack - we completely and utterly dominated them - they couldn't get it out of our 50, if we had of kicked straight we would have won and caused the upset of the season. You haven't watched the game a second time - that is really obvious.

We had a TERRIBLE start, really bad efficiency, it was down at below 60% - shocking. As soon as we turned that around we got back.

Port had some absolutely insane goals that were just insanely freaky and lucky. While we missed close to ten shots on goal.

We outscored them with shots on goal mate - that is a seriously important stat.

 

[JustaBattler]

They didn't put their cue in the rack - we completely and utterly dominated them - they couldn't get it out of our 50, if we had of kicked straight we would have won and caused the upset of the season. You haven't watched the game a second time - that is really obvious.

We had a TERRIBLE start, really bad efficiency, it was down at below 60% - shocking. As soon as we turned that around we got back.

Port had some absolutely insane goals that were just insanely freaky and lucky. While we missed close to ten shots on goal.

We outscored them with shots on goal mate - that is a seriously important stat.

Stick around mate

 

[Michael Jezz]

Did I say it didn't?

I have been told - by our very own Michael Jezz, no less - that I need to look at results. I have been told for years that looking at the why is providing excuses, reasons why we have not been successful, as though I personally have influence over what the club chooses to do with its football department or list management. I have been told that it's sick to point out the fact that we lost by 28 points, in this very thread.

We. Lost. The. Game. That's the reality. We lost the game by 28 points, in what was the third smallest margin of the round. Results are blowing out this year; you had a 2 point loss, a 27 point loss, then us; everyone else lost by way more. We've played this year the team that came top of the ladder last season and the premier for two of our 3 losses, with the other being to a team which came sixth last season regardless of how disappointing it was.

Tell me what part of what I am saying is not fact.

I am getting rather tired of being told to think something, say something. Adhere to the groupthink of spiraling negativity on here. I'm getting sick of the perennial bipolar nature of this board, because either we're a smokey for top 4 one week or it's '25 years of failure' the next.

No smokey for me - I have consistently said we are crap for 2 years and the results and method bear that out. I am all for optimism but it needs to be backed up by evidence of improvement

 

[Stamos]

If both teams had of kicked straight - so including Port - we would have comfortably won.

Imagine Port without Gray, Rosee, Dickson, Amon Wines, Boak - ok - now you have Carltons team with injuries. I blows my mind that people are unable to see the effect of having 2/3rds of your best forwards out - plus 2-3 of your midfielders out does to the team.

People are seriously expecting Carlton to go from 11th to beating the 2020 and 2021 Premiers - with half their best team out (easily top ten) - with complete melts about it.

We outscored them, totally dominated in 2 quarters and they had some ridiculous lucky plays and decisions go FOR them and against us.

That team on Saturday night would have beaten almost every other team in the league.

Seriously reminding me of the sacking of Ratten - team had 17 of their starting list out injured when he was sacked - absolutely no idea on this forum sometimes.

Sorry, which 2 quarters did we totally dominate?
I assume you're going to say the last quarter, when we kicked 2 goals to nothing in the final 6 minutes, to reduce the margin from 41 points? But I can't see another quarter where anybody could stretch to say we dominated?

And to think that it was only our poor goal kicking which stopped us from winning suggests you were not at the game.

 

[Gethelred]

No smokey for me - I have consistently said we are crap for 2 years and the results and method bear that out. I am all for optimism but it needs to be backed up by evidence of improvement

Lol.

 

[TwiggleyFanClub]

Port won the game by several freaky break outs rebounds from our forward pressure. The last quarter it almost didn't leave our 50.

Bombing it long to Eddie as our CHF against Aliir while McKay was off?
Or Cripps resting forward for long stretches? A guy with no forward craft and shocking accuracy in set shots?
Dumping it on Harry's (another with surprisingly little forward craft) head, in spite of him being absolutely towelled up by Aliir all game?

And you think it was a couple of freaky break outs that got them over the line, and not our shambolic circus of a forward line?

 

[Pentatonic Flat Fifth]

28 points was flattering with a couple goals in junk time and we all know it.

It was closer to a 40-50 point loss.

Disagree entirely - we totally dominated the last quarter and with just a few of the misses going our way we would have won.

They outscored us by one goal in each quarter - we had MORE scoring shots.

On the other side of the coin they had so many freakishly positive things go their way.

It was closer to a 40-50 point loss.
This is honestly not even close to the reality of that game.....

 

[mochacinolatte]

Only play I can trust to hit a target is a Walsh. Without Walsh we be in serious shambles.

 

[Pentatonic Flat Fifth]

Carlton invited this pressure when they publicly announced we expect to play finals.

Focus has been on the Saints a fair bit as well as the Bombers and people have been calling for Buckleys job for a few weeks already. It's not like the focus is solely on Carlton at all.

This weekend it is very squarely on us - with not only TV, online but even SEN all focusing on us.

Its ridiculous. 4 goal difference (easily could have happened in the last with straight kicking) and Carlton wins - beating the flag favorite (Melbourne, Doggies have played no one).

 

[skadoosh]

Disagree entirely - we totally dominated the last quarter and with just a few of the misses going our way we would have won.

They outscored us by one goal in each quarter - we had MORE scoring shots.

On the other side of the coin they had so many freakishly positive things go their way.

It was closer to a 40-50 point loss.
This is honestly not even close to the reality of that game.....

Yeah you are spot on. Port were lucky to beat us, not that they were good and we were crap or anything of that sort...

 

[Michael Jezz]

Had breakfast with the dominator post season 2019 at the height of Teague Train euphoria. He was not convinced saying care taker coaching and playing in the back half of a dead season is devoid of pressure. He predicted the coach and playing group would get found out. These ex champs see things we don't

 

[Coops93]

Well there's glass half full and then there's thinking the only difference between the sides was goal kicking...