News Collingwood looking for new assistant coaches. Leppitsch a target.

[Leviathan Pie]

A contract extension for Buckley.. God allmighty.

Staggering, isn't it?

 

[jonmacTrag]

GW was in the bosses seat when Hawthorn embarked on a rebuild with injured blokes in their mid 20s. Like Dekka, he had an awesome run, but his recent work shouldn't be lauded. He left the Hawks list in a worse state than we're in.

This sudden re-examination of GW's qualifications is very co-existent with the rumours he feels Buckley is the right coach.

Remarkable coincidence no???

Make no mistake I believe whatever the facts of his tenure that the playing group is now so fractured he needs to go . . .

However . . .

There are a number on these pages - and I'm not pointing this at you - who clearly have personal issues with Buckley and are not rational in their tirades.

 

[BringouttheGimp]

so let’s think about this.
Bucks says I need a speedy mid
Hine says there’s a kid called Nathan Freeman in the draft
Bucks says fine.
Hine says we need a good utility, Buckley agrees
Hine says we should take Scharenburg.
Buckley says fine.
Buckley says I want AT at any cost - Hines says NO the price is my job.

Do I need to go on?

You're a funny bloke re..

I wouldn't say he has that big a say in the youngsters we draft.. direction.. yes.

And once you're in the AFL system.. Buckley is involved.. big time..

I know the game you're playing.. leaving a lot out as usual.

 

[BringouttheGimp]

Staggering, isn't it?

Unreal

 

[No SPIN]

I imagine they sit around at a table together and discuss the type of players being sought and who's available. Then there are further gettogethers to discuss progress and short list players. There would be some discussion of salaries and pay demands, of caps and what can be fitted under them. I don't believe the various people involved work in isolation.

Agree - but if you assume in my post above Hine is a proxy for the rest of the group, then I think it puts Buckley influence on list management in some context.

 

[No SPIN]

You're a funny bloke re..

I wouldn't say he has that big a say in the youngsters we draft.. direction.. yes.

And once you're in the AFL system.. Buckley is involved.. big time..

I know the game you're playing.. leaving a lot out as usual.

Are you saying Buckley is responsible for our poor drafting?

 

[Johno9911]

If the Buck's extension does come true I hope we at least revamp the coaching panel, persisting with the current set up is destined for failure.

Leppa as an assistant coach would be a solid addition and I would love us to approach Webster from the WCE, who has been their forward and a development coach for a while now. Additionally I think Bucks needs someone like Williams is to Goodwin at the Dees, an experienced figure who can help mentor or develop the coaching panel. Could someone like Roo's or even Lyon be options in that sort of role?

 

[No SPIN]

GW was in the bosses seat when Hawthorn embarked on a rebuild with injured blokes in their mid 20s. Like Dekka, he had an awesome run, but his recent work shouldn't be lauded. He left the Hawks list in a worse state than we're in.

So you’re saying appointing him was a mistake?

 

[barrackers]

Firstly we're f’ed for years, so don't be too keen to get your new coach in just yet because he'll no doubt be nutted long before the next window

Secondly, Ross Lyon is on a shortlist of possible coaches, try not to have nightmares about that

Thirdly sounds like we are after someone with another year to run on their contract, the club would be very aware of it's own timelines, there's no rush


2002/2003 (GF GF)
7 years
2010/2011 (GF GF)
7 years
2018/2019 (GF PF)
7 years
2026/2027

While a straight 7 years between periods looks nice and clean I don’t see it as accurate.

2002/2003 (GF, GF)

2 seasons (can’t count the year where success reappears)

2006/2007/2008 (EF, PF, SF) - transitional period

2007 - Buckley, Clement, Licuira retired. Rocca lasted a couple more years, but only played 8 and 4 games in those seasons.

2008 - Burns, Wakelin retired.

2009/2010/2011/2012 (PF, flag, GF, PF)

5 seasons

2018/2019/2020 (GF, PF, PF)

The 18-20 period is much more like 02/03 than 06-08 or 09-12. The run was quite short, we nearly pinched an unexpected flag (02 v 18), it came off a sustained lower period in the preceding years and a big dip immediately followed. Whether that dip is short remains to be seen; likewise whether our young players will develop and whether we’ll have a couple of transitional years with Pendlebury, Mihocek etc alongside our next core group. If that happens we could be looking at just 2-3 seasons out of finals, which is a big difference to the suggested 7 years.

 

[sr36]

This sudden re-examination of GW's qualifications is very co-existent with the rumours he feels Buckley is the right coach.

Remarkable coincidence no???

Make no mistake I believe whatever the facts of his tenure that the playing group is now so fractured he needs to go . . .

However . . .

There are a number on these pages - and I'm not pointing this at you - who clearly have personal issues with Buckley and are not rational in their tirades.

I've mentioned it a couple of times previously.

Personally, I don't think we should be looking for great individuals, but instead we should be looking at great ideas. GW had them, Clarko had them, Dekka had them, Hardwick had them. And they've used them and others have followed their ideas. But unless they have new great ideas, they're not likely to be ahead of the pack and if they are still stuck on their original great idea, that others have matched and improved upon, they're probably going to be behind the pack.

 

[BringouttheGimp]

Are you saying Buckley is responsible for our poor drafting?

I don't think we've drafted poorly.

As far as player talent goes.. no.. for what they're worth.. pick 5.. 20.. 78.. good job Hine.

You can have 38 of the same type of player.. they can be all good right.. the mix is where we've got it all wrong.. that's Buckley right there.. he is coaching the side.. he's the one that asks for a certain type.. overall.. Hine has done well. It's Buckley that hasn't.

 

[sr36]

So you’re saying appointing him was a mistake?

I think the next great idea that sees a football club dominate, like Hawthorn only recruiting excellent kicks or Richmond recruiting pace, Geelong's waves of handball, our press, etc.. is most likely to come from someone new. I hope we target blokes based on their vision for the future, rather than targetting blokes based on a vision that has run its course. I don't know if that is GW or not. I don't think there are messiahs that are way ahead of the pack - only great ideas that are ahead of the pack. And recent decisions at Hawthorn show that GW is not a flawless operator - there's no such thing. Hopefully, he has more great ideas to come or if someone else at the club has a great idea he can recognise it and help fulfill it.

 

[BringouttheGimp]

Are you saying Buckley is responsible for our poor drafting?

Hine doesn't walk in to Buckley's office.. and just say.. heeeeeey.. this one's on the house re.. I got us 3 tall forwards with our first 3 picks in the draft.. are you kidding me? And Buckley's response is.. great I'll see you later.. I don't wanna brag.. but yeah.. I would have done the same shit.

Great for business re when Hine is now coaching the side?

 

[No SPIN]

This sudden re-examination of GW's qualifications is very co-existent with the rumours he feels Buckley is the right coach.

Remarkable coincidence no???

Make no mistake I believe whatever the facts of his tenure that the playing group is now so fractured he needs to go . . .

However . . .

There are a number on these pages - and I'm not pointing this at you - who clearly have personal issues with Buckley and are not rational in their tirades.

GW would not reappoint Buckley if he felt there was a fracture in the group.

 

[Collingwoodity]

I don't think we've drafted poorly.

As far as player talent goes.. no.. for what they're worth.. pick 5.. 20.. 78.. good job Hine.

You can have 38 of the same type of player.. they can be all good right.. the mix is where we've got it all wrong.. that's Buckley right there.. he is coaching the side.. he's the one that asks for a certain type.. overall.. Hine has done well. It's Buckley that hasn't.

I think Hine's recruiting/drafting has gone about as well as Buckley's coaching:

8/9 years of lulling unspectacularity interspersed with 2 years of excellence.

 

[jackcass]

Here’s an idea.Why don’t we hire Longmuir to be head coach? He did a great job with our defence back in 2018,totally transforming it. How long is he contracted at Fremantle for?Make him an offer he can’t refuse,

I'm always amused at how much this is embellished. Our defence was 1 of our strengths before Longmuir took over. He took 1 of our best lines and Bucks gifted him Crispy from the midfield. Exactly what did he do that was so transformative?

 

[Collingwoodity]

GW would not reappoint Buckley if he felt there was a fracture in the group.

How do you know this?

 

[Kappa]

How do you know this?

No Spin operates on the assumption that the club is infallible and always makes good decisions.

of course this has been debunked a million times, but he only hears what he wants to hear.

 

[No SPIN]

Hine doesn't walk in to Buckley's office.. and just say.. heeeeeey.. this one's on the house re.. I got us 3 tall forwards with our first 3 picks in the draft.. are you kidding me? And Buckley's response is.. great I'll see you later.. I don't wanna brag.. but yeah.. I would have done the same sh*t.

Great for business re when Hine is now coaching the side?

How exactly is Bucks responsible for blowing 8 1st rd picks - unless you can prove this point, then blaming Buckley for the list as many are doing is nonsense.

 

[jackcass]

Yeah it's so disheartening. Can they look for a new head coach AND new assistants? Why are they so afraid of change? We need change!

A new head coach would probably want a say in who he/she thinks their assistants should be.

 

[No SPIN]

How do you know this?

In what world would a GW equivalent not consider the dynamics of the playing group with the Coach, when considering reappointment?

 

[No SPIN]

No Spin operates on the assumption that the club is infallible and always makes good decisions.

of course this has been debunked a million times, but he only hears what he wants to hear.

Its common sense - but by all means feel free to challenge my logic.

 

[jackcass]

I'm not sure how it works at most clubs, but it seems obvious to me that coaches should have a big say in the recruiting criteria that is used for drafting and it seems obvious that Clarkson did at Hawthorn when they targetted kicking and that Hardwick did at Richmond when they targetted pace. Because the skillset of who is recruited should be guided by the skillset necessary to succeed under the coaches plans and it's the coaches who should be attuned to game style trends and thus what attributes are likely to come more to the fore. But they shouldn't have any say in the actual blokes drafted as that's the recruiters area of expertise. Personally, I think both the coaches and recruiters have stuffed up and not adjusted our recruiting criteria since 2009 or probably earlier.

Wouldn't the coaches input be more into the types of players he thinks he needs rather than any major say in who specifically those players are or how they're acquired? Even the examples you cited in Hardwick at Richmond and Clarkson at Hawthorn wouldn't have been nominating specific players to meet there requirements, just specific traits they need to have.

 

[jonmacTrag]

I've mentioned it a couple of times previously.

Personally, I don't think we should be looking for great individuals, but instead we should be looking at great ideas. GW had them, Clarko had them, Dekka had them, Hardwick had them. And they've used them and others have followed their ideas. But unless they have new great ideas, they're not likely to be ahead of the pack and if they are still stuck on their original great idea, that others have matched and improved upon, they're probably going to be behind the pack.

No argument - in any walk of life unless you are improving you are actually going backward.

 

[jackcass]

Leppa has outright said he has no interest in an assistant coaching role.

So ultimately if he was to come to the club it would have to be in some other guise.

Regardless, it’s a gutless move to protect the favourite son and blame others for his failure.

Actually, he said recently he'd be open to having the discussion didn't he?