Autopsy Rd 8 vs Dogs - 16 point loss. Let's not sugar coat it ... we choked!

[Bell Ringer]

Good
-Weitering, 7 or 8 intercept marks from kicks that the best midfield in the comp were delivering, he bails out Teague and Barker time and time again


Bad
-How do you get smashed in clearances against a first game ruck when you also have Cripps? Barker needs to go, every line he has looked after for 10 years has been trash and I don't understand how someone can survive so long at a club that has totally under performed

Barker's continuing employment at the CFC is a disgrace.

 

[Sector 7G]

Did anyone notice that Williams take that shot for goal when he had no hope of making the distance.

I think he did it because he was blowing too hard and needed to catch his breath rather than do the team thing and pass it quickly to someone in a better position.

He was on the 50, made poor contact and it was touched right on the line. Definitely needed to take the shot.

Just another player like MMcG who has a poor natural fitness and can't afford to get injured as it hampers his already borderline fitness.

 

[blue healer]

Stats suggest some crucial players weren’t properly prepared for this game.

Not sure whose fault that is whether it’s the players professionalism or coaching/selection or conditioning staff, but it obviously isn’t up to scratch, once again.

20 yrs on, fans still waiting for Carlton to get their on field act together.


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Interesting that you use stats as the basis of your comment that we weren't properly prepared for the game.

Try this, The bullies had 6 players who had less than 10 disposals, we had 5 and two of these were JSOS (three quarters of a game) and SPS (one quarter). Harry kicked 4 goals from 7 disposals.

Not sure that you can use stats alone to say they were better prepared than us. Bottom line is they are, at this point, a better team than us for mine.

 

[blue healer]

No doubt we should persist, but not as a one of the main centre bounce mids. I would use him more as a rotation and or more at round the ground stoppages for now

I agree with this, not sure he should spend too much time at the centre bounces, that's not his strength at present. But where possible he should always be around the ball in general play, this is his strength.

I've been a bit of a Cunners knocker but I am right on board this time in, looks to me like (despite the calls from here) that we've actually handled him pretty well.

 

[blue healer]

As an aside how does Teague who played almost his entire career as a defender and kicked a sum total of 6 goals throughout it, end up being a forwards coach (when he came at first to Carlton) and being the proponent of an "offensive philosophy".

Where did Rocket Eade play?

 

[Just Kreuzing]

A big issue we need to address is that we play too many players who are not fully fit. Saad was clearly not fit today (check his time on the bench). Williams doe not seem fit, Cripps must carry something - extended time on the bench and playing horribly. Find some balls and rest these "star" players until they are fit. I don't know if it is Russel, Teague or Loyd, but they are responsible for this. Rather play some kids, we loose anyway when those players get worse and worse as the game progresses.

Add Levi to that list of unfit players.

 

[Blue__Balls]

Crap feeling this morning.

If you told me before the game we'd end up losing by 16 points to the team sitting second on the ladder, I'd be a bit disappointed but not overly surprised.

But once again, the manner in which the game played out is just so emblematic of our problems, that it's hard to feel like we're improving.

I mean, we are, in some ways. That's great. But the single biggest issue that we have as a playing group is an inability to stay focused for four quarters and to claw back some control over the game when the opposition get on a run. In a full season and then some, despite the coach saying that it's been a focus for almost that entire time and that we've developed some "levers we can pull", it just keeps happening.

 

[El Topo]

Last 2 weeks we have been spanked in centre clearances, previous 5 weeks we have won those differentials

So, last 2 weeks it's more about the personal, either carrying injuries and or players being more of an attacking nature

We need to get a better balance of those 3 mids

The other sides have seen how we set up - could also be that our stoppage 'system' has been figured out

 

[chunkylover53]

Williams is clearly injured, he's also unfit as hell and slightly overweight.

The fact we play him every 2nd week and think this is appropriate really makes me question Russell.

Same goes for Cripps and Casboult.

Does he like players playing through injury to toughen them up? He's big on mental toughness as well. Something is very off about it. Just give them the time off they need ffs.

 

[KnaveyBlue]

Our midfield absolutely got crushed in the 4th.

The biggest issue in the 4th was actually Caleb Daniel freewheeling off Owies from the back flank.

I could be wrong, but it seemed like Fogarty had the job on Daniel and had been keeping him quiet. Then suddenly in the last quarter Owies is on him, and Daniel literally doubles his output for the whole game in one quarter.

No disrespect to Owies, but he's a basketball convert, whereas Daniel was born clutching a football. At an absolute loss as to how our coaches let this match-up happen.

 

[Original Moody Blue]

I guarantee you weren’t thinking that at 3/4 time. It would send a terrible message to the young players on our list and potential recruits.

Geez there are some overreactions In here.

We were in trouble in the last 6 minutes of the Third quarter. You could see the Dogs had changed their game plan and we had no idea.

 

[FlowersByIrene]

Not much to say really.

 

[FRUMPY]

Did anyone notice that Williams take that shot for goal when he had no hope of making the distance.

I think he did it because he was blowing too hard and needed to catch his breath rather than do the team thing and pass it quickly to someone in a better position.

Just didnt hit the ball right - hits it clean and he makes the distance easily - just a s**t kick

 

[Iamcarlton]

On Kennedy, we've destroyed him like so many others.

Not picked when he clearly warrants selection, then finally picked but then played out of position, then dropped again....a week later.

Yes he's part of a rotation of young players that get given chances but in unfavorable positions then expected to perform straight away .
When it doesnt happen after 1 or 2 games are then dropped then rinse and repeat .
Theres just not a spot for him now in our midfield we are just too slow through the midfield best position when Gov and Jack has been injured is as a leading forward .
So where did they play him last on the wing

 

[Arr0w]

The other sides have seen how we set up - could also be that our stoppage 'system' has been figured out

Stoppage setups are never the same, for any side.

You have a number of different setups in the playbook, depending on strengths and characteristics of our side as well as the opposition

What's changed is the personal in the last 2 weeks and or not releasing first option

We won 7 CC's

Pitto 4
Cripps 2
Walsh 1

Yet we got first hands on more than double that

 

[ajb72]

Just want to apologise. Due to mother's day and other commitments, turned the game on 2/3'rds through the third term and we were 27 or 28 pts up.

Didnt actually see us kick a goal...

 

[Bell Ringer]

He was on the 50, made poor contact and it was touched right on the line. Definitely needed to take the shot.

Just another player like MMcG who has a poor natural fitness and can't afford to get injured as it hampers his already borderline fitness.

Well I sure am glad we identified, chased and signed them to deals north of $600K/pa rather than other getable players who, y'know, were actually capable of playing regular, high level, impactful AFL games.

 

[Davey33]

Probably all those who are happy to see us kick less than 50 points per game.

As for the guru Clarkson, how's he going now that he has only an average list to work with?

Or those who prefer to have an experienced coach with a proven track record guide us.
Besides the low scoring thing is really a bit of a myth.
If you look at his successful years, you can count on one hand the amount of times they scored below 50 points.
Only in last year's at Freo was there regular low scoring.
His Win- Loss record from 2008-2015 is excellent.

AFL Tables - Ross Lyon - Coaching Record

afltables.com

 

[Original Moody Blue]

Gov has also only played 2 games this season. He hasn't really had the chance to be a dominant player.

Williams has talent. We just don't have the coaches who can keep him at that level for long enough.

Do you have inside information that Kennedy won't be at Carlton next year? BUT... I disagree that we shouldn't give him games. Who knows... if he plays well in the seniors for the rest of the year, we might get a trade offer for him. SPS need to be played on the wing or in the middle. This playing him at the HBF is a joke. We have more than enough players who can play his role as a rebounding defender on our list already. Play them in that position and let SPS roam on the wing as a link up winger.

McGovern was over weight and unfit for most of last season, supposedly due to injuries. Now out for another 8 weeks. We have much better options than McGovern.He has played 76 games in 6 seasons... Take away his 23 games he played in his first full year, you can see you have an injury prone, expensive recruit. I cannot recall one game where he was best afield or dominated a match.

 

[AlecDuncan]

How do you know he’s injured? What is the injury?

He has to have his knee drained every week to stay on the park. Probably needs a clean-out with several weeks off.

 

[jj1978]

The headline is we have more games left against non top 8 teams than we do against Top 8 teams. Before the season started we did think we were a chance of finishing 7th or 8th but that didn’t depend on us needing to beat Richmond, Port, Brisbane or the Bulldogs. Only loss which impacts finals is Collingwood. We can still make up for that by beating a Top 6 team. Once you hit some form it really helps and we have shown enough to suggest we will hit form soon.






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Disagree.... last few seasons we get to a point about half way where the energy is sapped and the team is mentally shot (only the dead cat bounce of a sacked coach helped). We're close to hitting that point (if not already) where after giving it a crack our players will chuck it in. A big defeat by the hands of Melbourne will seal our seasons fate.

 

[Percy2257]

McGovern was over weight and unfit for most of last season, supposedly due to injuries. Now out for another 8 weeks. We have much better options than McGovern.He has played 76 games in 6 seasons... Take away his 23 games he played in his first full year, you can see you have an injury prone, expensive recruit. I cannot recall one game where he was best afield or dominated a match.

We should trade him at the end of the year. That experiment has failed, alas. But I’m sure that we will keep him.

 

[jj1978]

People are questioning Teague but I think he has the tools...still a relatively young, new coach. We've seen glimpses of good play from us during his tenure and we were an absolute joke before he took over. Looking around the league most senior coaches took a few years and some other personnel changes before things clicked...look at Melbourne and Goodwin this year for example. Hardwick took a while and a serious review.

Problem IMO is more our assistants...Barker has been here for too long during a period of crapness. Could make a huge difference if we replace him with a good, senior assistant...I think I remember we were going to bring in Justin Longmuire until he got offered the Freo job? Melbourne and Sydney seem to credit Choco Williams and Don Pyke respectively this year for playing a big role in their improvement...that's the kind of change we need.

Barker seriously has to go! We talk about senior coaching assistance for Teague (welcome Woosha)... Barker has the level 4 creds, has been a senior coach for half a season and around the traps as well, you'd think we be sweet for experience. If questions are not being asked about his value within the club then something is amiss.

 

[jj1978]

We still lost... and let Bruce kick 5... and one KPP injury away from a write off season.

 

[SkyhorseTamer]

On Kennedy, we've destroyed him like so many others.

Not picked when he clearly warrants selection, then finally picked but then played out of position, then dropped again....a week later.

Kennedy has been tried in the midfield and for those that watched the vfl and remember his midfield stints in the afl they know why he's not getting a game through there.

Run and gun and open games, he can't get near the ball. First quarter of the vfl was ping pong and he had 1 or 2 touches. Only came into the game when it got more congested and slow, so.... When has Teague ever wanted to slow the game down and make it more contested? Kennedy would be fine in a different structure/game plan but ours... Hell no.