Opinion Sack Hinkley 3 - 2021 is worse than 2020 already

[JimmyBC]

We'll always have that comeback against WC at the Beige Bowl with Neadey tearing down the wing.. incredible, within 4 years he'd struggle to outrun Tex Walker.

 

[GoTheMightyCrows]

Looks like you lot are up and about celebrating another loss

 

[Marmozet]

Compare the pair

Fagan: Coaching from the bench, talking to players, giving orders, watching the game intently.

Ken: In the box, sedentary, no energy, guzzling Coke Zero.

That was the case between him and Pyke nearly every Showdown.

 

[malcheski]

Looks like you lot are up and about celebrating another loss

Ohh mate, not wrong. I for one am over the moon for the fact I've invested both financially and emotionally into the club for years, only to have it coached (for 9 years) by a guy who's only qualified to sell me a used Mondeo with some brand spanking new re-treads.

Haven't been home since Saturday night, too caught up in the celebrations I have been.

 

[Harlott]

This lack of being able to comeback from a reasonable deficit is so anti Port Adelaide. Really says something about us when we’re in that situation.

 

[Lockhart Road]

Hinkley Era

• 3QT deficit
21 — WCE, 2013 (club record)
12 — Adel, 2013
9 — GC, 2013
8 — Melb, 2018
7 — WB, 2017
6 — StK, 2016

• Halftime deficit
38 — WCE, 2013 (club record)
24 — Freo, 2014
21 — Adel, 2018
15 — Adel, 2013
11 — Bris, 2018
11 — WCE, 2017

• 1QT deficit
22 — Carl, 2014
22 — WCE, 2013
19 — Freo, 2015
17 — Adel, 2013
17 — Syd, 2013

Not pleasant reading regarding resilience.

tribey do you have data on the opposite - record leads under Hinkley that ultimately resulted in losses?

e.g. that final 2013 minor round game in Bars vs Carlton at West Lakes; I recall we were seven goals ahead in the 3rd quarter and lost by a point.

 

[sobrave]

Hinkley Era

• 3QT deficit
21 — WCE, 2013 (club record)
12 — Adel, 2013
9 — GC, 2013
8 — Melb, 2018
7 — WB, 2017
6 — StK, 2016

• Halftime deficit
38 — WCE, 2013 (club record)
24 — Freo, 2014
21 — Adel, 2018
15 — Adel, 2013
11 — Bris, 2018
11 — WCE, 2017

• 1QT deficit
22 — Carl, 2014
22 — WCE, 2013
19 — Freo, 2015
17 — Adel, 2013
17 — Syd, 2013

Not pleasant reading regarding resilience.

We basically have to be in front at 3/4 time or were ****ed.

If we're 2 goals down at half time were also basically ****ed.

Good coaching!

 

[RobbieGray17]

This lack of being able to comeback from a reasonable deficit is so anti Port Adelaide. Really says something about us when we’re in that situation.

It was a ruse. We got of to slow starts, allowing us to come home strong. Not the best strategy as I noted in a game vs the Hawks. We came out slow, they got off to a ripper start with the wind. We had the wind and they locked us down.

 

[Andre]

Yeah so the 2 games I remembered were it. Also an interesting trend is that our somewhat meagre comebacks are almost exclusively versus non Vic or small Vic clubs.

So if we're surprised by a s**t opponent we're a slim chance of coming back, but get 2 - 3 goals down early against a good one and it's almost zero. Not inspiring confidence for the business end of the season.

 

[dirty2]

We will know he has succeeded if this thread never reaches part 4. I'm still hopeful it won't!

1400ish more posts.

 

[Long live PAFC]

Certainly fits with the narrative of heartbreaking come backs to within a kick before falling over due to exhaustion, having spent all of our energy catching up.

I wonder how often clubs do come back though? Broadly speaking, the side who is up at quarter time, half time or 3 quarter time, goes on to win. I’m not sure port are all that out there with those rates of winning/losing.

up by 6-11 points at 3 quarter time, 85% of those sides go on to win.

 

[Miss December]

This lack of being able to comeback from a reasonable deficit is so anti Port Adelaide. Really says something about us when we’re in that situation.

It tells us that Ken is a game day spud.

 

[Long live PAFC]

It tells us that Ken is a game day spud.

Or that he is like every other coach in the league who 85% of the time isn’t about to overcome a 6-11 point deficit at 3 quarter time? Or 60% of the time loses if his side is down by a goal or more at quarter or half time?

The worrisome thing about Ken’s coaching is that the same mistakes seem to be made against the same sides. The inevitable losses at Adelaide oval against an undermanned interstate side desperate for a victory to prove their validity. Or the predictable loss against fast sides like Brisbane, St Kilda, north and Essendon (from seasons ago) often at marvel, the hoofing it long onto Dixon’s head.

We have a really good list with some powerful players. The game plan and structures look really good. But we seem to be in this constant two steps forward, one step back cycle, always looking for a missing piece.

 

[snozulu]

Credit where credit is due, at least Hinkley didn't say "learnings".

or syndesmosis

 

[Miss December]

Or that he is like every other coach in the league who 85% of the time isn’t about to overcome a 6-11 point deficit at 3 quarter time? Or 60% of the time loses if his side is down by a goal or more at quarter or half time?

The worrisome thing about Ken’s coaching is that the same mistakes seem to be made against the same sides. The inevitable losses at Adelaide oval against an undermanned interstate side desperate for a victory to prove their validity. Or the predictable loss against fast sides like Brisbane, St Kilda, north and Essendon (from seasons ago) often at marvel, the hoofing it long onto Dixon’s head.

We have a really good list with some powerful players. The game plan and structures look really good. But we seem to be in this constant two steps forward, one step back cycle, always looking for a missing piece.

A potato peeler?

 

[Macca19]

tribey do you have data on the opposite - record leads under Hinkley that ultimately resulted in losses?

e.g. that final 2013 minor round game in Bars vs Carlton at West Lakes; I recall we were seven goals ahead in the 3rd quarter and lost by a point.

QT:
24 - West Coast R21 2018
23 - Hawthorn R11 2018
12 - GWS R18 2016
12 - Hawthorn PF 2014
11 - Fremantle R11 2019
10 - Adelaide R15 2014
9 - Carlton R8 2016
9 - Western Bulldogs R10 2013
9 - Adelaide R3 2017
9 - Fremantle R17 2018
8 - Geelong R10 2017
8 - Richmond R4 2019
7 - North Melbourne R3 2014

1/2T:
23 - Geelong SF 2013
20 - GWS R18 2016
18 - West Coast R21 2018
17 - West Coast R17 2015
15 - Richmond R15 2017
11 - Carlton R11 2016
11 - Western Bulldogs R10 2013
10 - Adelaide R15 2014
9 - Adelaide R20 2018
2 - Fremantle R1 2015

3QT:
29 - Carlton R23 2013
15 - West Coast R21 2018
10 - North Melbourne R3 2014
9 - Western Bulldogs R11 2016
5 - Carlton R11 2016
4 - GWS R4 2017
3 - Fremantle R1 2015

All I can say is Choco was significantly worse

 

[Lockhart Road]

QT:
24 - West Coast R21 2018
23 - Hawthorn R11 2018
12 - GWS R18 2016
12 - Hawthorn PF 2014
11 - Fremantle R11 2019
10 - Adelaide R15 2014
9 - Carlton R8 2016
9 - Western Bulldogs R10 2013
9 - Adelaide R3 2017
9 - Fremantle R17 2018
8 - Geelong R10 2017
8 - Richmond R4 2019
7 - North Melbourne R3 2014

1/2T:
23 - Geelong SF 2013
20 - GWS R18 2016
18 - West Coast R21 2018
17 - West Coast R17 2015
15 - Richmond R15 2017
11 - Carlton R11 2016
11 - Western Bulldogs R10 2013
10 - Adelaide R15 2014
9 - Adelaide R20 2018
2 - Fremantle R1 2015

3QT:
29 - Carlton R23 2013
15 - West Coast R21 2018
10 - North Melbourne R3 2014
9 - Western Bulldogs R11 2016
5 - Carlton R11 2016
4 - GWS R4 2017
3 - Fremantle R1 2015

All I can say is Choco was significantly worse

Thanks, mate.

In 2013 I visited Adelaide twice during which I was at both the round 5 West Coast win and the round 23 Carlton loss.

The problem is me, sounds like.

 

[philreich]

Let's not go overboard. This isn't 2015, or 2016, or even 2020. There's no doubt about this list and it's potential. Kane Cornes is there to write 'sh*t' articles. It's his job. Remember the articles he wrote about Richmond in 2017. Obviously they had the team to contend. In reality we do have a contending list. Both games that we lost this year lacked intensity and effort. Both were away games against good sides. We wouldn't have beaten Richmond if we were a sh*t side. They're the best side in the competition and we did something we failed to do in previous seasons. Obviously we didn't go into those two games with the right mindset, OR there are other mental/stress issues with the quarters being increased. I believe Sydney, Geelong, Richmond, and West Coast have all had uncharacteristic performances.

I highly doubt we aren't good enough. We are. Something to think about is Richmonds 2017 season. Lost two games by big scores, and lost to 1,2,3 and 6.

To add: Richmond were up by 30 points against WB and lost, up by 30 against GWS and lost. Down by 30 against Fremantle. They weren't playing great by any means but I think people in the know would have known their potential despite the results.

View attachment 1117793

I'm hopeful that we're getting the vast majority of our injuries out of the way early in the season, and as September draws closer, guys like Butters, Duursma and the like will be cherry ripe to attack the finals series - giving us the best chance of success. Successful finals campaigns are luck based to some degree.

The big question that needs to be answered is, if at last we do happen to make it to the big dance on September 25, is this group of players capable of standing up to the red hot furnace of grand final pressure?

We won our first AFL premiership on September 25 - how ironic would it be, if we were to win our second on the same day!!!!!

 

[TeeKray]

Thanks, mate.

In 2013 I visited Adelaide twice during which I was at both the round 5 West Coast win and the round 23 Carlton loss.

The problem is me, sounds like.

The last 2 games I went to at Footy Park were the Gold Coast SUNS choke in '11 and the collapse against Carlton in '13.

The problem around that time was definitely me.

 

[Lockhart Road]

The last 2 games I went to at Footy Park were the Gold Coast SUNS choke in '11 and the collapse against Carlton in '13.

The problem around that time was definitely me.

That’s a relief.

 

[sobrave]

Ken is averaging one complete non competitive loss every few weeks in a year we're meant to challenge for the flag

Sack him

 

[Steve Dore]

... All I can say is Choco was significantly worse

Despite being an AFL premiership coach Choco, after controversially having his contract extended in 2009 for two years was sacked mid way through the 2010 season. Choco's football department at the time was running on the smell of an oily rag.

Why should Hinkley, with resources and support Choco could only ever of dreamed of, be afforded greater leniency than our only AFL flag winning coach?

What has Hinkley achieved that, unlike Choco, puts his coaching performance beyond question?

 

[1954]

Out of interest how many coaches make game day changes that win you a game? I reckon it would be fewer than you think.

What play or player would you have shuffled to get us back in against the lions or the Eagles?



This is the bigger issue for Ken and Port. Plan A is good and we’ve seen that the side can cope if the other side is just on top (Saints for a quarter, Carlton or Richmond for patches). This isn’t 2015-18, where we had one plan and other sides had it sussed.

Our problem seems to be we don’t turn up. The lions weren’t beating us with a superior list or game plan. They didn’t out think us on the day. The lions, like the Eagles, rocked up ready to play whilst our 22/23 didn’t. This has happened through out Ken’s tenure and does happen elsewhere. Sometimes he gets a response at quarter time and we lose but not by too many. On the weekend there was minimal fightback. Why we don’t rock up set for a battle - particular against sides where this has happened before - I just don’t know.

Like 2020, Port can win the flag, needs to take the opportunity. I don’t think Ken is a great coach but this year, there isn’t the clear contender of previous seasons, and maybe he can sneak a flag.

Absolutely agree with the `we don't turn up' bit, which has been a problem for a long time and as has been mentioned by many is extremely obvious very early, and also the Ken `plan A' bit, because when it doesn't work his body language appears negative as if he doesn't know what to do.

Without going into too many specifics though numerous coaches would have changed their game plan during breaks in an attempt to change the course of a game, with the most recent successful example being Hardwicke the other night against the dogs.

 

[PowerLil]

Absolutely agree with the `we don't turn up' bit, which has been a problem for a long time and as has been mentioned by many is extremely obvious very early, and also the Ken `plan A' bit, because when it doesn't work his body language appears negative as if he doesn't know what to do.

Without going into too many specifics though numerous coaches would have changed their game plan during breaks in an attempt to change the course of a game, with the most recent successful example being Hardwicke the other night against the dogs.

Ken waits for '30 seconds of magic".

 

[TeeKray]

It's not even necessarily about making massive changes. Sometimes you just need to identify that the opposition are hot and the game needs to be slowed down and turned into trench warfare for a little bit, particularly on the road.

We have a mature team with leaders on every line that considers itself a premiership contender. It's disturbing that we have proven twice already this year that we are powerless when a good team gets on a roll with the crowd behind them.

The two most similar games to a grand final we have played this year are West Coast and Brisbane away. The grand final is an away game, likely with a hostile crowd and against a high quality team. What confidence would anyone have based on exposed evidence that we wouldn't be lambs to the slaughter under that heat and out of the game by half time?