Autopsy Dogs lose to Tigers - Rd 7, 2021

[Philthy1]

The most frustrating part about the relentless JUH questions is it's glaringly obvious that most of these journos aren't watching our VFL games, yet are projecting their opinions as if they know anything about the situation.

Yes, Schache played poorly. But he was still obviously the better choice than JUH because he can actually run out a game, and his VFL form has been better. You don't debut a player who is clearly not ready against the reigning premiers. He would've been torn to shreds

If that stuff passes for "journalism" they might as well send Norman Gunston or Pixie Anne-Wheatley into the pressers and let them ask questions.

Might be showing my age there, no doubt.

 

[Jdoggy]

Don't usually post after a loss but few things would like to comment on.

Was a disappointing evening for sure to potentially go 7-0 up but anticipated this as a danger game as soon as Dunkley's injury last week was realised. English' absence definitely didn't help but the loss of Dunkley for such a game to me was worse.

The first 6 weeks of this season has been such a joy building up the hype of our stacked midfield because it was actually delivering on the hype but the way I now view it is that we are now heavily dependent on them all being available as I wouldn't describe it as "depth" like most observers have but actual essentials. There's a few names of our midfield we can ill afford to have absent or things may turn out like they did last night against such a team like Richmond and Libba fought mighty hard but needs his contested counterpart for the war; sure they didn't have Martin but they need not rely on him when their vaunted system clicks into gear.

Dunkley was a hard head lost for the midfield battle which as we now have seen masks our KPD and overall defensive deficiencies and while we managed well at least for the first half, gee he would've been vital for that 3rd Quarter Battle; ultimately I think we can survive some of the midseason fixture without him but to me he was/is the biggest loss of all.

I've quietly been one of the Naughton back brigade as I think he could become the games best Swingman starting at either end and switching for needs and whilst I don't mind the implementation of him 100% forward as he continues to present and attack like he is, there are a few things I want to unpack:

Some people suggesting Easton to potentially take 2nd tall; I've been one of his biggest fans but I remember periods in years past where we've had him play KPD due to necessity and he got crucified by us when it was clear it he wasn't playing a role he's suited to. There have been times too early in Bailey William's career when he's asked to play such a role and got absolutely roasted for it where after Cordy's showing last night, really frustrates how long it's been since we've had bonafide FB/CHB. I absolutely love Keath which makes me more disturbed at the idea that we didn't have him not too long ago and still don't have a 2nd adequate KPD as he's asked to play both gorilla/intercept KPD.

I'm all for not seeing Cordy play in the seniors but that's because his best/only position he can play effectively is 3rd tall and not KPD which like the above mentioned, he was playing only due to necessity. You've all seen it before, when he plays 3rd tall and our system is on point he actually has good positioning, decent at groundball anticipation and has plenty of mongrel to shirk/break tackles whilst playing to his limits; but nights like yesterday playing KPD make him look like one of the worst players we've ever fielded.

This isn't a knee-jerk reaction to call on Naughton to go back, however others also mentioned our lack of Plan B; for me last night Bevo's Plan B needed to be something like Naughts going back when it was clear we were getting slaughtered with D50 entries. Of course now its all hypothetical/hindsight but it had to be realised by the time 7-10 minutes had elapsed of the 3rd that we were losing the plot and throughout the whole game the Tigers bombed plenty of high ball into their forward 50 that always made me nervy and they had so many near speccies threatening to tear the game apart. I know he kicked our only goal for the quarter from the first I50 we got but I'd say it was more so damning that we did not have a forward half possession up til that point and having him back their to adequately contest the high ball or match up better with Lynch to at least steady the defense could have gone a long way to helping us stem the onslaught in the first place, then throw him forward once we wrestled back some ascendancy, but alas.

For mine that needs to be an option to consider while we don't have Dunkley for such a long period and swing him back if we start to lose midfield dominance and our defense gets exposed like it did last night; otherwise start him forward and keep him there if the game is kept on our terms. Maybe now more than ever I realise why our recruiting hero S Power was adamant he is a required player and I pray this doesn't then require Treloar to subtly transition back to his Collingwood Version.

I have big hopes for West but last night was one of those Horror nights that he didn't do any further favours for himself with undisciplined acts and his "high" free against Houli was true definition adding salt to the wound; hope he can find some form soon to show he belongs.

Anyway, onto next week and the games ahead which will be a good test to really assess where we're at but 6-1 is still a better place to be when you see clubs in shocking on/off field states.

 

[Dogs_R_Us]

There are a few senior players on our list that had their colours lowered before we look at the players that just came up from the ressie's.

Some people can step in to a role for just 1 week and just thrive like Jordy.
Schache has earnt his opportunity, but he needs a consistant run of games to get confidence up and repetition . West and Lippy also need a run of games to get use to the pressure of AFL, you can't prepare for it.
Dunks is a massive out, Westy and Lippy looked way off but they also need a few games into them before we start judging.
Its up to the senior players to show them how its done. We didn't do that last night.

Players who are in and out of the team (Lipi), and others who’ve been trying and hoping and finally make it, imagine the pressure they feel, will I stuff up, who’s my opponent, a million thoughts going through their heads. They’re not going to be able to do everything we expect straight away. Everyone needs to calm down.

 

[ScragCity]

Loved seeing Bevo cuck that pathetic braindead journo.

 

[perro_loco]

Awful, awful performance tonight.

Just to start off I've seen a few comments regarding Glouftsis' umpiring in the match and I just want to set the record straight. She was the emergency umpire and came on in the first five minutes after umpire David Harris wet down with an injury.

Glouftsis umpired a full VFL match last night and had to back it up with almost a full match tonight. I have nothing against Glouftsis but there is clearly a reason why she has been umpiring the VFL in the last few weeks. Her tally in the end was 4 free kicks to us and 8 free kicks to Richmond

Umpiring was not the reason we lost tonight, there were dozens of other elements I could list but have narrowed it down to the ones that bothered me the most.

1. Schache... I have no idea what anyone sees in him, so what if he kicked 5 goals against Gold Coast in the VFL anyone who bothered to watch the VFL last week against the Giants would've seen exactly what happened tonight, weak at the contest and fumbles constantly. I get that JUH isn't 100% match fit but he would've put up a better effort tonight.

2. Truly one of the worst performances by our captain tonight. Missed one of the easiest set shots to put us up by 25 at HT. 7 of his kicks were direct turnovers and from his 9 inside 50 kicks we scored 1.1 (7). Just 7 contested possessions too, 7 of our players had more.

3. How about looking when kicking inside 50? We've gone back to our 2018, early 2019 way of thinking with just pathetic kicks inside 50. 3 times we targeted Schache the same number as JJ, which says something.

4. Richmond's pressure was outstanding and we couldn't match it, we lost every quarter pressure wise and finished with a rating of 169, our lowest in a long long time. You cannot let a team have 15 inside 50s in a row no matter what.

5. It's all very well for the club to post videos of our players doing trick shots at goal at training, but maybe actually practise set shots. 37% in front of goal we were tonight, for a potential top 8 team that is pathetic.

6. All 4 ins had next to no impact. West got unlucky with some free kicks but he has to do more than 5 kicks, he finished the game with 1 solitary ranking point. Hannan didn't really get a chance so gets a pass, Schache was mentioned above and Lipinski was serviceable but needed to impact more. He should've attended more centre bounces.

7. It shows how poor we were when their debutant Collier-Dawkins got more ranking points than...

Wood
Naughton
Crozier
Scott
Martin
Cordy
Schache
Hannan
Bruce
Duryea
Johannisen
West

Positives...

We were in it until the last 5 minutes.

Dale is clearly the most improved player in the competition.

Keath was outstanding and doesn't get the credit he deserves.

Scott had a terrific first half and is worth persisting with.

Now as always here are some of the rarer stats…

Expected Score
WB: 64
RIC: 82

Centre Bounce Attendance
19 - Martin
18 - Macrae
17 - Liberatore
15 - Bontempelli
11 - Treloar
3 - Smith
2 - Lipinski
2 - Schache
1 - Bruce

Ruck Contests (Hitouts/To Advantage)
57 - Martin (21/7)
6 - Bontempelli (3/0)
6 - Keath (3/2)
5 - Schache (1/0)
3 - Bruce (1/0)
2 - Cordy (1/0)

Hitouts To Advantage

WB: 9
RIC: 4

First Possessions
WB: 38
RIC: 38

Clearances/Effective Clearances
WB: 36/25
RIC: 31/23

Tackle Efficiency
WB: 66%
RIC: 66%

Forward Half Contested Marks
WB: 5
RIC: 8

Score Launches
4 - Liberatore
2 - Wood, Daniel, Dale
1 - Martin, Smith, Scott, Bruce, Hannan, Keath, Treloar, Lipinski, Bontempelli

Shots At Goal
WB: 19 (37%

RIC: 25 (44%)

Targets Inside 50
9 - Naughton
5 - Bruce
4 - West
3 - Johannisen, Schache
2 - Hannan, Treloar
1 - Treloar, Hunter, Bontempelli

Defensive 50 Intercept Marks
WB: 4
RIC: 7

Marks Dropped
WB: 3
RIC: 1

Unforced Turnovers
WB: 12
RIC: 10

No Pressure Errors
WB: 5
RIC: 1

Turnovers/Frees/50M Penalties Punished By Goals
2 - Bruce
1 - Naughton, Treloar, Hunter, Bontempelli, Dale, Crozier

Pressure Gauge
WB: 169 (Poor)
RIC: 182 (Average)

Free Kick Summary
View attachment 1115625

Score Sources
View attachment 1115626

Excellent post and agree regarding the woman umpire. She did a fair job. Criticising umpires when you are completely given a lesson in pressure footy is like complaining about missing your train when you arrive late.

 

[Dogs_r_barking]

Is it just me or are fans almost warlike in their intensity these days? As if their whole sense of themselves rides on feeling superior to the other team and its supporters and they are willing to go to extreme lengths to express it, including using verbal and sometimes physical violence. Am I exaggerating?

I think it is very much part of the Tiger‘s make up, to be the joke of the competition for two decades, I.e. losing to the 9th based team in finals, kicking against the wind, getting belted regularly, fans spitting on players, microwaving their memberships etc etc. it will take more than three flags for them to forget their awful past. Their psyche is scarred so they over-hype their success.

Think how graceful the Hawks fans were to us in 2016, and compare it to the in your face aggressiveness of Tiger fans, one team is used to success the other isn’t.

 

[ScragCity]

Bailey Dale becoming an AA defender has been the biggest plot twist I've seen in an AFL season

 

[Dogs Rule]

wow!

Prestia - BnF winner in one of our flag years and arguably our best straight out mid (Dusty Fwd).

Vlaustin -Is our leading intercept defender and top 5 BnF the last two years.

Lambert - Top 3 BnF in 2017 and 2018 and was AA squad 2018

I acknowledged English and Dunkley is decent as well, but let’s not pretend the guys we were missing aren’t our best players. Kidding yourself.

Cool story bro

No wonder the majority of the population think Tigers supporters are a wunch of bankers.

 

[Chicago1]

Tonight will most likely be the last night that we spend on top of the ladder. It hasn't happened very often in my 44 years as a member. It's been kinda nice. We should do it again some time.

 

[CarnTheScray]

I think it is very much part of the Tiger‘s make up, to be the joke of the competition for two decades, I.e. losing to the 9th based team in finals, kicking against the wind, getting belted regularly, fans spitting on players, microwaving their memberships etc etc. it will take more than three flags for them to forget their awful past. Their psyche is scarred so they over-hype their success.

Think how graceful the Hawks fans were to us in 2016, and compare it to the in your face aggressiveness of Tiger fans, one team is used to success the other isn’t.

Hope we meet them again in finals. And beat them.

Remind me in 4 months.

 

[Munnez]

I am sure there is an entirely valid reason for it, but why did Bevo elect to play Schache over Ugle-Hagen?

From an outsider looking in, seemed like an odd selection

JUH would only have a 1/4 in him and then would be gassed and become a liability

 

[Munnez]

Grimes really got into his head although to be fair he was getting tackled and pushed under the ball regularly and probably should have had half a dozen free kicks. The Richmond defenders seem to get away with murder.

They being Tigers defenders get an awful lot of leeway with the scragging that they do.

 

[Munnez]

Players who are in and out of the team (Lipi), and others who’ve been trying and hoping and finally make it, imagine the pressure they feel, will I stuff up, who’s my opponent, a million thoughts going through their heads. They’re not going to be able to do everything we expect straight away. Everyone needs to calm down.

I feel that the main difference was between the ears in that match. Tigers never believed they were out of the match, and we couldn't muster the belief to put them away. We missed a couple of easy chances to put the foot on the throat, which invited them to crank the pressure then we crumbled. Maybe as a team we were gassed as we were very stagnant for a lot of the match.
Hardly put a kick to advantage for the majority of the night which plays right into Richmond's hands. A pretty poor performance yet until the last 5 minutes were still in it. Regroup and refocus and get the job done next week

 

[Dogs Rule]

JUH would only have a 1/4 in him and then would be gassed and become a liability
[/QUOTE

I think Schache offered a fair bit less last night.

 

[immortalmike]

JUH would only have a 1/4 in him and then would be gassed and become a liability

That's one quarter better than Schache. He was a liability from the first bounce.

 

[Dogs_r_barking]

To be fair to both West and Scache not playing them all year and then bringing them in for such a hot match, is not good list management/development, you are setting them up to fail.

 

[hoianbulldog]

The most frustrating part about the relentless JUH questions is it's glaringly obvious that most of these journos aren't watching our VFL games, yet are projecting their opinions as if they know anything about the situation.

Yes, Schache played poorly. But he was still obviously the better choice than JUH because he can actually run out a game, and his VFL form has been better. You don't debut a player who is clearly not ready against the reigning premiers. He would've been torn to shreds

Or kicked a bag....... i just had flash backs to Chris Grants first game.

 

[wian]

Feral the operative word. I haven't felt that vibe walking around the ground during the breaks since the old days of Vic Park and Farty Hill.

Screaming from the end of the long long line to get more grog at the bar staff "what's going the f on? The game's f ing started! F ing f ing".

The bay full of em next to ours a woman kept turning her head 180 to look at us once tiges started to get the upper hand. Just watch the game love, it's in front of you not behind. No need to gloat.

I've never wanted to smack anyone except drug taker supporters, but by God this lot went close.

PS. In no way does this post condone violence or have I ever been involved in any - is the reason I'm exhausted today because it took all my strength to ignore these bandwagon jumping narcissists or because a 7.50 start for an afl game you have to take public transport to and get home at midnight a ridiculous time for young and old alike?

Aaah. That feels better.

Sent from my SM-A505YN using Tapatalk

The majority of them are a bunch of absolute Piss Pots from what I observed last night..

 

[CarnTheScray]

To be fair to both West and Scache not playing them all year and then bringing them in for such a hot match, is not good list management/development, you are setting them up to fail.

And to be fair we’ve known how Schache is since 2019: not competitive 1-on-1 and hates physicality.

 

[NBates]

The majority of them are a bunch of absolute Piss Pots from what I observed last night..

I don't know how old you are, but they used to have a group of supporters proudly calling themselves the Grog Squad. No longer PC to proudly advertise that, but it's deep in their DNA it appears....

 

[hoianbulldog]

If that stuff passes for "journalism" they might as well send Pixie Anne-Wheatley into the pressers and let them ask questions.

Please make it happen, imagine pixie interviewing mick malthouseafter a loss.

 

[Dogs_r_barking]

Just saw Bevo’s press conference, boy is he pissed, very protective of the players though, but I think some players will be talked too this week.

 

[CarnTheScray]

Just saw Bevo’s press conference, boy is he pissed, very protective of the players though, but I think some players will be talked too this week.

The guy knows what it takes to get to the end of finals. He knows the next 5 years is our best opportunity to win flags.

God can I just fast forward to the finals so I don’t have to constantly worry about who will beat who.

 

[hoianbulldog]

Lambert - Top 3 BnF in 2017 and 2018 and was AA squad 2018

What was top of the pop back then? Too long ago for me to remember.

Was it Plastic Bertrand or was he a bit before that?

 

[hoianbulldog]

JUH would only have a 1/4 in him and then would be gassed and become a liability

So why name him as an emergency? I dont disagree with what you say, i just dont get why we would tell the world he is close if he is not.