Review Dogs Lose to Demons by 28 - Rd 11, 2021

[Some Idiot]

I don't think one game from Dale against 10 games of virtual All-Australian form is the gotcha that you want it to be. (and yes, the turnovers were horrendous, but he wasn't absolutely dreadful because he made up for it with hard running, some okay pure defensive stopper stuff and accumulating 20+ possessions)

He actually finished with 30 touches, the most metres gained on the ground and only a few turnovers. Definitely wasn't elite in his kicking like previous weeks but hardly a disaster.

 

[Mattdougie]

I don't think one game from Dale against 10 games of virtual All-Australian form is the gotcha that you want it to be. (and yes, the turnovers were horrendous, but he wasn't absolutely dreadful because he made up for it with hard running, some okay pure defensive stopper stuff and accumulating 20+ possessions)

Did I say that it’s a gotcha moment?

No it’s pivotal to Dale as teams will see that and man him every week now. How he deals with that will end up being the rating of his year, if he plays as he did tonight for the rate of the year the first half of the season won’t matter will it? If he works through it then no one can deny he has improved

 

[immortalmike]

To be fair, we were 9-1 before tonight, so worrying signs are ignored when you’re winning and flying. Not sure we were going that badly.

Finals aren’t won in May and we’re missing three critical midfield cogs in Dunkley, Treloar and Martin. Remove Gawn, Oliver and Petracca and they struggle.

We always seem to have an "off night" when we play a legit contender. 2 out of 3 big games we've been found wanting. And we were lucky to get away with wins against the Eagles, GWS and Carlton. The latter two couldn't keep up the pressure that had them beating us up and Eagles were a couple of dodgy calls away.

Sure take Melbourne's three best players away they'd struggle a bit. However, our three best players were playing, two barely had an impact.
Yes we have injuries but it doesn't excuse lack of application and the same troubles we've seen since 2017 still rearing their ugly head.

 

[spenze]

Premierships aren't won in May, the Bullies will be at the pointy end come September, be interesting to see what lessons are learnt from tonight and applied later on. Guess what I am saying is that don't read too much into tonight, Crows smashed the Tiges about this time in 2017, did us no good. As finals are won in the midfield, you guys are stacked.

 

[Deadly Darcy]

Their laughs in the huddle are because they’ve got some arrogant dudes. They’re not gonna coast to a premiership if they only have to roll with plan A. Right now it’s all clicking for them.

they didn’t have Louis Butlers, or Garcias, Mcneils or even Jordan Sweets and Cody Weightman’s out there.

they won tonight because they got the jump on us in the guts which is because we’re in flux there, they had a hot night with efficiency and we had some of those guys give very little.

it was not cat and mouse. We go into the finals with a much better start in the guts, much better forward have lock in which we’ve had all year and we make a bunch of their average AFL players kick it down the throats of our half backs.

Their defence is sublime but you need to be potent to win 3 finals. We have that potency and they don’t.

I’d say they laughed because they are loving their footy at the moment. And rightly so! Richmond won three premierships once they learned how to laugh in huddles

 

[Mattdougie]

We always seem to have an "off night" when we play a legit contender. 2 out of 3 big games we've been found wanting. And we were lucky to get away with wins against the Eagles, GWS and Carlton. The latter two couldn't keep up the pressure that had them beating us up and Eagles were a couple of dodgy calls away.

Sure take Melbourne's three best players away they'd struggle a bit. However, our three best players were playing, two barely had an impact.
Yes we have injuries but it doesn't excuse lack of application and the same troubles we've seen since 2017 still rearing their ugly head.

If Martin, Treloar and Dunks were playing their midfield wouldn’t be able to hold them all.

I can’t work out why they tagged Bont and Libba and Bev just left Oliver and Petracca free to do as they want.

I know the players made errors but that was a really poor coaching night imo

 

[Some Idiot]

We always seem to have an "off night" when we play a legit contender. 2 out of 3 big games we've been found wanting. And we were lucky to get away with wins against the Eagles, GWS and Carlton. The latter two couldn't keep up the pressure that had them beating us up and Eagles were a couple of dodgy calls away.

Sure take Melbourne's three best players away they'd struggle a bit. However, our three best players were playing, two barely had an impact.
Yes we have injuries but it doesn't excuse lack of application and the same troubles we've seen since 2017 still rearing their ugly head.

Brisbane at Ballarat and Port away were both good wins against 'contenders'. Can't deny that there's been some worrying signs when the heat is on, but I think you're forgetting about the Brisbane win in terms of contenders.

 

[jdz101]

We always seem to have an "off night" when we play a legit contender. 2 out of 3 big games we've been found wanting. And we were lucky to get away with wins against the Eagles, GWS and Carlton. The latter two couldn't keep up the pressure that had them beating us up and Eagles were a couple of dodgy calls away.

Sure take Melbourne's three best players away they'd struggle a bit. However, our three best players were playing, two barely had an impact.
Yes we have injuries but it doesn't excuse lack of application and the same troubles we've seen since 2017 still rearing their ugly head.

Come off it.

This team is completely different to any of the teams since 2017 and it's significantly better.

It's perfectly fine not to expect them to win every game, especially against the best teams.

They were poor tonight. If this team plays to their ability, I think they beat Melbourne. They have the ability.

 

[Scary_Foot_9]

One player who I’ve low key been very disappointed with this year is Hayden Crozier.

In his first couple of years at the club he was ultra consistent in terms of intercepting or killing the ball and help out his teammates in transitions. At the moment he’s all at sea one on one and unproductive in all those other areas. Ryan Gardner probably plays this role better at the moment. If I found myself saying this 1 year ago I wouldn’t have thought it was possible.

 

[immortalmike]

If Martin, Treloar and Dunks were playing their midfield wouldn’t be able to hold them all.

I can’t work out why they tagged Bont and Libba and Bev just left Oliver and Petracca free to do as they want.

I know the players made errors but that was a really poor coaching night imo

That's fair. But I'm not sure how it would've helped our forward entries hitting Lever and May and being constantly outworked on the switch.

We just don't tag and I have no idea why when it has worked every time we have.

 

[Dogs_r_barking]

We always seem to have an "off night" when we play a legit contender. 2 out of 3 big games we've been found wanting. And we were lucky to get away with wins against the Eagles, GWS and Carlton. The latter two couldn't keep up the pressure that had them beating us up and Eagles were a couple of dodgy calls away.

Sure take Melbourne's three best players away they'd struggle a bit. However, our three best players were playing, two barely had an impact.
Yes we have injuries but it doesn't excuse lack of application and the same troubles we've seen since 2017 still rearing their ugly head.

How do you explain the games against Port Adelaide and Brisbane? I think you will find we won them.

 

[immortalmike]

Come off it.

This team is completely different to any of the teams since 2017 and it's significantly better.

It's perfectly fine not to expect them to win every game, especially against the best teams.

They were poor tonight. If this team plays to their ability, I think they beat Melbourne. They have the ability.

Are they? Well they need to prove it.

I don't expect to win every week. If I was a Melbourne supporter I wouldn't have been disappointed in last week's loss. As it is I would have rather beat Melbourne and lost to the Saints. Off days happen. But it shouldn't happen every time we play another contender. That it a trend.

 

[Mattdougie]

That's fair. But I'm not sure how it would've helped our forward entries hitting Lever and May and being constantly outworked on the switch.

We just don't tag and I have no idea why when it has worked every time we have.

You add the 6-7 we have out and you have better players with ball in hand and will have more entries but i agree if we play them again and Bev allows us to bomb it in we will get beat again.

The strange part tonight is we wouldn’t run and draw their players and cut through them with hands like we normally do. That would have nullified May and Levers ability to zone off and our deliveries at worst would have been deeper to contests.

When we have to go toe to toe with good teams our bottom 6 get shown up for how far off or they are and tonight was another example but not all bad.

Played awful
Coached awful

Only lost by 5 goals

 

[immortalmike]

How do you explain the games against Port Adelaide and Brisbane? I think you will find we won them.

Port was a great win. The only time this year I thought we played consistent finals footy.
Brisbane I don't consider a contender outside of the GABBA. Good ordinary team in Melbourne and worse in Ballarat.

 

[Mattdougie]

Port was a great win. The only time this year I thought we played consistent finals footy.
Brisbane I don't consider a contender outside of the GABBA. Good ordinary team in Melbourne and worse in Ballarat.

Yeah I agree

Any final Brisbane play interstate is the end of them. They will ruin a GF down here is they make it through home finals

 

[immortalmike]

Brisbane at Ballarat and Port away were both good wins against 'contenders'. Can't deny that there's been some worrying signs when the heat is on, but I think you're forgetting about the Brisbane win in terms of contenders.

I don't really rate Brisbane. Much like us (at the moment) they are regular season specialists who don't get it done away from home.

 

[Proffessor]

Disappointing to lose another big media build up game but nothing to get too carried away about.

We were missing a number of key players, had an off night and got beaten by solid opposition who came with a plan and executed it. However we lost by less than 5 goals, despite handing them some on a plate.

They essentially focussed their pressure on our key playmakers to try to shut them down. Unfortunately, our second tier midfielders weren’t able to step up to become playmakers and exploit their relative freedom.

Hopefully, this will be a different story later in the year. Dunkley, Treloar and Wood could have made a huge difference tonight. Stef Martin could also have been handy, but even if Sweet is playing ruck next time he will be more experienced and should be better prepared for Gawn.

The future is still bright.

 

[threenewpadlocks]

I don't really rate Brisbane. Much like us (at the moment) they are regular season specialists who don't get it done away from home.

Brisbane haven't lost a game and played incredibly well since we beat them. In retrospect, it's a better win then we felt at the time.

It's very selective to say that we've played poorly in 2/3 of our most important games when clearly a win over likely Top 4 team in Brisbane is more important than a team that's less likely to be top 4 in Richmond. If you flip those wins around, it makes us less likely to finish top 4 right now.

 

[Dogs_r_barking]

Out of the contenders, we have beaten GWS (A), Port Adelaide (A), Brisbane (H), West Coast (H), loss to Richmond first game after losing English and Dunks and Williams by 22 points, Loss to Melbourne tonight by 28. Contenders to come - Geelong, Swans.

Melbourne have beaten Geelong, Richmond GWS and Bulldogs. Season is still alive folks.

 

[immortalmike]

In saying all that. Our team cohesion took a hit this week. It's always difficult when you are forced to make three changes to a 100 point winning lineup.

 

[Zgope1]

I’d say they laughed because they are loving their footy at the moment. And rightly so! Richmond won three premierships once they learned how to laugh in huddles

Could be that. Tommy Boyd reckons they’re the most arrogant lot his bulldogs team played so that might’ve informed that view

 

[Dogs_r_barking]

In saying all that. Our team cohesion took a hit this week. It's always difficult when you are forced to make three changes to a 100 point winning lineup.

We also lead the competition for the most players played.

 

[immortalmike]

Brisbane haven't lost a game and played incredibly well since we beat them. In retrospect, it's a better win then we felt at the time.

It's very selective to say that we've played poorly in 2/3 of our most important games when clearly a win over likely Top 4 team in Brisbane is more important than a team that's less likely to be top 4 in Richmond. If you flip those wins around, it makes us less likely to finish top 4 right now.

That's nice. They still suck in Melbourne.

I never said important. I said against contenders. Brisbane win was very important in the context of finishing high on the ladder. Beating Richmond would have proven that we could win under the heat of finals like football.

I'll put it onto you. Did you think the Brisbane game felt anywhere near like a final?

 

[threenewpadlocks]

The thing that I take away is that it's incredibly clear that the direct upgrades of our players to return will replace players who had weak games.

McNeil - quiet - will be replaced by some combination of Hannan, Richards, Vandermeer when everyone's fit.

Smith poor at the centre bounce and having to break away from the stoppage - there was a reason we saw him all pre-season and didn't give him a single centre bounce attendance whatsoever until Dunkley was injured.

Butler - didn't play badly relative to the fact that he's literally only the 35th or so best player on our list, but didn't impose himself on the game and that set shot in the last quarter was horrendous.

Sweet - battled hard and competed with Gawn at the stoppage and hitouts themselves, but was a literal passenger in all facets of play outside of that. Only had 3 disposals and laid only 1 tackle for the entire match. Stef clearly will be an upgrade on him.

We should be worried if the quality of our best players were dropping off and it's a sign that maybe the entire depth of the list wasn't as good. But the evidence of this game is that we should improve by a few goals simply by having a half-dozen players return.

 

[threenewpadlocks]

That's nice. They still suck in Melbourne.

I never said important. I said against contenders. Brisbane win was very important in the context of finishing high on the ladder. Beating Richmond would have proven that we could win under the heat of finals like football.

I'll put it onto you. Did you think the Brisbane game felt anywhere near like a final?

I would argue the open-air conditions of Brisbane where we had to work hard against the wind in two of the first three quarters (and then deliberately played defensive to hold onto the win, losing the last quarter despite looking better and with the win) replicates finals footy as well. The wind failed to make it clean, like finals isn't clean.